galgrey Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 I've nothing to add re: pain management. Just know that you and Nube are in my thoughts and prayers. Cynthia, & Cristiano, galgoAlways in my heart: Frostman Newdawn Frost, Keno Jet Action & Chloe (NGA racing name unknown), Irys (galgo), Hannah (weim), Cruz (galgo), & Carly CW Your Charming Princess http://www.greyhound-data.com/d?i=1018857 "It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life, gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are." -- Unknown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cashie Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Poor Nube! I hope something starts to work for him soon! I was in the same boat with Cash about a week ago. He was only taking Tramadol (1-2 every 12 hours) for several weeks and was doing great, then suddenly last Monday he seemed to get worse overnight. He is now taking 300mg of Gabapentin every 12 hours (we started with 100mg to get him used to it), 100mg of Tramadol every 8 hours and 75mg of Rimadyl every 12 hours. He seems to be feeling so much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cully Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Nube Havok is sending lots of good vibes your way. :bighug waiting at the bridge Connie Van Teddy & Jojo, Cobra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinw Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Kim, this must be so scary for you, especialy after having lost Rainey so recently. It's also scary to talk to the vet, or it was for me. . No matter what happens, this won't be easy. Xavi the galgo and Peter the cat. Missing Iker the galgo ?-Feb.9/19, Treasure (USS Treasure) April 12/01-May 6/13, Phoenix (Hallo Top Son) Dec.14/99-June 4/11 and Loca (Reko Swahili) Oct.9/95 - June 1/09, Allen the boss cat, died late November, 2021, age 19. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KF_in_Georgia Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) Kim, I'm really worried that you and Nubie will have a terrible weekend if you don't get your vet's approval to seriously increase the Gabapentin. It takes about 48 hours to really kick in, and if you can't get approval from your vet before the weekend, Gabapentin next week won't be able to help Nubie much before next Wednesday. That's too long to make him wait for relief. If you have to, be really blunt with your vet. Remind him that the goal here is not to stand off the pain until Nubie recovers. The goal is to keep your boy comfortable. If increased Gabapentin makes Nubie pain free but too drowsy, you can always ease back, but the important thing is to get on top of the pain. Your vet's instructions seem to be trying to nibble away at the pain rather than just plain squashing it. Best wishes to you and your boy. Edited July 20, 2012 by KF_in_Georgia Kathy and Q (CRT Qadeer from Fuzzy's Cannon and CRT Bonnie) and Jane (WW's Aunt Jane from Trent Lee and Aunt M); photos to come. Missing Silver (5.19.2005-10.27.2016), Tigger (4.5.2007-3.18.2016), darling Sam (5.10.2000-8.8.2013), Jacey-Kasey (5.19.2003-8.22.2011), and Oreo (1997-3.30.2006) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaineysMom Posted July 20, 2012 Author Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) Nube Havok is sending lots of good vibes your way. :bighug sending many hugs and prayers Havoc's way too!!! :hope Kim, this must be so scary for you, especialy after having lost Rainey so recently. It's also scary to talk to the vet, or it was for me. . No matter what happens, this won't be easy. Rainey left us in March of 2011, although it still seems like just yesterday. She was our first greyhound and paved the way for the rest of our lives. She loved her Nubers, and he loved her. I'm just not ready yet to let her be with him again. Kim, I'm really worried that you and Nubie will have a terrible weekend if you don't get your vet's approval to seriously increase the Gabapentin. It takes about 48 hours to really kick in, and if you can't get approval from your vet before the weekend, Gabapentin next week won't be able to help Nubie much before next Wednesday. That's too long to make him wait for relief. If you have to, be really blunt with your vet. Remind him that the goal here is not to stand off the pain until Nubie recovers. The goal is to keep your boy comfortable. If increased Gabapentin makes Nubie pain free but too drowsy, you can always ease back, but the important thing is to get on top of the pain. Your vet's instructions seem to be trying to nibble away at the pain rather than just plain squashing it. Best wishes to you and your boy. I hope we did the right thing, Bruce and I made a decision together. I gave him another 100mg Gabapentin at 6pm (so 2 x today) before talking to the vet. I know a lot of you are comfortable medicating on your own, but for the most part, I am not. But in this case, at this point, I do not see the problem and can only hope it helps, as nothing else is. He seems more agitated now tonite....maybe it was the wrong thing I did. I can't imagine it will be an issue, so many are on WAY more than even 200mg per day. I'd do anything to make him feel better now I thought all we went through with Rainey was the worst thing imaginable. I was wrong. This blows. I feel like I am letting him down SO bad. Edited July 20, 2012 by RaineysMom Kim and Bruce - with Rick (Rick Roufus 6/30/16) and missing my sweet greyhound Angels Rainey (LG's Rainey 10/4/2000 - 3/8/2011), Anubis (RJ's Saint Nick 12/25/2001 - 9/12/12) and Zeke (Hey Who Whiz It 4/6/2009 - 7/20/2020) and Larry (PTL Laroach 2/24/2007 - 8/2/2020) -- and Chester (Lab) (8/31/1990 - 5/3/2005), Captain (Schipperke) (10/12/1992 - 6/13/2005) and Remy (GSP) (?/?/1998 - 1/6/2005) at the bridge"Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." -- Ernest Hemmingway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MachosMom Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 RaineysMom ... I just wanted to give you a big hug (and one for Nube too!!!) I can tell from the posts how much love there is and I am sorry I can't offer any miracle answers to make it all better my thoughts and prayers are with you. Mom to Macho (JS XtremeMachine 1/12/2007 -8/17/2012 ... Gotcha day 9/2/2011. I miss you BigMan)Moonbeam (Ninos Full Moon 11/1/2009, Gotcha day 9/2/2012), Hattie (Kiowa Hats Off 4/14/2011, Gotcha day 10/13/2012), Keiva (JS Igotyourbooty 1/12/2007, Gotcha Day 1/8/2014)Jimmy (Blu Too James 06/26/2014, Gotcha day 09/12/2015), a shepard mix named Tista, some cats, and some reptiles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KF_in_Georgia Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) Kim, Is Nubie's tramadol dosage higher than it has been? Tramadol has a reputation for causing some anxiety and panting at higher doses. If it's the tramadol, then it's not necessarily pain he's showing. I think you're fine with the gabapentin. The experts say it takes about 48 hours to get to full effect, so I don't think that extra pill can be having much effect at this stage. Pin your vet down on what your highest allowable doses are for Nubie so you'll know what you can do on nights and weekends when your vet isn't available and the stress of the e-Vet is too much for you and your boy to deal with. (Your vet either needs to give you dosage numbers--or give you his home phone number. Tell him you're worried about weekends and nights and don't want your boy in pain. I had a hard time getting info from my vet in a timely manner one time--I'm not sure he was getting my messages--so I went to the office and sat in their waiting room and made it clear that I wasn't leaving without seeing the vet...but I wasn't putting Sam and me through one more sleepless night.) And ask your vet which med is safer for increases, if you only increase one. My vet said I should give extra tramadol for short-term relief (if I think we're just having a bad day), but be prepared if Sam reacts badly to it. (Basically, my vet doesn't want me to panic if Sam gets anxious from the tramadol.) But when we're ready to increase the regular meds to another level, my vet said we'd probably increase the gabapentin sooner than the tramadol. But my vet has told me the maximums, and has authorized me to double Sam's tramadol (depending on how Sam does with it) and go up as much as another 300mg a day on the gabapentin if necessary. Kisses to Nubie... Edited July 20, 2012 by KF_in_Georgia Kathy and Q (CRT Qadeer from Fuzzy's Cannon and CRT Bonnie) and Jane (WW's Aunt Jane from Trent Lee and Aunt M); photos to come. Missing Silver (5.19.2005-10.27.2016), Tigger (4.5.2007-3.18.2016), darling Sam (5.10.2000-8.8.2013), Jacey-Kasey (5.19.2003-8.22.2011), and Oreo (1997-3.30.2006) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
45MPHK9 Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I know a lot of you are comfortable medicating on your own, but for the most part, I am not. Just to be clear, I never medicated Bee on my own. I followed explicit directions given to me by my vet. I think the rest of us would say the same. Your vet's advice is inconsistent with the advice most of us have received from our vets. I think this is why so many of us are concerned and saying the same thing about increasing the amount of meds. This includes jjng, our resident vet here, who is so kind to offer her professional opinion here on Greytalk. Thinking about Anubis. Tricia with Kyle, our senior mutt dog Always missing Murray Maldives, Bee Wiseman, River, Hopper, Kaia, and Holly Oaks Holly“You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.“ -Bob Dylan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeylasMom Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I know a lot of you are comfortable medicating on your own, but for the most part, I am not. Just to be clear, I never medicated Bee on my own. I followed explicit directions given to me by my vet. I think the rest of us would say the same. Your vet's advice is inconsistent with the advice most of us have received from our vets. I think this is why so many of us are concerned and saying the same thing about increasing the amount of meds. This includes jjng, our resident vet here, who is so kind to offer her professional opinion here on Greytalk. Thinking about Anubis. Please learn from our own mistakes and follow Kathy's advice - when you do reach your vet, find out max dosages, what increment to increase in, and in what order. Please don't always need to wait to hear from your vet in order to make changes. One aspect of osteo pain is breakthrough pain, you will deal with it periodically and you need to increase meds (sometimes imo significantly) to deal with it immediately, then you can back down again. Also, my experience is that osteo progresses slowly for some time (often before we're aware our dog has it) but toward the end, it will be exponential. As often as I had read about this and watched others go through it, I was not prepared (mentally) when it happened. You will want to be prepared with dosage increases if you end up facing that on a weekend for instance. Big hugs to you and gentle kisses for Anubis. I hope the extra Gabapentin kicks in soon and helps him feel better. Jen, CPDT-KA with Zuri, lab in a greyhound suit, Violet, formerly known as Faith, Skye, the permanent puppy, Cisco, resident cat, and my baby girl Neyla, forever in my heart "The great thing about science is that you're free to disagree with it, but you'll be wrong." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaineysMom Posted July 20, 2012 Author Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) I know a lot of you are comfortable medicating on your own, but for the most part, I am not. Just to be clear, I never medicated Bee on my own. I followed explicit directions given to me by my vet. I think the rest of us would say the same. Your vet's advice is inconsistent with the advice most of us have received from our vets. I think this is why so many of us are concerned and saying the same thing about increasing the amount of meds. This includes jjng, our resident vet here, who is so kind to offer her professional opinion here on Greytalk. Thinking about Anubis. Please learn from our own mistakes and follow Kathy's advice - when you do reach your vet, find out max dosages, what increment to increase in, and in what order. Please don't always need to wait to hear from your vet in order to make changes. One aspect of osteo pain is breakthrough pain, you will deal with it periodically and you need to increase meds (sometimes imo significantly) to deal with it immediately, then you can back down again. Also, my experience is that osteo progresses slowly for some time (often before we're aware our dog has it) but toward the end, it will be exponential. As often as I had read about this and watched others go through it, I was not prepared (mentally) when it happened. You will want to be prepared with dosage increases if you end up facing that on a weekend for instance. Big hugs to you and gentle kisses for Anubis. I hope the extra Gabapentin kicks in soon and helps him feel better. I can't thank you guys enough for the advice -- I know you have been through the same and I trust the advice. From what I've read, I've seen that his dose is low, but JJnG kind of correlated what our vet said. I just don't want to make him any more uncomfortable than he already is. After going through what we did with Rainey (and scarily, on similar meds, but for seizures) I don't want him to get whacked out any more than he is (being as unstable on his feet as he is!). the Tramadol he is on is what he was on most of the prior 2 weeks (until we stopped this past Sunday) and has been fine on it for the past 2 days. Edited July 20, 2012 by RaineysMom Kim and Bruce - with Rick (Rick Roufus 6/30/16) and missing my sweet greyhound Angels Rainey (LG's Rainey 10/4/2000 - 3/8/2011), Anubis (RJ's Saint Nick 12/25/2001 - 9/12/12) and Zeke (Hey Who Whiz It 4/6/2009 - 7/20/2020) and Larry (PTL Laroach 2/24/2007 - 8/2/2020) -- and Chester (Lab) (8/31/1990 - 5/3/2005), Captain (Schipperke) (10/12/1992 - 6/13/2005) and Remy (GSP) (?/?/1998 - 1/6/2005) at the bridge"Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." -- Ernest Hemmingway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiggysMom Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Sending more good thoughts for all of you. Wendy with Twiggy, fosterless while Twiggy's fighting the good fight, and Donnie & Aiden the kitties Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GenetJen Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 In the same boat, RaineysMom. Will get an answer from our vet one way or another tomorrow. I see these doses and want to increase Maya's, but then remember some of these boys are 70-80 lbs and Maya's only at 45 lbs right now. So I gave her a little extra tramadol and gabapentin today (because I think we are so low on the scale, especially the 100 mg gab 1x per day). I would like to know the maximum that is safe for her. Sorry you're going through this, especially after losing Rainey so recently. You're absolutely right, it does blow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GenetJen Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Is Nubie's tramadol dosage higher than it has been? Tramadol has a reputation for causing some anxiety and panting at higher doses. If it's the tramadol, then it's not necessarily pain he's showing. This is good to know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest patterpaws Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Sending lots of love and healing energies to you, you and Nube (and Maya!) are on my mind a lot lately. Hoping you all find some relief soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xan Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I'm sitting here feeling the near panic you must be feeling, so worried about Nube, watching his discomfort ... : I have no experience and no advice. Just many many hugs for you both! My Inspirations: Grey Pogo, borzoi Katie, Meep the cat, AND MY BELOVED DH!!!Missing Rowdy, Coco, Brilly, Happy and Wabi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancy14 Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 Kim, Just to let you know that I'm thinking about you, Bruce and especially Nube. From Wisconsin -- It's Nancy, Bob, Carla, June Bug and our newby Skorch.... along with Buffy. She's the little hound that meows. With loving memorials to K.C., Barko and Major Turn -- all playing at the bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3greys2cats Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 Sending hugs, it is so hard to watch them suffer,I just went through this in April w/Sara and her Hemangio , you are not letting him down, you are doing the absolute best for Nube, he knows you love him. :bighug Roberta & Michael with Furkids- Flower (Shasta Flowers 6/7/06) & Rascal the kitty - Missing our sweet angels - Max(M's Mad Max) 10/12/02 - 12/3/15, Sara (Sara Raves 6/30/01 - 4/13/12) Queenie & Pandora the kitties - gone but never forgotten Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliemac Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 Just wondering how all of you are doing today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cully Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 :bighug waiting at the bridge Connie Van Teddy & Jojo, Cobra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racindog Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 Good morning Nuber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlies_Dad Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 Thinking of Nube this morning. Kyle with Stewie ('Super C Ledoux, Super C Sampson x Sing It Blondie) and forever missing my three angels, Jack ('Roy Jack', Greys Flambeau x Miss Cobblepot) and Charlie ('CTR Midas Touch', Leo's Midas x Hallo Argentina) and Shelby ('Shari's Hooty', Flying Viper x Shari Carusi) running free across the bridge. Gus an coinnich sinn a'rithist my boys and little girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonder Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 Kari and the pups.Run free sweet Hana 9/21/08-9/12/10. Missing Sparks with every breath.Passion 10/16/02-5/25/17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFullHouse Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 How is Nube today? Judy, mom to Darth Vader, Bandita, And Angel Forever in our hearts, DeeYoGee, Dani, Emmy, Andy, Heart, Saint, Valentino, Arrow, Gee, Bebe, Jilly Bean, Bullitt, Pistol, Junior, Sammie, Joey, Gizmo, Do Bee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaineysMom Posted July 24, 2012 Author Share Posted July 24, 2012 hi guys, thanks for checking in. I just fed him about a 1/2 hour ago and he's sleeping now, which yesterday he was extremely restless, panting and in pain. I upped his gabapentin to 200mg 3 x day (who was that lady that said she wouldn't self-medicate her dog???? ) and gave him a single 50mg tramadol at about 12:40 (he'll get the other 2 and the 2 Gab's at 1:30pm), hoping the overlay might help some. Not sure if that's the best thing, hoping it will help bridge the dose gap but worried will lessen the regular dose and cause issues that way, I don't know. he was SO bad yesterday, when he got like that last Monday and Tuesday (before we changed the Gab dose and frequency) he at least settled back down by 2:15pm or so -- yesterday, he was panting and in pain past 7pm! he never slept, just lay there panting or kept getting up and being restless. poor guy doesn't get a breakfast tomorrow morning his appt is at 10:20am and they said not to feed him (in case they want to do a procedure). I can't give him his Rimadyl since that has to be taken with food but he can get the Gab's and Tram's, so hopefully that helps enough. I just keep PRAYING that SOMETHING helps, somewhere. It is just too painful to see him only get worse. I don't want to have to have him go under but if they suggest radiation, they'll have to do that but if it helps some.....I don't know. hugs to all. Kim and Bruce - with Rick (Rick Roufus 6/30/16) and missing my sweet greyhound Angels Rainey (LG's Rainey 10/4/2000 - 3/8/2011), Anubis (RJ's Saint Nick 12/25/2001 - 9/12/12) and Zeke (Hey Who Whiz It 4/6/2009 - 7/20/2020) and Larry (PTL Laroach 2/24/2007 - 8/2/2020) -- and Chester (Lab) (8/31/1990 - 5/3/2005), Captain (Schipperke) (10/12/1992 - 6/13/2005) and Remy (GSP) (?/?/1998 - 1/6/2005) at the bridge"Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." -- Ernest Hemmingway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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