Greyhound who won't eat or drink - advice?

[MattM]

Hello all,

We are looking for some advice on our 7.5 year old greyhound. Over the past month and a half he has been having worsening diarrhea and the vets have not been too helpful. We've done all the regular things, stool samples, flagyl, and he kept getting worse until we took him too the hospital for some IV fluids. An X-ray revealed diffuse inflammation in his GI tract, while a round of panacur has produced what seem to be roundworms in his stool. After 2.5 days of panacur, he is still having lots of diarrhea and is refusing to eat much of anything, nevermind rice and turkey, or Hill's kibble, or Hill's dry food. Right now, we are trying to get him an abdominal ultrasound - what have other people done in this situation?

Thanks,

Matt

 

[Time4ANap]

Our boy Rocket had a number of tummy issues so we went through this type of thing off and on.  

When he needed a bland diet I would feed Evangers Cooked Chicken which he never turned down.  It's not a complete nutritious meal, but will get some food in him without distress and seems to be easier to digest than home-cooked chicken or turkey etc when there is a GI issue. 

Rocket would also usually eat scrambled eggs or some cottage cheese when his stomach had issues.  We also went to 4 smaller meals a day instead of 2 full meals to make it easier on his stomach. This always worked well and once he was eating i would give him a mix of the canned food along with overcooked pasta and the scrambled eggs until his stools formed and we could ease him back on to regular food. 

The worms will most likely have to be completely clear and his stomach somewhat healed before he really feels like eating. It's kind of a balancing act until you find the right combination of food and a lot of trial and error. 

Good luck - hope he's better soon. 

[greysmom]

I second the very small portions idea.  The worst thing to experience when you feel like crap and are nauseous and don't want to eat anything cause it hurts and makes you feel worse is a huge blob of too smelly, too much food plopped down in front of you.

Try *very* small portions - like a spoonful of meat baby food or high quality canned dog food. Or hand feeding a few bites of broasted chicken from the store.  Sometimes non-meat items like oatmeal or overcooked pasta work better as they are less smelly.

As far as everything else goes, you might need to see a specialist to get to the bottom of whatever is going on.  BUt you really do need to figure it out before going much farther, as that will dictate a lot of how and what you feed going forward.  An ultrasound is a good place to begin.  Get it done asap.

[tbhounds]

I’m not entirely sure how the doctor can see the diffuse inflammation  from a radiograph. You really do need to see what the ultrasound shows. At some point you may even have to have your dog scoped. Sounds like you might be dealing with IBD. Do you have any blood work results you can post?

Edited January 30, 2021 by tbhounds

[MattM]

Thanks for the answers everyone. We feel we have been feeling abandoned by the vets, and wish we had just given him panacur ourselves weeks ago instead of listening to the vet (won't give it to him without a positive fecal test). He did a three day course of panacur, and as a result seemed to pass a whole bunch of worms in his stool. However, this hasn't affected the diarrhea - sometimes 8 or more a day! Our best bet is that he had worms, and is mostly cleared but is suffering from diarrhea. 2 mg of immodium (he is over 70 lbs) reduces the diarrhea a little bit.

We are seeing an internal medicine vet as soon as we can, but we are worried about keeping him hydrated. He has stopped drinking, and we are feeding him water and pedialyte with a syringe. We've tried all sorts of things to get him to drink - ice cubes, chicken broth, peanut butter flavored water, and nothing seems to be working. We've given him more bowls, moved his old bowl... It goes without saying that he is also not eating anything. Last time we took him to emergency, he seemed a little more energetic after IV fluids but then stopped eating and drinking again.

If he doesn't eat for a few days, that's fine. But the lack of fluids is deeply concerning us. We have an appt and hopefully ultrasound for Thursday and are trying to avoid another $1500 overnight animal hospital stay just to get him hydrated.

What to do?

 

 

 

Edited February 2, 2021 by MattM

[EllenEveBaz]

No experience with this, but sending best wishes for your appointment today.  

[MattM]

Finally got him in to see the internal medicine doctor, and he has quite bad colitis (diagnosed by abdominal ultrasound). Had to spend another night on IV fluids for hydration. Nothing wrong with his kidney's and he doesn't have pancreatitis with normal blood work (aside from dehydration). Still no positive fecal test, but we had a picture of his stool showing round worms after panacur. Next step is to keep him hydrated, and eating!

We are waiting on PCR of his diarrhea to test for various viruses, and parasites. Hope that he keeps drinking and eating, now that he is at least hydrated. They've given us antacids, anti-nausea and appetite boosting medications.

Thank you for the good wishes! He is such a sweet dog.

Edited February 4, 2021 by MattM

[MaryJane]

Has anyone suggested white rice and white fish (like tilapia). My seizure girl developed IBD after using one type of seizure med and the only thing that would work for her is white fish with white rice or cooked oatmeal - I would add some cooked veggies like green beans or mashed up carrot.

[cleptogrey]

glad to hear he was hydrated by the vet. Annie had chronic colitis brought on by stress. We used Flagyl which she was on for a good 6 months. Very slowly the dosage was decreased. I did ask my vet about the use of Tylan Powder vs. Flagyl. My vet is super knowledgable and explains how meds work really well. With Tylan it's a matter of preference, both antibiotics they work almost the same way, you can also ask about Tylan. The PCR will tell you which bacteria is affecting your dog. A friend's GH had a nasty case of a bacteria (starting w/ C) that is in bird droppings. It took quite a while to clear up.

As to the panacur lots of dogs are wormed monthly on it- and it should not have resulted in that much discomfort unless it's a large worm kill. i did see ridiculous lethargy and discomfort w/ drontal plus which i now avoid. Something else is festering. But the obvious worms that were killed off- your vet poo-pooed it? HUH? I just went thru worming w/ panacur(SafeGuard Goat dewormer) w/ my new pup for 4 rounds(2 weeks apart) then a month later 2 rounds, now monthly(as with the other dogs) 3 consecutive days. 5 days of panacur with 2 weeks of Flagyl works for Giardia. I use straight ivomec vs. heart guard or interceptor- all heart worm meds w/ DEWORMERS- so, ultimately all the dogs getting heart worm protocol are wormed monthly.

I personally hate purchasing ID diets but when your dog is physically stressed it works. Annie dropped from 65 to 53lbs in a matter of 2 weeks w/ her colitis. she gained all of her weight back and things did return to normal including her diet. There is light at the end of the tunnel. Slow and steady-

[MattM]

Thanks @Time4ANap for the suggestion of Evangers - it is the only thing he is willing to eat. His current diagnosis is hemorrhagic gastroenteritis, but with no idea what the underlying cause is. He is still having a dozen instances of diarrhea today, and we are focussed on keeping him hydrated and fed until we get some test results back. And @cleptogrey it is bizarre to us that our vets are so dismissive of worms when they are so easy to treat!

We have gotten him to eat a little bit of a rice, and we even started adding some metamucil at the suggestion of the doctor. Feel bad for our sweet guy, he is clearly in discomfort. If we could only slow down the diarrhea...

 

[cleptogrey]

1 hour ago, MattM said:

Thanks @Time4ANap for the suggestion of Evangers - it is the only thing he is willing to eat. His current diagnosis is hemorrhagic gastroenteritis, but with no idea what the underlying cause is. He is still having a dozen instances of diarrhea today, and we are focussed on keeping him hydrated and fed until we get some test results back. And @cleptogrey it is bizarre to us that our vets are so dismissive of worms when they are so easy to treat!

We have gotten him to eat a little bit of a rice, and we even started adding some metamucil at the suggestion of the doctor. Feel bad for our sweet guy, he is clearly in discomfort. If we could only slow down the diarrhea...

 

i would think about a second opinion. (take a copy of your records with you). do you know about the pinch and gently lift the skin and see how quickly it goes back to normal? your vet should have demonstrated this so you can see if the dog is dehydrated. 

my late saluki was prone to gastroenteritis. he always went on flagyl and white rice with chicken was our vet's suggested food. he was not one for RX diets- as a matter of fact they probably didn't exist back then. your dog's gut needs to heal, so a commercial food is not the answer- bland is best.  make sure it's white rice- overcooked. if you have an pressure cooker it saves time. i cooked rice for years the old fashioned way, with quartered skinless chicken, then i would debone and chop the chicken. the rice was more than yummy. also, i did many small servings of cooked rice and was prescribed to feed simple human cookies- graham crackers or nilla wafers in-between. the healing process was slow. both azim(saluki) and annie(greyhound) and felix(greyhound) were on cooked rice for extended periods of time. azim survived parvo(pre-vaccine days) and lived on it for 6 years!  annie who had colitis changed to kibble within 4 months, felix ate it when his kidneys were on the decline. 

[Time4ANap]

Glad that he likes the Evangers.  Right now we have at least a dozen cans on the shelf just in case we need it. It works really well when they wake up with tummy gurgles in the middle of the night as well. 

Rocket had a sweet tooth and we were able to put a splash of Gatorade in his water to get him to drink.  Not something you want to do all the time but if it gets him to drink when he needs to, it's worth a try. Don't keep adding Gatorade but back off the amount over time. 

I agree with Cleptogrey on the overcooked white rice. You can cook it with chicken broth to give it some flavor.  I would usually give Rocket 4 or 5 small meals a day consisting of some combination of white rice, Evanger's, scrambled eggs, and maybe some cottage cheese, rotating the various components to keep his interest up. I often cooked a dozen or two dozen scrambled eggs in a batch and then just pulled that and the rice from the refrigerator to reheat a little. it's not too much of a chore if you batch cook the stuff. i would also sometimes use overcooked pasta instead of rice, as well. 

It sounds like he definitely needs a round of flagyl, and may need another round of panacur in 2-3 weeks as the worms usually hatch on a cycle. We recently spent a year each getting our seniors that we adopted clear of hookworms, so you definitely need to retest every few weeks to be sure that all of the eggs are gone. 

Good luck and hope you can find a vet willing to give your hound a little more relief and who will work with you. 

Edited February 8, 2021 by Time4ANap

[MattM]

Hi all,

Thanks for the help and advice. We have been trying to get him to eat rice every way we can, but no luck. Also, his test results showed that he is not absorbing folate or vitamin B12 which suggests and intestinal disease.

We got the results back from the diarrhea PCR, and he seems clear of bacteria and viruses and parasites. Still, we are going to do another round of panacur, and tylan. Our new vet suggested that we scope him, as either he has IBD or invasive cancer.

Question for the greytalk community, he is 7.5 years old and has generally been pretty good. Does it make sense that he would suddenly develop such severe IBD at this point? Similarly, an invasive cancer at this age? It is a lot for us to take in. Has anyone gotten scope diagnoses of IBD?

Edited February 9, 2021 by MattM

[FiveRoooooers]

Unfortunately, anything can happen at any age. Paddy Mayhem was just 7+ when he received his wings. A necropsy showed his beautiful body was riddled with cancer. I hope a different story for your boy. If you can get the scope done, I would do it. 

[cleptogrey]

8 minutes ago, FiveRoooooers said:

Unfortunately, anything can happen at any age. Paddy Mayhem was just 7+ when he received his wings. A necropsy showed his beautiful body was riddled with cancer. I hope a different story for your boy. If you can get the scope done, I would do it. 

"anything at any age"- do discuss X-ray vs scope w/ your new vet and the cost and if malignant growths can be seen adequately w/ an x-ray. unless you have great medical insurance this all really hurts the wallet as well as your emotions and heart. hoping that nothing is found and tylan does the trick

[MattM]

Well, we have been muddling along for several weeks trying to get Ethan stabilized, and recently he got much worse. His diagnosis from the Angell's animal hospital in Boston was IBD/colitis diagnosed with an abdominal ultrasound. They suggested a scope to see if he had cancer, but the scope wouldn't have changed his treatment course much. To review, something triggered a lot of diahhrea. Whatever caused it initially, it seems that his problem now is inflammation in his colon. This has been going on since mid-December, and we've tried a number of things. Flagyll seems to have done no good, and dietary changes are difficult since he continues to lose weight and often refuses to eat, so we are constantly striking a balance between giving him limited food and preventing him from starving. 

So now we have two problems: IBD/colitis, and anorexia (refusal to eat). As a 75 pound Greyhound he has already lost over 10 pounds.

So we decided to treat for IBD with prednisone, and three weeks of tylan antibiotic. In the meantime, we have been trying to find a diet that a) he'll eat and b) helps his diarrhea. We give him a little peanut butter in the morning otherwise he won't eat his medication. We've also been giving him Dyne and metamucil to give him some calories and also help his diarrhea. Nothing seems to be helping. 

He seemed to get much worse yesterday - we tried giving him hydrolyzed protein kibble, some swiss cheese and cauliflower. Then, for the first time he had an episode of incontinence while he was lying in his bed. He is only 7.5 years old, so a little young for incontinence. Hard to get in touch with the vets, and they are very thin on suggestions. Our regular vet told us outright that there was "nothing we can do."

Does anyone have any suggestions? We are horribly worried about him. 

[macoduck]

 "Composure Max" in the liquid form.  https://www.chewy.com/vetriscience-composure-max-liquid/dp/48692

I've used it both as a calming aid and as an appetite stimulant.

 

[1Moregrey]

No experience with: IBD/colitis, and anorexia (refusal to eat). As a 75 pound Greyhound he has already lost over 10 pounds.

Just something to check into:  My grey has hookworms and gets the tummy grumbles and will not eat sometimes.  What has worked for her has been a little bit of buttermilk I just put a little in her dish 1/8-1/4 of cup.  If she needs to drink I add some water to the buttermilk and it seems to jumpstart her taste buds as she will eat a little bit.

Not sure if it would add to the diarrhea or be ok with IBD/colitis.  Just wanted to share what helps my girl eat in case it could help you.

Hope you find something that helps you.

 

[GreyhndHomecare]

On 3/15/2021 at 8:53 PM, MattM said:

 

Hi, Matt,

A lot of people swear by Olewo Carrots.  I haven't used it, but I see the name come up all the time when I'm researching for my greyhound website. Here's a the link, plus a greyhound's owner review of it (I have found many health solutions for my dogs from fellow owners' comments at Amazon):

https://www.amazon.com/Olewo-Dehydrated-Carrots-Supplement-11-Pound/product-reviews/B0083QBVHY

 

5.0 out of 5 stars My IBS EPI dog is now 'regular' and healthy with Olewo carrots, Honest Kitchen Perfect Form, and Animal Essentials Plant Enzymes

"Olewo Carrots, Honest Kitchens Perfect Form, and Animal Essentials Plant Enzymes & Probiotics have completely changed my pup. She has had horrible allergy and digestive issues for years, and once I thought we had her on the perfect combination of food- only to have her allergies grow worse and the digestion get worse than I ever could have imagined. My pup couldn't make it through the night without 'accidents', and she's only 7. She was miserable, and so was I trying everything to get her better.

The vets were worthless, and I found my girl couldn't eat any dry kibble on the market (we did the proper into-trial phases and trying for weeks before deeming the food a no go). Darwin's mail order turkey dog food seemed to be acceptable to her system, but the final 'product' my pup produced was far from perfect. My husband found Animal Essentials Plant Enzymes & Probiotics, and that made my pup more 'regular' in her routine, although still not a perfect poop. Honest Kitchens Perfect Form was another step in the right direction, but still I was missing something. Olewo carrots were it! I mix everything together for my pup 2X a day, and she's been PERFECT for 2 months now. It's a lot of trial and error, but pet parents, please don't give up! I hope my 'formula' may help some others!"

Gail