I Am Most Desperate. Has Anyone's Greyhound Had Complications Af

[Guest got2now]

I know there are hundreds of pages here of personal stories about greyhound osteosarcoma, and I've read many of them here and elsewhere, but I'm about to go completely to pieces and desperately need some straight advice from anyone whose greyhound has experienced complications from amputation.

 

One of our greyhounds was diagnosed with osteosarcoma a month ago. After tedious research and phone calls,we made a decision and a plan. She had her right front leg amputated at the UGA vet school almost 2 weeks ago on 1/27/2016 and was scheduled to have stitches removed and chemo this Thursday. Everything seemed to be on track for her participation in a clinical trial that involved amputation, chemo and possible treatment with the drug rapamycin, but her incision looked bad when I picked her up on Halloween day (10/31/2016). I was told that a greyhound's thin skin and lack of body fat makes closing an incision very difficult. Our dog wasn’t sent home with antibiotics, and her incision didn’t improve. Last Friday, I took her back to UGA, and she's still there. They have no idea when she can come home.

Tonight, a new vet on rotation told me they operated on her and removed not just tissue but some muscle that had become infected since she had been there over the weekend. They thought she would need more surgery after that but hoped the infection would ultimately be contained so she could start chemo. She needed to start chemo within a 2 week window after the amputation, but we're o not on target for that.

Putting her through the amputation was the most difficult decision I've made as a dog owner, and I don’t have any confidence that more surgeries will improve her outcome with the experience we’ve had thus far. I personally could not feel any worse about this whole awful experience and the decisions I made. In spite of the weeks of research, the advice and the confidence I once had in my own logic skills, it seems that I made the wrong decision in putting her through all of this. Instead of spending the small amount of time she had left to be with her and to keep her comfortable, she’s lost a leg, been strung out on anxiety-producing opioids, and spent 2 extended stays in an animal hospital, far away from her home and from those who love her, with no end in sight.

Do I stop this torture, drive to UGA tomorrow, and bring her home to be euthanized, or do I leave her at a f@#*ing amateur hour vet school to suffer through more surgery and an uncertain outcome? I could just die of guilt and regret right now. What could I have been thinking to take her to that place?

Edited November 8, 2016 by got2now

[spottydog]

I've lost two dogs to Osteo. Neither was a candidate for amputation. However, I did a lot of reading and it seemed that dogs that got an infection at the site did statistically better than those that didn't...Perhaps it will turn out to be a good thing, despite the awfulness of the present situation. Best wishes, Margo

[Time4ANap]

I'm so sorry that you and your hound are going through this. At this point, if I had to make any decision, my ultimate question is what will quality of life be if more surgery is done, hopefully after receiving a thorough explanation of what is being considered prior to any surgery, and what the goal of the surgery is.

 

If you aren't getting those answers at the vet hospital, you need to go higher up the chain and get them, and don't take no for an answer.

 

These hounds are remarkably resilient, and can handle much more than we think they can. If you are uncertain that the vet is doing the right thing, consider a consult with Dr. Cuoto. It's well worth the price for confirmation that you are still going down the right road, or to receive some direction that might have additional options to consider.

 

Cuoto Veterinary Consultants Website

 

Hoping for the best here for you and your girl.

[greysmom]

Breath. Just breath.

 

Infections at the amputation site - even very serious infections - are quite common following surgery of this magnitude. My own boy had to go back for two more surgeries to debride necrotic and infected tissue and had a drain for stitched to him for several days. It was about 4 weeks post amp before we could start chemo. There is some evidence that indicates post-surgical infection does somehow extend the life of the dog. No one is sure why, but it's very strongly indicated.

 

We ended up having nine more months with him, after the month from he!! following surgery. Your boy should be on a combination of antibiotics, gabapentin (a nerve pain drug), an nsaid (piroxicam or similar), and a pain reliever like tramadol. If she can't tolerate the tramadol ask if she can switch to codeine sulfate. That's what we had to do for Dude. Don't let them use fentanyl. Many greyhounds have a bad reaction to it if they are opioid sensitive.

 

If you don't like the care she is getting at UGA, or if you don't like how they are treating you, or anything else about this whole marathon, see if there is another hospital that she can be transfered to. You should be informed and give your permission for everything they are doing to your dog. You should at least have a basic understanding of how and why they think a treatment/surgery needs to be done. If his care team isn't keeping you updated then the manager or director of the hospital needs to be informed in the strongest terms possible.

 

Please do contact Dr Couto and see what he says after reviewing your girl's files. Good luck and keep us updated.

[Neighsayer]

Two people from my group had post amputation issues over the last few months. One had the remaining leg swell up to the point of not being able to walk on it. The vets in the specialty hospital were not even sure what was going on. He was home a few days after amp, and was back in the hospital for two weeks.he is fine now, happily hopping about with no issues.

The other had a more typical infection like what you describe. That one was in and out of the hospital, but is also fine and happy now.

 

Both these moms expressed the same feelings that you are experiencing. Did I do the right thing? How could I have done this to him? Should I just go yank him out of there? Will I get my boy back? Will he have any quality of life? Both these dogs are twelve, which added to the guilt of not just bringing him home to live out what time he had left instead of amputating the leg.

 

Sometimes these things happen. I'm sorry to hear that you are going through this. Amputation is major surgery, and there may or may not be complications. Stay in touch with your vet. Know what they are doing and why. Get another opinion if you need to. The two dogs I mentioned are leading happy lives now. Make sure that you have your own supports to get you through this. I hope you have a good outcome after this bump in the road. We never know which dog will walk out of the hospital with no problems after the surgery. We all hope that our dogs can do it that way, but it is out of our control. Don't look back! Second guessing will just make you feel worse.

Hope this resolves soon. Hugs!

 

Just wanted to add that both these dogs were at a very well respected specialty hospital with tons of greyhound experience. One of these moms also asked if she should just yank him out of there, take him someplace else, or put him down. That was grief, fear and guilt talking. If you have real doubts about the hospital's ability to provide quality care, then consider moving him, but the new place will have to play catch up! If your reaction is out of guilt, frustration, panic, and fear, just get more involved in the decisions about his care. More hugs!

Edited November 8, 2016 by Neighsayer

[Guest got2now]

A big thank-you to all who responded. Your replies talked me off the ledge and gave me perspective. It seems the best move will be to drive to Athens and speak to whomever is in charge, as well as consult with my vet. It makes sense that the infection can help the cancer. I know a woman whose glioblastoma disappeared after a post-op infection in her skull. This type of reaction is where much cancer research is centered, so it's good to think that the same could be true for dogs.

 

I did initially consult with Dr Couto, whose reputation has preceeded him for the many years we've been adopting greyhounds. He wasn't able to give me any advice, but did confirm what my vets knew about osteosarcoma and its options.

 

As to the care at UGA, they don't specialize in greyhounds but did seem familiar with the breed at our first interview. Their doctors work on a rotation, so the ones we've dealt with for the last 2 weeks with her surgery have just rotated to another department, and the "new team" has just stepped in. All of them seem very...young. Young, stressed-out and verbose. My girl's surgery, which they told me after it was over, was very complicated because of her "greyhound skin," and I wondered why they pushed it until so late in the day. The 5 day fentanyl patch was tough on her - opioids like that may be effective with pain, but I've seen them make dogs and people act crazy. I visited her every day after her surgery, and she was very anxious from the drugs, disconcertingly so. Now, she is on the same gabopentin, tramadol and rimadyl my vets gave her upon diagnosis. I didn't think to ask if they changed that. God forbid another fentanyl patch.

 

One of my concerns is that after spending all weekend at UGA, her infection spread to the point that shoulder tissue needed to be removed, and now more of that shoulder muscle needs to be cut out. Isn't that kind of major? The future cost estimate is as much as the amputation was. And what if what's left gets infected after that? They haven't been able to control it since the surgery, so I'm wondering, when will it stop?

Edited November 8, 2016 by got2now

[Guest Sportingfields]

I am so very sorry both of you are going thru all this. Hope you can get definite answers from the dept head before they do anything else, then consult with Dr. Couto's staff, so you can make the best decisions possible for her health and well being and quality of life.

[racindog]

Don't get down on yourself!!!! You did not do anything but love her and try to do the best thing by her. And I can tell you that you did NOT make a bad decision sending her to UGA. I used to work at the vet school and I seen them do some amazing things and they always put love at the top. Folks at this forum know I have a pretty rotten view of vets in general so I am sure they will be shocked to see me actually speaking positive about any. But I really believe she is in good hands. Sometimes CRAP just happens despite every ones best intentions. Dr. Cuoto of course is the best in the world so if you can get/use his input that would be great. I am so sorry this has happened. I had my girls ("Ivy" (Dream Irish) leg amputated as well and she was home within 4 days in great shape. Sadly even with chemo she only made it ~9 months more but for she and I both the amputation decision was without regret and it gave us the extra months. So you did NOT make a bad decision. So whatever you do don't give up and blame yourself. The ship is NOT lost at this point. You did make a good decision based on love. Crap happened but you will STILL continue to make the necessary decisions based on love-and because of that everything will be OK. You can never go wrong no way when you are motivated by love as you are. Your girl is most blessed to have a mom like you! Hang in there for her sake. Keep in touch on this forum. We care. We love too. God bless you and your girl.

PS- I don't believe UGA would or even could leave your girl suffer in any way so try not to worry about that too much. I seen them do things out of compassion and love that are 'out of the norm' to put it mildly. They consistantly put love first while I was there and later- in a big way. Wish I could be more explicit but trust me- they saved dog lives that had the death sentence in more ways than one -all because they loved them so much and put them FIRST-even ahead of themselves.

[greysmom]

If they can't get the infection under control, they should have cultured the wound to find the right antibiotic. As far as taking out the necrotic tissue in her shoulder - she's not going to use those muscles anymore anyway, so it's just a matter of getting the infection out.

 

I saw our boy every day and called morning and night - every day - to keep up with his care. The staff in our hosptial rotated every 10 hours, so the people taking care of him in the morning would not be the same ones taking care of him that night. It's not unusual for large facilities, but it does mean you need to keep up with a lot of people!

 

I second making sure you take care of yourself, as well. The amp for Dude was the most stressful thing we've ever done, and we were grateful for all the support we received from friends and family.

[TwiggysMom]

I haven't posted in GT in forever, but Twiggy's situation was very similar to your girl's. In Twiggy's case, she had Pseudomonas A - highly resistant infection, for which the proper antibiotic would not only have been extremely hard to come by, but potentially prohibitively expensive (along the lines of a year's pay expensive).

 

The emergency vet I took her to (not the place she had the surgery, as that was at OSU which is 6 hours away) had an innovative idea - they hospitalized Twiggy for 5 days and used a Vac-Therapy bandage. What this is basically, is a surgical sponge inserted into the infected area, and hooked up to a machine that constantly sucks out the bad stuff. For a large 4-legged dog like a GSD or Bernese Mountain Dog, the machine could be worn by the dog & treatment could be done at home; however with a more dainty new amputee, this was not feasible.

 

After they believed the infection was removed from the area, the surgeon stitched her back up, and she healed good as new (well, minus one leg, lol)

 

You might ask the hospital if they have access to a Vac-Therapy (or similar) for your girl. The hospital I took her to had just gotten theirs, but this was over 5 years ago. And - I'm happy to say that Twiggy is still alive and well today more than 5 years post-amp for Osteosarcoma. She is definitely one of the success stories!

 

I sincerely hope this is just a brief setback for your girl - in the meantime, do NOT beat yourself up, you went into this with the best of intentions, as I'm sure your girl's medical team did as well. Sometimes, things just don't go as planned.

[Guest got2now]

Thank you for the kind words and good points. I spoke with our vet and decided that we'll go through with this other surgery, then see how it goes. We've come this far and don't want all this to be in vain. It really helps to have a perspective from people who have been through it, and I cannot thank you all enough.

they hospitalized Twiggy for 5 days and used a Vac-Therapy bandage. What this is basically, is a surgical sponge inserted into the infected area, and hooked up to a machine that constantly sucks out the bad stuff. For a large 4-legged dog like a GSD or Bernese Mountain Dog, the machine could be worn by the dog & treatment could be done at home; however with a more dainty new amputee, this was not feasible.

 

 

Wow, that's a great story and super-useful info. I will definitely speak to them about it this afternoon. The culture on her infection is not ready yet, so we don't yet know what it is. So glad to hear your story - thank you.

[ramonaghan]

No experience with this or advice, but I just want to wish you both well. You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.

[palmettobug]

Our local specialist clinic has a hyperbaric oxygen chamber for pets, would that be something to consider?

[tra708]

I just wanted to chime in with my support. You make the most informed and loving choices you can, but many things are just out of your control. I've been through this twice, and in hindsight there are things I wish I had done differently, for sure. And I spent many hours freaking out, and shed many tears of regret.

Like others have said, stuff happens that you couldn't have predicted, despite your best efforts to do exactly the right thing. Don't be so hard on yourself!!

It sounds like once you get rid of the infection, your girl will turn the corner towards getting better. Find the vet that you feel the most connection with, and

ask them what they would do if it was their own dog. Don't panic.

Healing thoughts and prayers for your pup.

[Guest got2now]

A UGA vet just called to give me an update and lay out our options. She informed me that due to timing, the infection our grey got as a result of the surgery she was required to have for the clinical trial now precludes her from that clinical trial. That means more than just not being in the trial. It means that their costs will retroactively be our responsibility, and the future costs that were promised by the trial are retracted. And what that means that we probably can't afford future treatment.

In spite of the fact that we fulfilled their requirements and were assured of her participation in the study, they will exclude her participation because of an infection she acquired in their care. At no time did they print or say this. I trusted their words when making the difficult decision of putting our girl through the ordeal of amputation and subsequent treatment that was to follow. It is incredible that no one, not one single person in all those I spoke with, even hinted that if we did all that UGA required, they could pull the plug and renege on our agreement.

Based on the lack of funds to continue on our own, our dog’s life expectancy, after all she has been put through and the thousands of dollars we've spent, is roughly the same as if we had done nothing at all. I don’t understand how they can do this.

How does one party get to change the terms of a deal after the other party makes irreparable decisions that both parties participated in and agreed too? I just cannot believe this is happening.

Edited November 9, 2016 by got2now

[TwiggysMom]

I feel your financial & emotional pain. Due to her infection, Twiggy was never eligible for any trials. I am extraordinarily fortunate to have her still here & doing amazing. But funds are an issue. >$60m at this point (or at least the last time I checked). Being long-term unemployed due to my age doesn't help. But there is no way I can limit her life due to funds now, so I keep trying to do everything I can. When funds run out, there is nothing you can do, and there is tremendous sadness, but absolutely no shame in that.

 

That said, I hope it doesn't come to that for you & that we all hear a steady upswing for you & your girl!

[45MPHK9]

I am so sorry for what you are going through. Osteo is a goddamned nightmare no matter what route you take.

[greysmom]

http://www.animalfriendsrescue.org/financialassistance.html

 

I hope this link works. I'm so sorry.

[Guest got2now]

I feel your financial & emotional pain. Due to her infection, Twiggy was never eligible for any trials. I am extraordinarily fortunate to have her still here & doing amazing. But funds are an issue. >$60m at this point (or at least the last time I checked). Being long-term unemployed due to my age doesn't help. But there is no way I can limit her life due to funds now, so I keep trying to do everything I can. When funds run out, there is nothing you can do, and there is tremendous sadness, but absolutely no shame in that.

 

That said, I hope it doesn't come to that for you & that we all hear a steady upswing for you & your girl!

 

I feel your financial & emotional pain. Due to her infection, Twiggy was never eligible for any trials. I am extraordinarily fortunate to have her still here & doing amazing. But funds are an issue. >$60m at this point (or at least the last time I checked). Being long-term unemployed due to my age doesn't help. But there is no way I can limit her life due to funds now, so I keep trying to do everything I can. When funds run out, there is nothing you can do, and there is tremendous sadness, but absolutely no shame in that.

 

That said, I hope it doesn't come to that for you & that we all hear a steady upswing for you & your girl!

[Guest got2now]

Just reread my petulant and bitchy last post. So. Sorry. Everyone on here has been through tough times, and reading through your posts reminds me of how special and wonderful this breed is and the people it attracts. I'm lucky to have been a mom to 5 angelic greys and so so so grateful to have had an "open all night" place to talk about them for so many years.

 

I really appreciate the kind grey lovers who started and maintain this site and the owners who share experiences late at night when they could be sleeping or watching tv or or following election returns or doing anything else but typing to the heartbroken after a long day. It means a lot and it helps a ton. I forget about that donation button when things are going well and will do better.

 

Tomorrow is another day, and I'm going to drive to Athens and see my sweet sweet doggie and cannot wait to nuzzle her face and have her lean in for attention.

Edited November 9, 2016 by got2now

[o_rooly]

I read nothing petulant or bitchy in your previous post.

Please be kind to yourself.

I'm so sorry to hear of the exclusion from the trial. What an awful disappointment.

I was very fortunate to not have to battle osteo with my buddy Aston, but in his progressive illness and complications, I walked the tightrope between quality-of-life, risk/reward/side-effects and financial costs. It is no easy thing, and it's not a decision that is easily understood unless you're stuck in the middle of it. And even then....

I wish you peace and clarity, and remember -- When you make decisions, especially difficult ones like this, you are doing the best you can with the information you have at the time. Be leery of using hindsight to gauge whether you did right; it's just a way to beat up on yourself. You couldn't have foreseen this outcome.

Your decisions have been made out of love for your sweetheart. You can do no wrong there. Follow your heart.

We are here for you.

Edited November 9, 2016 by o_rooly

[TwiggysMom]

You are neither petulant nor bitchy. You love your girl and want to do the best for her

 

I know this is a very difficult time and I hope so much that your girl goes on to further great things

[3greytjoys]

http://www.animalfriendsrescue.org/financialassistance.html

 

This is an excellent link for pets' financial assistance.

 

Not sure if this might be helpful but Christine Kellogg, DVM relocated to Woodstock, GA. She participated in the Greyhound Heath and Wellness Program headed by Dr. Couto, in Ohio. Just thinking she might be able to refer you to a Greyhound savvy specialist for a second opinion.

 

Your sweet girl's situation is heartbreaking. I imagine she'll be so glad to see her most beloved person. Our thoughts are with you both.

[Batmom]

You don't sound petulant or bitchy at all. No advice, just sending lots of hugs for you and your girl.

[Guest Sportingfields]

No words, just.