So Many Babies

[MP_the4pack]

 

It seems every time I open up the H&W forum, there's another diagnosis of OS.

[Guest Energy11]

I was just saying the same thing to DH a while ago, when we had our five outside.

 

It is soo heartbreaking! It is like an epidemic!

 

God Bless and love them, and their families.

[CaliforniaGreys]

It really hurts

[Guest ss556]

I agree Mary Pat, I was thinking the same thing. How very sad.

[rycezmom]

Repost

 

I have tried to rationalize this in my own mind and it occurred to me that as time goes on, more and more people are joining GT. All of us are well within our comfort zone here and know that we will get wonderful support here when we lose one of our hounds. Support that is frequently withheld at work or among friends who are not hound or dog lovers. We are after all, here for the benefit of our hounds and their well being. GT is a very large extended family and we have taken each other and each others hounds into our hearts and know them so well that we have incorporated them into our everyday lives. Therefore, more people we know will post of their loss of hounds we have grown to love. I also realized that we, as a group, are caring for a larger and larger number of hounds who are living well into their old age. What wonderful care they are getting from their collective GT family to live this well and long. I like to think that maybe we are seeing more losses because the number of adopted hounds has increased. Because our communication has increased. Not only have we increased our knowledge and communication through this board but have expanded our friendships to worldwide. We share with a global greyhound community instead of our small local communities. This open global communication may just make it seem that there is more. It makes my heart swell with gladness that the number of hounds in forever homes today continues to increase. And with that increase we will always see an increase in loss. I will relish the numbers for I know that every hound we mourn here on Greytalk had a loving home, a comfortable couch and a family that loved him or her. What more could we ask for our hounds. "

 

 

Yes, the losses once again seem to be overwhelming. But they were all loved..............

 

L.

[sarabz]

I agree- every time I open up GT it seems like there's a new hound with OS. How prevalant IS cancer in our beloved greys, and other dogs? I'm sure there is a smaller percentage than it seems, right? Right?

 

[Guest buttonwillow]

I agree- every time I open up GT it seems like there's a new hound with OS. How prevalant IS cancer in our beloved greys, and other dogs? I'm sure there is a smaller percentage than it seems, right? Right?

 

 

 

I hope so. I've belonged to cat forums and horse forums and it seems like there is a tremendous amount of cancer, bone cancer in particular, here. I've never read any talk of amputations before. I've not had a dog since I was a child, til now, though. I just got here myself so I can't say but it is worrying me! Poor doggies, and poor doggie friends.

[RobinM]

It kinda comes in waves. My heart breaks that much more every time I read it.

[greysmom]

It's heart-breaking.

 

And Dude started limping a few days ago that rimadyll (sp?) doesn't seem to help. I'm so scared.

[Houndtime]

It is so sad and scary, too.

[Guest kydie]

I can't even post the saddness I feel for the pet parents that's pups are stricken with this, as we all know we could be next on this long list

[CaliforniaGreys]

And another

[mychip1]

I had the same thought - almost appears epidemic.....I know that Rottie's are prone to cancer, but it just seems overwhelming....and perhaps people are right; the fact that we gather here at GT makes it more noticable.

 

Are there any studies out there on potential preventatives....i.e. homeopathics, etc. Before Jack passed, I lived in horrible fear of it - as his mom had died at seven. And I count our blessings every day that our 10 year old's cancer last year was soft tissue and we got clear margins.....But now I look at my two and three year olds and wonder if there is anything I can do to help shield them from this.....I know what the answer probably is, sadly, because everyone on here w/a dog w/osteo would have tried to prevent it if there was any way. But I just don't know what the latest round of research is showing.....

 

More reason to support OSU's efforts....

[MerlinsMum]

I was thinking the same thing, too. My heart feels so heavy and yesterday I also heard that Lucy, a pretty 9-year-old greyhound girl who lives in my neighborhood, had her front leg amputated at the shoulder. She'd had a persistent limp and I had spoken to her guardian about it, and he was telling me about the tests she'd have to take, and I just had a nasty feeling in my gut at the time I haven't seen her or her guardian since it happened, I found out from DH who was told by Lucy's guardian's immediate neighbor.

 

Then I came home, logged onto GT and my heart broke for other people, all over again

[duncan41]

I agree- every time I open up GT it seems like there's a new hound with OS. How prevalant IS cancer in our beloved greys, and other dogs? I'm sure there is a smaller percentage than it seems, right? Right?

 

 

 

I am also reeling from the numbers of "C" diagnosis posted recently. When Dr. Couto spoke at Sandy Paws in 2008, he projected that 2 of 3 racing greyhounds (not show dogs) will be diagnosed with some form of cancer. That was two years ago, so I am not sure if that stat has changed. Dr. Couto's GH&W program not only benefits our beloved hounds, but crosses over to the human side - he works closely with the OSU Medical School. Makes me wish I had millions to donate to his program. Just think what a $10.00 dollar donation from every registered GTer would do!

[mychip1]

I agree- every time I open up GT it seems like there's a new hound with OS. How prevalant IS cancer in our beloved greys, and other dogs? I'm sure there is a smaller percentage than it seems, right? Right?

 

 

 

I am also reeling from the numbers of "C" diagnosis posted recently. When Dr. Couto spoke at Sandy Paws in 2008, he projected that 2 of 3 racing greyhounds (not show dogs) will be diagnosed with some form of cancer. That was two years ago, so I am not sure if that stat has changed. Dr. Couto's GH&W program not only benefits our beloved hounds, but crosses over to the human side - he works closely with the OSU Medical School. Makes me wish I had millions to donate to his program. Just think what a $10.00 dollar donation from every registered GTer would do!

 

Yup...I know what I would do with my money if I had a lot of it....!!! But even with a little, you are correct, worth giving. That statistic is absolutely frightening. I know of dogs where it occurred at the site of major injuries and I worry about my three year old who has healed up from a broken leg.....

[MP_the4pack]

Three of my four babies had cancer.

 

One OS,

One Fibrosarcome of the spleen and liver

One hemangio of the spleen and liver.

 

 

I believe Dr. Couto said that OS will hit about 25% of our NGA greys.

[Guest budsmom]

I agree that there is far too much of this horrible disease taking our beloved hounds. It breaks my heart to read of each new diagnosis, and I also fear for my own babies. I think, though, that there are a few things we should keep in mind. People whose hounds have been diagnosed are more likely to come here to GT for support and help, so I don't think we're looking at a statistically accurate sample. Also, I read somewhere that most dogs of all breeds and mixes will probably either be treated for or die of some form of cancer. Since they are living longer, we are seeing more "human" diseases of all kinds in our pets. I think we can all help prevent it by supporting causes like Dr. Cuoto's and by taking the best possible care of our hounds. The best quality food, vet care, love and exercise we can give them, which I know everyone on this forum already does or they wouldn't be here. I hope every day that with people like all of us here, Dr. Cuoto and his team, the Morris Foundation, the American Cancer Society, and all the other organizations working for a cure that our dreams will be realized soon and that we can end this horrible disease for all our family members - both fur and skin.

[NeylasMom]

Are there any studies out there on potential preventatives....i.e. homeopathics, etc. Before Jack passed, I lived in horrible fear of it - as his mom had died at seven. And I count our blessings every day that our 10 year old's cancer last year was soft tissue and we got clear margins.....But now I look at my two and three year olds and wonder if there is anything I can do to help shield them from this.....I know what the answer probably is, sadly, because everyone on here w/a dog w/osteo would have tried to prevent it if there was any way. But I just don't know what the latest round of research is showing.....

There is information out there. When I did my research I was of course paying more attention to the info about treating cancer rather than preventing it, but I did read some and I saw other things that I skipped over. What I remember mostly revolved around immune health (feeding an appropriate diet, supplementing with fish oil, etc.) and avoiding things that may be cancer causing (pesticides, fluoride, non-purified water, etc.).

 

Of course, even if you do everything right, it's nowhere near a guarantee. I'm sure there's a genetic component, and there is clearly a link to body size/build and to locations of previous injuries (fractures in particular), all of which make our greys more susceptible.

 

Osteo is a terrible disease. It's incredibly aggressive, too quick to metastasize and difficult to diagnose and treat. I wish no one had to deal with it and unfortunately for those of us who will have greys throughout our lives, it's pretty much inevitable. How terrible is that?!!

[silverfish]

I agree- every time I open up GT it seems like there's a new hound with OS. How prevalant IS cancer in our beloved greys, and other dogs? I'm sure there is a smaller percentage than it seems, right? Right?

 

 

Well, you know, I was thinking the same thing this morning. I called out to DH that there was another new dx of osteosarcoma which I thought was the fourth this week. His reply? 'American?' to which I replied yes, and he said 'That's very sad. Why do so many of them get osteosarcoma over there?' and of course, I have no answer.

 

I could talk over the possibles all night, but it's a fact that though any dog can get bone cancer, and it's particularly prevalent in the large, long-boned breeds, we just don't seem to see the numbers over here in England that you do. Oh, there have been cases, don't get me wrong, it's here. But not in the numbers. I spoke to Sid's trainer about it and asked her what sort of percentage she'd expect to see in her retired dogs and she shrugged and said 'Bone cancer? I don't think of heard of any. Most of my oldies seem to die of kidney disease, if anything'.

 

Now, I know she's had cancers - one of her house dogs died from thyroid cancer and a dog I had from her died from kidney cancer - but here, if your dog limps, OS is not the first thing we think of. Why?

 

I've wondered about the obvious difference between the UK and the US; the crate system. Our dogs aren't kept in crates, they're kennelled two to a run and share a bed (we have less sleep startle incidents too). But Dr Couto says no, because if that were the case, more males than females would get it and the numbers don't bear this out. He is (or was when I spoke to him via email) of the opinion that there is a strong genetic component.

 

So that begs the question, 'Is anyone in the racing fraternity doing anything about tracing the bloodlines that carry cancer genes and eliminating those dogs from the breeding pool?'

 

Does anyone keep track of retired dogs and what they died from? I seem to remember a survey being done a few years back. Did anything come of that?

 

 

Are there any studies out there on potential preventatives....i.e. homeopathics, etc. Before Jack passed, I lived in horrible fear of it - as his mom had died at seven. And I count our blessings every day that our 10 year old's cancer last year was soft tissue and we got clear margins.....But now I look at my two and three year olds and wonder if there is anything I can do to help shield them from this.....I know what the answer probably is, sadly, because everyone on here w/a dog w/osteo would have tried to prevent it if there was any way. But I just don't know what the latest round of research is showing.....

There is information out there. When I did my research I was of course paying more attention to the info about treating cancer rather than preventing it, but I did read some and I saw other things that I skipped over. What I remember mostly revolved around immune health (feeding an appropriate diet, supplementing with fish oil, etc.) and avoiding things that may be cancer causing (pesticides, fluoride, non-purified water, etc.).

 

Of course, even if you do everything right, it's nowhere near a guarantee. I'm sure there's a genetic component, and there is clearly a link to body size/build and to locations of previous injuries (fractures in particular), all of which make our greys more susceptible.

 

Osteo is a terrible disease. It's incredibly aggressive, too quick to metastasize and difficult to diagnose and treat. I wish no one had to deal with it and unfortunately for those of us who will have greys throughout our lives, it's pretty much inevitable. How terrible is that?!!

 

Yes, bone cancer is very aggressive and quick to metastasise, also very very painful.

 

As I said above, Dr C seems to think the genetic component is a very important consideration. Other factors? Well, I remember seeing Jennifer apply Frontline to Scooter when I was visiting and it seemed an awful lot of liquid to me - it leaves a streak an inch wide all down their backs? And it smelled quite strong. We don't have that here - we have Frontline, but it seems different. Just a very much smaller amount of liquid. So it got me wondering, how different is the chemical composition in things like Frontline? What else is different? Food? Pollution? Chemicals allowed in the US but not here? I just don't know.

 

And it makes me wonder what diseases we're seeing here, that you guys don't have much of! But I do know that OS isn't considered anywhere near inevitable here. Lucky for us, unlucky for you.

[mychip1]

Are there any studies out there on potential preventatives....i.e. homeopathics, etc. Before Jack passed, I lived in horrible fear of it - as his mom had died at seven. And I count our blessings every day that our 10 year old's cancer last year was soft tissue and we got clear margins.....But now I look at my two and three year olds and wonder if there is anything I can do to help shield them from this.....I know what the answer probably is, sadly, because everyone on here w/a dog w/osteo would have tried to prevent it if there was any way. But I just don't know what the latest round of research is showing.....

There is information out there. When I did my research I was of course paying more attention to the info about treating cancer rather than preventing it, but I did read some and I saw other things that I skipped over. What I remember mostly revolved around immune health (feeding an appropriate diet, supplementing with fish oil, etc.) and avoiding things that may be cancer causing (pesticides, fluoride, non-purified water, etc.).

 

Of course, even if you do everything right, it's nowhere near a guarantee. I'm sure there's a genetic component, and there is clearly a link to body size/build and to locations of previous injuries (fractures in particular), all of which make our greys more susceptible.

 

Osteo is a terrible disease. It's incredibly aggressive, too quick to metastasize and difficult to diagnose and treat. I wish no one had to deal with it and unfortunately for those of us who will have greys throughout our lives, it's pretty much inevitable. How terrible is that?!!

 

I will read up on preventatives.....I am particularly concerned about my three year old that I just got two weeks ago. He was retired due to a fracture. I had a BRIEF (1 second as he was kissing me) moment of hesitation on getting him for that reason, but how incredibly selfish would that have been....

[NeylasMom]

 

And it makes me wonder what diseases we're seeing here, that you guys don't have much of! But I do know that OS isn't considered anywhere near inevitable here. Lucky for us, unlucky for you.

What do you guys feed your dogs? And if kibble, what is it made from? Commercially raised animals or other?

 

Is racing different there than here? Length of time, when they start training, length of track or races, etc.? Other than genetics, which I could see would be a huge factor as I don't imagine there's much cross breeding b/w UK and US dogs, those are the things I think of first, but what do I know?

 

mychip1, I dn't blame you at all for hesitating. Now that I am dealing with this disease, I would think twice too, but in the end, what can you do? It's no guarantee either way.

[joejoesmom]

I know that Dr. Couto has said that 25% of US racing dogs get OS. I'm not sure, but I seem to remember someone saying (perhaps Dr. Couto) that US racing hounds do not have more cancer overall than other breeds, but that it tends to be bone cancer more often.

 

I urge everyone to remind themselves that the average greyhound lives a very long life for his size. In general, greyhounds are quite healthy compared to similar large breed purebreds. Yes, they seem to develop certain illnesses more than other breeds, but that is true of most purebreds. Dalmations have a high rate of deafness; most large breeds have a higher rate of hip displasia; most smaller breeds have a higher rate of luxating patellas; etc.

 

I am not saying that osteo is not devastating, it certainly is. There is no doubt it is painful and I truly wish it didn't strike so many of our beloved hounds. I just wanted to try to keep it in perspective.

 

I hope that the knowledge that osteo is an issue in our breed does not keep people from rescuing these noble dogs. Rather, I hope that this knowledge allows us to pay attention to minor changes in our dogs and insist on xrays in hopes of catching any possible cancer at an early stage.

 

Lastly, I urge everyone to support cancer research. Dr. Couto and his team work directly with our hounds, but their research also benefits humans. In addition to working with the OSU (human) medical center, the Greyhound Health and Wellness Program works closely with Nationwide Children's Hospital in Columbus. Apparently bone cancer in children and bone cancer in greyhounds share a lot of similarities. I know that protocols developed jointly between Dr. Couto and the doctors at Childrens have been applied to both greyhounds and human children.

 

Jane

 

p.s. I hope I don't sound too "preachy". I will get off the soap box now.

[joejoesmom]

I know that Dr. Couto has said that 25% of US racing dogs get OS. I'm not sure, but I seem to remember someone saying (perhaps Dr. Couto) that US racing hounds do not have more cancer overall than other breeds, but that it tends to be bone cancer more often.

 

I urge everyone to remind themselves that the average greyhound lives a very long life for his size. In general, greyhounds are quite healthy compared to similar large breed purebreds. Yes, they seem to develop certain illnesses more than other breeds, but that is true of most purebreds. Dalmations have a high rate of deafness; most large breeds have a higher rate of hip displasia; most smaller breeds have a higher rate of luxating patellas; etc.

 

I am not saying that osteo is not devastating, it certainly is. There is no doubt it is painful and I truly wish it didn't strike so many of our beloved hounds. I just wanted to try to keep it in perspective.

 

I hope that the knowledge that osteo is an issue in our breed does not keep people from rescuing these noble dogs. Rather, I hope that this knowledge allows us to pay attention to minor changes in our dogs and insist on xrays in hopes of catching any possible cancer at an early stage.

 

Lastly, I urge everyone to support cancer research. Dr. Couto and his team work directly with our hounds, but their research also benefits humans. In addition to working with the OSU (human) medical center, the Greyhound Health and Wellness Program works closely with Nationwide Children's Hospital in Columbus. Apparently bone cancer in children and bone cancer in greyhounds share a lot of similarities. I know that protocols developed jointly between Dr. Couto and the doctors at Childrens have been applied to both greyhounds and human children.

 

Jane

 

p.s. I hope I don't sound too "preachy". I will get off the soap box now.

Okay, so I just re-read my post and I'm afraid that it comes across as being callous and non-supportive. As anyone who knows me would say, I am not either of these things. Unfortunately, it wouldn't let me edit my previous post. So I apologize if anyone took it that way. My heart goes out to anyone and anyhound who has to face this terrible disease.

 

I just don't want anybody to decide against adopting a rescued greyhound simply because they are more likely to get bone cancer than other cancers. As we all know, these are very special dogs who all deserve to be rescued and pampered and spoiled and loved for the rest of their lives.

 

Jane

[silverfish]

 

Okay, so I just re-read my post and I'm afraid that it comes across as being callous and non-supportive. As anyone who knows me would say, I am not either of these things. Unfortunately, it wouldn't let me edit my previous post. So I apologize if anyone took it that way. My heart goes out to anyone and anyhound who has to face this terrible disease.

 

I just don't want anybody to decide against adopting a rescued greyhound simply because they are more likely to get bone cancer than other cancers. As we all know, these are very special dogs who all deserve to be rescued and pampered and spoiled and loved for the rest of their lives.

 

 

Jane

 

Jane, I didn't read your post as either preachy or callous just level-headed and objective - and when it comes to our beloved dogs, we do need to inject a little objectivity now and then, especially when it comes to huge, emotional decisions about things like bone cancer and whether to amputate or not. And you're right, it would be a great pity if someone chose not to adopt because of the possibility.

 

I don't envy anyone who faces the amputate/don't amputate decision. I talked this one through with Sid's trainer not so long ago who was trying to save a young dog with a shattered foot. She had never had to agree to a front leg amputation before (the owner didn't want him and said 'put him down') and she was torn - put him down, or amputate and hope he'd get adopted. She went with the amputation in the end after much agonising, and he's doing very well indeed - sigh of relief all round.

 

It's not easy.