Why Have We Been Spending So Much On Fancy Food?

[Guest KsFrets]

Being the typical caring pet owners, we've spent a small fortune on fancy designer dog food like Chicken Soup and Canidea and COTW and Nutro etc etc. It sucks paying upwards of $40 for them teeny 35 pound bags, only to have the houndies stick their noses up at it, and when they do eat it, the end result is a back yard full of dairy queens. Then last year we found a wholesaler food http://www.anirup.com/dog-foods.html that had good ingredients, good percentages, and the poopers even kind of like it, and the poo even became pick-up-able. We have to buy in bulk (10 bags at a time) to get them for $24 per 50 pound bag (that includes tax and delivery). Great deal, good food.

 

Well, several weeks ago I mis-calculated our next order, and fell short by about a week. So I went to Tractor supply, and picked up a 44 pound bag of basic Purina Dog Chow. Only $19. The big green bag. I decided to mix it in with what was left of the good stuff, to make it last, until the next shipment came. Well, to my complete suprise, the dogs LOVE the cheap Purina. I noticed them picking it out and eating it first. So I decided to do an experiment just to see how they do on the Purina. So with the new shipment of the other food still unopened, they are about halfway through the basic cheap Purina, and it's been full strength for two weeks now. I'm blown away! Three finniky greyhounds and our little mutt are gobbleing this stuff down like crazy and licking their bowls out, and eachother's bowls out! And their poo is almost bouncing... it's the most solid it's EVER been for all three greyhounds, since we got them. And, instead of the average three poos a day, they are down to two a day average.

 

So what gives? The dogs are doing better on this cheap Purina, than any of the fancy stuff I've blown a lot of money on. All indications are that it tastes better to them, and their bodies are processing and using it better. Even more amazing is that there was no transition troubles. It was as if they've been eating it all along. I'm going to let them finish this bag, and then go back to the "better" stuff I bought in bulk. That could be interesting. Is it possible that sometimes we love our poopers so much that we are actually buying them food that is too rich for them?

Edited May 3, 2011 by KsFrets

[Anne]

When I moved out here to the middle of the desert in Arizona, my choices were severely limited. We went to Pedigree and my dogs have all done VERY well on it. Coats are shiney, poops are firm, dogs love it and it's available anywhere I go.

I feel that the best food for your dog is the one that keeps on weight, keeps em shiney, keeps their poops firm and that they have no issues with. For me it's pedigree. My dogs were on a very expensive food and didn't do as well as they do on pedigree. They did well on Diamond too, but it difficult to find, so we don't use that anymore.

[Brindles]

Is it possible that sometimes we love our poopers so much that we are actually buying them food that is too rich for them?

You nailed it! Absolutely.

 

The canine nutritionist here will tell you that any bag of food with the AAFCO statement is fine to feed. He also says that dogs only need 18-22% protein, and that their requirement does not increase with exercise. Hard working dogs need more energy to top off muscle glycogen stores, but they don't need more protein.

Edited May 3, 2011 by Brindles

[Hubcitypam]

I quit being a food snob a LONG time ago. My Rex had colitis and a horrible tummy and I tried a ton of high end foods. What fixed him was Iams.

 

With just the one grey I feed straight Iams but when I have multiples I feed 1/2 Iams and 1/2 dog chow. When Elvis went home from his 7 months here his Mom marveled that I had put weight on him. She had fed him dog chow before as she used to be a kennel assistant, but the mix really worked for him.

 

Lots and lots of greys grow up on Purina products. Until they stopped making it a couple of years ago Purina Hi-Pro was a favorite of a lot of farms and racing kennels.

[Guest d0ggiem0mma]

I used to only feed the top shelf, A+, super expensive stuff. My whippet, Zipp, was such a finicky eater and we had a hard time finding something for him. At some point he got into my foster dog's cheap food (old yeller, nasty crap) and was loving it. Now we feed Eukanuba and he likes that. All of the dogs are doing really well on it!

 

Now as for the bottom shelf stuff, I won't go there. Just because your kid likes cake more than green beans doesn't mean it's good to feed nothing but cake!! I won't feed anything with artificial colors or weird stuff like that. They get the Eukanuba food, milk bones, and Purina marrow bone treats. Their coats look great, stool is fine, and they're healthy as can be!

[OwnedBySummer]

I don't feed top shelf, either. Summer refuses Blue Buffalo. And Taste Of The Wild needs a lot of additives before she will eat it. So... she gets Nutro (Natural Choice Grain Free, Turkey Meal and Potato). She loves it and does very well on it. And she does the happy dance for it, which she never did with the others. So, hey, who am I to argue?

[FiveRoooooers]

My professorial friend who is also a vet knows a professional sled dog racer (dog sled racer? it's early this morning ) who feeds his crew Purina Dog Chow. They are in tip-top shape, with beautiful coats and firm poo.

 

So with all the money you'll be saving now on kibble, you can spend more on stuffies and treats and .....

[Batmom]

Trends in dog diets tend to mimic trends in people diets. Not always a good thing. In particular, I wonder if the ongoing "rice is better than corn!" fad and the current "no grains" fad may cause more problems than they solve and may do a disservice to our dogs' health in the long run .......

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest kydie]

For me,,,,,,, it matters most where the food is made,,,, after the China issue years ago,,, I buy only products made in the USA,, each has to do what is best for them,, years ago when all food even the lower cost stuff was made in the USA,, it was less of a concern for me

[winnie]

We've been feeding our grey girls Diamond Naturals Chicken & Rice for years now. We made the switch when DH lost his job. It's a "cheap" food, but had very good ingredients and is usually high rated on those dog food nutrition websites. Our greys like it and do well on it too.

[Guest KennelMom]

We've fed the gamut from Pedigree to Kirkland raw to Natural Balance and TOTW - often going back and forth between a high end for a while, then a low end for a while to compare/contrast results. We've never had a problem with dogs eating any kibble we put in front of them and have had shiny coats on both low end and high end foods (spray fat onto any food and that will go a long way to shining up a coat, which is pretty much what they do to make it palatable and help with the shine factor b/c owners often correlate that with health). The bottom line is, feed what works best for your wallet, your life and your dog.

 

We fed grain-free food LONG before I realized how deleterious to human health they can be. I just didn't really understand the mechanism behind grains' interaction with GI and immune systems until I started learning about human nutrition. Who knows, though, if grains ultimately have the same effect on a dog that it does in people, since their GI system is a little bit different from ours.

 

Feeding a large crew over the years, I can tell you that most dogs will do just fine on just about any food and will probably live out their expected lifespan with few or minor issues stemming from their food. Some will have poop/GI or allergy issues with some foods. My order of preference for food will always be raw/whole foods then grain free kibble, then wheat/corn/soy free, then any other kibble on the market. Generally speaking, our dogs have done best (nose-to-tail appearance, poop, health and performance-wise) on foods in that order, though the totally grain free and wheat/corn/soy-free is probably a toss. Poop texture and smell varies wildly and doesn't seem to be very dependent on food "quality," but the volume is definitely related...the cheaper the food, the more output and that seems to hold true for every dog so far.

 

We currently feed raw. Across all the foods we've fed, I think I've had the best overall results from (in this order): Taste of the Wild High Prairie, Natural Balance, Iams in the green bag, Kirkland Lamb & Rice. The other foods were all "good enough to keep the dogs alive and looking OK" - it was usually a poop or gas issue that led us to switch.

Edited May 3, 2011 by KennelMom

[Batmom]

We fed grain-free food LONG before I realized how deleterious to human health they can be. I just didn't really understand the mechanism behind grains' interaction with GI and immune systems until I started learning about human nutrition.

 

Well, but ... newer research into what whole grains do in people shows huge benefits, far beyond colon regularity and including things like dampening inappropriate T-cell responses (that's the immune system), promoting recovery from cerebral ischemia, scavenging ammonia, relieving various forms of diarrhea not simply by "bulk" but by modifying gene expression, achieving beneficial changes in the vascular endothelium (read: prevent atherosclerosis, vasculitis) in similar fashion, reducing the activity of inflammatory chemicals, again partly by modifying gene expression ..... I don't know if the same level of research has occurred in canines (probably not, but I haven't looked), but the research into initial digestive system processing and digestive byproducts is quite similar between people and canines.

 

Interesting too is that these benefits seem to predominantly stem from whole grains. Not bran buds, not metamucil, not similar vegetable/fruit/legume constituents, but whole grains. It's wild.

Edited May 3, 2011 by Batmom

[Brindles]

Trends in dog diets tend to mimic trends in people diets. Not always a good thing. In particular, I wonder if the ongoing "rice is better than corn!" fad and the current "no grains" fad may cause more problems than they solve and may do a disservice to our dogs' health in the long run .......

This is exactly right. I don't think the grain free foods are bad for their health, but you can bet it's a marketing ploy. Those foods use potato instead of corn so they can call it "grain free." The potato may not be a grain, but it's still full of starch, just like corn and other grains normally seen in dog food. So unless you have a dog with certain allergies, feeding grain free is just jumping on the bandwagon.

 

Eliminate all plants and you eliminate carbs from the diet. Not a good thing. Grain free foods go straight through my dogs. They need the fiber from the plant products, so I'll stick to my Pro Plan.

[GeorgeofNE]

Every dog my family has ever owned before the last batch (now gone--so sad!) grew up on Puppy Chow and then Dog Chow.

 

Our dogs were, for the most part, dual purpose hunting/show dogs.

 

They were gorgeous, healthy, energetic, and there were really very few problems at all.

 

No one should feel pressure to spend more than they can or want to because some people believe you need to buy "the best."

[Guest KennelMom]

We fed grain-free food LONG before I realized how deleterious to human health they can be. I just didn't really understand the mechanism behind grains' interaction with GI and immune systems until I started learning about human nutrition.

 

Well, but ... newer research into what whole grains do in people shows huge benefits, far beyond colon regularity and including things like dampening inappropriate T-cell responses (that's the immune system), promoting recovery from cerebral ischemia, scavenging ammonia, relieving various forms of diarrhea not simply by "bulk" but by modifying gene expression, achieving beneficial changes in the vascular endothelium (read: prevent atherosclerosis, vasculitis) in similar fashion, reducing the activity of inflammatory chemicals, again partly by modifying gene expression ..... I don't know if the same level of research has occurred in canines (probably not, but I haven't looked), but the research into initial digestive system processing and digestive byproducts is quite similar between people and canines.

 

Interesting too is that these benefits seem to predominantly stem from whole grains. Not bran buds, not metamucil, not similar vegetable/fruit/legume constituents, but whole grains. It's wild.

 

The studies I've been able to find compare whole grains consumption to refined grain consumption and, yes, I would expect there to be benefits to that. I don't really care to get in to a debate on grains in this thread or at all, actually...I think we both know this is a subject that we don't agree on There is a TON of information out there for anyone who wants to spend the hours/days/weeks/months slogging through it.

[Guest Swifthounds]

Eliminate all plants and you eliminate carbs from the diet. Not a good thing.

 

Not quite.

[Guest BrianRke]

People tend to like food that is bad for them too.

[racindog]

The dogs willingness to eat a food is not always an accurate indiator of the food quality IMO. It is commonly observed that most dogs will prefer the cheap foods in taste tests because the cheap foods are loaded with "palatability enhancers" to get the dogs to eat it (since without them the ingredients are so bad the dogs wouldn't want to eat it at all).

 

 

[Guest kydie]

I agree "older" dog formulas have been around for years,, but like our own food,,it has changed a great deal,, the food I fed to my dogs 30 years ago,, is far from what is placed in those long time "stand by brands" today,, each must feed what they think is best,,, but at the time of the "China" dog food disaster I was sure glad I was not and had not been feeding ANY of the brands on THAT list for a very long time

[4My2Greys]

The dogs willingness to eat a food is not always an accurate indiator of the food quality IMO. It is commonly observed that most dogs will prefer the cheap foods in taste tests because the cheap foods are loaded with "palatability enhancers" to get the dogs to eat it (since without them the ingredients are so bad the dogs wouldn't want to eat it at all).

 

 

 

That was my first thought. Set a child in front of a bowl of shredded wheat and a bowl of sugar sweetened cereal and which one do you think they will pick. Odds are they will pick the sugar sweetened cereal every time. So that is not a good indicator of the quality of the food.

[Guest KsFrets]

Set a child in front of a bowl of shredded wheat and a bowl of sugar sweetened cereal and which one do you think they will pick

That's a fair argument, however, even if I was on a health food diet, and was having liguid poo every day for months, I would probably be very concerned and stop the diet. The "end" product of the cheap Purina food is the healthiest it's ever been (we've had greys for 4 years) for our dogs. It almost seems that the more I spent in the past on dog food, the more they poo'ed and the runnier it was. When they were on Nutro, Magnus was throwing up every night, nasty yellow stuff. As soon as we switched, that stopped. Edited May 3, 2011 by KsFrets

[Hubcitypam]

For me,,,,,,, it matters most where the food is made,,,, after the China issue years ago,,, I buy only products made in the USA...

Weren't a lot of the foods in the recall made in the USA using China sourced ingredients? And some were higher end brands.

 

My guys like the chicken jerky from China too. I eat off the dollar menu at Arbys and McDonalds. We're all still here.

[Guest Spencers_Greyt]

I hate talking about food because of getting slammed for what I feed my dogs.... but I have tried all the super high end foods as well and always had problems with them mostly in the diarrhea dept. So I have a friend that breeds Harriers and she feeds them Pedigree so I thought I would give Pedigree a try (this was 7 years ago) and lo and behold - no diarrhea and they all like it. So I have fed it ever since. I know that it doesn't have the best ingredients and I know that it has a lot of filler but if it doesn't make them sick then in my mind it can't be too bad for them!

[Guest FastDogsOwnMe]

To be honest I prefer higher end foods for the ingredients but when I have had to buy something grocery store (like when I was on a road trip and realized I forgot to bring the dog food ) or times in my past when I've been broke, my dogs did completely fine. I think my dogs could eat anything. They can switch with no problem. I think exercise is more crucial than diet in keeping dogs in top form Have thought so for many years, ever since I was a dog walker in my teens. I never could talk people into upgrading to a better food, but JUST with my walking, the dogs got shiner coats, better over all appearance, brighter eyes, and better behavior, and of course, more muscle and lots of weight loss. The only difference was with me walking them they got exercise.

[4My2Greys]

I am beyond slamming people for what they feed their dogs. I've had to make adjustments myself in what I feed my dogs because of budget. The biggest problem I have is with a company that charges an inexhorbitant amount for a "prescription diet" when the ingredients are nearly identical to some of the lowest grade dog foods on the market that you pay a fraction of that price for.