Bizarre Sunshine Behavior...

[JAJ2010]

This is going to be a book.... and I'm aware how insane this all sounds, but I'm hoping maybe someone will have suggestions for a direction to go or an answer for me.

 

So we are having one bizarre thing happen with Sunshine since the move in to the new house about a month ago. She's been having these growling episodes at what appears to be nothing. There are 3 big long ones that I have witnessed.

 

2 weeks ago she started growling in the direction of the Xmas tree. BF thinks she was growling at the cat but after she started growling the cat darted under the tree from behind the couch, so I'm not sure he is right... This happened in the evening

 

Last week she started growling at the empty couch first thing in the morning after her morning run/pee outside. We are not talking nice little growls, but a scary frothing at the mouth growl complete with hackles standing on end and a very stiff assertive stance from her. This went on for about 5 minutes while I stood there trying to figure out what was upsetting her. Finally I walked over to the couch and asked her "what are you growling at" She very slowly crept up to the couch (acting like something was going to jump out at her) and sniffed at a laptop?? Then was 100% fine!

 

BF has mentioned to me that she's been growling once and a while at nothing that he can pinpoint. I told him to keep an eye on her in case her hearing or eyesight is failing. She's only 4! But she is acting 100% normal when these episodes are not happening. Eating fine, playing fine, snuggling normally, etc. Rainy is not concerned while all of this is happening and she just ignores it! As do the cats normally

 

Sunday around 4:30am I woke up to growling. It was so steady and closeby that I assumed one of the girls were growling in their sleep. I laid there for a few minutes waiting for the growling to stop and the cute little yips of their dreams to start. The growling continued so I sat up to look and see what was going on. Sunshine was standing on the couch staring in my direction and growling the scary serious growl! I say my direction because I didn't feel the zip of fear in my belly that she was growling AT me. When I sat up I didn't say anything and was trying to wake up and figure out what exactly was going on. Maybe 2 minutes after I sat up Murdoc jumped off the bed and ran from the room. He usually sleeps on the bed with us, so that's nothing new. When he jumped off she stopped growling and laid back down. I laid back down and tried to fall asleep and she stood back up and started growling at the doorway of the bedroom! (Door is always open when we sleep) I got out of bed and approached her, petting her under the chin and asked if she was ok. Then she slowly and stiffly (not timidly) left the bedroom and checked out every room of the house. Almost like she was expecting something to be hiding in some corner of some room? She was completely non phased that I approached and touched her although she seemed to know that I was there so she wasn't out of it.

 

At that point I was awake and went downstairs to watch tv. While I was doing that she was in the livingroom play bowing at Murdoc to get him to play with her.

 

I'ma bit freaked out! Your not supposed to wake up to your dog standing there potentially growling at you! Is she having some sort of sleep episode? But all the other growly times have been when she was fully awake and she sure seemed fully awake and alert on Sunday morning.

 

She is on some anxiety meds to help her with her phobia of strangers. Is maybe that starting to effect her mentally? She hasn't had a medicine change in over 3 months. Otherwise she is sleeping, eating, playing, and is her normal self. Is she growling at the cat? Of so why? Is she going to escalate and try to eat the cat? (ok as I type this she just play bowed and tried to get Murdoc to play her her! LOL)

 

Is there something medically going on? If this is something she's doing without even knowing that she is should I crate her at night? If she starts growling at Gary or I we can handle it, but what if she corners and growls at BF's 10 yr old kid? (I'm not used to having to worry about a kid too!) She doesn't give me the impression of not being mentally there when this happens though. I think she is fully aware of what's going on but I just am not understanding. I'm hesitant to correct her since I really am not sure what exactly is going on...

 

My heart is saying that this is crazy this is my cuddly 'not a mean bone in her body' Sunshine who I've known for a few years now. But then that logical side kicks in and reminds me that she is an animal with large teeth and a huge bite. She can easily crack venison leg bones! The more I think about the growling at me the more freaked out I get! Do we need to keep us and the kitties safe by crating her at night or even just putting her muzzle on.... She actually wears her bright pink basket muzzle when we are not at home since she has naughty teeth and loves to chew on stuff. So she's used to wearing a muzzle, but I would hate to make her wear it while we are not at home and while we are sleeping.

 

This is a dog with zero aggression. I can do anything to her and she doesn't mind... Besides all of her naughty issues she really has turned into a normal well mannered dog. If you ask her to do something she does it cheerfully. Doesn't challenge the pack ranking of the house and is just an easy non alpha dog.

 

Could this be some sort of focal seizure? Then I start wondering about brain tumors... I'm hesitant to go to the vet and just say my dog is growling at thin air, is something wrong with her?

 

I actually have an email into Jackie, the lady we use for AC, and I'm hoping possibly she can help shed some light on this. I mean is the house haunted???

 

I know a friends pit was growling on at one of her bf's friends and Jackie told her it that the dog said it was because he has a dark something above him and the dog wanted everyone to know and for him to get it fixed. Friend is Wiccian so she understood and ever since the dog has LOVED that particular friend. This growling behavior was something that went on for at least 2 years prior.

[greyhead]

Why do you not want to go to the vet and say she's growling at thin air, as you put it? Brain tumor was the first thing that came to my mind. Did your Wiccan friend actually do something for the pit other than verbalize the problem? If so, could she do it again for you?

[tbhounds]

You really need to tale your hound to the vet for a full exam and have a complete blood panel run-- you really need to rule out a medical issue before you can look into behavioral problems.

[EnzaFerrari]

Medical check up of course, but I'd also look for mice. She might hear them in the wall, etc.

[Guest cwholsin]

Our friends have actually had the same problem with their doberman, and finally figured out that he's hypoglycemic. My bet is there's a medical issue going on that's causing personality changes during episodes. Mini-seizures is another possibility. Definitely take her to the vet and tell them about the bizarre hyper-aggresive episodes that are uncharacteristic and don't seem to have an identifiable cause (something that would normally elicit an aggressive reaction). Definitely take her to the vet and get her checked out!

[JAJ2010]

Why do you not want to go to the vet and say she's growling at thin air, as you put it? Brain tumor was the first thing that came to my mind. Did your Wiccan friend actually do something for the pit other than verbalize the problem? If so, could she do it again for you?

 

I guess I'm hoping for some direction on what to tell the vet. Right now I just feel a bit crazy... Sunshine is a shy dog who sees the vet enough as it is. I'm also trying not to hemorrhagic money if it can be avoided. I almost feel like it should be something that's brought up during an already scheduled visit not make an app because of this... If we was acting sick, lethargic, spooky all the time, not eating/drinking, running a fever, etc it would be easy to claim it's medical and we would be rushing off to the vet. But she is actually acting more normal and less nervous than ever in the new house!

 

She didn't do anything other than laugh with the friend and tell him what was said. Once everyone knew about the 'issue' the dog never growled at him again. No clue if the dark shadow ever left... But maybe the dog didn't feel the need to keep trying to tell him since he now knew? Even as I type this I'm feeling like I need a stink in the looney bin!

[JAJ2010]

I didn't think about mice! So it could be seizure related...

 

If we do go to the vet do we rush off this this week? Or can we wait until after the holidays? It's been 3 times in the past month (which is pretty infreq) and I find it suspicious that is magically started as soon as we moved to a new house...

 

If I'm able to verbally snap her out of it is it not medical then? So far I've just been very quiet and observed.

[vjgrey]

[i feel this response should come with a disclaimer - I'm ONLY describing what we've been through with our hound. NOT saying any/all of it applies to Sunshine's situation],

 

Oh, boy. I'm not sure whether my old threads are still around, but we've gone through something similar with Gabe. During his "episodes," he would snarl/growl at absolutely nothing for 3-4 minutes. Vicious, awful growls that always reminded me of the rabid dog scenes in "Old Yeller." Usually, he stood still during these, but during one, he actually crossed our bed and attacked me. He'd snap out of it very suddenly and would be back to his sweet, normal self with seemingly no idea what had happened.

 

We discussed his case with a neurologist, who recommended a lot of testing, but we ultimately decided not to go through with it. Our regular vet felt that we'd wind up spending thousands of dollars, put Gabe through a lot of stress, and probably still wouldn't get a definitive answer. He did feel we could narrow it down to two good possibilities - idiopathic epilepsy (essentially a focal seizure) or something called REM Sleep Behavior Disorder (Essentially the same disorder that causes people to act out violently in their sleep). While Gabe seemed wide awake during his episodes, they did always follow sleep.

 

We chose to deal with it physically/behaviorally by making sure he never sleeps near people or hounds. For a while, he was crated or muzzled, but since our other two hounds have learned to avoid him, and we don't have children, it's not really necessary anymore. He IS crated or separated from the girls when we're away.

 

It's worked fine for us. He had two or three episodes a year for several years but hasn't had one in...about three years, I think? We're not really sure why they stopped.

 

I would recommend crating or muzzling Sunshine at night until you can figure out what's going on. Or maybe you could get an X-pen and fence off the area with her bed?

[Tallgreydogmom]

I would start by taking him to the vet for a physical and blood work after the Holidays. Seem like the best place to start. I also go with mice or squirrels somewhere in the house. Try to listen to what he is hearing.

[JAJ2010]

[i feel this response should come with a disclaimer - I'm ONLY describing what we've been through with our hound. NOT saying any/all of it applies to Sunshine's situation],

 

 

OMG! YOU were the one story that had be freaked out the most Sunday morning after I fully woke up and started freaking out! During his episodes did he act like he was seeing something to growl at? If it's a seizure I'm confused why she would go and check each room in the dark afterwards.

 

I kept thinking "Is this how it started out with them?"

 

I didn't even think of Xpenning her couch off for nighttime. Thanks!

Edited December 20, 2011 by JAJ2010

[vjgrey]

[i feel this response should come with a disclaimer - I'm ONLY describing what we've been through with our hound. NOT saying any/all of it applies to Sunshine's situation],

 

 

OMG! YOU were the one story that had be freaked out the most Sunday morning after I fully woke up and started freaking out! During his episodes did he act like he was seeing something to growl at? If it's a seizure I'm confused why she would go and check each room in the dark afterwards.

 

I kept thinking "Is this how it started out with them?"

 

I didn't even think of Xpenning her couch off for nighttime. Thanks!

 

No, he didn't seem to be looking AT anything while he growled. It was more like he was looking through things. He also didn't seem to have any memory or awareness at all of what had just happened. Even when he attacked me, he didn't seem to be aware of what he'd just done. He seemed confused/worried that I was upset and crying.

 

There's probably a simpler explanation for Sunshine's behavior. I certainly didn't mean to freak you out!

[FiveRoooooers]

If I read everything in your post correctly, this is new behavior for Sunshine since you moved into the new house? She never displayed this behavior or anything like it in your previous house? What, if any, other changes have occurred since the move? The advice to get Sunshine checked out is excellent. But I'm also going to go out on a limb here (probably alone) and suggest that she may be trying to tell you something about the new house.

 

edited to correct "he" to she. Sorry.

Edited December 20, 2011 by FiveRoooooers

[seeh2o]

But I'm also going to go out on a limb here (probably alone) and suggest that he may be trying to tell you something about the new house.

You aren't alone here, my first thought was medical issue, my second thought was ghost(s) in the new house.

[GeorgeofNE]

Medical check up of course, but I'd also look for mice. She might hear them in the wall, etc.

 

 

That's the first thing that I thought too. Rodents in the house she's seeing and you're not.

 

Look everywhere for droppings--but also take her to the vet. Could be a vision problem, could be something worse.

[JAJ2010]

If I read everything in your post correctly, this is new behavior for Sunshine since you moved into the new house? He never displayed this behavior or anything like it in your previous house? What, if any, other changes have occurred since the move? The advice to get Sunshine checked out is excellent. But I'm also going to go out on a limb here (probably alone) and suggest that he may be trying to tell you something about the new house.

 

No other changes to diet or care other than we moved into a new house. Her last med change was in Sept and we just bumped her amatriptamine up .25mg I've never dealt with any type of seizure, but she's not trance like while it's going on. At the Xmas tree incident she even glanced at me then went back to growling at that spot. I'm torn becasue I'm not convinced it's a medical thing, but then the worrier in me thinks maybe it is medical and I'm just crazy to go with my gut instinct.

 

And they are used to moving/traveling. We travel every weekend in the spring/summer/fall plus have moved Apts at least once every year for the past 3 years.

 

Her vision appears to be fine. She can still catch popcorn and her hearing is still impeccable when she wants it to be. No visual changes to her eyes (I'm going to pretend I didn't attack both dogs with a flashlight to compare)

 

But I'm also going to go out on a limb here (probably alone) and suggest that he may be trying to tell you something about the new house.

You aren't alone here, my first thought was medical issue, my second thought was ghost(s) in the new house.

 

ok the people that know her have been suggesting this! Should I be worried about that?

 

[i feel this response should come with a disclaimer - I'm ONLY describing what we've been through with our hound. NOT saying any/all of it applies to Sunshine's situation],

 

 

OMG! YOU were the one story that had be freaked out the most Sunday morning after I fully woke up and started freaking out! During his episodes did he act like he was seeing something to growl at? If it's a seizure I'm confused why she would go and check each room in the dark afterwards.

 

I kept thinking "Is this how it started out with them?"

 

I didn't even think of Xpenning her couch off for nighttime. Thanks!

 

No, he didn't seem to be looking AT anything while he growled. It was more like he was looking through things. He also didn't seem to have any memory or awareness at all of what had just happened. Even when he attacked me, he didn't seem to be aware of what he'd just done. He seemed confused/worried that I was upset and crying.

 

There's probably a simpler explanation for Sunshine's behavior. I certainly didn't mean to freak you out!

 

I was freaked out about your situation way before you posted here. That was the first thing that popped into my head on Sunday since she was growling in my direction. She's not very trance like though. After she sniffed the laptop on the second episode she got all wiggly and embarrassed. "Nothing to see here, I wasn't growling at a laptop... Look aren't I silly when I wiggle and wag my tail..."

[Batmom]

Mice or chipmunks in the walls, or new furnace/plumbing/house settling sounds.

[seeh2o]

I had critters in the attic and in the walls once, my beloved half grey would start barking toward the sound in the middle of the night from wherever he was sleeping. I didn't know they were in the house until he started barking at them in the middle of the night. It wasn't vicious as what you are describing, but that's probably individual to each dog.

 

As for ghosts, you may want to ask Soulsmom about living in a house with a greyhound and ghosts.

Edited December 20, 2011 by seeh2o

[FiveRoooooers]

I had critters in the attic and in the walls once, my beloved half grey would start barking toward the sound in the middle of the night from wherever he was sleeping. I didn't know they were in the house until he started barking at them in the middle of the night. It wasn't vicious as what you are describing, but that's probably individual to each dog.

 

As for ghosts, you may want to ask Soulsmom about living in a house with a greyhound and ghosts.

[Guest sheila]

2 weeks ago she started growling in the direction of the Xmas tree. BF thinks she was growling at the cat but after she started growling the cat darted under the tree from behind the couch, so I'm not sure he is right... This happened in the evening

 

Last week she started growling at the empty couch first thing in the morning after her morning run/pee outside. We are not talking nice little growls, but a scary frothing at the mouth growl complete with hackles standing on end and a very stiff assertive stance from her. This went on for about 5 minutes while I stood there trying to figure out what was upsetting her. Finally I walked over to the couch and asked her "what are you growling at" She very slowly crept up to the couch (acting like something was going to jump out at her) and sniffed at a laptop?? Then was 100% fine!

 

These two incidents are what jumped out at me. First you have a new house and now there is a tree in the house that probably has blinky lights and decorations on it. That might be confuzzling enough. Then if you have a cat that may or may not have been under the tree, moved to the couch than back to the tree, there is another confuzzling thing. Perhaps on the second incident (for a dog that is already confuzzled) the laptop made a bleep or a tweet that caused yet another confuzzlement? It seems like most incidents revolve around the couch and may or may not be related to one another but a combination of things that happen in that area. Is there any way the cat could be 'messing' with her in addition to the new home and the Christmas tree?

[Hollis]

But I'm also going to go out on a limb here (probably alone) and suggest that he may be trying to tell you something about the new house.

You aren't alone here, my first thought was medical issue, my second thought was ghost(s) in the new house.

 

 

Nope, not alone. My FIRST thought was ghosties.

[KahluasMagic]

My first thought was ghosts too.

[BatterseaBrindl]

My first thought was also GHOST!

 

I live in a house that was built well over 100 years ago.

We also are very rural and get mice, especially at this time of year when they're trying to get someplace warm.

Neither of our Greyhounds hear the mice, but Bandit, our Pointer, was very good at letting us know we needed to set a trap.

 

I also work in a century+ buiding.... and there are ghosts there.

[Guest Energy11]

I definitely would do a complete exam and bloodwork to rule out the physical, then, worry about behavioral. As was previously mentioned, physical problems can definitely cause behavioral.

 

I have heard of haunted houses, so who knows! Dogs, cats and children do see things we don't.

 

But, having been in human and veterinary medicine, I would rule out possible physical causes (*I am also thinking focal seizures), then, go from there. '

 

Is your dog a senior? Our Goldie, 11, has "episodes" like that nightly. She will cry, look at the ceiling, bark, growl, and sometimes, come at me (never DH). She has Canine Cognitive Disease (Doggie Alzheimers). She does this for a while and then, goes to sleep. She sometimes needs a Valium to chill. We are used to it.

 

Sending good thoughts your way!

[JAJ2010]

These two incidents are what jumped out at me. First you have a new house and now there is a tree in the house that probably has blinky lights and decorations on it. That might be confuzzling enough. Then if you have a cat that may or may not have been under the tree, moved to the couch than back to the tree, there is another confuzzling thing. Perhaps on the second incident (for a dog that is already confuzzled) the laptop made a bleep or a tweet that caused yet another confuzzlement? It seems like most incidents revolve around the couch and may or may not be related to one another but a combination of things that happen in that area. Is there any way the cat could be 'messing' with her in addition to the new home and the Christmas tree?

 

Actually those would be two different couches. Sunshine has her own couch in the bedroom to sleep on. The laptop does beep when closed but that would be a normal sound... Maybe she is just confused. Although we've been here almost 2 months. It was Mid Nov when we moved in. Seems like we've been here shorter though! I would normally agree with the cat messing with her, only it seems to revolve around Murdoc and he's not the brightest crayon. Frizzle is the evil one!

 

I definitely would do a complete exam and bloodwork to rule out the physical, then, worry about behavioral. As was previously mentioned, physical problems can definitely cause behavioral.

 

I have heard of haunted houses, so who knows! Dogs, cats and children do see things we don't.

 

But, having been in human and veterinary medicine, I would rule out possible physical causes (*I am also thinking focal seizures), then, go from there. '

 

Is your dog a senior? Our Goldie, 11, has "episodes" like that nightly. She will cry, look at the ceiling, bark, growl, and sometimes, come at me (never DH). She has Canine Cognitive Disease (Doggie Alzheimers). She does this for a while and then, goes to sleep. She sometimes needs a Valium to chill. We are used to it.

 

Sending good thoughts your way!

 

She's only 4 yrs old. When Goldie has seizures is she "out of it" or does she seem very cognitively with it?

[JAJ2010]

I just sched an app with our AC for 11am tomorrow morning. Maybe I'll get some answers!