Update On Bailey And Questions About Chemo

[TinyMityMo]

It's been a month since Bailey had her splenectomy and was diagnosed with cancer. For the most part she has done really well and bounced back nicely - her appetite picked up immediately and she seemed in good spirits. We've known though that there were more tumors scattered throughout her omentum that her vet could not remove. In the last week I think she's back sliding some. She's getting picky eating again though and I thought I could feel one of the remaining tumors in her belly (meaning it's gotten bigger). She's starting to have more urine leakage so I'll need to up her DES frequency.

 

 

Original biopsy said spindle cell sarcoma. We sent a sample of the tumor to Dr. Couto since he asked for more histochemical stains to verify that it wasn't hemangio. It wasn't. He said it was fibrosarcoma. He said that the VAC chemo protocol has a better than 50% probability of working and that they could supply the two injectable components to my vet. I believe they will be mailed out today

 

Edit in the middle of writing this post. I just spoke with my vet and she is going to arrange for the chemo to be administered by an oncologist she has consulted with before (one who knows of OSU and Dr. Couto too). So, the following questions were originally typed out to share with my vet, but I'll still ask them for my own benefit.

 

 

What I was wondering is if anyone on GT has had experience with chemo treatments and can share some of the details. Does it need to be a day long visit or an office visit? Do they give the IV drugs with extra fluids or anti emetics. What blood values to they evaluate and how often? What immediate and longer term side effects are seen? How many cycles of chemo are given?

 

This is the protocol they recommend...

 

VAC protocol (21 day cycle)

 

• Vincristine (Oncovin^®): 0.75 mg/m2, IV, days 8, 15.
• Doxorubicin (Adriamycin^®): 30 mg/m2 (or 1 mg/kg if < 10 kg), IV, day 1.
• Cyclophosphamide (Cytoxan^®): 200-300 mg/m2, PO, day 10.
• Sulfa-trimethoprim: 15 mg/kg, PO, q12h

Edited February 25, 2010 by TinyMityMo

[grey14me]

No experience, but wanted to send hugs and prayers for your sweet Bailey :hope

[Wonder]

Oh Mo

 

How many Burpdogs do you have left? And is she eating them ok?

[gazehund]

Also no experience, but wanted you to know I am thinking about you and Bailey.

[racindog]

Whe Ivy got hers it would take around an hour-IV. I gave her around 6 Fresh Factors a day and it never caused her any problems. I really think they helped keep her immune system strong etc. She had 4-6 treatments. She suffered no ill effects from the treatments-didn't even loose her appetite. Bailey is in my prayers.

 

 

[Wonder]

Mo- do you have Fresh Factors?

[TinyMityMo]

Mo- do you have Fresh Factors?

 

no. She'll still eat goodies with relish but is getting picky on the kibble (switched her to Evo red meat formula) with add-ins. I was rushed this morning, so after she left half her kibble I let Murph finish it and she got to gobble 3 Burpdogs quite happily.

[dante2zoe]

No experience with dogs, but my son had the VAC treatment every three weeks as part of his cancer treatment. I don't know if it correlates, but that combo was rough on the kidneys/bladder and he had to remain in the hospital for 36 hours on IV fluids to flush things out. He still ended up with some damage, but 6 years later is alive and well, so its all good in my book! Wishing you the best! If you have any other questions, please let me know. Cindy

[Guest zoolaine]

I think it depends on the chemo used. I know Sunny started chemo Tuesday(for high grade cutaneous lymphoma) but it is using different drugs and protocol (he only has chemo once every 3 weeks) . On his chemo days he has to be dropped off by 9am and they check his blood work - CBC - and if that is good they do the chemo in the early afternoon and he is ready to be picked up between 3-5pm. I think whatever chemo they are using they check the bloodwork prior to the treatments.

 

The side effects in dogs are much less than in people. In their words: with people they try to "cure" them where as in dogs they try to control and put it into remission. They practically kill people in order to kill the cancer. With dogs they want them to be able to have a quality life, "what's the point if they can't just be a pet dog" .

 

Good Luck with the treatments

Edited January 29, 2010 by zoolaine

[Guest bigorangedog]

We just have experience with the doxorubicin. Whitey has had 3 of his 5 treatments, every 2 weeks. So far he has not had a single side-effect, although he is shedding a lot (but not excessive - just more than usual).

 

At our treatments, they do a CBC first thing and wait about 15 min to see how his white blood cell count is. Then they give him a shot of Benadryl. They put in the IV and attach a little pump thingie -- they put the syringe of doxo into the pump and it continually infuses the drug over 20 minutes. They wait a half hour to make sure there were no really bad effects, and then we go home. Whole thing usually takes less than 2 hours.

 

I hope your process goes as well as ours has.

[Guest MorganKonaAlex]

I've had 3 dogs go through chemo for osteosarcoma and I went through it for breast cancer. Demon and Morgan had 4 rounds of carboplatin. They take a CBC before the appt. The Vet Onc examines the dog and if the WBC and RBC are high enough, the chemo is administered immediately following the exam. It only takes 15 minutes or so and we stay in the room during it. Then we leave.

 

Alex has an alternating protocol of carboplatin and doxorubicin and a different oncologist. They wanted him dropped off and picked up several hours later.

 

Some of the different procedures are because of Vet preferences and some is dictated by the drugs. I had doxorubicin and Cytoxan myself. Doxorubicin will burn skin if it comes in contact so there are additional precautions handling it. It's bright red and the patient's urine will be red for several hours afterwards. I think it's a bit harder to take than some of the chemo agents. Alex had no noticeable side effects after carboplatin but did seem a bit lethargic and had a lower appetite after doxorubicin. Cytoxan causes bladder irritation. They really want fluids pushed for the first 24 hours to flush it. It caused a metallic taste in my mouth. Food didn't taste right and was very unsatisfying.

 

As mentioned by another poster, the dose given to dogs is less than humans. They don't tend to have the stomach issues humans get.

 

If the WBC isn't high enough, they postpone chemo by a week to give the WBC more time to recover. None of our treatments were delayed but it's not uncommon and nothing to panic about.

[greysandmollie]

Mo,

 

I went through chemo with Rascal for Lymphoma. It has been several years ago now so I don't remember the drug names anymore. His treatments were fairly short...inserted an IV into his leg and put the drugs in. He was also on oral meds in the initial treatment. He would be extra tired the next day but always rebounded pretty quickly. My vet recommended pred which had the great side effect of getting them to eat. We didn't do that due to Rascal having no bowel or bladder control but he ate fairly well through it. I never had to leave him for treatment and I believe we went once a week for 6 weeks.

 

I have some Fresh Factors if you would like to try them I would be happy to send you a bottle to see if it helps.

[Guest mybabies3]

I agree that it depends on the kind of cancer. My gh is being treated for lymphoma. His protocol was for weeks on once a week and one week off then four weeks on. His treatments never exceeded 30 minutes including the CBC. The two middle treatments were not effective, one was a series of chemo pills for four days. His protocol was switched to having to get treatment five days in a row with the chemo being administered through a cathater which stayed on for the five days. Schultz handled the treatments well and had a ravenous appetite when he was on the preds. Since being off the preds he has a pretty good appetite as long as he gets something really tasty along with his kibble (chicken, burger, rice, noodles veggie....)The thing that took the longest in the whole process was driving the 50 miles one way and then back for treatments. Best of luck to you and your journey.

 

Oh yea, the Zofran for nausea is the best. It is the same meds my mother is taking during her chemo. They give it thru IV during some of this treatments and he gets it in pill form at home for several days after treatment.

[Wonder]

 

 

I have some Fresh Factors if you would like to try them I would be happy to send you a bottle to see if it helps.

 

I just sent her a bottle today

I have 2 more bottles so if they seem like they are working, I'll bring them to Sandy Paws

Sparks has been on them for a few years but at his age, I don't think they are going to do much more good

[Guest TaraCoachCougar]

Cougar had his spleen removed back in June, but his cancer was hemangiosarcoma. He did the treatments where he went every three weeks. We could see a change in appetite for up to three days following each treatment, but he would always eat and drink. We just had to find the right thing for him to eat. Canned food was usually favored over kibble and yogurt and cool whip became staples, too.

 

Following the IV chemo, we put him on leukeran pills. We started with 2 per day, but he's got other issues going on so I backed off to 1 every other day and if he is struggling, I'll stop him for several days.

 

At his check-up at the end of December he was still clean from the bloodword, ultrasound and x-rays. I think the trips down to the oncologist where harder on him than the actual treatment.

[crazygang]

Just sending prayers for Bailey...

[Guest IrskasMom]

Me to sending Hugs and Prayers for Bailey

 

BTW. What is Fresh Factors and where can you get it ???

[Wonder]

Me to sending Hugs and Prayers for Bailey

 

BTW. What is Fresh Factors and where can you get it ???

 

• Promotes strong joints and bones*
• Helps dry up and heal hot spots and prevents new ones*
• Restores bloom in older dogs
• Promotes healthy joints in growing dogs*
• Helps give all dogs a luxurious coat and itch-free skin
• Enhances digestion/reduces stool size, cleanup
• Promotes a playful, upbeat attitude
• Provides raw food factors necessary for a dog’s optimal health
• Contains equivalent of 10,000 mg of cartilage (50 to 1 concentrate) per tablet
• Easy to feed chewables – highly palatable

http://www.springtimeinc.com/product/88/2

[grey8greys]

Fresh Factors are a great suppliment, you can get them at www.springtimeinc.com. They are having a sale now buy 2 get 2 free. I have been using them for years and am very pleased with them. I also use Joint Health which is also very good.

[Guest GryffinSong]

I was treated with adriamycin and cytoxin for breast cancer. I understand that dog doses are smaller, but I had a terrible time with white and red blood counts, nausea, dizziness, fatigue, taste changes, and more. The low white and red counts hospitalized me three times. I needed blood transfusions, antibiotics, and isolation to lessen the chance of infection. It was not fun at all.

 

Hopefully your baby will be ok. Hugs!!!

[TinyMityMo]

Bailey had her first chemo today. Since last Wednesday she's been peeing in her sleep. She was already on DES for doing this on occasion but increasing didn't stop it. Lab tests done Monday and Wednesday show that she has 2+ protein in her urine and very low serum albumin. She's not concentrating her urine much. Dr. C called it overflow incontinence. A quick and dirty ultrasound at my vet last night showed a large tumor (that you can feel and even see bulging out a bit) on/around her right kidney.

At the specialist today they wanted to do their own ultrasound with their high tech instrument. That showed that tumor is 8.14 cm and that there are multiple smaller ones throughout her entire abdomen. Her stomach, small intestine and bladder have slightly thickened walls and she is starting to accumulate a small amount of fluid in her abdomen.

She seems ok tonight. She ate much of her dinner (canned Wellness). She is quiet though - perhaps a holdover from the Benedryl they administered. So, hopefully she'll respond to the chemo and shrink that one nasty tumor and get her protein to stop spilling into her urine.

[greysandmollie]

Many for the chemo to work!

[Batmom]

Sending prayers and some scritchies for your so beautiful, so sweet girlie.

[MP_the4pack]

That's the protocol Dr. Couto recommended for Pearl.

 

She doesn't have incontinence, but her cancer was really hot and grew way too fast in just 2 weeks post splenectomy. Her liver tumors were growing faster than 1 cm a day.

 

She had her chemo on Monday, but is not responding.

 

However her sister Diamond had chemo for OS during Nov and Dec. It was only Doxyrubicin, not the VAC protocol. She had quite a bit of incontinence after the first chemo, but it's abated. She's back to one proin a day. She used to be one every 2-3 days, but after chemo I had her on twice a day.

We're back to once a day with a few misses here and there.

 

I'm glad she's feeling fairly well. I hope you are lucky with the chemo.

[TinyMityMo]

Bailey had 3 out of 4 parts of the chemo. When she went in for the 3rd part they said her white cell count was a little low and to wait until Monday (an extra 3 days) before trying the last part. She'd been eating less and less and when we took her in this past Monday for the last part of the first round of chemo they told us that it was obvious that the chemo wasn't working and that the main tumor was significantly larger. They said they could keep her overnight and give her IV fluids and still give her the last dose, but that it would make her very sick and wouldn't help. Of course we didn't do it and took her home.

She might have held on a few more days, but she was barely eating anything - just no room inside I guess. We had been thinking Saturday would be the day, but she was so shaky on her feet this morning and really resistant to getting up and moving around so we took her in tonight and helped her to the bridge.

So, she's up there now, digging huge holes and chasing bunnies.

 

Good night my sweet Bailey-Boo, we tried, really, we did.