Bizeebee

Our guy definitely also likes to 'take laps' around our house, and we see the distinctive "better get outside" trot as well. So, while I can relate to the frustration at a lot of fruitless outside trips, I would say this is probably normal. Now, if he's actually needing to go out (especially #2) a lot of those times then you might make sure he's ok medically. If he's eating on a schedule things should move through him on a schedule as well. On the other hand, as I'm sure you know well, boys can almost always scrounge up more pee to mark on things Obviously this depends a little how long you've had him - if he's pretty new, then kind of weird behavior like this is probably just a reflection of him not quite being comfortable and settled in yet. I also think the new ones kind of need to be told where to be - on a bed or wherever - when the humans are doing their own thing ~ making dinner, watching tv, etc. Ours, at least, needed encouragement to go relax when we were doing the same, or couldn't be paying him constant attention. These guys aren't used to getting to make their own choices to the extent they get to when they live in a house. If you get the impression that he's doing it just to go outside to sniff/play/dink around then maybe try rewarding him when actually does his business, and not rewarding (whether with treat or undue attention) and bring him back in quickly if he does not. Have you done any training with him? If he's amenable to it, you might work on a different 'tell' for going outside. Ours is making good progress ringing a bell.

Originally the main concern was obsessive drinking (and thus urinating) along with a few of the other maybe-greyhound but maybe-Cushings type things [very easy to bruise, minor hair loss, constant hunger - he'd be overweight if we allowed it]. We're technically still waiting on the urine Cushing's test, but we expect it will be negative. Does the ability to concentrate his urine kind of rule out diabetes insipidus? He also only does the drinking/peeing when we're home and awake - leading us/vet to believe it's more behavioral/anxiety related. Considering his malabsorption, constant 'starving' attitude, and likely upper GI upset, an anxiety explanation isn't that hard to believe. We also learned when talking to the vet more in depth that it's not a mass on the adrenal, it's actually that one of the glands is just significantly larger than the other, but proportionally so. With that, and the negative metanephrine test, the vet isn't as concerned about the adrenal at the moment. Unless the Cushing's test surprises us, or he starts to seem unwell, the plan is just check it again in a couple of months to see if it's changing.

Any nutritionists in the house?? We're feeling a bit overwhelmed by the recent recommendation by our vet to put our grey (4yo male) on a hydrolyzed diet. He was found to have low levels of folate and cobalamin; he wasn't/isn't really having notable GI symptoms but had lost some weight so on a hunch they tested his absorption along with a bunch of other things [other tests negative/normal]. So they've recommended supplements as well as trying a hydrolyzed (veterinary) diet for a while to let his gut heal up. Now I'm hitting a wall in my research and having a hard time finding good answers to my questions; so I'm hoping someone here might be able to weigh in. Especially since we can't really talk to the vet again until Monday. There are a limited number vet diets, and they all seem to either be hydrolyzed chicken or hydrolyzed soy. He had previously been on chicken food (stupid, in hindsight, but with no obvious bowel issues we had no reason to change it), so I'm wary of chicken as it is more likely to be something he's sensitive to. Is this a logical assumption? Or is it moot because it's hydrolyzed? The truly burnin question: I've noticed some of these vet foods have other, plant proteins (usually potato or pea) that are not hydrolyzed. Does this not matter? Is it only animal protein that really matters?? What about the protein in grains and other non-animal sources (thinking about treats)? Does all the protein need to be hydrolyzed for this kind of diet to work?? I've also found one food with hydrolyzed protein that actually isn't prescription-only, and is much more affordable - which is hard to ignore. It also gets a lot closer to nutrient percentages that we'd like him to be at, but maybe those are too much for a dog in this situation? This food also has peas, which do contain protein and it's not hydrolyzed. Should this option be dismissed out of hand because it's not a prescription food? https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/product/wholehearted-grain-free-skin-and-coat-care-pea-and-salmon-recipe-dry-dog-food#pdp-ingredients Does anyone have any experience with these foods? Any knowledge or experience to share? Grateful to any and all

Yep, extensive ultrasounding is how we found the mass in the first place. We were referred to the university vet school after our normal vet exhausted the "well, it's not a UTI or stones" route on drinking/urination issues. We actually just talked to the vet about more test results (nothing on paper in hand yet) but it sounds like he was negative for urine metanephrines, so the hope is we aren't looking at a pheo. And since they established he can concentrate his urine they are skeptical of Cushing's. They actually found that he has some malabsorption issues - cobalamin and folate - so they're recommending dealing with that straight away. Fingers crossed that's all it is.

GT'ers who've had or seen a grey with Cushing's - do they actually get the potbelly? If so, do you have a picture you would share? We're currently in the process of figuring out what is up with our Bismarck, all we know at the moment is that he has a significant adrenal mass, and a lot of symptoms of Cushing's. The rest of the important test results are pending - hopefully we'll know by the end of the day today. He certainly doesn't seem to have the potbelly, which does seem to be pretty common in Cushing's dogs. But, with a greyhound, I don't know what that would even look like.

Have you joined the "Getting rid of parasites" facebook group? It has a vague name, but it's basically about greyhound hookworm. Jennifer Ng is pretty active there and it's an all around decent (if overwhelming) resource for info. I think you also need to be careful when evaluating any protocol based on the experience of other dogs whose medical histories you won't necessarily know. This protocol is more conservative and might be fine for a dog that's not super-infested. For a dog whose count/symptoms are high/intense, the increased dosage of the as-written Prison Protocol may be worth the risk.

Just wanted to say that coconut oil can be given orally as well. Same advice as far as not doing too much too quickly, but if there's any concern about fish breath/farts, an alternative oil can help with that Back in the fall our guy 'blew out' his coat and got pretty flakey for a few days but then it mostly stopped and the flakes did too. He's still a little flaky on what I'd call his top butt (where the tail meets his back) but it only flakes if we give hearty scritches, he doesnt seem bothered by it or to itch. It seems like some dogs shed a little all the time and some shed a lot a few times a year. If it's not normal shedding, you might look at the food she's on. It seems like that's the first place you look when it's a derm issue. And maybe secure some fleece, or other soft material, around the straps of the harness that hit the irritated areas?

We did the Prison Protocol to the letter (some people prefer a variant where doses are staggered) and have had two negative tests, we're waiting a little longer to do the antigen test (as opposed to fecal). We started as soon as we got him and did the protocol for just shy of six months.We'll also be keeping him on Advantage Multi, or an alternative moxidectin topical, monthly to keep any stray larval leak in check.

What time is her last turn out? Maybe try pushing it to as late as you can? It doesn't sound she she's waking up starving, I've got one of those and you definitely know it when that's what they want. Does she tend to eat or drink right before bed? Or maybe even get up while you're sleeping for a midnight snack? One nice thing about having a regular eater is you can anticipate bathroom times a lot better. You might put the food bowl up after a certain time of night, could probably limit water, if there's no medical issue, for the last two hours before bed. New treats or food that are moving through her at a different pace? We've definitely noticed that when we change things up. It definitely could be her waking up for some other reason - new neighbor who leaves really early? Furnace kicking on? Pjs did help our guy somewhat (but not when he's dying of hunger). And they are darn cute. Depending on where you are, you might get a helping hand with a clock reset this weekend. In most of the US, at least, we 'Spring ahead' on Sat night/Sun morning.

You've got some excellent advice here, I wanted to throw in my two cents and some experiences we've had as well. My first thought is that you haven't had him very long, so short a period that IMO 1)you can't really say he has true SA and 2)you can't reasonably expect to have done that much bonding. When we got our current grey we honestly didn't do real alone training. We would have, but we got to pick him up earlier than we expected and weren't quite ready work-wise. We got him on a Saturday and went back to work on Monday. He hated the crate so we didn't use it, and I watched him on a nanny-cam when I was at work. I came home midday for lunch to let him out and play. For the first week or two he cried and yowled when we were gone, but he never did anything destructive and it got better over time. We let him cry it out and he got used to the fact that we were coming back and by a month in I wasn't using the cam anymore because he was just sleeping while we were gone. He had been an overexcited hazard when we first came home, but we ignored behavior we didn't like (barking, jumping, craziness) and now he greets us much more calmly and gets pets pretty much as soon as we walk in the door. That just took time, time that you just haven't had yet. Yours could have true SA, but you don't know that yet. He's still settling in, and you are too. There is really no new-dog scenario where you wouldn't be dealing with something like this - whether it was a puppy and potty training, or a different rescue and other issues. There's really no such thing as a seamless transition with a new pet. There's no shame in returning a dog that isn't a good fit, but I also don't think you've given this the proper time to know if that's necessary. I'm also shaking my head at whatever guidance is encouraging you to train your dog to be independent. Dogs that aren't feral need us for everything, what does being independent even mean? My personal opinion would be to throw away guidance that is telling you not to love on your dog because it's going to teach them to have SA. That's not a thing. If you want to pet him, pet him! I wouldn't reward/pet him when you don't want to encourage him (like maybe don't encourage snuggling while you're on the toilet), but if he comes up to you, and you both want to snuggle, snuggle! Once you do that, I think the bonding will come must faster. But also remember that the bonding ebbs and flows. When we first brought ours home he was awesome, so snuggly and playful (the polar opposite of our first shy spook), but come winter and we've run into issues - maybe medical maybe behavioral, the investigation is ongoing - that makes us question what we've been doing and what we need to do moving forward. I think they say 3 days, 3 weeks, 3 months - general milestones for settling in and changes in personality. 3 months hit us hard; some people still see dogs coming out of their shell at a year. YMMV. I'm not sure why you guys don't want him in your bedroom, other than not wanting to have to deal with training it out later, but I'll tell you this story: My SO got his first greyhound around 8 months before I came along, and during that time the dog got to sleep in bed with him. Once I was in the picture, the bed was definitely not big enough, so the hound had to choose between the many comfy beds - in our room or elsewhere in the house. He adjusted very well, and even moved himself into the room across the hall for the duration of his time with us. While I wouldn't necessarily recommend letting him sleep in bed with you unless you really want that, if he's pacing and whining on and off all night, he's anxious all night. How would you feel being stressed for that many hours on end? Do you use a crate? It seems like crating isn't as big of a thing in the UK, but a lot of people in the US swear by it. Many dogs do really well with a den-type area, both at night and when they are alone during the day. You might not get too much advice on it locally, but I think you'll find good resources here (and elsewhere on the internet) if that's a route you want to try out. You just need to dial back the managing and the stressing (he can sense it and it's not helping). Live your life how you want to (with the bedroom door open) and help him find his place in it. In a month or so, my prediction is that things will be a lot different.

Was he fostered in a house prior to coming to live with you? If not, you might as well ignore anything the group told you about him being house trained. He was kennel trained while racing - which means they get to go out 3-4 times a day, but if they mess in the kennel in between that time, well, it just happens. No one is there to reinforce good, or discourage bad potty behaviors. Approach it like house training a puppy (albeit a large one) for the first time. If you can find out what the turn out schedule was at the kennel that'll be a good place to start. You'll have to teach him give you a "tell" to going out, hopefully you can reward and retrain what he had been doing. Some greys literally never develop one. A big boy who's not great on a leash, not quite potty trained, and two small dogs in the house, I think I'd still have him leashed to me when I was home, for his safety and everyone else's.

No worries I appreciate any insights. For us, there are definitely more medical tests/things we could do, but the issue certainly seems to be boredom or anxiety (leading to excessive drinking) as well. Did the prozac work for Ernie?

Do you mean a 'cone of shame' type collar, or a training collar? Googling e-collar hits both. I'm going to assume you mean cone - I've actually heard of more people having an easier time with putting a shirt/pants/some kind of clothing on the dog, to loosely (and safely) cover the area of injury. That way the dog isn't also impeded by the cone, and can pretty much live life as normal, just without the ability to lick or get at that area.

We definitely noticed worse poops the day or two after dosing, but our non-dose-day poops were never quite as bad as some (and you) have experienced. We also don't really know what our hounds worm count was, as the vet never told us when we were getting positive results. For our guy, poop improvement was much more dependent on finding a food that agreed with him. That's kind of hard when you know there are multiple variables at play, but we definitely noticed a difference with the three or four we tried. And we supplemented with Olewo carrots a lot when we first got him, that definitely helped keep things firm while we were figuring things out and he was settling in. Others will chime in, I'm sure, with dosing specific shedding or side effects they may have seen.

Forgot to mention, if you aren't already using something like Olewo carrots or (plain) psyllium powder, either of those could help firm up her poops some while you're working on treatment.

We did some borax sprinkling on our poop spots [we babysat a hook dog with pudding hookwormy poops] after scraping up as much as we could. It takes a bit of a toll on those spots, but that was June and by August you couldn't even tell where those spots were. I wouldn't recommend it for all over treatment, but for spot treating it really wasn't any worse than pee burn on the grass. No judgement, I also take a lot of pride in my yard, but honestly, with a greyhound that gets to run, pee, poop, and possibly even dig in your yard, your partner is going to have to get used to not having the same yard as before-dog. It can still be beautiful, but it's likely never going to be "perfect" again. On the other hand, if you guys find a turf grass that can stand up to your grey running around without tearing it up please let me know what variety that is!

I had read somewhere online that dumping some 20 Mule Team (borax) onto the residue left in the yard would help eradicate the bugs from the pile places. We did that when we were babysitting a pup with hooks and pretty bad poops. Hard to know if it works, since you can't really test the soil, but fingers crossed. And, if you are somewhere it's currently below freezing, that should help a lot keeping them from thriving in the soil. FWIW, unless your German Shepherd was around a bunch of infected greyhounds, or in a shelter somewhere greyhound-hookworms are rampant (Florida), she may not have the same type of hooks that greys have. By all means go to whatever vet you are comfortable with, but it's become pretty evident to the greyhound rescue orgs in the trenches that these hooks aren't the same as the hooks the average other dog contracts. Yours may be a regular variety (albeit a bad infestation), and could very well be treatable by normal methods. The methods greyhound owners are having to use to get rid of hooks are pretty intense; if your non-grey can avoid that it would be preferable.

Our boy also has developed a tendency to act restless and whiny in the evening when we want to relax, and after ruling out a lot of medical things (important to do that first), we think he is probably just bored - especially since the weather here has been AWFUL. We try to do some training exercises, or games - like hiding tiny treats in his toy box so he has to dig for them, and are thinking about training him to chew (only on approved things) just to use up some of that energy until we can actually hang out outside again. Maybe try fostering or babysitting another hound and see how that goes?

We've also had (early) success with the Prison Protocol as linked above. It includes Drontal and Advantage Multi. And I'll echo, definitely check out the hookworm thread, it has a lot of good information from people on modified protocols that have had some success as well. Unless your vet is already very experienced with this problem, they probably are woefully ignorant of the specific hookworm situation with greyhounds. You'll probably have to educate them on protocols, etc.

This link definitely has great information, but it doesn't actually mention the two drugs from the Prison Protocol (Advantage Multi & Drontal Plus). Nor do the four drugs it does mention - Bravecto, NexGard, Simparica, and Credelio - share the same active ingredients as the PP drugs. I'm no vet, but from the name the drugs don't appear to be in the same family. Advantage Multi : Imidacloprid & Moxidectin Drontal Plus: Praziquantel, Pyrantel pamoate & Febantel Bravecto: Fluralaner NexGard: Afoxolaner Simparica: Sarolaner Credelio: Lotilaner Obviously, everyone has to make their own decisions for their own dogs, based on their vet's advice and what they observe. But I'm personally skeptical of unverified claims about neuro issues from the Prison Protocol. It's purely anecdotal, but we gave the Protocol as directed by the group who came up with it and not only did we not experience negative effects but it appears to have worked for our dog (we're due for a third fecal soon). I believe others have had similar success (in the hookworm thread). I'd just hate to see a new owner scared off from a working protocol based on a claim without any evidence (as of yet).

Do you have a link for the discussion of neurological issues associated with the Prison Protocol? Obviously the protocol is off-label use of the products, but I haven't been able to find anywhere to read up on neuro issues dogs have had. OP - The main takeaway is that the current crop of hookworms are TOUGH and there probably isn't one "correct" protocol that is going to work for all dogs. And whatever does work is taking a long time. The hookworm thread is long but definitely worth wading through to see the other things that people have tried and had success with. Have you tried Olewo carrots to help firm up stools in the meantime? They work (I assume) similarly to psyllium husk. I'm not sure if vets do this, but for people, unknown digestive bleeding would probably result in an endoscopy or similar procedure to see where the bleeding is actually coming from. As for water, you can actually buy a refractometer (it measures how well the urine is concentrated) on Amazon for like $25 and you can see for yourself (as often as you want) whether his pee looks ok. Although your vets should certainly have done UAs to confirm that as well. But if your pup is essentially eating their water (whether in food or with carrots/psyllium) and still peeing normally then I wouldn't worry about water. Unless you live in Australia where it is a million degrees, or the dog is showing other obvious signs of dehydration.

We just finished the Prison Protocol (to the letter) and I dont think there were any of those kind of behavioral things that we really noticed, But, we started the protocol as soon as we got him and we're now just settling into a "normal" monthly flea/tick kind of routine, so we didn't really have a baseline before treatment.

The answer really depends on what food your using (calories/other percentages) as well as the other protein you're actually giving. Kibble can vary up to 100 calories per cup! But if your vet isn't concerned you probably don't need to be either. Ours looks really skinny to me and the vet wishes he was even lighter than he is!

He would LOVE this. But do you find that playing this game kind of encourages your dogs to ransack the house when you aren't playing the game?

Ya, I'd call this normal greyhound behavior. Our first hound had a couple too many run-ins with little dogs at the dog park; even when muzzled he could pound them into the dirt. We don't go to the dog park anymore. Though there is a place by us that takes private reservations, and I know some people in our local hound group have gone together. Something like that might work nicely for her, but if it was my dog I wouldn't be taking that chance at the regular park anymore. It's also worth mentioning that there's probably no such thing as a dog being good with "all dogs" or "all big dogs" etc. Every dog is different like every person. The dogs she has met up until this point may have been communicating "we cool" whereas at the dog park (or similar scenario) it's a free for all of playing/rough housing/chasing and she can literally catch any of them she wants.