Weird Redness Around Eyes - What To Do What To Do?

[ChiliDog]

A hound destined to come home to Quebec has this weird redness around both his eyes ...

 

Kennel manager told me that "it was probably from tearing and the family should use eye wipes"

 

I don't think so....

 

Any thoughts? Or at least any thoughts on what we should ask the vet to look for and/or test?

 

 

 

Edited December 7, 2013 by ChiliDog

[KF_in_Georgia]

I can't tell you what it is, but I can tell you the kennel manager is flat-out wrong. The tear-staining dogs get is stained fur, not reddened skin. It also happens below the eye, not all around it.

 

I'd ask the vet for a referral to a veterinary dermatologist.

[Batmom]

Could be demodex (NOT contagious). I'd let regular vet take a look-see first.

[kudzu]

Only time I've seen anything like that there were also at least a couple other spots on the dog that looked red or had hairloss. One dog has allergies. The other dog had demodectic mange. The problem areas on the dog in the picture more closely resembles my memory of demodex. As I said though, there were also a few other places like some redness on her toes. It was minor, not dramatic, so didn't really catch my eye much. The reddened areas of hairloss around the eyes was much more obvious & what initially caught my attention. There were also small spots of hairloss on her ears. She had long hair on her ears so those were not obvious either. As the condition progressed those areas did all become obvious but not in the beginning.

 

Just based on my prior experience I'd suggest a skin scraping on the first vet visit. That may help direct the vet towards a more likely cause or exclude the less likely causes. Good luck.

 

edited: because I'm an idgit

Edited December 7, 2013 by kudzu

[winbo]

Our joe had eyes that looked like that and it turned out to be because of food allergies.

[macoduck]

We've had a GT person in the past have a dog with similar hair loss. Hopefully someone will have better recall than me.

[ChiliDog]

we were thinking mange or allergy and someone suggested ringworm ??

[KF_in_Georgia]

Obviously, your vet isn't going to do a referral to a specialist until he's seen the dog first.

 

But my vet did a lot of "I'm not sure. Let's try this" for my dog. Nothing showed on skin scrapings, and we tried antibiotics, prednisone, ivermectin, topicals, changing foods, etc. I love my vet, but I had to ask him for the referral after we'd spent a year giving various things a try.

 

So unless your vet looks (or does a scraping) and says, "I know exactly what this is," and gives you a definitive diagnosis, you might need to push for a referral. My girl saw at least three different vets in two months (animal control's vet, rescue group's vet, my own vet); each vet prescribed exactly the same thing--cephalexin and prednisone after scrapings that showed nothing helpful. Her problem turned out to be a fungal infection (ringworm) below the surface of her skin--didn't show on scrapings--and a bacterial infection at the surface and was only diagnosed after a biopsy. The biopsy wasn't cheap, but I'd spent more than that in the previous year ineffectively treating the wrong problem.

[Josie]

we were thinking mange or allergy and someone suggested ringworm ??

Maybe red mange?

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/demodectic_mange.html

[cleptogrey]

looks like allergies to me. all of the mange i have delt w/ is raw looking,(demodex and scrop.) mange can initially looks like a scrape that doesn't heal. a good old fashioned vet will most likely be able to identify it quickly. food change, shampoo, environmental allergy?? have those listed when he goes for a consult. hopefully some benadryl and a basic diet change will do the trick. what's the main ingredient in the pup's kibble?

[philospher77]

Are the eyelids swollen any? Any discharge? Just am getting through treating a nasty blepharitis in Pixie-pup, so of course that's the first thing I think of.

[BatterseaBrindl]

That's not ringworm or scabies.

Sorry I can't help help any more

[Remolacha]

Looks like allergies to me too, but I have never personally delt with mange, so I don't really know what it looks like.

[Guest MnMDogs]

Could be demodex (NOT contagious). I'd let regular vet take a look-see first.

Funny, I just asked Ryan if that's what Mar's eyes looked like when he got her because she had demodex. He said yes, looked a lot like that.

[Charlies_Dad]

Kennel manage doesn't know what they are talking about. I would agree it looks like it could be an allergy issue or mange. Demodex makes sense as well at this appears very localized.

[kudzu]

all of the mange i have delt w/ is raw looking,(demodex and scrop.)

Have only dealt with mange once so our experience could be atypical. However, my girl's symptoms developed slowly & in the order of localized hair loss in very small spots. The the skin in that area would get red. Then it would seem to clear up. Then it recurred in a new spot. It wasn't until it occurred on her hocks & she developed secondary infection that she was diagnosed with demodex. And it didn't look raw until the secondary infection set in. Up until then we had two different vets thinking it was likely an allergic reaction. In contrast the dog with allergies had red, raw looking skin around the eyes first then it spread to feet.

 

I think the reason my girl with demodex didn't have raw looking skin was because it didn't appear to cause her any itching or discomfort. That is until the secondary infection set in. The dog with allergies spent a lot of time rubbing her face. But there was more than just the rim of her eye with problems. Then again, she was a foster & already had the condition. Who know what it looked like in the beginning.

[ChiliDog]

What is the treatment for demodex?

 

I feel VERY bad about this as he's still at the kennel awaiting his neutering and the family who chose him (Mom, Pop and three kids) are so very anxiously awaiting him at home.

 

 

But I don't want to adopt to them a hound with a possible expensive medical issue

[kudzu]

Treatment is ivermectin but as what I felt was very scary high amounts. Thankfully for most breeds, Greyhound included, there is a really high safety margin. My girl was a longdog, a Staghound. She was Deerhound x Greyhound x Borzoi. She tolerated it extremely well. Had no problems. And it worked. Well, it worked for the most part. She was one of the rare dogs who ended up with chronic demodex but we never had to repeat the ivermectin treatment for it. It just showed up with a small spot or two when she had some major stress. We also had her spayed as hormones can play a big role. We did a full thyroid panel as thyroid probs can contribute. Really anything that can dampen the immune system can contribute to demodectic mange. My girl's was idiopathic.

 

Back to treatment - It is not expensive at all. I bought a $50 bottle of Ivomec injectable cattle wormer & a bottle of molasses. I used a syringe to suck up the prescribed dose of Ivomec & then filled the rest of the syringe with molasses. The molasses is to cut the awful taste of the Ivomec. My girl, who was usually very pick about food, actually enjoyed having this squirted on her food. The priciest part of it all was the initial treatment of the secondary infection that had attacked before diagnosis & the follow up skin scraping to make sure the treatment had worked. Even that wasn't expensive as veterinary costs go.

 

Here is my concern about dogs who develop demodex as adults. It is believed to be the result of some immune system problem. Sometimes it's never any more than the one major outbreak of demodex which is cured with ivermectin never to return. For other dogs, like my girl, it becomes chronic but more importantly it can be a harbinger of possible future immune related problems. You won't know until after treatment whether your dog is the unlucky one. The good news is that these dogs are the exception. The majority (I'd say the vast majority) of dogs don't have serious probs from the treatment, the demodex after treatment or immune system related trouble.

 

Note: You do need to do the skin scraping for diagnosis before starting treatment. Also, you need to make sure the person administering the medication is careful with the dose & complies with the medication schedule. If I remember correctly, noncompliance can contribute to demodectic mange becoming chronic. (And yes I did wonder if I'd somehow messed up my girl's treatment. I don't think so but I'll always wonder.) And you must follow up with skin scraping to confirm the demodex is gone. If not gone you much continue the treatment.

[GeorgeofNE]

Mange or allergies.

 

Probably allergic to those eye wipes!!!

 

Just kidding. Not ringworm. Treatment for mange is not expensive (at least not here).

[Charlies_Dad]

I hope you can get this boy to his new family soon Donna.

[ChiliDog]

I hope you can get this boy to his new family soon Donna.

 

Trying, Kyle, trying.

 

BTW tried to PM you - your box is full