Ronan Has Osteo

[Guest 2Brindles]

My sweet boy Ronan began limping on Saturday, but his feelings of restlessness had started two or three weeks prior to the limp. I waited through Wednesday, giving him canine aspirin and waiting to see if would resolve itself with limited movement, rest, and the aspirin. I was able to get him seen this morning; being that he is eight now and a greyhound, the vet immediately recommended x-rays to which I readily gave my assent. She came back with an image, the faintest and most innocuous-seeming shadowy area on his upper right front leg. The x-ray of his chest did not reveal metastasis. I will be taking him to Pieper Memorial on Monday to meet with one Dr. Robert Gilley. It is an initial exam and consult, although I have been told Ronan will need a biopsy for a definitive diagnosis. I am concerned about putting him through such an invasive procedure; can a definitive diagnosis be concluded with more x-rays? Will a biopsy undermine his bone?

 

I should note that I do not want to put Ronan through extraordinary measures. I do not want to put him through the trauma of an amputation (particularly the amputation of a front leg), nor do I want to put him through chemotherapy and radiation. I do not mean this a slight against pet owners who do choose this route; for my part I do not want to diminish his current quality of life only to receive a few more months. He is eating, drinking, and moving about with a little difficulty. I want to provide him with pain management until his quality of life starts to diminish, at which point I will set him free.

[BauersMom]

I'm very sorry you're dealing with this.

 

My suggestion would be to have OSU read the x-rays, before a biopsy (and it really should be a fine needle aspirate, FNA) is done. They may be able to help without you needing further diagnostics.

 

The OSU consultation link is here:

https://greyhound.osu.edu/consultationservice/

 

There is also great information about pain management in the osteo thread in this forum.

[robinw]

Oh no! I'm so sorry. I went through this with Phoenix a couple of months ago, and handled it the same way you are. I second BauersMom's suggestion of sending the x-rays to OSU. If nothing else, it will give you confirmation of the diagnosis. I did not have a biopsy/FNA completed as OSU was very confident in their diagnosis. I've heard that a traditional biopsy can compromise the bone, but that an FNA is fine.

 

Please let us know if there's anything we can do, OK?

[greysmom]

If you are opting for palliative care then a biopsy is not useful. The care you give him will not change whether you "know" it's osteo or not. Plus, fine needle aspiration is very tricky to use as a diagnostic tool - unless you get the needle in just the right place, it doesn't grab the cells you need to look at. It's pretty painless and non-invasive, as tests go however. A larger core biopsy (sorry, I've forgotten the correct name) will likely remove too much of an already compromised bone.

 

Make sure you speak to you vet about having adequate pain meds on hand at all times. They can go along just fine for weeks and then all of a sudden need something stronger - and it's usually on a weekend when vets are closed. Tramadol in combination with gabapentin seems to be the most effective combo. Though tramadol can cause some dogs to become restless.

 

I'm so sorry for you and your family. I hate this disease and how it takes our beloved sweathearts away. You can come to the osteo thread and just have the support of others going through this too, if you'd like.

[Batmom]

 

I'm so sorry you and Ronan are having to deal with this. No advice, just lots of hugs for both of you.

[45MPHK9]

I'm so sorry to read about Ronan. Our Bee Wiseman was just diagnosed with osteo this week, too. My vet did a set of X-rays. He was very confident that she had osteo based on those X-rays. Just to be sure I sent the X-rays to OSU and they agreed that X-rays were consistent with osteo. We knew that we would not opt for amputation/chemo for Bee. We told our vet not to do the FNA or bone biopsy. We felt confident that we had all the information we needed.

 

Hugs to you and Ronan.

[4My2Greys]

[Guest 2Brindles]

Thank you for the advice and suggestions. I do have both radiographs with me as I will be bringing them to the specialist on Monday. If I wanted to submit the radiographs through the OSU submission form, can I scan the images using my computer scanner without damaging the images?

[mychip1]

Many prayers...

[BauersMom]

Thank you for the advice and suggestions. I do have both radiographs with me as I will be bringing them to the specialist on Monday. If I wanted to submit the radiographs through the OSU submission form, can I scan the images using my computer scanner without damaging the images?

 

Yes, you can. If they have enough resolution/clear enough, this will likely be enough for them to go on. I scanned mine in but they wanted more views before they made an assessment, and so I went to Angell Memorial in Boston to get digital/high-res X-rays and they were emailed to OSU directly.

[Guest boondog]

I'm so sorry.

 

I'm so sorry to read about Ronan. Our Bee Wiseman was just diagnosed with osteo this week, too. My vet did a set of X-rays. He was very confident that she had osteo based on those X-rays. Just to be sure I sent the X-rays to OSU and they agreed that X-rays were consistent with osteo. We knew that we would not opt for amputation/chemo for Bee. We told our vet not to do the FNA or bone biopsy. We felt confident that we had all the information we needed. Hugs to you and Ronan.

 

I'm also sorry to hear about Bee. I must have missed it.

 

All of you are in my thoughts.

[Devotion]

I'm terribly sorry about Ronan. A real gut punch, osteo is...

 

IMHO there isn't a reason to do a biopsy or even a FNA. I've been down this road several times. way more than I'd like to admit. If you are going the pain management route just make sure you have adequate meds on hand. I too have only done pain management for mine. My advice is to talk with your vet about pain management now. In my experience it didn't just creep up with the pain intensity. It came on suddenly and I wanted to be able to control it. Bone pain is horrible so have some good drugs on hand.

 

make each day count. let Ronan live each day to the fullest.

 

blessings to you both...

[Guest AmberStar47988]

Oh no! I'm so sorry for Ronan and Bee, and both of their families.

[Charlies_Dad]

I am so very sorry to read of Ronan's diagnosis. I hope you have many months of happy memories with him, take a lot of pictures and share them if you can.

[GeorgeofNE]

So sorry about Ronan AND Bee.

 

I wouldn't bother with a FNA either.

 

Crummy disease!

[Batmom]

IMHO there isn't a reason to do a biopsy or even a FNA.

 

That really depends on the appearance of the bone lesion and on any other symptoms or radiographic findings for the specific case. There are other bone conditions -- several different fungal infections and bacterial infections, for example -- that cause bone lesions. Some of these lesions may be difficult to distinguish from osteosarcoma, and some respond well to treatment. If the specialists have any doubt, I would certainly encourage a FNA.

[Guest 2Brindles]

His limp has gotten really pronounced since yesterday; I had to wait to start Rimadyl with him today as I had been giving him canine aspirin up until Wednesday and the vet did not want to mix meds. I'm hoping that gives him some relief through Monday, at which point we will see the specialist.

[robinw]

His limp has gotten really pronounced since yesterday; I had to wait to start Rimadyl with him today as I had been giving him canine aspirin up until Wednesday and the vet did not want to mix meds. I'm hoping that gives him some relief through Monday, at which point we will see the specialist.

I'm sorry. I hope the rimadyl provides relief.

[cleptogrey]

If you are opting for palliative care then a biopsy is not useful. The care you give him will not change whether you "know" it's osteo or not. Plus, fine needle aspiration is very tricky to use as a diagnostic tool - unless you get the needle in just the right place, it doesn't grab the cells you need to look at. It's pretty painless and non-invasive, as tests go however. A larger core biopsy (sorry, I've forgotten the correct name) will likely remove too much of an already compromised bone.

 

Make sure you speak to you vet about having adequate pain meds on hand at all times. They can go along just fine for weeks and then all of a sudden need something stronger - and it's usually on a weekend when vets are closed. Tramadol in combination with gabapentin seems to be the most effective combo. Though tramadol can cause some dogs to become restless.

 

I'm so sorry for you and your family. I hate this disease and how it takes our beloved sweathearts away. You can come to the osteo thread and just have the support of others going through this too, if you'd like.

 

we used the gabapentin/tramadol combo w/ metacam as well. and yes, it's aways a weekend or holiday when your hound becomes really uncomfortable, for us it was new year's eve, sorry to hear about you pup, cancer sucks, it's as simple as that.

[TwiggysMom]

I am so, so sorry to hear this. As others have said if you are going the palliative care route, final confirmation is unimportant.

 

I'm in OH this week at OSU this week where Twiggy just had her leg amputated for osteo 2 days ago.

 

Even if you were planning aggressive treatment, generally OSU recommends FNA versus bone biopsy, as that is too invasive and weakens an already compromised bone (they did an ultrasound guided FNA on Twiggy the day before surgery). Your vet sounds relatively technically advanced. They may have the x-rays digitally already, and can provide them to you to attache to the consult form if you ask. Mine was able to do this for me, and that is how I got my preliminary diagnosis from OSU.

 

Spoil your boy, keep him as pain free as you can, and limit his activity to protect his leg.

 

I am so sorry to hear another one diagnosed this week. It is gut-wrenching and awful.

[4greyhounds]

Many Many Prayers..... :grouphug

[Guest 2Brindles]

I just sent scans of Ronan's x-rays to OSU using the consultation form. I apologize if this has been posted elsewhere, but how long does it take for a response?

[45MPHK9]

I just sent scans of Ronan's x-rays to OSU using the consultation form. I apologize if this has been posted elsewhere, but how long does it take for a response?

 

I emailed my X-rays on Tuesday night. I had my response by Wednesday afternoon. I don't think they are usually that fast, though. I expected to wait at least two or three days to hear back.

 

How is Ronan today?

[robinw]

Yes, it's usually very fast. If you don't hear from them within a couple of days, shoot them an email and they'll get right back to you.

[Guest 2Brindles]

I gave him his first 75 mg Rimadyl this morning. He will get two a day. When he woke up his limp was quite pronounced; now it is a little less so. He still managed to eat the cat food that had been left down though He wants to rest a lot, but when he wasn't frisking about he has always been a pro at taking it easy. His appetite is good and he has been drinking; he won't turn a cookie down either. Aside from the limp, he is as he always was.