Fear Of Men

[Sambuca]

I got a foster, Bart, a week and a half ago. He is just about perfect. Sweet, gentle, affectionate, playful, no resource or space aggression. Hes also good with cats and dogs. The problem is hes afraid of strangers, but men especially. My goal is to just expose him to as many men as possible. He is scared enough that he won't take food when men are even close by. I have had men pet him, but he is a mess the whole time. Is there anything else I can do to help him deal with his fears?

[Guest Clawsandpaws]

I see you are from Connecticut, this wouldn't happen to be WW's Bart's Best, would it? He is from the kennel I volunteer at. I LOVE Bart!!

 

Edited to add: Sorry I do not have any advice

Edited January 24, 2013 by Clawsandpaws

[OwnedBySummer]

RobinW had a totally terrified galgo with the same issue, "Iker". Iker can be patted by men now! Perhaps she can give you some help?

[JJNg]

Slow down and don't force interaction so soon. If he won't take treats when men are even close by and is a mess when men pet him, he's totally overwhelmed. Forcing him to deal with it is flooding him and can make him worse.

 

Are there any men (family or friends) who he will see on a regular basis? Start with a couple familiar men, and work on getting him comfortable around them. In the beginning, that might just mean hanging out around the house together with the man being instructed to ignore him completely (no eye contact, no approaching no touching) and casually tossing treats. Or going for a walk together, again with the man ignoring him. If he will take treats from you, that will be a sign that he's getting more comfortable.

 

I'd give Bart the chance to make the first move - wait for him to approach, sniff, show interest in the man. Even then, the man should continue to not make eye contact or try to pet him. Have the guy offer a treat, and if he won't take it, drop the treat on the ground for him. With time, he'll get more comfortable and may allow petting. When he gets to this point, have the man rub under his chin, neck, or chest, instead of petting the top of his head. Reaching over the top of the head is often intimidating for a shy dog.

 

After he learns to trust a couple of familiar men, it will probably get easier to introduce him to new people. Just remember to take it slow, and ask people to initially ignore him and wait for him to approach. Do the same with women too, and as he learns that strangers are ok, this may help with men as well.

[GreyhoundGirl]

Mason is afraid of men as well (I knew it when I got him). I don't force it. We go to meet and greets so he can get used to strangers. Generally, he's ok once he's been around them more than a few times. For example, he loves my father, a man who does the meet and greets with us and the maintenance guy (who I swear is like the dog whisperer...they just LOVE him ).

 

He has gotten better at meet and greets; he no longer hides behind me, he now stands next to me. Molly has been great for him because she believes everyone was put on the earth to tell her how pretty she is so she models GREAT behavior of how to act around people (read: wag your tail until they pet you ).

 

The dog park helps too because EVERYONE there loves dogs.

 

As he warms up and gets more comfortable he will slowly come out of his shell; don't rush it, let him slowly learn to trust them and positively reward (even if it's just with praise and snuggles) the small steps.

[Sambuca]

I see you are from Connecticut, this wouldn't happen to be WW's Bart's Best, would it? He is from the kennel I volunteer at. I LOVE Bart!!

 

Edited to add: Sorry I do not have any advice

Thats him! What was he like in the kennel? Was he as wonderful there as he is here? Hes really perfect.

 

My boy Sailor was like this too, so I've been through this. I was just hoping for some tricks to speed things up since I want him to get adopted. I'm single, so no men calling regularly. I can see what I can do. I have found that if someone is walking a dog, he warms up to them much quicker. Last week I dropped him off say a friends for a few hours and he did fantastic with her and her grown daughter and their 2 greyhounds. He also did ok, not great, but ok with the female vet and vet techs, but didn't like the male vet tech. I'm just really glad hes not fear aggressive.

Edited January 24, 2013 by Sambuca

[Guest Clawsandpaws]

Bart is an absolute LOVE, I am baffled by his behavior though, he was handled on a daily basis by a man/men, the kennel manager is a pretty big guy, who adored Bart. He was also handled by male volunteers (I know of at least three who touched him, loved on him at least every weekend) and they were all different ages/sizes with different facial features (beards, blonde haired, brown haired, long haired).

 

The only I can think of is are they wearing coats/long sleeves/boots? The kennel manager always wore shorts/tees and sneakers, as did many of the rest of us.

 

I am so glad he was put in a great foster home, he deserves it! He was quite the gentleman in the kennel, and every bit as perfect as you say . I stalked your group a bit because I saw that you guys took most of my favorite dogs that we transported up North ( I believe we sent up 17, you guys have Fancy, Toast, Franny, Abby, Sun and Bart!) Please give him a rub for me!!

Edited January 24, 2013 by Clawsandpaws

[brianamac]

Super cool that you have all this inside info from someone who knew him in the kennel... that's great!

I'm sure it's more the 'image' of a man, but to help at home maybe you could find some youtube videos where a man speaks, turn it up loud, and feed him yummy treats. Even though he may not react negatively to voice alone, it may help acclimatize him to one of the aspects of men he is scared of (the deep voice).

I understand, our boy is WAY more afraid of men then anyone else.

[JohnF]

Try to make it appear that the men are doing what you tell them to (ie. they ask and you OK it)

Also get them to read and use Calming Signals, and not crowd or pat the dog.

See here:

http://www.canis.no/rugaas/onearticle.php?artid=1

[Guest Downtownhoundz]

I got a foster, Bart, a week and a half ago. He is just about perfect. Sweet, gentle, affectionate, playful, no resource or space aggression. Hes also good with cats and dogs. The problem is hes afraid of strangers, but men especially. My goal is to just expose him to as many men as possible. He is scared enough that he won't take food when men are even close by. I have had men pet him, but he is a mess the whole time. Is there anything else I can do to help him deal with his fears?

 

After three years Bunny STILL has that problem! He runs upstairs if anyone rings the doorbell!

[a_daerr]

Henry had an aversion to "certain" men when he came to us. Tall men, men with facial hair, men wearing hats. His anxiety was worse when it came to men coming into our house, as opposed to men in public places. For him, it was just a matter of time and being introduced to new people. I agree with Jen, though, that it's good to just take it slow. Desensitization is a gradual process. Flooding him with a lot of different men could actually have a reverse effect and make him more fearful.

[Sambuca]

Bart is an absolute LOVE, I am baffled by his behavior though, he was handled on a daily basis by a man/men, the kennel manager is a pretty big guy, who adored Bart. He was also handled by male volunteers (I know of at least three who touched him, loved on him at least every weekend) and they were all different ages/sizes with different facial features (beards, blonde haired, brown haired, long haired).

 

The only I can think of is are they wearing coats/long sleeves/boots? The kennel manager always wore shorts/tees and sneakers, as did many of the rest of us.

 

I am so glad he was put in a great foster home, he deserves it! He was quite the gentleman in the kennel, and every bit as perfect as you say . I stalked your group a bit because I saw that you guys took most of my favorite dogs that we transported up North ( I believe we sent up 17, you guys have Fancy, Toast, Franny, Abby, Sun and Bart!) Please give him a rub for me!!

I will be happy to give him lots of rubs for you. Would you be willing to ask the men at the kennel if Bart was afraid or wary of them when they first met and then warmed up to them? Maybe hes more comfortable in a familiar place.

I will slow down with him. I'll try to take him some places and tell all men to ignore him for now. He did go up to a couple men who wanted nothing to do with him and sniffed them. So ignoring may be key here. Hes just so darn cute everyone wants to love on him.

[Batmom]

Best if any men you run across just completely ignore him.

 

If you have a confident and friendly dog, some walks where you might meet men could be instructive. Let your friendly dog meet & greet, let your foster just stay at your side and watch and make his own decision about whether/when to approach anybody.

 

 

 

ETA: Was typing while you were typing above. Ignoring is a GOOD thing :) .

Edited January 24, 2013 by Batmom

[galgrey]

I agree with this advice. I had a severely traumatized galgo that was the same way. She was very intimidated by eye contact from strangers, especially men. She did best if they completely ignored her and didn't even look at her. If she saw them a few times and "had a good experience" meaning they didn't try to force interaction with her, she would eventually get curious and approach them on her own. Good luck with him.

Slow down and don't force interaction so soon. If he won't take treats when men are even close by and is a mess when men pet him, he's totally overwhelmed. Forcing him to deal with it is flooding him and can make him worse.

Are there any men (family or friends) who he will see on a regular basis? Start with a couple familiar men, and work on getting him comfortable around them. In the beginning, that might just mean hanging out around the house together with the man being instructed to ignore him completely (no eye contact, no approaching no touching) and casually tossing treats. Or going for a walk together, again with the man ignoring him. If he will take treats from you, that will be a sign that he's getting more comfortable.

I'd give Bart the chance to make the first move - wait for him to approach, sniff, show interest in the man. Even then, the man should continue to not make eye contact or try to pet him. Have the guy offer a treat, and if he won't take it, drop the treat on the ground for him. With time, he'll get more comfortable and may allow petting. When he gets to this point, have the man rub under his chin, neck, or chest, instead of petting the top of his head. Reaching over the top of the head is often intimidating for a shy dog.

After he learns to trust a couple of familiar men, it will probably get easier to introduce him to new people. Just remember to take it slow, and ask people to initially ignore him and wait for him to approach. Do the same with women too, and as he learns that strangers are ok, this may help with men as well.

[cleptogrey]

Best if any men you run across just completely ignore him.

 

If you have a confident and friendly dog, some walks where you might meet men could be instructive. Let your friendly dog meet & greet, let your foster just stay at your side and watch and make his own decision about whether/when to approach anybody.

 

 

 

ETA: Was typing while you were typing above. Ignoring is a GOOD thing :) .

perfect advice. annie was absoutley mortified of men w/ spanish accents. well, my sil is from spain, talk dark(handsome)w/ typical 30 year old stubble. it took her over 2 years to finally come up to him and he's fantastic w/ animals. we let annie do what she needed to do- go into the back bedroom. eventually, and that was eventually she would walk past him and when she was near he made sure he had some table scraps in his hand. 3 years later, she's fine. but this is a dog who needed to be surgically inserted in the car for 9 months.

 

about greeting other people, felix is an extrovert- he goes up and loves everyone to death. annie stands on the side and watches. after a good 1/2 year i would calmly bring her near someone, hold her head and praise her and ask the person to gently pet her back. she is pretty tolerant but not a canidate for therapy dog.

[Guest Clawsandpaws]

I will be happy to give him lots of rubs for you. Would you be willing to ask the men at the kennel if Bart was afraid or wary of them when they first met and then warmed up to them? Maybe hes more comfortable in a familiar place.

I will slow down with him. I'll try to take him some places and tell all men to ignore him for now. He did go up to a couple men who wanted nothing to do with him and sniffed them. So ignoring may be key here. Hes just so darn cute everyone wants to love on him.

I will ask the kennel manager today and get back to you in a PM

[racindog]

Slow down and don't force interaction so soon. If he won't take treats when men are even close by and is a mess when men pet him, he's totally overwhelmed. Forcing him to deal with it is flooding him and can make him worse.

 

Are there any men (family or friends) who he will see on a regular basis? Start with a couple familiar men, and work on getting him comfortable around them. In the beginning, that might just mean hanging out around the house together with the man being instructed to ignore him completely (no eye contact, no approaching no touching) and casually tossing treats. Or going for a walk together, again with the man ignoring him. If he will take treats from you, that will be a sign that he's getting more comfortable.

 

I'd give Bart the chance to make the first move - wait for him to approach, sniff, show interest in the man. Even then, the man should continue to not make eye contact or try to pet him. Have the guy offer a treat, and if he won't take it, drop the treat on the ground for him. With time, he'll get more comfortable and may allow petting. When he gets to this point, have the man rub under his chin, neck, or chest, instead of petting the top of his head. Reaching over the top of the head is often intimidating for a shy dog.

 

After he learns to trust a couple of familiar men, it will probably get easier to introduce him to new people. Just remember to take it slow, and ask people to initially ignore him and wait for him to approach. Do the same with women too, and as he learns that strangers are ok, this may help with men as well.

JJNg nailed it. Forcing men on him right now is the worse thing you could do. It could ruin him forever to men imo. He needs to be totally ignored by them at this point. Do what JJNg has said and in time he will overcome IMO. Thanks for fostering him and helping him!

[greytpups]

I agree with this advice. I had a severely traumatized galgo that was the same way. She was very intimidated by eye contact from strangers, especially men. She did best if they completely ignored her and didn't even look at her. If she saw them a few times and "had a good experience" meaning they didn't try to force interaction with her, she would eventually get curious and approach them on her own. Good luck with him.

Robin did pretty much what JJNg's wrote. Iker, Robin's galgo, now loves my DH and snuggles with him all of the time and I saw Iker take a treat from a male at GIG. But Robin worked at it slowly. My Brooke is still shy, especially if strangers walk up to her. She does better when ignored and she makes the first move.

[Guest WhiteWave]

Ronon doesn't like any stranger, but men in particular upset him. He will not take food, he will not do anything but shake/tremble and hide behind me. I still take him in public, but he has never gotten better with anything we do. It takes him months of daily contact with a person to accept them. Took 6 months with my Mother and he is finally comfortable with her. After years of dealing with it, I gave up. He is what he is.

 

Although I had a male roommate when we got Ronon and Ronon never let him touch him willingly. They just ignored each other after a few months.

[JJNg]

From Clawsandpaws description of Bart at the kennel, I suspect he is probably just overwhelmed by the recent change in environment (kennel to transport to home), and he'll come around quickly if just given a little time and patience. The dogs that are true spooks (probably due to genetics or a complete lack of early socialization) are more like WhiteWave's Ronon - they act like that in any environment and may never accept strangers. Doesn't sound like that's the case with Bart since he seems to have warmed up to you quickly, is ok with strange women, and already showing some interest in men who ignore him. I'm currently fostering a spooky girl who, after 3 months, still runs if I make any moves in her direction and won't let me touch her voluntarily.

[Guest Clawsandpaws]

From Clawsandpaws description of Bart at the kennel, I suspect he is probably just overwhelmed by the recent change in environment (kennel to transport to home), and he'll come around quickly if just given a little time and patience. The dogs that are true spooks (probably due to genetics or a complete lack of early socialization) are more like WhiteWave's Ronon - they act like that in any environment and may never accept strangers. Doesn't sound like that's the case with Bart since he seems to have warmed up to you quickly, is ok with strange women, and already showing some interest in men who ignore him. I'm currently fostering a spooky girl who, after 3 months, still runs if I make any moves in her direction and won't let me touch her voluntarily.

I asked the kennel manager about it and let Sambuca know, Bart was indeed afraid of men when he was first brought to the kennel, but he warmed up with time and patience

[RedHead]

My non grey Karma was EXTREMELY fearful of men when I got her as she was hit over the head with shovels and newpapers among other things (to the point of shivering and hardly being able to stand). At the time I got her there was a lot of construction going on at my house and I noticed she was fine with with all of the various construction men...basically because they walked past her and ignored her going in and out all day, and she would come behind them and sniff the air. This is opposed to "well do-ers" like my dad who tried to baby talk her and pet her which ended up with her barking and growling!

 

Being able to pet a dog is sort of a human thing, for some dogs just being calm in the same room as a scary thing is an important first step. Petting paired with a panicked mindset will only produce anxiety. Petting while the dog is relaxed and happy is the only thing that will create a positive bond. As the other have said, having men come in and completely ignore him is really what he needs and wants. HE will approach when he is ready. In my case liver treats did WONDERS but each dog is different.

 

Trust me, if Karma overcame this (well, mostly) you can do it! It just takes time and a lot of patience!