Fce? Please Help!

[BluegrassGrey]

Last night my poor 10.5yr old Sidney had some sort of accident in the yard. It was dark & raining when he went out to potty. Heard him screaming- ran out to get him & he was covered in mud on his face & neck. Gave him pain meds and he was able to eat dinner. But still lots of panting & pacing still.

 

This morning Sidney goes out with the rest of our greys and eats his breakfast. But his head is still hanging down a little and more pacing & panting. Then his rear legs start buckling & he is losing control of his hind legs. Get him to the vets office before they even open.

 

I suspected FCE before we got there. Our vet did an exam and neurological testing. Sidney has decreased pain sensation in his rear legs. The x-rays were negative for disc damage. They gave him morphine injection and a Robxain injection. We were sent home with Robaxin 500mg (3x/day) and Tramadol 100mg (3x/day)and Dexamethasone injections 2x/day for 3 days). We also have a prescription for Gabapentin PRN.

 

Diagnosis was FCE or ruptured disk.

 

I know some of you all have been through this. Could you please share your stories of how it happened, what the diagnosis & treatment were, and the prognosis?

 

I am absolutely heartbroken over this. Sidney was a very active, bouncing Greyhound up to the point this happened. He would jump into the SUV on his own, run & play all the time, and he really had too much spring in his step (jumping for joy any time he could).

[Burpdog]

Sounds like a bad injury. Do you have an acupuncture vet close?

[BluegrassGrey]

Definitely accupuncture in Louisville. I will have to check for one in Lexington.....

[KF_in_Georgia]

Jen Bachelor's champion agility greyhound, Katie, suffered an FCE. There was a long rehab period, but it did bring Katie back to better than 90 percent of her original mobility. (Katie eventually succumbed to cancer.)

 

Start here to read about the original accident. Keep following posts tagged Katie Neurological. After that, look for Katie Rehab. Hydrotherapy was a huge help to Katie since it meant she could move and strengthen her legs without having to worry about keeping her balance.

[Batmom]

Might email greytdecals -- IIRC her Alan had an FCE. Can't recall if BrucieDad's Bruce had one, or if that was a different problem? I know there are a few other members who've been through this, and hopefully some will pipe up. About the only advice I can give is, have patience with his recovery. Many hugs to both of you.

[racindog]

First I am so very sorry to hear this! I am praying for Sidney-that's the most important thing IMO.

Second I went through something similar with my dear little Cash. She went down for the first time- suddenly while running- on ~April 26 2011 and seemed to recover quickly with prednisone, tramadol, and accupuncture and Traumeel, hypericum, and arnica and the regular Springtime Joint tabs etc. I really would recomend accupuncture with a reputable Dr and the hypericum-that seems to have helped a lot. However it wasn't long before she was in a lot more pain and her poor little body was as tight and hard as concrete. She got injections in the sacral area where that trouble was centered and was put on 1 or 2 robaxin/day to relax the hard tight muscles. Unfortunately she went down again. Perhaps the robaxin dose was too high and it relaxed the muscles enough for the disc or whatever to pop out again? who knows. We reduced it to 1/2 robaxin/day. She once again regrouped despite pain and seemed to be making slow improvement. But then very suddenly she got paralyzed even worse-evidently Schiff-Sherrington syndrome-then just as suddenly she went "out of it" and had a temperature of 105.7-presumably from the pain-this happenned so quick-while I was sleeping with her and Minny (who was also non-ambulatory) in the living room. I really believe she knew what her situation was and wanted to cross over because for the first time the previous evening she resisted all my efforts to help her and give her her meds etc. So we rushed to the evet where she was finally released from a very broken body on July 11 2011 that had caued her a great deal of pain most of her life. Cash also had a severe cervical injury and a broken hock that was improperly healed and was a bleeder. I do believe that sometimes with treatment they recover and don't have any terrible issues or pain afterwards and have heard of dogs recovering after treatment. Both vets and myself were hoping this would be Cash's outcome and were thinking positive but it just wasn't to be. She was 12 years old when this happenned so all things considered my little darlin' did quite well. But I do believe you've got to give it some time before the best outcome can be determined. Please keep us advised.

[Burpdog]

Michele Frazer, DVM, CVA

Lexington, KY 40511, USATele: 859-253-0002

 

 

Clare Seagren, DVM, CVA

Lexington, KY 40505, USATele: (859)255-8481

 

CHI vetsLouis Johnson, DVMSpecialty: Small Animal, EquineLEXINGTON, KY 40513, USATele: (859)361-3552Fax: 859-224-8152There are a lot of them in

Lexington but many equine:

 

Daisy Richardson, DVM, CVA

Lexington, KY 40511, USATele: (859)230-7550

[greysandmollie]

My first Greyhound had what was after many tests diagnosed with FCE. This was many years ago now....his onset was very quick. One minute fine and then down and couldn't get up. Lost control of bowels and bladder. No control over back legs....he was in NC State vet hospital by the evening. And within 24 hours he was able to get back up but was wobbly. Within 48 hours he was able to walk again. After lots of testing they basically told me that they was not much they could do. We did acupuncture and it made a big difference but the effects didn't last and I could not afford weekly acupuncture at that point in my life. Ultimately his mobility came back but he never regained bowel control. He was only 8 when this happened and over the years he also lost bladder control. But he seemed to feel good and enjoy life so it was all good.

 

I would have thought they might have prescribed Pred for him...if there is any inflammation that would be helpful in his recovery I would think.

 

I am sorry that you are going through this....

[greytdecals]

Giving high doses of prednisone within the first 24-48 hours after the injury is critical to how well they recover! It also depends on where the piece of cartilage gets lodged in the spine(how high up in the spine.)

 

The only way to diagnose FCE 100% is MRI.

 

Our Alan took several months to recover....which he never did completely. We took him to water therapy for several months. He went on to enjoy life...even with his disability.

[BluegrassGrey]

Thank you everyone for sharing your stories. I am just torn to pieces right this minute.

 

greytdeals- vet is giving Sid- IV then subcutaneous Dexamathasone (I looked it up and defined as "a potent synthetic member of the glucocorticoid class of steroid drugs"). I will have to ask the vet his thinking behind using that and not prednisone.

 

greysandmollie- I hope he has the outcome your boy did. I have and would again clean up poop and pee any day for this boy!

 

racindog- I dearly remember Miss Cash and her beautiful dress up collars. She had a beautiful lively spirit like Sidney- we need prayers from near & far for certain!

 

Burpdog- thank you for posting the vet list. Even as a RN- I believe all different treatments are worth trying.

 

KFinGeorgia- I have started reading the blog. It is very encouraging- exactly what I need right now.

[GreyPoopon]

Two of mine have had FCEs.

 

The first was Cora. It happened in the middle of the night--she was suddenly restless and panting and would not settle. She lost the use of the right side of her body, which, in conjunction with her not-yet-healed broken leg, made her a one-legged dog. She did have deep pain response, so the vet was hopeful. Steroids were not used because she'd been on an NSAID. She eventually regained most of her mobility on the right side, but the broken leg never fully healed--it turned out to be OS.

 

The second was Cal. She was playing in the living room, then started pacing and panting, settling only for a few seconds at a time. She lost the use of her right hind leg, which was already wobbly. Even though she'd been on an NSAID, she was given an injection of Dex, plus stomach protection meds. A couple of days later, something went very wrong with the front leg on the same side. X-rays were clear, so it must have been a sprain. More Dex was administered, plus antibiotics in case it was an infection. The FCE leg recovered more quickly than the sprain, and, in fact, is better than it was before the FCE. I half-jokingly suggested to my vet that the piece of cartilage that broke off might have been what was bothering her before; no way to know though.

 

Just by-the-by, both diagnoses were based on observation, not MRIs. Neither went to rehab. And the change in treatment reflected what the vets had heard at the last conference they'd attended.

Edited February 25, 2012 by GreyPoopon

[greytdecals]

 

 

greytdeals- vet is giving Sid- IV then subcutaneous Dexamathasone (I looked it up and defined as "a potent synthetic member of the glucocorticoid class of steroid drugs"). I will have to ask the vet his thinking behind using that and not prednisone.

 

 

I misspoke...I didn't mean to state prednisone specifically...I think that any type of steroid is going to be of help but still wouldn't hurt to ask the Vet! I am so used to prednisone because I took it myself on a regular basis for many years and so that is what always comes out of my mouth when I think steroids!

 

I think that the damage happens within the first 24 hours of injury...so treating with steroids in that time is going to lessen the amount of damage (that is the hope)

Edited February 25, 2012 by greytdecals

[EllenEveBaz]

No advice, just sending best wishes for your boy.

[galgrey]

[BluegrassGrey]

My poor baby is back in the hospital..... after we brought him home, he lost function in his front legs as well. He could bear no weight. He still has function in his trunk, head, neck (i.e. able to kind of sit up). He is still on dexamethasone injections, but the vet has weaned him off Robaxin & Tramadol to see if his function would improved. He does not appear to be in pain, but was no worse or better this morning.....

 

Does anyone have any other ideas? Why would he go from walking fine to complete paralysis like this, with no improvement? What are we missing? What does the vet need to be doing? We are hoping for some improvement by tomorrow.

 

His steroid injections began within about 13 hours of the original incident.....

 

Please help us!

 

About how many days did it take to see improvement with your all's babies? Did they get worse before getting better?

[BluegrassGrey]

 

Sidney

[GreyPoopon]

With my two, there was noticeable improvement quite quickly--a day or two. The improvements were fairly quick the first week, slower after that. Neither got worse after the initial assessment (the next morning for Cora, within a couple of hours for Cal).

 

I hope the vet can help your boy.

[BluegrassGrey]

Thank you GreyPoopon. I really hope my guy improves like yours did. Did your vet or you give aspirin? I just read a greyhound person/vet recommended that be included to "dissolve the clot."

[GreyPoopon]

No aspirin. The NSAID (Metacam) was discontinued for both due to the risk of stomach bleeding from the combination of steroids and an NSAID. Cora was not given steroids but the vet wanted to have the option. Cal got steroids and stomach protection meds.

[Devotion]

I have had one with FCE. Diagnosed with MRI. lots of steroids and rehab and he recovered to about 85%. It did take him about 6 weeks however. We were told by some who had gone through it a few days to a week but not for our boy.

Prayers for you and that you will have a positive outcome.

[LuvAPuppy]

Gosh I hate to do this and so late at night,(near midnight here, so it's too late for you to talk to them), but you need to be aware of all the possibilities no matter how horrible.... Are they sure he didn't break his neck, in which case he could now have....injured his spinal cord causing the (permanent) paralysis? I sure hope it's just more swelling pressing on the cord, that will go down with the steroids. And you know the swelling from an injury is worse on the second and third day...

[JJNg]

Any updates on Sidney? Unfortunately, it sounds more like a ruptured disc than FCE. Other than very briefly right at the start, FCEs usually are not painful, and they do not typically progress. On the other hand, ruptured discs tend to continue to be painful and can get worse due to inflammation and extrusion of more disc material.

 

Ruptured discs can require surgery, and if this is something you want to pursue, it would probably be best to transfer Sidney to a specialty center for further imaging (myelogram, MRI, or CT) to see if surgery is needed. If he still has sensation in his legs, and you do not want to pursue surgery at his age, time and supportive care might lead to some improvement, but this depends on how much damage has been done.

[racindog]

Bluegrass IMO jjng above said it perfectly. In my laymens terminology and experience what I believe I learned is that it all depends on the spinal cord and if it has been damaged. It is my understanding that sometimes the disc materail from a ruptured disc -particulalrly if it is an old injury-will sometimes cut/damage the spinal cord. It is my understanding that one example is the syndrome Cash had which had very specific symptoms-back "curled under" from sacral area and paralyzed front legs. I'm sure there are probably many other manifestations but I believe the bottom line is that once the cord is damaged there is nothing short of a miracle from God that can help. As I understand it you can't tell whether the neurolgical symtoms you are observing are the result of a damgaged cord or just inflammation/swelling etc from the recent injury without diagnostic work OR whether or not you see improvemnent in a reasonable time. I have heard of many dogs that have recovered from ruptured discs so clearly many times the neurological things seen right after an injury are the result of inflammation etc which gets mostly better. It is interesting that he got worse after the Robaxin- so did Cash-could it have relaxed them so much the bulging disc got worse? Who knows. Honestly Momma had an incident with her cervical vertebra a couple of months ago and she was treated with Robaxin and it HELPED her. Sometimes a good vet can tell whether the symptoms are likely from cord injury or inflammation I think but based on the limited experience I have had with it seems like the only choice is diagnostic work or wait and see if there is improvemnent. I tend to favor the wait and see as long as they are not suffering in pain because I don't think there is any guarantee they can find "it" even if you put them through testing. But what jjng said sounds important- if it is an injury that needs to be surgically repaired then perhaps there is a good prognosis after surgical intervention. I'm so sorry you are going through this. I know it is so heartbreaking to see them like this. Still praying.

[greysandmollie]

I am so sorry that he is not improving....I hope that you have gotten better news since your last post.

 

I would have to agree that your circumstances don't sound like FCE. After the intial onset with Rascal he only improved. I was told by the vets then that most of the improvement is happening within the first week....

[carronstar]

Checking in on Sidney after the weekend. Hoping for a positive update.