Vulva Tuck

[Houndtime]

Idol came to us with a little extra skin flap in the vulva area. I always try to keep her extra clean and thought I was doing a good job. Last month she experienced some irritation and I took her to the vet. We got a medicated shampoo and a powder to use twice a day. I see some improvement, but not a lot. She is still very red in the area and everyday when I wash her, some dried stuff is on the cotton pad.

 

Our vet said to think about the vulva tuck. I am just wondering if anyone has had experience with this.

 

Idol's issues are coming on top of Fuzzy's sheath infections, and I am just getting so down from these poor dogs. I am grateful that nothing is life threatening, of course, but I am taking them from one place to another. Fuzzy is now under the care of a specialist and he has a follow up appointment next week. I don't even know when to schedule Idol's surgery, if she should have it.

 

Thanks for listening.

[45MPHK9]

No advice for you, Irene. Just sending you and Len a hug. It's tough dealing with these chronic problems month after month. Those doggies are lucky to have you taking such good care of them.

[Batmom]

eaglflyt had this done for her girl. You might want to PM her if she doesn't see this.

 

I know some other folks have had it done but I'm drawing a blank on names.

[maggiespet]

Hugs to you and Len. Thank God it's not life threatening - but stressful regardless.

[Guest longdoglady]

Anna has the same problem, I clean her with diluted hibiscrub twice daily and she is prescribed Incurin (estriol) which keeps the vaginal lining healthy and helps "pop out" the vulva. This is working for her, she was constantly sore and getting infections before taking Incurin. Depending on how severe Idol's tuck is, you could always try the non surgical route first.

[Guest eaglflyt]

Yes, Ady Bea had this surgery in March of 2010. Her surgery was necessitated by recurrent urinary tract infections thought to be due to the extra skin fold being the perfect place to harbor bacteria. The surgery was successful and she has not had any UTIs at all since her surgery. I was nervous about the anesthesia and surgery, but she flew through both. The surgical center even let me bring along her favorite blanket and pillow and the food she was used to eating. The first 2 or three days she was a bit swollen (nothing excessive) and had some dried blood in the area. I applied dry cold packs for the swelling and she had pain pills that she only needed for the first couple of days. She seems so much more comfortable now and no longer has that irritated area ... or those repeated urinary tract infections. She was only 2 years old when the surgery was done. Yes, I would do this surgery again without question.

 

Good luck and just let me know if you have any other questions. Hugs to you and your girlie.

[Houndtime]

Idol hasn't had, thank G-d, urinary tract infections. She is red and irritated and has some crusty stuff in there. I try to clean her and sometimes she bleeds a little. I am waiting to hear back from our vet as to what to do. Thanks.

[Houndtime]

Ok, I just heard from Dr. Newman. She would like to try an antibiotic for a shot at curing it that way. Continue with the cleansing and powder. Trying this before considering the surgery, since this is Idol's first episode with irritation. Hopefully, this is a one time thing. Dr. Newman also said, if it is a chronic condition, we may have to cleanse her "forever". So, ok.

[Guest BrianRke]

Diamond had this problem and the vet said he doesnt like to do surgery on this, its too risky. He gave me these great wipes to try called KetoHex wipes (Chlorhexidine & Ketoconazole). I just wipe the area a few times a week with one of these pads and have had no problems at all. Been using them for almost 2 years with great results.

[sabrina]

Irene sorry that Idol is going thru this. Hope the vet's idea works & Idol is ok

[Cully]

I just sent this to a friend of mine who just had this surg on her standard poodle. She sent me these articles.

 

http://www.acvs.org/...FoldDermatitis/

 

Cassie's Cure:

"Incontinence" Mystery Solved

by Judy Kody Paulsen

(Excerpt from Summer 2004 issue of GCNM News)

Christine Boyd and "Cassie"

 

Christine Boyd adopted "Cassie" after she was returned by her first adoptive family in July 2001. Outgoing and energetic, Cassie was able to coax Christine's shy Greyhound, "Betty Jo," to play and be sociable. Cassie was the perfect dog; until the licking started.

 

Early in 2003, Cassie began licking her "girl parts" – and not just on occasion, but almost incessantly. Christine noticed Cassie's bedding was often wet, but she couldn't determine if this was from urine or saliva from licking. Then began the odyssey: Numerous veterinarians were consulted. The initial diagnosis was incontinence and a prescription was given for a common drug used for strengthening the urinary sphincter muscle. When no improvement was noted, the pursuit for other solutions began.

 

Diagnosed with and treated for an assortment of ailments ranging from urinary tract infections to food allergies, Cassie continued licking and was exhibiting visible signs of discomfort as she hunched over and shivered while urinating. She also began to resist any cleansing of the area by Christine, which was part of the routine that had been prescribed early on. Her silken white hair soon began to discolor around the affected area and Christine became increasingly frustrated by the temporary or total lack of response to treatments.

 

After numerous opinions from various veterinarians, the mystery of Cassie's problem began to unfold, literally – for it was a fold of skin that was causing her problem. Close scrutiny was almost impossible due to the tautness of skin obscuring the vulvar area, not to mention Cassie's resistance to examination because of the discomfort. Urine stays trapped under the fold of skin and actually scalds and destroys the tissue, similar to the effects of a chemical burn. Many dogs with this abnormality have a concurrent urinary tract infection as well. Surgical removal of the fold of skin was suggested as the remedy for this condition.

 

A decision had to be made on whether to subject Cassie to surgery to correct her deteriorating condition. Evidence that Cassie's sunny disposition was being affected caused even greater consternation for Christine, and she decided to launch an Internet search for information on surgical correction of this anatomical abnormality. One particular surgical procedure was cited frequently in her research; "episioplasty." The documented vast improvement for dogs receiving this procedure seemed almost too good to be true, but warranted further research. One study suggested this condition is more prevalent in spayed females, presumably resulting from the change in hormone levels, although other studies indicate prior ovariohysterectomy (spaying) did not appear to be an influencing factor. Other published studies hypothesized that a history of prior corticosteroid administration can cause this condition.

 

It is no secret that corticosteroids are frequently used in racing Greyhounds. According to "Care of the Racing Greyhound – A Guide for Trainers, Breeders and Veterinarians" Blythe, Gannon and Craig; "Injected corticosteroids are often used indiscriminately and incorrectly in the therapy of injuries" in racing Greyhounds. It has long been known that steroids, even when clinically unnecessary, have been administered to racing Greyhounds in spite of the well-documented, long-term negative effects. In addition to pharmaceutical hormones, the physical and psychological pressure of training and racing can stimulate an abnormally high production of cortisol – a natural hormone released in response to stress – which can eventually result in multiple organ dysfunction.

 

Dr. Andrea Speed

 

After consulting several veterinarians over the period of about a year, Christine elected to have episioplasty performed by Dr. Andrea Speed of De Anza Animal Clinic. Dr. Speed had previously evaluated Cassie in October 2003 and felt at that time surgery would be the best approach for this problem. Speed rarely sees this abnormality, and feels it is possibly more common in female racing Greyhounds since they are not allowed to "cycle" (come into "heat") normally. Female racers in heat would disrupt kennel life at the track and are routinely administered testosterone to prevent this. In Dr. Speed's extensive experience with spaying retired racers in preparation for adoption, she has frequently observed abnormal vaginal development and other problems as well.

 

Not having performed an episioplasty before, but confident of a positive outcome, Dr. Speed did her own research on the procedure in a veterinary surgery publication. Always willing to consider new techniques, but cautious about not getting in over her head, Speed recalls her thought after studying the literature; "I think I can do that!" Concluding that the procedure wouldn't involve a lot of dissection or avoidance of critical vessels or organs, she opted to do the surgery. Performed under a general anesthesia, and requiring about 30-45 minutes of surgical time, the procedure was described as "not difficult" by Dr. Speed and the patient was sent home with pain medication and an "E" collar to prevent licking.

 

Before surgery, the skin was so tightly stretched over the vulva, a full view of the unexposed tissue was not easily achieved during examinations. After surgery the full extent of the undoubtedly painful condition was glaringly obvious. Christine's training as a trauma nurse did not prepare her for the post-operative appearance of Cassie's surgical site. She said she "felt horrible" when she realized the extent of damage to the flesh of and around the vulva from the chemical-like burns due to the pooled urine under the fold of skin for months and months. Also, the persistent licking during the months prior to surgery had excoriated the skin, creating the appearance of "hamburger meat" in the now-exposed area.

 

Anticipating a lengthy and painful recovery, Christine was delighted to see Cassie show almost immediate improvement in her attitude and most noticeably, the absence of licking. "Out of habit," Christine states, "Cassie would turn around and go to lick every time she lay down, but once she stuck her nose back there, it was as if she thought 'Hey, it doesn't hurt anymore, so I don't need to lick.' She would stare at the sutured area for a moment, then flop over, and go to sleep. She has left it alone ever since!"

 

From this experience, Christine has learned, "That you just have to keep asking questions" when traditional treatments and diagnoses don't provide relief for your animal. "Yes, it is time and money consuming, but if I had given up asking all over town, Cassie would still be suffering."

 

Veterinarians have easy access to information from many sources and they should be willing to investigate unusual cases presented to them. Don't be afraid to ask your vet to do some homework and if he/she is not receptive to this approach in any situation regarding your animal companion, time to change vets.

 

"The surgery was a huge success!" Christine exclaims. "Now, Cassie is doing wonderfully. She is healed, dry and has normal-appearing pink skin and does not stay awake at night licking or have to clean herself the minute she urinates. She just feels better all around, not having the constant pain and irritation."

 

Particularly grateful to Dr. Speed and a few others who were "willing to listen to an obsessive-compulsive dog-mom and to look for solutions," Christine hopes imparting her experience will save someone a lot of money and time and hopefully prevent a lot of misery for their dog, as well.

 

[Guest eaglflyt]

Ditto about the above post.

 

For us, it was when Ady Bea's 4th or 5th UTI hit within a year or so while we were snowed and iced in after an unusual winter storm. We were unable to get her out and to the vet, or E-vet, even if we used our tractor with agricultural tires or our 4 WD truck! We had a suffering girl and no way to get her to a vet!!! She was crying each time she needed to urinate, which seemed to be every few minutes and she'd only pee a few drops. (If you've ever had a UTI yourself, you know that pain.) It was a miracle that our vets talked us through what we could use and how to properly dose the antibiotics we had on had for our horses (SMZ-TMP). The drug did rapidly help and we saw our vet as soon as we could get out of our driveway and safely get her to town.

 

I had never felt so helpless and very bad for our girl. Our vet referred us to a board certified, surgical specialist. Our vet hadn't performed the surgery before, nor on a sighthound, and although he felt it wouldn't be an issue, he felt better having a specialist do the surgery that did this surgery frequently and had vast sighthound experience with this very problem.

 

We have fostered at least 20 or 30 greyhounds so far for our group. Of all the female greys I have ever met or fostered, I have never yet met a female greyhound that didn't have this anatomical condition ... even those that had never raced, like our Ady Bea.

 

I have always tried to avoid surgery and anesthesia for our hounds unless there were no other options. For us, this became a "have to" situation for our girl.

[Houndtime]

I appreciate all the responses. Thank you so much. This was a topic that I was not familiar with at all. I really respect my vet and like that she would like to treat it medically, if possible, as any surgery has risks. If we decide that the surgery is necessary, we will certainly proceed. No need to suffer or be uncomfortable.

[Hubcitypam]

We have fostered at least 20 or 30 greyhounds so far for our group. Of all the female greys I have ever met or fostered, I have never yet met a female greyhound that didn't have this anatomical condition ... even those that had never raced, like our Ady Bea.

Wow. I've fostered a bunch in the last 11 years and have never seen a female greyhound that had it....or maybe I just wasn't picking up their tails and inspecting... Just checked foster girlies girlie parts and they look fine.

[Brindles]

My Echo suffers from this problem, but it has never caused a UTI. I would NOT do the surgery unless the condition is causing health problems. It's a large incision in an area where stitches easily pop out. Not something I want to put my girl through. I treat her flare ups with antibacterial/antifungal powder and wipes. Otherwise, she keeps it pretty clean on her own.

 

We have fostered at least 20 or 30 greyhounds so far for our group. Of all the female greys I have ever met or fostered, I have never yet met a female greyhound that didn't have this anatomical condition ... even those that had never raced, like our Ady Bea.

Wow. I've fostered a bunch in the last 11 years and have never seen a female greyhound that had it....or maybe I just wasn't picking up their tails and inspecting... Just checked foster girlies girlie parts and they look fine.

Strange. I've been around hundreds of females over the years at the track, and I have only seen a handful who have the issue.

[Guest bugg]

My 3 y/o standard poodle had a vulva tuck four weeks ago, July 14th, and she did very well. I used the Bite Not collar on her the first 24 hrs and after that she was good to go and ready to swim again. Of course...... that wasn't allowed until after the sutures came out which was 10 days later. Today you wouldn't even know she had surgery 'down' there. Her hair has grown back and I'm relieved this is behind us, because like Idol, Belle suffered from vaginitis. I was delighted that my vet had experience in this type of surgery, it gave me peace of mind, still I was apprehensive because of the area in question. The incision/sutures did not cause any irritation or inflmation during urination.

 

If you go to www.acvs.org and enter "vulvar fold dermatitis" you will find a graphic picture of the procedure.

 

I highly recommend vulva tuck, because the results for us.......were excellent.

 

Good luck and know we are keeping you close at heart.

 

June Van Tosh

Boxwood Belle, OA,OAJ,SG,SS,SJ,SR,PS1.

[Guest K9Cookies]

Our girl, Gracey, had the surgery this March. She had chronic discharge, although never had any UTIs. The surgery helped things a lot, but she still has some of the drainage. I'm glad we did the surgery though. She is much more comfortable.

 

Good luck with your decisions.

[Guest jettcricket]

We have fostered at least 20 or 30 greyhounds so far for our group. Of all the female greys I have ever met or fostered, I have never yet met a female greyhound that didn't have this anatomical condition ... even those that had never raced, like our Ady Bea.

Wow. I've fostered a bunch in the last 11 years and have never seen a female greyhound that had it....or maybe I just wasn't picking up their tails and inspecting... Just checked foster girlies girlie parts and they look fine.

 

Double wow...seriously??? I've been fostering for the past 12 years and so far that I know of none of the females that I've had have had this problem.

 

We have fostered at least 20 or 30 greyhounds so far for our group. Of all the female greys I have ever met or fostered, I have never yet met a female greyhound that didn't have this anatomical condition ... even those that had never raced, like our Ady Bea.

Wow. I've fostered a bunch in the last 11 years and have never seen a female greyhound that had it....or maybe I just wasn't picking up their tails and inspecting... Just checked foster girlies girlie parts and they look fine.

 

Double wow...seriously??? I've been fostering for the past 12 years and so far that I know of none of the females that I've had have had this problem.

 

I hope the antibiotics works for your cute little Idol Irene. What a doll baby she is.....

[GeorgeofNE]

Our female English Setter (who passed away this year) had a chronic discharge problem, but it truly didn't seem to ever bother her. I think the vet suggested it, but my folks chose not to do the surgery since the dog really did seem fine--no issues with UTIs or anything.

[Guest bugg]

Hey, i'm curious. those of you that have or have had dogs with vulva fold, were they spayed before their first heat cycle? some say spaying a large breed female before a first, or close to, heat cycle can cause vulva fold due to immature develope. My std poodle, Belle, was spayed at 6/mos. This is the earlies i've ever spayed a female. All the others had a heat cycle.

Thanks for replies,

June Bugg

[Batmom]

Hi, Bugg! My greyhound girls (past and present) had/have folds. They were spayed at @ 2 and 4 years, respectively.

 

My late girl Zema had some perivulvular dermatitis one year but that cleared up -- mostly by itself. I did clean gently and put some ointment on @ once a day for awhile. Current girl Gidget doesn't seem to have any problems.

[Guest Greytnorth]

Our girl Ruby had this problem when we first brought her home. She was so uncomfortable and would sometimes cry when she would urinate or try to "clean" herself. We tried the antibiotics and the creams and they worked short term. We chose the surgery 5 years ago and it was the best decision for us. The first few days after the surgery where really tough and I felt guilty for putting my poor girl through that but it was a permanent solution for a chronic problem.

 

You need to make the best decision for your girls however, short term pain after the surgery for a chronic condition might be the best thing for her.

[Guest eaglflyt]

I'm being truthful. I have yet to meet a female greyhound that didn't have the skin fold that at least partially covered their vulva. Some never have a problem. Many do.

 

If you look closely, you may find the fold of skin partially or completely covering the area and the fold of skin may need to be lifted to see the extent of any problem.

 

I have spoken to our vets at length about this issue, including one of our vets that has been the vet for many greyhound farms. They all agree.

[Hubcitypam]

Hey, i'm curious. those of you that have or have had dogs with vulva fold, were they spayed before their first heat cycle? some say spaying a large breed female before a first, or close to, heat cycle can cause vulva fold due to immature develope. My std poodle, Belle, was spayed at 6/mos. This is the earlies i've ever spayed a female. All the others had a heat cycle.

Thanks for replies,

June Bugg

I'd think finding a greyhound spayed before her first heat would have about the same odds as hitting the Powerball with the only winning ticket.

[JJNg]

I'd think finding a greyhound spayed before her first heat would have about the same odds as hitting the Powerball with the only winning ticket.

I'm wondering how often track greyhounds actually come into heat? It was recently discussed in another thread that greys rarely come into heat before 18 months old. When are they started on testosterone injections to keep them from coming into heat? Don't they start racing at around 18 months?