greyhead

Thanks for those replies. I do fear that it's something peculiar to Shane. Forgot to mention that he as been showing symptoms of stress under conditions (e.g., car rides) that didn't bother him when Spencer was still around. He's getting better, but much of that is due to our avoiding situations likely to provoke a "heat stress" type of response.

Shane (with history of hookworm and recent signs of fleas) has been on Trifexis for two months, since we ran out of Interceptor, and is due another dose today. Problem is, the last time he took it, he was more or less knocked out for two days. By "more or less" I mean that although he ate, pottied when asked, and took brief walks, he did nothing else. He just laid on his bed the rest of the time, didn't change beds, didn't change rooms, didn't so much as scratch his neck! It was weird and worrisome. Fortunately, he returned to normal on the third day. I'm reluctant to give it to him again, but I don't have ready access to anything else. My question is: Is it possible that the standard weight-determined dose of Trifexis is too much for some greyhounds? (He has a history of Babesia and Lyme, creatinine of 2.6 in June, and just musculoskeletal stuff beyond that.)

Just heartbreaking, Steve, and we're so very sorry she had to leave now. That gorgeous photo is a beautiful way to remember her and to represent her departure.

Please give Kate our condolences on the loss of Morgan.

I'm so very, very sorry.

SIBO stands for Small Intestine Bacterial Overgrowth. Bacteria that are normally found in the intestines sometimes over-grow or multiple beyond the level at which they are supposed to occur for normal balance of the various intestinal bacteria. Campylobacter is one of those normally-occurring bacteria that can over-grow under certain circumstances. The circumstances leading to a case of SIBO are not perfectly understood, but in our family it happened after administration of an antibiotic (clindamycin) after a dental cleaning. In the end, clindamycin was one of the three anti-b's it took to get rid of the SIBO (which in our case was Clostridium-based). Sorry for the abbreviation without explanation. My fault entirely. We all come here in ignorance, whenever we need help, no matter how many thousands of posts we've made previously. So no apologies are necessary for that. Ever.

Claudia, food changes don't cause bacterial overgrowth. That is not your fault! Further, my vet never ever recognized the possibility that our dog's SIBO was SIBO! I had to finally just *order* them to do a culture & sensitivity on the poop. This is not your fault, and I'm glad you have a much sharper vet than we did. (Well, like my vet, yours went after it first with Tylan, which is too mild.) Repeat: Food changes don't cause SIBO (unless the food is contaminated, and that's a different issue entirely).

I'm so very sorry for your loss.

My GH has numbers like that AND dilute urine. Perhaps the OP misunderstood what was said about the concentration?

I still wonder if you'd do best to see the vet practice in Springfield. Our acupuncture/chiro vet also writes greyhound-savvy prescriptions for pain control when needed. But in any case I wish you the best in getting through this and hope you'll let us know how things evolve. We went through a couple supposedly savvy vets the first year we had our first greyhound before the third finally diagnosed the problem. Even then, the treatment wasn't adequate. We moved 30 miles away and landed with a fourth vet. But we've needed specialists too, such as the acu/chiro vet who is basically a rehab vet. It happens and isn't anything to feel guilty about!

I'm so sorry he left. Godspeed, Kingsley.

Did you adopt Seamus locally. You could ask people in the greyhound adoption group who they use. ETA: Even if you didn't adopt from them, there are one or two greyhound adoption groups in Oregon that could be helpful.

What a lovely story, Judy. That's the way I'd want mine to go -- having a ball right up to the end. I'm just so sorry she had to leave at all.

Rachel, while we were busy finding and treating his SIBO, Spencer developed IBD. All the food changes we made before we solved the problem came back to haunt us, as he had developed an inflammatory response to beef, chicken, salmon, rabbit, lamb, and buffalo. We were left with venison and kangaroo as protein sources he could tolerate, once he had gotten on budesonide (prednisone-alternative immunosuppressant for GI trouble). Additionally, IBD dogs need very simple formulas. So we had great luck with Natural Balance venison and sweet potato. We didn't need blueberries and all that other stuff that came in otherwise good foods. We *had* had great luck with Iams green bag! But once he got sick, he couldn't use it anymore. Grain-free is also the direction we went, and I hope you get good results.

After lots of Flagyl, other antibiotics, and anti-IBD meds, we had this same trouble. The internist recommended giving L-glutamine (500 mg/day). It was amazingly effective at making for coherent poop! It both heals intestine/stomach walls that have been inflamed AND discourages bad germs from multiplying. It's pricey but worth it. And we used the TwinLabs brand effectively, while the SolaRay (sp) brand didn't help.

I added more stuff to my post, so I wanted to be sure you knew that. There are more certifying bodies than the two I consulted, but these were the two I used. Not entirely up on Oregon geography, but I hope this helps.

Found Dr. Matthew Fricke at McKenzie Animal Hospital in Springfield. (See http://mahpc.com/ ) He does a range of things that could help, though I found him on the AAVA web site while looking for members. I think all the practitioners on that web site are certified, but it doesn't explicitly say so; or at least I didn't see it. I'll keep looking for other practitioners, but this could get you started. ETA: The AAVA page for Oregon practitioner search: http://www.aava.org/search/newsearch.asp?bst=&cdlGroupID=&txt_country=United+States&txt_statelist=Oregon&txt_state=Oregon&ERR_LS_20130917_153905_20679=txt_statelist%7CLocation%7C20%7C0%7C%7C0 Here's the certified chiropractor site: http://www.avcadoctors.com/ Follow the links, starting with Find An AVCA Doctor. I wasn't sure how close some of those docs are to you. It looks to me like Fricke might be a good, nearby place to start! Maybe you won't need a chiropractor specifically. Best of luck!

I hope someone who has faced a similar problem with chime in with good suggestions. We did use vanilla Ensure to add more calories whenever needed, but only a half-bottle at a time. (We had GI issues, and too much Ensure at once made the poops too loose. YMMV.) But I don't recall hearing much that would make for optimism that you can really stop the weight melt while on the pred. If you'll share what area of Oregon you're in, I can help find a certified acupuncture and/or chiropractor vet. (Ours is both and lives in Olympia, WA.) They can tell a lot just by using their hands when x-rays don't reveal the problem.

Yes, pred causes muscle wasting and weight loss in GH's. It must be given for something like cancer, but I can't see keeping your dog on it for neck pain. We've used Tramadol and gabapentin for lumbosacral stenosis, as well as acupuncture and chiropractic. Perhaps there's an anti-inflammatory that would help your dog too. But, yes, after losing 10 pounds and age 9, I'd stop the pred. The vet who doesn't think it's the pred causing it doesn't know greyhounds well enough, IMO. ETA: When one of my greys was on it briefly, he lost 5 lbs in three days. That's when we stopped.

When we had orange pudding poo at our house, it turned out to be from a bacterial overgrowth following post-dental antibiotics. Took three antibiotics to fix it, after analyzing the poop with a culture-and-sensitivity. Took so long to convince the vet to do the C&S that by the time we cured the overgrowth, the dog was left with IBD. So don't let it go on for months, and don't keep changing the food. (Dogs develop inflammatory responses to proteins they're exposed to during these episodes and can wind up never again being able to eat them. You don't want to be left with nothing to feed but kangaroo and emu!)

Glad they're testing the thyroid, as that can involve much soreness and grouchiness too. Of course, it could just be pain, from arthritis or strain. Tramadol and gabapentin are pretty safe, but gaba-p can involve some initial clumsiness/weakness that will wear off in a day or two. Much prefer those to NSAIDs! Will be hoping for a good update.

Totally agree with tbhounds. We lost a grey with somewhat wonky liver values when the vet didn't see much on ultrasound and proceeded to do a biopsy. He got too many drugs that day. Turned out there was no cancer anyhow. So, yes, move conservatively, and just deal with the toe for now.

After our Spencer had a Clostridium perfringens infection for months, he was left with moderate-to-severe IBD, seen on ultrasound. (He'd lost 20 lbs and was very ill, so I refused a surgical biopsy.) He was only Tylan for the next four years, among other things. No inappetance due to Tylan. But before we found and treated the IBD, he did the same thing you're describing with the food, doing well on each new thing for a day or two and then refusing it. If it is IBD, that reaction is due to an inflammatory response in the GI tract, and it will continue until he's treated for it. The bacterial infection must be knocked out first. After that, please treat with budesonide instead of prednisone. I'll be happy to explain that, when and if you wish. By the way, you might test for Intestinal Malabsorption. It may be that his ability to process B12 has been impaired. If so, sub-q administration of B12 (must be shot, not oral) will rectify a lot of problems, including appetite. ETA: Tylan is a very mild antibiotic. I can't imagine it able to handle Campy by itself. Campy creates colonies that produce toxins when the colony reaches a certain critical threshold, and those toxins can kill intestinal tissue. So at the risk of exposing my own PTSD around this issue, I looked around and copied this info on treatment: Clindamycin, gentamicin, tetracyclines, erythromycin, and fluoroquinolones are effective against Campylobacter spp. Penicillins, cephalosporins, and trimethoprim are generally ineffective. Resistance to the fluoroquinolones, tetracycline, kanamycin, and some other antibiotics has been documented among the Campylobacter spp, mediated by both chromosomal and plasmid mechanisms. Culture-dependent diagnosis can provide isolates for antibiotic sensitivity testing. It came from this site: http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/digestive_system/enteric_campylobacteriosis/overview_of_enteric_campylobacteriosis.html It took three antibiotics, given serially, to knock out Spencer's Clostridium! Perhaps you should request another culture & sensitivity (they did do a sensitivity, didn't they?) to see what else might actually work. Although the fluoroquinolones apparently may or may not work, there are four other things listed that could. This article was from spring of 2012, btw. Oh, and I agree totally with Houndtime above about the food changes.

So very sorry, Tonya. Godspeed, sweet boy.

Lots of good thoughts for you and Fuzzy!