Acid reflex and dental issues

[Bogangles]

A situation that has come up I have never hear of!

1. Does acid reflex cause dental issues

2. How should this be treated

3. Does anyone know the symptoms of acid reflex or experienced it with their greyhound

Currently, my dog has teeth problems, perhaps even exposed roots (furcation has been mentioned by two vets)

Has anyone experienced this situation with their greys? Or know how to treat this situation.

This is all new to me.

Thanks everyone.

[greysmom]

Acid reflux can absolutely cause teeth and other mouth and throat issues.  But it's much more common in humans than it is in dogs.  Stomach acids and bacteria vary greatly in dogs from people, and while they can get it it's much rarer.

Has your vet actually diagnosed your dog with AR through endoscopy or other testing??  Or is he going from symptoms and the condition of his mouth?  Is your vet knowledgeable about greyhounds and their particular mouth issues?

Some greyhounds just have terrible teeth.  Many people attribute this to their racing diet, but it's more than likely a genetic issue.  I had one dog who could have had an anesthetized full dental every 6 months.  He ate the same food, got the same dental chews, everything exactly the same as the 4 other greyhounds we had at the time who hardly ever needed even a scraping.  He ended up losing most of his teeth by the time he was 10 (and did fine that way for two more years).

They can also get auto immune diseases that affect their mouths, particularly  one called C.U.P.S (Chronic Ulcerative Paradental Stomatitis).  This affects the gums more than the actual teeth, causing gum ulcerations and terrible bad breath.  The treatment for it usually involves removing their teeth to stop the pain and degeneration.

If you have access to a certified canine dental specialist, I believe it would be worth the time and cost to get this diagnosis correct.

If your dog does have acid reflux a treatment with an otc acid reducer like Prilosec or famotidine can be tried.  Sometimes a diet change to different food - a lower fat and/or protein content - can help.

[GreyTzu]

I agree, acid eats away the enamel of the teeth.  It is one of the long term affects of Anorexia/Bulimia.  However some breeders will still worm broods during pregnancy and after birthing with Panacur (I think, if I can remember correctly) and it causes teeth discoloration.   All of the FTH puppies had it as a result.  

[cleptogrey]

2 hours ago, GreyTzu said:

I agree, acid eats away the enamel of the teeth.  It is one of the long term effects of Anorexia/Bulimia.  However some breeders will still worm broods during pregnancy and after birthing with Panacur (I think, if I can remember correctly) and it causes teeth discoloration.   All of the FTH puppies had it as a result.  

it's antibiotics that result in tooth discoloration not panacur. worming with panacur is standard procedure in whelping a litter. the dam(mother) releases eggs(from worms) that are with in her body(mostly muscles) and then passes them on to the pups. the eggs have lied dormant for years- so, worming for dam and yes, puppy worming for all. lettuce(whippet) had a litter last year and it was explained to me.

i go w/ genetics are per the horrible dental situation. but this is all too common in GH- hence/genetics. remember breeders are breeding for performance and a short life at the track. we give this wonderful companions a great long life that was never imagined by the breeders.

[GreyTzu]

44 minutes ago, cleptogrey said:

it's antibiotics that result in tooth discoloration not panacur. worming with panacur is standard procedure in whelping a litter. the dam(mother) releases eggs(from worms) that are with in her body(mostly muscles) and then passes them on to the pups. the eggs have lied dormant for years- so, worming for dam and yes, puppy worming for all. lettuce(whippet) had a litter last year and it was explained to me.

i go w/ genetics are per the horrible dental situation. but this is all too common in GH- hence/genetics. remember breeders are breeding for performance and a short life at the track. we give this wonderful companions a great long life that was never imagined by the breeders.

Yup, you are right!  It is an antibiotic.  It's been so long, I couldn't remember for sure.  So basically, ignore my post. 

[Bogangles]

I appreciate your responses.

I do not see any symptoms of acid reflex and I believe the vet was just treating her for it to avoid dental surgery. She said "she" had acid reflex but did not refer to any dogs she knew. She said she had Dr. Couto's manual there(?) but she did not understand my dog's previous BW results which should have been a red flag. Anyway this relationship is over.

I am crazy about this dog and so upset seeing her suffer like this. It is so difficult finding a good vet here these days, even board certified.

One of my previous greys had pretty bad teeth and went to a board BC dentist but they messed up the anesthesia and hurt her. She suffered for the rest of her life.

 

[greysmom]

If you post your general geographic area, some of our Canadian folks might be able to suggest a vet with more greyhound experience.

[cleptogrey]

4 hours ago, Bogangles said:

I appreciate your responses.

I do not see any symptoms of acid reflex and I believe the vet was just treating her for it to avoid dental surgery. She said "she" had acid reflex but did not refer to any dogs she knew. She said she had Dr. Couto's manual there(?) but she did not understand my dog's previous BW results which should have been a red flag. Anyway this relationship is over.

I am crazy about this dog and so upset seeing her suffer like this. It is so difficult finding a good vet here these days, even board certified.

One of my previous greys had pretty bad teeth and went to a board BC dentist but they messed up the anesthesia and hurt her. She suffered for the rest of her life.

 

anesthesia has change so much over the past couple of years that you shouldn't run into the same post op complications. so, when you find your new vet do talk teeth removal. there is nothing worse than a mouth full of infected teeth. DH never had braces, minimal dental hygiene as a kid(big family/little $$) and went thru years of antibiotics, periodontal work etc. the infections do affect health in the long term. i have friend's who tried to save their GH's teeth- when they were finally removed the dog had a totally new personality!   lighting isn't going to strike twice when it comes to your past experience. 

good luck

[Bogangles]

Thank you for your messages. We are going to a new vet this week, so hopefully he will understand greys.

[Bogangles]

New vet did not work out -- did not understand greyhounds.

Originally the last vet did blood and urine tests. There is protein 4+ in the urine, specific gravity 1.045, PH 6.5, Glucose Ketone negative, Bacteria - non seen.

She also sent a script for Clindamycin to "help" her teeth infection knowing the urine test. I believe the roots of her one of her back teeth are exposed and the word furcation has been used in previous consultations.

I am concerned that antibiotics may affect the kidneys, especially with a dog that does not eat consistently.

It is difficult finding a vet these days (despite the fact there is one on every corner!). I think the covid situation has changed many things. Adoption agencies have closed down and greyhound get togethers have been cancelled.

They are not treating my dog responsibly. I am very concerned.

Does anyone have any experience or advice on this.

 

 

[BatterseaBrindl]

Exactly where in Ontario are you located?

Perhaps I can help find a new vet….

[Bogangles]

We are in Toronto (Bayview and 401). I think we are going to Innisfil to Alcona Animal Hospital. What do you think -- would love your input.

Thanks.

[BatterseaBrindl]

I’m east … north of Kingston but I’ll put out some feelers …

[Bogangles]

Thanks so much. I went through the list on the forum and noticed Cliff Redford. I called and he was in Poland helping animals over there -- he was on the news actually.

[BatterseaBrindl]

I’ll send you info in a PM…

[NeylasMom]

Violet had furcations in two of her upper molars and they weren't in and of themselves a problem. We used a tiny dental brush to keep them clean because they will easily trap gunk. I don't know what those brushes were called or how to describe them. More like a toothpick with a cylindrical narrow brush on the end that would actually insert into the furcation and move back and forth gently. 

[Bogangles]

Thank you NeylasMom. I have a tooth brush with a smaller brush on the other end. I try to brush very gently but she does not like it.

Were Violet's teeth ever taken out?

[NeylasMom]

One of the furcated ones eventually was, but the other wasn't. She lost other teeth, a lot of small little ones in the front and a couple of other random ones (she had bad teeth), but we never had to take them all out. She was 12 when I lost her to osteo. 

FYI, we only started using the little brush after she had her first dental. If your pup has diseased gums, brushing likely doesn't feel good. 

[Bogangles]

Hello NeylasMom. I read Violets issues earlier today and what you went through. It is terrible you lost her that way. It is so heartbreaking. And thank you for taking time to respond to my dogs issues -- it is kind of you.

[NeylasMom]

On 6/17/2022 at 9:26 PM, Bogangles said:

Hello NeylasMom. I read Violets issues earlier today and what you went through. It is terrible you lost her that way. It is so heartbreaking. And thank you for taking time to respond to my dogs issues -- it is kind of you.

Thank you, and no problem