New Grey Diarrhea Woes

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Hello everyone, I'm a new greyhound owner, and I couldn't be happier. Moon is the sweetest dog. She loves nothing more than taking a leisurely walk and then spending hours snoozing and cuddling and briefly tossing around a squeaky toy. She seems to be adjusting to retirement pretty well: her only 'accident' was her first night home, she whines when left alone (need a dog gate to leave the house without her escaping) but isn't noisy or destructive when I leave the house, and she's sleeping through the night and has a good appetite.

 

But therein lies her problem: Moon has been having the runs since day one (we're on day 12). I've been feeding her rice mixed with Iams green bag and Merrick grain free, the food I'm trying to switch her to. She was on antibiotics when I got her as she'd just been spayed, but she has since finished them and I've been giving her some probiotic treats. Immodium seems to have no effect. She has vomited a couple of times, but only a bit of yellow bile that I think is related to grass-eating, which I've since been discouraging. The adoption agency dewormed her, so I don't think that's the problem, but I'm still worried. I can't help myself, I'm in full-on new mom mode.

 

I've been reading/hearing about so many potential remedies--oatmeal, pumpkin, yogurt, etc.--that I'm frankly overwhelmed. Is there any accepted 'starting point' in terms of getting her on the road to a normal kibble diet? I just feel bad throwing different things at her, hoping that they'll work.

 

Anyway, I'm looking from advice from the pros: experienced greyhound owners. Moon and I thank you in advance!

[a_daerr]

Throwing more things at her is going to do more harm than good. Keep her on a bland diet (chicken or lean hamburger and rice or oatmeal) with the probiotic for a few days. I'm not sure what type you're using, but Forti-Flora is good. Our vet uses Endurosyn. You could also try Flagyl, which a GI-specific antibiotic you would need to get from the vet's office. The diarrhea should start to clear up. When you notice that happening, slowly introduce her back on the food she was eating before (I'm presuming that's the Iams?) If she does well on that, I don't see a reason to mess with it. But if you absolutely feel like you have to put her on another food, then do a gradual 25%-50%-75% switch over 10-14 days.

 

Keep in mind that what you are describing is VERY common. Stress is also a big factor. She's been through a lot in 12 days, including a new home and major surgery. I wouldn't dive too deep looking for problems unless the diarrhea does not improve following the bland diet. Good luck!

Edited May 8, 2013 by a_daerr

[Guest cvdrumsta]

See, that's what I figured about the throwing things at her. So you think I should eliminate kibble entirely for a while in favor of lean meats? I'm certainly willing to try that.

 

And I'll get more Iams, which was indeed what they were feeding her at the rescue. I only intended to switch her because Merrick is a very high quality kibble and I want the best for her, but better may not be best for her, I'm beginning to see.

 

I'll hit the grocery store tomorrow and pick up some chicken. What ratio of chicken to rice is best, keeping in mind that Moon needs to put on some weight?

 

Thanks so much, it really means a lot to me (and to Moon, I'm sure!)

[GreyTzu]

Pick one food and stick to it for a few weeks.

WORM her again and again, regardless of what the parasite poop test results are.

There is nothing wrong with grass eating.

[greysmom]

I would probably fast her for a couple meals at least before beginning a bland diet. Many people use rice as the carb, but I find that it goes through without any digestion. I have switched to using plain pasta or potato or sweet potato for a carb source, and whatever protein they can have - boiled ground meat (beef, chicken, turkey), baked or poached chicken breast, baked or poached tilapia (fish).

 

You'll need to be feeding a couple cups to make up a full meal, but you'll also want to begin with just a small amount. After fasting, start with a 1/2 c pasta and 1/2 c protein. If that seems to stay down, feed that much again in a few hours. Take a break and do two more feedings in the evening. If that goes OK, next day combine the amounts into a morning and evening meal. If that seems to do OK - no vomiting or diarrhea - you can increase the amount until she's eating about 2 c of food at each meal. I try and keep the amounts at a 50-50 ratio just because of the cost of protein.

 

Make sure she's drinking enough. Diarrhea can cause dehydration very quickly. If it starts again after resuming eating, she needs to see the vet.

 

You can try switching the protein source to see if she's allergic, but it's most likely a worm problem. As said above, you may need to do two or even three rounds of worming to fully resolve the problem. If you don't catch the stool sample at just the right time when the eggs are being shed, they can be missed.

[cleptogrey]

go to your vet, bring a stool sample and see what your vet decides. many dogs come loaded w/ lots of bacteria in their gut, home remedies often don't work. meds are needed to clean their guts up and it can take more than one round of meds to do the trick. i'm not prescribing flagyl, but it's a wonder drug that seems to do the trick unless there are other underlying causes- worms. then it can be panacure or maybe even both- only your vet will know what will do the trick. enjoy your new pup!

[Batmom]

Pick one food and stick to it for a few weeks.

 

WORM her again and again, regardless of what the parasite poop test results are.

 

There is nothing wrong with grass eating.

Ditto. That's at least 2 rounds of worming with a broad-spectrum wormer like Panacur.

 

If she was eating IAMS at the kennel and doing well on it, feed her IAMS. If she continues to do well on it, then after 6 months you can buy yourself a steak and have a little party for a job well done .

 

I wouldn't move her to "bland diet" without doing the above. Some folks' bland diet recipes would give every dog I've had instant blowout diarrhea, and likely some of my recipes would do the same to their dogs. Food tolerances can get pretty individual. If you absolutely needed to do the bland diet thing, best is a 24-hour fast and then canned Hills' ID.

[a_daerr]

You'll need to be feeding a couple cups to make up a full meal, but you'll also want to begin with just a small amount. After fasting, start with a 1/2 c pasta and 1/2 c protein. If that seems to stay down, feed that much again in a few hours. Take a break and do two more feedings in the evening. If that goes OK, next day combine the amounts into a morning and evening meal. If that seems to do OK - no vomiting or diarrhea - you can increase the amount until she's eating about 2 c of food at each meal. I try and keep the amounts at a 50-50 ratio just because of the cost of protein.

 

Make sure she's drinking enough. Diarrhea can cause dehydration very quickly. If it starts again after resuming eating, she needs to see the vet.

 

Yep, totally eliminate kibble for a few days. And I agree with everything here. I have a rice cooker (best $20 I ever spent). And I make a half cup of rice/oatmeal with a half cup of protein. Like greysmom said, you can use chicken, ground turkey, lean hamburger, whatever. I cook the rice in chicken stock instead of water and add in unflavored Pedialyte. Then once you get the diarrhea under control, gradually introduce kibble back WITH the bland diet. Start with a quarter cup each meal. If that goes over well, bump it up to a half cup. If everything is looking good at that point, try going back to the kibble.

[GeorgeofNE]

What BatMom said.

 

Way too much going on in this dog's new life to be worrying about switching foods.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

All right, thanks for all the advice, everyone. I'm in touch with my vet, so we'll see what she thinks tomorrow.

 

I think I'm going to start using a higher starch rice, like a short grain sushi rice. It's more expensive, but I'm hoping the higher starch content will bind her. And a_daerr, I've been cooking the rice in diluted chicken stock as she won't eat it otherwise.

 

Is it important that I cook the rice and chicken fresh at each meal, or can I cook it ahead of time and refrigerate it?

 

Thanks again.

[a_daerr]

And a_daerr, I've been cooking the rice in diluted chicken stock as she won't eat it otherwise.

 

You could even cook oatmeal in chicken stock! I've done that too. And just so you know, I'm not making this stuff up. This is exactly what the vet's office has told me to do when I was frantic, calling them saying, "Hey!! The dog has diarrhea, and I need help!" I even had a situation where my dog ate a tube of Neosporin (wiped out all the bacteria in his GI and was maybe the worst diarrhea I've ever seen). And this method cleared him up within a week.

 

Fast her (if necessary), bland diet, and probiotic. Give us an update when she starts feeling better.

[Batmom]

If you are going to feed rice, make sure you add extra water. You want it miserably mushy. Any long- or medium-grain white rice should be fine. I usually add @ 30% more water than called for and cook till it's all absorbed.

 

You can cook ahead and refrigerate. If it won't be eaten within 4-5 days, I freeze instead.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Okay, just got back from the supermarket. Moon's dinner tonight will be extra mushy short grain rice mixed with boiled chicken and a couple tablespoons of plain lowfat yogurt. We'll see how that goes.

[Batmom]

You might want to leave out the yogurt for now. Causes diarrhea in some dogs.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Hm, I only got the yogurt as she is recently off antibiotics, but we'll see how she does on just the chicken and rice. Thanks!

[Batmom]

Many dogs tolerate it, some don't. So, if you're trying to figure out what's causing gas, loose stool, etc., simpler is usually better . Hope she enjoys her dinner!

[Guest OPointyDog]

Agree with all above - over-cooked rice that's mushy, and boiled low-fat meats. Right now the ONLY thing that one of our dogs can eat without diarrhea is mushy rice and boiled hamburger, so I've gotten pretty good at making huge batches and freezing parts of it and pulling it out as needed. I even bought a rice cooker, which is fabulous. Hopefully you won't need it long-term.

 

There are a number of things your vet might suggest along with a bland diet. Flagyl and Tylan powder are both antibiotics that work to balance the good and bad bacteria in the gut, and both have anti-inflammatory properties, too. So your vet may decide to add that along with the bland diet.

 

One of our dogs is definitely lactose intolerant, and doesn't do well on yogurt, but does very well on FortiFlora. So your vet also might suggest a probiotic, but it varies a lot from dog to dog about whether this helps.

Edited May 8, 2013 by OPointyDog

[Feisty49]

Good advice here -- lots of it.

 

My advice is that when her diarrhea clears up, reintroduce Iams in the Green Bag. Trust me -- and the dozens of others on here who swear by Iams in the Green Bag -- try it. What *may* be considered great/good food isn't worth anything if your dog has loose poo. Seriously...don't worry about food ratings and what's good or bad. You'll read all different opinions about food on this forum as well as from general Google research. You'll need to remember that they are opinions and what works for individual dogs. It's not gospel.

 

The best food for your dog is the one that works. Don't get caught up in a high-end kibble just for the sake of the name. I reiterate: The best food your dog is what keeps her healthy and without soft-serve poos.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Feisty49

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Good advice here -- lots of it.

 

My advice is that when her diarrhea clears up, reintroduce Iams in the Green Bag. Trust me -- and the dozens of others on here who swear by Iams in the Green Bag -- try it. What *may* be considered great/good food isn't worth anything if your dog has loose poo. Seriously...don't worry about food ratings and what's good or bad. You'll read all different opinions about food on this forum as well as from general Google research. You'll need to remember that they are opinions and what works for individual dogs. It's not gospel.

 

The best food for your dog is the one that works. Don't get caught up in a high-end kibble just for the sake of the name. I reiterate: The best food your dog is what keeps her healthy and without soft-serve poos.

 

I bought a small bag of Iams Green Bag today for when she's ready. I only got the Merrick with the best intentions ... I wanted the best for my pup! But of course you're absolutely right: if filet mignon gives me the runs and a cheap cheeseburger doesn't, then forget the filet.

 

The good news is that the mushy high-starch short grain rice was a hit with the pup. At first she looked in the bowl, saw no kibble, and gave me the stink eye, but after a couple minutes, she was gobbling it up. Guess it took her a minute to find that chicken! I could count the number of grains of rice left on my hands, where with the cheaper rice she left behind a bunch of it. We'll see how it goes.

 

Again, I can't thank you all enough. Even though I volunteered at a rescue group for six months before adopting, the real thing is never quite like the book, and it's wonderful to have this support network.

 

<3

[a_daerr]

I even bought a rice cooker, which is fabulous.

 

Best $20 I ever spent! I use it for cooking rice and oatmeal, and there's even a top rack to poach the meat.

[cleptogrey]

Many dogs tolerate it, some don't. So, if you're trying to figure out what's causing gas, loose stool, etc., simpler is usually better . Hope she enjoys her dinner!

you said it batmom! leave out the yoguart. i say probiotics.

 

your rice cooker will be your best friend, i LOVE my aroma cooker which has a timer! and YES...i find that short grained white yummie rice better. it really breaks down if you add too much water. i buy 20# bags at the asian market. when ever there is a new crop something seems to go on sale- $9,99 for 20#

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Took a poop sample to the vet for a fecal float and Giardia test just a little while ago.

 

Two rice and chicken meals in, poop is still runny. We'll see how it goes.

 

Thanks again.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Poor Moon has hookworms!

 

Just gave her Heartgard at the vet's recommendation, and then I give her another dose of Ivermectin in two weeks.

 

Hope it works, the poor thing! D:

Edited May 9, 2013 by cvdrumsta

[Guest OPointyDog]

Oh yeah, that could definitely be contributing to the problem! They are tenacious - we had to have several rounds of dewormer to get rid of them here. It's a good idea to treat them aggressively!

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Oh yeah, that could definitely be contributing to the problem! They are tenacious - we had to have several rounds of dewormer to get rid of them here. It's a good idea to treat them aggressively!

 

I know! I just gave her her pill and then I give her this liquid in two weeks, and then another pill in four weeks. The vet sounded reasonably confident, but I feel pretty helpless. I mean, just one pill, and now all this waiting.

 

Plus I know they can form cysts in the muscles ... What do you do about that?