11-Year-Old Gh Whining/restless At Night

[Guest gleigh78]

Edited to add: Please help; I haven't had a decent night's sleep in months!

 

I've been dealing with this with my 11-year-old gh, Ajai, for a few years. It's only at night. He whines, refuses to walk in or out of a room (like he's stuck in the hallway), and wants to go hang out outside. He'll stay out there, ignoring me if I call him in, for about 30 minutes or so, then bark to come in when he's ready. He'll sleep for 20-30 minutes, then he's up again wanting out, only to want in again. Sometimes he wants to come in the bedroom, but he needs me to "escort" him in, so he whines at the door in the hallway until I get up and bring him in.

 

This comes and goes, intensity-wise, but it's never gone away. He's had multiple vet check-ups by multiple vets. At first -- about 6 years ago -- the vet said he was just afraid of the dark. Nothing physically wrong. A nightlight took care of it for a while. When that stopped working, we had to turn on the hallway light. About two years ago, we found that he had a thyroid problem. Pills took care of his levels and some mild aggression that formed b/c of that, but didn't fix the whining. About six months ago, he was diagnosed with SLO and lost all his nails. The whining was the same, no worse, unless he had *just* lost a nail -- and that was a scream, not a whine. Within the past 6 months, his eyes have gotten just a bit cloudy from glaucoma, but the vet said he *should* be able to see OK, not perfect, but no big deal.

 

I haven't wanted to put him on ClomiCalm or anything b/c during the day he's the laziest dog in the world, and not afraid of anything. I don't know what else to do, though -- like I said, any of the illnesses he's come down with over the years don't affect his nighttime behavior. And if it were pain-related, wouldn't he do this in the daytime as well? It's only at night. If I can't sleep b/c of his whining, and I go into "Ajai's room" -- the office, where we leave the light on -- to use the computer, he's quiet and goes to sleep. It's like he just wants me to be awake and with him so he can sleep.

 

Our vet is coming out to see him next Thursday. She has a mobile unit, so I plan to bring her in the house and show her exactly where he goes so she can see the house. We have five dogs total (3 gh's, 1 rott mix, 1 husky mix) and all but one are 9 years and up. We've dealt with a lot of ailments and illnesses over the years, but none of them have remotely touched this. If it's behavioral, I don't know what to do at this point at his age.

 

I live on a narrow, very curvy road in the country and there are no sidewalks to walk him. Two pedestrians have gotten hit by cars -- one killed -- on this road, so that's not an option. We also have an issue with people's loose dogs. This issue was going on before I moved here, when I lived in the suburbs and walked the dogs every day. We have a huge fenced yard for them, and they all run and play every day. I know that's not enough exercise, but since we've moved here, the rottie has lost 15 pounds and is in the best shape of her life. All the others are doing great too.

 

We have two DAP diffusers, one in the office where he likes to sleep, and one in our bedroom. Haven't noticed a difference.

 

Any suggestions? I'm guessing that at this point the only thing we can do is put him on a drug like ClomiCalm or something. We have a different gh who was on that for about 2 years, but his behavior was far different. He was insanely hyperactive and stressed. Ajai doesn't seem stressed, just insistent. And he's *never* been hyperactive.

Edited August 19, 2011 by gleigh78

[macoduck]

It almost sounds like it might be dementia. There is medication to help with that although the name escapes me. It's so hard to watch them get old.

[DesiRayMom]

Dementia, senility, I prefer to call it "elder confusion"

 

There are a few things my clinic used for this...Anipryl, Senelife, & a couple of others whose names escape me.

IMHO....worth a try. Unless someone can come up with another idea?

[Guest iconsmum]

Is he too cool? He might need to have a blankie wrapped over him when he's lying down to boost his body temp.. I think I'd get him a pair of pyjamas or, cheaper, put him in a large fleece sweatshirt and start cutting it down to fit him. The pj's might work better since his back legs and kidney area need to be covered up too. That might account for the fact that he's been whiny at night for a long time.

[JJNg]

I was initially thinking dementia (technically called cognitive dysfunction syndrome, or CDS, in dogs), but the OP mentioned that this started 6 years ago. Could it possibly be behavioral, based on your response to his whining, restless behavior? Maybe he's just learned that the insistent behavior at night gets him your attention and company?

 

If there was any stress or anxiety associated with this, I'd suggest trying a dose of Valium or Xanax at bedtime. I've used this successfully with several older dogs that were starting to show signs of CDS and keeping their owners up at night. Have you tried any natural or herbal supplements? I don't have as much experience in this area, but maybe this would be a situation where melatonin might be helpful?

[cleptogrey]

It almost sounds like it might be dementia. There is medication to help with that although the name escapes me. It's so hard to watch them get old.

it sounds exactly like my welsh terrier, cataracts, restlessness, confusion of day and night, he also had loss of hearing and started to urinate in his bed when he nested and tried to settle down. willie could not be crated(trying to contain the urine problem) not kept in the kitchen, he needed to be with the other dogs. i tried sedatives to calm him down hoping for a good nite's sleep, i had one stoned puppy pacing around the house(he was still panting and pacing and it was winter and my house is cold). it was really sad, a vivacious character who turned into a lost soul. when he became so disoriented(space wise he managed even w/ the cataracts) it was time, i couldn't see it myself, a good good friend who is a vet(not my vet) told me it just wasn't fair to let him suffer from dimentia any longer. i thank her for her wisdom even though it was a hard decision, he was the only dog i could not be with at his euthanisa.

 

i hope your vet finds something else, it's a difficult one.

[BatterseaBrindl]

I was initially thinking dementia (technically called cognitive dysfunction syndrome, or CDS, in dogs), but the OP mentioned that this started 6 years ago. Could it possibly be behavioral, based on your response to his whining, restless behavior? Maybe he's just learned that the insistent behavior at night gets him your attention and company?

 

 

I tend to agree with this, since it has been going on for a number of years.

If you have ruled out any physical discomfort/pain issues, then could it be that he has you 'well trained'?

[Guest gleigh78]

I was initially thinking dementia (technically called cognitive dysfunction syndrome, or CDS, in dogs), but the OP mentioned that this started 6 years ago. Could it possibly be behavioral, based on your response to his whining, restless behavior? Maybe he's just learned that the insistent behavior at night gets him your attention and company?

 

 

I tend to agree with this, since it has been going on for a number of years.

If you have ruled out any physical discomfort/pain issues, then could it be that he has you 'well trained'?

 

It may well be that he has me trained! I've always thought it was something else that the vets just couldn't find, but maybe that's wishful thinking. He can easily whine all night long. I tried for months to ignore it, but he will NOT be ignored.

 

As for him being cold -- it's like the older he's gotten, the warmer he is. Weird, right? I always thought it'd be the other way around. He has several fleeces (though no long-sleeve kind), one t-shirt, and two knitted coats. Whenever I try to put one on him, he pants, so I usually just leave them off. I do put them on him if it's snowed and I need to send him outside. Though he *loves* snow and I think he'd be happy without anything on.

 

Now for my "DUH" moment -- I put on the radio in Ajai's room last night, on an a.m. talk station, and he slept ALL NIGHT LONG. It was glorious! In the past, I've tried TV, music on the radio, and football on the radio, with no luck. Maybe my boy just hates music, football and TV. DH fed the dogs at 6:30, turned off the radio, and came back to bed for an hour. And what do you know, Ajai was up and whining all of a sudden!

 

Thanks so much for the responses. I'll talk to the vet next week about all of these.

[Guest Swifthounds]

What supplements do you give him?

[Guest gleigh78]

What supplements do you give him?

I don't give supplements anymore. I did for about 3 or 4 years, then when we moved, I got out of the habit in all the chaos -- and then realized that I didn't notice a difference in any of the dogs. I had been giving GH Gang glucosamine and MSM.

 

Right now he's only on .7 thyroxine for the thyroid. And as for vitamins, he gets 2 fish oil tablets twice a day and 400 IU of Vitamin E-400 for his SLO. He was on plenty of other meds when his SLO was acting up, but now he seems over it and I stopped using drugs besides the vitamins. Never noticed a difference in his behavior (besides stress/pain from the actual loss of each nail) during that treatment. The vet said he'd need to be on those for the rest of his life, but he hasn't had a recurrence since the initial attack last winter. I'd rather he not be drugged up if I can't tell that it's helping.

[greyhead]

I wonder if his thyroid values should be looked at again. That .7 dosage may have become a little high in his older years. Just a thought.

[cleptogrey]

Now for my "DUH" moment -- I put on the radio in Ajai's room last night, on an a.m. talk station, and he slept ALL NIGHT LONG. It was glorious! In the past, I've tried TV, music on the radio, and football on the radio, with no luck. Maybe my boy just hates music, football and TV. DH fed the dogs at 6:30, turned off the radio, and came back to bed for an hour. And what do you know, Ajai was up and whining all of a sudden!

 

Thanks so much for the responses. I'll talk to the vet next week about all of these.

 

i hope he's listening to npr! does he miss the radio at the kennel suddenly?

[Guest verthib]

Edited to add: Please help; I haven't had a decent night's sleep in months!

 

I've been dealing with this with my 11-year-old gh, Ajai, for a few years. It's only at night. He whines, refuses to walk in or out of a room (like he's stuck in the hallway), and wants to go hang out outside. He'll stay out there, ignoring me if I call him in, for about 30 minutes or so, then bark to come in when he's ready. He'll sleep for 20-30 minutes, then he's up again wanting out, only to want in again. Sometimes he wants to come in the bedroom, but he needs me to "escort" him in, so he whines at the door in the hallway until I get up and bring him in.

 

This comes and goes, intensity-wise, but it's never gone away. He's had multiple vet check-ups by multiple vets. At first -- about 6 years ago -- the vet said he was just afraid of the dark. Nothing physically wrong. A nightlight took care of it for a while. When that stopped working, we had to turn on the hallway light. About two years ago, we found that he had a thyroid problem. Pills took care of his levels and some mild aggression that formed b/c of that, but didn't fix the whining. About six months ago, he was diagnosed with SLO and lost all his nails. The whining was the same, no worse, unless he had *just* lost a nail -- and that was a scream, not a whine. Within the past 6 months, his eyes have gotten just a bit cloudy from glaucoma, but the vet said he *should* be able to see OK, not perfect, but no big deal.

 

I haven't wanted to put him on ClomiCalm or anything b/c during the day he's the laziest dog in the world, and not afraid of anything. I don't know what else to do, though -- like I said, any of the illnesses he's come down with over the years don't affect his nighttime behavior. And if it were pain-related, wouldn't he do this in the daytime as well? It's only at night. If I can't sleep b/c of his whining, and I go into "Ajai's room" -- the office, where we leave the light on -- to use the computer, he's quiet and goes to sleep. It's like he just wants me to be awake and with him so he can sleep.

 

Our vet is coming out to see him next Thursday. She has a mobile unit, so I plan to bring her in the house and show her exactly where he goes so she can see the house. We have five dogs total (3 gh's, 1 rott mix, 1 husky mix) and all but one are 9 years and up. We've dealt with a lot of ailments and illnesses over the years, but none of them have remotely touched this. If it's behavioral, I don't know what to do at this point at his age.

 

I live on a narrow, very curvy road in the country and there are no sidewalks to walk him. Two pedestrians have gotten hit by cars -- one killed -- on this road, so that's not an option. We also have an issue with people's loose dogs. This issue was going on before I moved here, when I lived in the suburbs and walked the dogs every day. We have a huge fenced yard for them, and they all run and play every day. I know that's not enough exercise, but since we've moved here, the rottie has lost 15 pounds and is in the best shape of her life. All the others are doing great too.

 

We have two DAP diffusers, one in the office where he likes to sleep, and one in our bedroom. Haven't noticed a difference.

 

Any suggestions? I'm guessing that at this point the only thing we can do is put him on a drug like ClomiCalm or something. We have a different gh who was on that for about 2 years, but his behavior was far different. He was insanely hyperactive and stressed. Ajai doesn't seem stressed, just insistent. And he's *never* been hyperactive.

 

What about trying a thundershirt at night? www.thundershirt.com I hear it really works. Also, what about Rescue Remedy? Give him a dropperful before going to bed each night.

[winnie]

Our 11 y/o greyhound, Faye Oops, will get restless and wander downstairs and bark if we leave our bedroom door open. She doesn't necessarily have to go potty either. Our problem was easily resolved by simply closing the door at night. Our pack of four greyhounds sleep in our bedroom at night. Being with her pack and not having the freedom to wander the house cured her of her 2 a.m. barking fits. She hasn't had any potty accidents in our bedroom either.

 

I hope that the radio is the solution you've been looking for!

[Guest gleigh78]

Our update: The vet has diagnosed Ajai with cognitive dysfunction (senile dementia). She prescribed 10 mg of a sedative called oxazepam to give him at night, and that seemed to work the first couple of nights. After that, not so much. One night, I even gave him a second one about 3 or 4 hours after the first, with no luck. So we scratched that after about a week. I don't like to give medications if they don't seem to have much effect. Maybe I should be giving it more time instead of quitting so quickly? Thoughts?

 

The radio doesn't seem to work anymore. I might try Winnie's suggestion with a little change... Maybe a baby gate on our bedroom door so that he can't get out but the cats can still move through the house. Or maybe a baby gate on the office door where he normally sleeps so he can't get out. Our dogs do have free run of the house at night, and this will probably confuse them at first, but it's worth a shot. Just can't mess with the cats because they are evil little things They'll stick their paws under the door and shake it if they find one closed.

 

Our vet also suggested that we try a cognitive dysfunction medication called Anipryl. We haven't tried it yet. Has anyone used that and had luck with it?

 

Other recommendations from the vet:

 

-- Hills diet called B/D (Any experience with this? We've had such a hard time finding a food that doesn't mess with his stomach and still is good for his lupus that I'm really hesitant to try switching again. He's on Nature's Balance fish & sweet potato)

-- 2000 IU Vitamin E per day (he's already on 1600 IU Vit E, no problem to add another pill)

-- 3 mg Melatonin per day

-- Increasing late evening activity so he's tired at night (I've tried and he's not receptive to this. Walks are the only thing he has ever been willing to do, activity-wise, and I used to literally pick him up off his dog bed even for those. I have seriously never met a lazier dog.)

-- Revisiting basic training commands late at night (I can try this. He's rarely treat-motivated but if I work with all five dogs at once, he sometimes gets interested.)

-- Shutting him out of the bedroom (Won't work -- I can hear him whining/barking across our whole house and outside.)

-- Spraying a can of compressed air at him when he gets too close (I can try this. Where do you go to buy compressed air??)

 

Now a new behavior has popped up, and hopefully it was just a one-time thing. I was sitting in the dining room at my sewing machine at around 11 p.m., putting strips of snaps overtop of the old, beaten-up velcro on Ajai's and Charley's belly bands. (Two of the greyhounds wear belly bands when no one's home b/c they have been caught peeing in the house. Sometimes they do pee in their belly bands. They're rarely home alone longer than 6 hours, and usually not that long.) Anyway, I was replacing the velcro with snaps so they'd hold on better, and Ajai walked in the room and laid down on a rug next to me. He often does that when I'm sewing. He had just come in from outside an hour earlier and had barked to tell me he was ready to come in, so I thought he was finished until morning. But nope -- he got up, walked a few paces into the kitchen, and peed on my new rug. I yelled, grabbed him and pulled him outside, and he finished out there. But he had peed all through the kitchen and mud room. So I got to wash all of the rugs in the mud room and steam clean the kitchen rug. Sigh. Hopefully this was a fluke! If it happens again, he'll have to wear the belly band even when we're home.

[winnie]

Getting old sucks... both for people and our pets.

[Guest gleigh78]

I know, Winnie! My poor little guy. I've always jokingly called him my little old man, because he was such an old soul as soon as I got him at age 2. But now he really is my little old man, and it's not so funny anymore.

 

There's so much to say that I forgot a big piece of the puzzle. Ooops. Ajai's thyroid panel (full panel, not just T4) finally came back on Tuesday and the vet said it was on the high end of normal. So she's taking him down from .8 thyroxine to .4 thyroxine -- just splitting our pills in half -- to see if that has any effect. Fingers crossed!

 

Also, to verthib -- I've considered a thundershirt. Does anyone have experience in whether they work for this situation? Most of the examples I found when I looked them up a few weeks ago have more to do with storms. He's one of only two of my dogs that aren't afraid of thunderstorms! And I could try Rescue Remedy as well. I need to get refills for his DAP diffusers; I could add some Rescue Remedy into that order.

Edited September 8, 2011 by gleigh78

[Guest LindsaySF]

I would restrict his area at night. Chase (age 14) will wander endlessly if given the opportunity. I prop a baby gate between my bed and dresser, it makes a little "crate" for her, then she lays down and goes to sleep. At random times she will get up during the night, stand at the gate looking longingly at the other side , but then she gives up and goes back to sleep.

 

Excess thyroid supplementation could very well have an effect. I'd be curious to see if cutting the dose makes a difference.

 

A thundershirt can't hurt. A cheaper option might just be some jammies. Sometimes they achieve the same effect by wrapping around the dog.

 

I wouldn't bother switching his food, not if he's doing well on it. Melatonin can't hurt. I wouldn't use any aversives like compressed air. If he's senile, he doesn't know any better, and the air won't "teach" him anything, it will just scare him.

 

As for the peeing, if it's a one time occurrence, I'd chalk it up to an accident (maybe he didn't go when he was outside, or forgot he had to go until it was too late). If it continues I'd get a urinalysis done.

 

Good luck!

 

 

 

~Lindsay~

[GeorgeofNE]

I don't understand why a vet who has said she thinks he has CCD would also suggest spraying him with compressed air when he whines?

 

He's either senile, or not. And if he is, no amount of behavior modification is going to change anything.

 

I don't think it's CCD. Not if he's been doing this for six years.

[Guest gleigh78]

The latest update: He's MUCH better. I think that it was mainly the thyroid being out of whack again. For what it's worth, the vet did suggest that I try just the lower dose of thyroxine before putting him on the cognitive dysfunction meds. Since the thyroxine seems to have helped the worst of the problem, I won't be using any more meds.

 

He still acts somewhat weird, and I do suspect that he has the beginning stages of dysfunction. He's not waking up all night anymore, but he won't go back to sleep after about 6 a.m. Which I can deal with -- it's been too early for our schedules up until now, but once the baby comes in December, and I go back to work in February or so, my schedule will change to be that early (or earlier) anyway, so I'm just retraining myself now. I go to bed at 10:30 now (I used to wait up to see my husband when he got home from work between midnight and 1 a.m.) and wake up around 5:30 to let Ajai out. I go back to sleep till he barks to tell me he's ready to come back in, which is around 6 a.m. I try to keep myself awake at that point, then feed the dogs at 6:30. If I go back to bed when Ajai comes in at 6, he whines, but at least I've typically had a full night's sleep and he's not waking me up every hour anymore! Every once in a while I have a bad night without my old man's help (courtesy of a pregnant and painful body), and those mornings I often go back to sleep after I feed at 6:30. Ajai does not appreciate this and he'll whine. By this point, the house isn't dark anymore, so I don't think his eyes have much to do with it. (He has a little glaucoma and his eyes don't dilate the way they should, but he doesn't seem affected by this, as far as I can tell.)

 

Incidentally, if I take a nap on a weekend during the day, Ajai doesn't care. He also doesn't get "stuck" in the kitchen or refuse to go in and out of rooms without me. It's just between, say, 1 a.m. and 8 a.m. that seems to be a problem. As I just wrote that, an idea came to me. His buddy Charley (another GH) is almost always with him in the office (Ajai's room) after DH & I wake up. Charley also typically stays with Ajai if I take a nap. But Charley always sleeps in the bedroom with us at night, and Ajai isn't comfortable in the bedroom, so they're separated then. Hmmmm...

[greyhead]

We have nightlights here and there for our 11-year-old, whose night vision has deteriorated due to nothing but age. We recently found some motion-detecting ones that we've perched on the sides of the stairs so he can change levels at night and come up higher if he gets cold downstairs. I'm really glad Aja is doing so much better! Cutting the thyroid med in half is a pretty huge change, although clearly the right thing to do at this time. Don't be surprised if you need to take it back up one or two notches after while.