Hobbes Is Doing Poorly - Advice Needed

[Fiona3]

After a year of struggling with Irritable Bowel Disease, Hobbes had been doing well with diet control alone for about 3 months. Then about 3 weeks ago he suddenly developed explosive diarrhea, had another bout of vertigo, and just didn't look good. Flagyl again made the situation worse and Lomotil & Sulfasalizine were ineffective at best. Our vet finally placed him on limited Prednisone doses and and new restricted diet of Hills ZD food. He started to improve at first, then within a few days his bowels became watery. In desperation I gave him 2 Immodium and the next day he was solid. Our vet had us give him Immodium for two days and he was greatly improved - she had us skip a day and it was immediate return to diarrhea the day after. She is now placing him on 1 Immodium for the next 3 days and hoping it will help calm his bowels. She is concerned about doing this long-term.

 

As the Immodium seems to be the only safe medication that doesn't irritate his system, I wondered if anyone had given Immodium on a regular basis to help with IBD? Hobbes seems sensitive to just about all medication given to him. We are going to send another stool sample out for testing but our only other option now is to have him tested with a colonoscopy and at his age of 13 I am very concerned about putting him thru this.

 

Except for the bowels and his wobbling legs, he seems happy and content. I am just so worried about my precious boy! I appreciate any advice you may have.

[Finnsliz]

My only experience with Immodium was Birdie's overdose. I didn't realize that it was an opiate

 

I hope the course of treatment does the trick for poor Hobbes. Good luck Fiona

Edited June 29, 2007 by Finnsliz

[Guest MorganKonaAlex]

Morgan has mild IBD. He was on Imodium for several months at a time while we were searching for the best solution.

[Burpdog]

3 days of immodium doesn't seem excessive to me.

 

Have you tried fiber caps? Or just sprinkling metamucil on his food? Have you tried boiled meat only? Has he had any allergy tests?

[Fiona3]

Thanks everyone - it was determined thru trial and error over the past year that he has food allergies that are contributing to the IBD. His bowels have been so inflammed and sensitive during this last bout that the tiniest alteration seems to set him off (unfortunately meat is on the list of offenders - he would love to be given a diet of boiled chicken and meat but that has not worked well for him). Even the Pumpkin I added faithfully and once worked liked a charm is adding to the problem.

 

MorganKonaAlex - do you remember what dose and how often Morgan was taking the Immodium? This information would be good to give to my vet. And this seems to be the only "safe" medicine that works to stop his diarrhea.

 

Hobbes is my big baby and the sweetest boy - I so much want to do the right thing for him and make him comfortable.

[Burpdog]

With Boggles, Marilyn had to change the protein source many times. There was a period where rabbit worked, then venison, etc. Have you emailed her? She has a lot of experience.

[Fiona3]

With Boggles, Marilyn had to change the protein source many times. There was a period where rabbit worked, then venison, etc. Have you emailed her? She has a lot of experience.

 

I just sent off an e-mail to Marilyn - I am open to all ideas and information, especially from someone so experienced with greyhounds.

Thanks for your help - Mary

 

[Guest BooMooandDoo]

I say go with novel proteins. . . . Something he's never had. . .Kangroo, Brushtail, Venison, Bison. . . . stay with those. .and only those until he stabilizes. You also have to READ THE LABEL. . . .

 

Though something my say lamb. . .it could have chicken, turkey, fish. . further down the ingredient list. This happens all the time.

 

PM if you need some ideas on novel protein foods.

 

We have one with food allergies/ibd and taking him off all poultry has worked wonders!!

[Guest lizmego]

Thanks everyone - it was determined thru trial and error over the past year that he has food allergies that are contributing to the IBD. His bowels have been so inflammed and sensitive during this last bout that the tiniest alteration seems to set him off (unfortunately meat is on the list of offenders - he would love to be given a diet of boiled chicken and meat but that has not worked well for him). Even the Pumpkin I added faithfully and once worked liked a charm is adding to the problem.

 

MorganKonaAlex - do you remember what dose and how often Morgan was taking the Immodium? This information would be good to give to my vet. And this seems to be the only "safe" medicine that works to stop his diarrhea.

 

Hobbes is my big baby and the sweetest boy - I so much want to do the right thing for him and make him comfortable.

What kind of "meat"? Chicken, Beef, Pork, Turkey, Bison, Salmon??? Have you had any allergy tests done? Basically, you need to find out what he's allergic to - rice? oatmeal? flaxseed? potatoes? Any ingredient that is found in commercial foods need to be tested for to determine his allergies. The IBD is most likely caused by his allergic reactions. So you get rid of the ingredient that is causing the allergies and hopefully his IBD will clear up. Giving Immodium and continuing to feed the ingredient that he is allergic to is not solving the problem. You're just messing with the symptoms, that I would think would compound upon themselves over time, when even Immodium won't work anymore. Does that make sense?

 

I'll PM you.

[DustysMom]

A friend of mine used Tylan powder for her dog who had colitis. It was the only thing that worked in her case.

[Fiona3]

Lizmego - I got your e-mail and I've read the information. What you say does make sense. So far he has been allergic to beef, chicken, lamb, bison, pork but seemed to be doing well on California Natural Salmon products. Unfortunately, after 3 months he developed an allergy to salmon. We were hoping the ZD diet which is hypo-allergenic would do the trick when his bowel makes the adjustment. And the Immodium is only a stop-gap until we can get the diet under control. I was hoping to continue using it until we solve the problem. I'm going to suggest to my vet that we get an updated allergy test performed and see where to go from there. We really are going one-day-at a time and my vet calls me every day for an update.

[Guest SquanHound]

I would agree that while the immodium will help with the current flare up, you need to find the correct food for him for a long term solution. If there are allergies then try doing one protein, one carb style dinners (cook white fish and potato, if that doesn't work try white fish and rice, if that doesn't work then try chicken and rice and so on until you can isolate what agrees with him and what doesn't). We had great success by moving our IBD boy onto a very high fiber diet (Hills w/d) and according my vet she has tried that on a few of her IBD patients and with mixed success (depending on the pup), but done particular well on greys for whatever reason.

 

Also, instead of immodium you can also ask you vet if they can prescribe Endosorb. This works better than immodium for my IBD boy. My vet has prescribed up to a week on this if need be, but generally it works with 24 hours.

 

[Guest pappiea]

One of my greys has a mild IBD. For her the culprit has been wheat. All types of wheat. We have to read everything. Particularly, biscuits. She uses Eukanuba low residue. Luckily, none of the boiled meats are a problem, so they are added to her kibble. Will keep good thought for your boy

[Guest greytmonty]

Lizmego - I got your e-mail and I've read the information. What you say does make sense. So far he has been allergic to beef, chicken, lamb, bison, pork but seemed to be doing well on California Natural Salmon products. Unfortunately, after 3 months he developed an allergy to salmon. We were hoping the ZD diet which is hypo-allergenic would do the trick when his bowel makes the adjustment. And the Immodium is only a stop-gap until we can get the diet under control. I was hoping to continue using it until we solve the problem. I'm going to suggest to my vet that we get an updated allergy test performed and see where to go from there. We really are going one-day-at a time and my vet calls me every day for an update.

If the Z/D doesn't work, have you tried H/A? Also prescription hypoallergenic food.

 

[Guest MorganKonaAlex]

MorganKonaAlex - do you remember what dose and how often Morgan was taking the Immodium? This information would be good to give to my vet. And this seems to be the only "safe" medicine that works to stop his diarrhea.

It was several years ago and I didn't keep detailed notes at the time. I think it was 1 Imodium every 12 hours, but I can't be sure. After he was stabilized, we switched foods and were able to wean him off all medications.

[lovinggreysslp]

You have gotten excellent advice already from above posts. I'll just add a couple things from our experiences with Clay who was diagnosed with IBD in December. Firstly, what works for one dog with IBD does not necessarily work for another. Keeping a journal with current food and meds and how Hobbes is doing (stool wise) can be very helpful in the long run. Making only one food or medicine change at a time is also important. Also, I second the idea of trying Tylan powder. We order it online and our vet told use how much to use. It made a huge difference in Clay's case. Another life saver for Clay has been Propectalin tablets (similar to immodium) which also contain a probiotic. Please feel free to pm if you have any questions. I belong to an dogs with IBD yahoo group and have learned so much from other dog owners experiences. Best of luck as you find what works best for Hobbes.

[Remolacha]

IBD is such a frustrating situation! I was lucky in that Flagyl works well for Fletcher, so I only had to use Imodium back before we knew what the problem was. You may have to keep changing his diet, since it sounds like he does ok for a while and then gets sensitive to an ingredient. I only have a couple of things to add to the great advice you've gotten. Fletcher does better with oatmeal than rice, potatoes, or pasta, don't know if you've tried that. Also, he can't do any veggies, so think about "minor" ingredients as well when you are eleminating things.

 

edited because my fingers move faster than my brain!

Edited June 29, 2007 by jbuckwal

[Fiona3]

Thank you all for the really wonderful advice - I have printed out your ideas and plan to review them with our vet tomorrow to come up with a new plan.

 

Although Hobbes has been gobbling up the ZD diet, he is suddenly on a hunger strike tonight and won't eat anything for supper. I am afraid to give him any food that will "set him off" with more diarrhea. He kept looking at the bowls of food the other dogs had and just gave me that "Why Me?" look. I'll try feeding him again later on but this just adds to the concern I have for him.

 

This really is so frustrating - I can think of tons of food that would spark his appetite but I don't dare give him any of it.

[lovinggreysslp]

Our vet and I can certainly agree that IBD is very frustrating.

Clay would occasionally either refuse food or eat very slowly (normally inhales his food). I would give him a dose of the propectalin (since for Clay the refusal was a sign that his stomach was hurting/and or gas pains) and he would be back to eating 15 minutes later. Others on the yahoo group have noted that some of their hounds like the ZD and some do not. Clay eats his prescription dog food and nothing else. I go so far as to muzzle him at all times when he is in the backyard to avoid eating of any grass, wildlife, greyhound droppings etc. I would encourage you to "stay the course" and have him eat his current food only. I just learned this tip on making dog treats from dry kibble: put 1 cup dry kibble in blender and grind it up (will be like course flour), add enough water to make into a paste, drop by heaping teaspoons onto an ungreased cookie sheet, bake at 375 for 20 minutes. Even though the taste should be the same, Clay absolutely loves his treats!! If you are interested in the propectalin I have given a link below.

http://www.vetsolutions.com/Products/hando...propectalin.pdf

[Guest MZH]

Tylan works very well with some dogs. My vet knows of greyhounds who need to be on it for life. If they stop getting it the big D starts again.

 

If you are really desperate you might want to ask your vet about trying Entocort EC. I have chronic diarrhea and this stops it. So does methylprednisolne (Medrol pack), but that's not a safe thing to take for long-term use. The Entocort is a bit safer as it acts mainly in the gut. Sometimes it needs to be taken only for 2-3 months as it gives the intestine time to heal.

 

It is also very expensive, but it's given me my life back and is worth every penny to me. My vet has given it to pets with special needs. It works great for pets and us humans.

 

Marcia

 

[JerseyGirlInOz]

Have you considered trying a probiotic?

 

I give mine a half-teaspoon of InLiven Probiotic Superfood daily, but you would probably need to start with 1/8th tsp and gradually build up to one teaspoon, preferably 2x/day.

 

In most cases, food allergies/sensitivities result from an inability of the digestive tract to break down the proteins contained in the foods. Probiotics help restore the bacterial balance of the digestive system and aid the digestive process by helping to break down proteins, carbs and fats more efficiently. A natural result of this the reduction (and in most cases, elimination) of diarrhea, constipation and vomiting.

 

And like Tylan, it's great for humans too.

[Guest mleg2001]

THe problem with giving long term is that is can cause the liver to cease functioning properly

 

Have you considered seeking a holistic vet?

 

scroll about 1/2 half way down the page

 

http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/ahealth.htm

[Lilysmom]

I'm sorry your pup and you are dealing with this. I'm no expert and I'm sure your vet has thought about this. I would be afraid to use Immodium long term. It can cause colitis in humans (which causes diarrhea) so I can only imagine what long term use would do to a dog.

 

Wishing you all the best and I hope your sweet pup is feeling better.

[Guest argolola]

Hobbes will be in my prayers.

[Fiona3]

I'm going to be talking to the vet today and review the ideas that everyone has suggested. Hobbes seems to be feeling better now that the Prednisone dose has been scaled back. His legs don't seem as wobbly so he went for two "tiny" walks down the street and back yesterday. His dose of Immodium was one pill per day Thurs-Sat. and then discontinued on Sunday. This morning he was back to all liquid again so clearly we need some kind of help in getting his intestines to calm while he adjusts to a new diet. His appetite is a little off this morning but that could be due to stomach cramping.

 

Other than the diarrhea, he seems happy & reasonably healthy for a 13 year old. If only we can get this IBD under control.

 

Thanks for all your help - this has been a rollercoaster ride and its nice to know I can come here for some wonderful and experienced advice.