Possible Cranial Cruciate Injury, Or Maybe His Spine!

[Riverhound]

I mostly need to vent (rant). Maybe this should be in soapbox?

 

We took Joe to a fancy (expensive) ortho guy, who did a very comprehensive (painful) exam this afternoon. No x-rays, so I starved the poor dog for no reason! He said, well geez, could be his knee, could be his back, I really dunno. Rest him up for 8 weeks and come see me again (for another gazillion dollar exam -- not covered by the insurance, I don't think?) if he's not all better. Maybe he needs surgery, maybe he doesn't. Maybe he has LS, maybe he doesn't. We're just gonna wait and see if he gets better or worse. (But it's NOT cancer, so really I can't complain too much! Except I am complaining, cause I want answers. Damn it. ) And I know it's not the vet's fault that Joe's a weird-o who might have a bizarre injury for a greyhound. But Grrrrrrr.

 

So, no stairs, no sofa, no upsie-downsie obedience training. No running, no stuffies, no playing. NO FUN. We bought a gazillion treats and things to stuff in Kongs right after the vet trip, and Joe got McDonald's. I think DH will be ordering doggie puzzles, and I'm going to reread the keeping an invalid entertained threads. He'll be overweight when this is over.

 

And, I finally got DH totally on board with chipping after Joe got all goofy with the girlie-hounds in Dewey. Now we have to put it off until Doofus is better, cause the girlie-hound will just make him want to tear around like a lunatic.

 

So, please wish us luck for an easy 8 weeks and a fully recovered houndie. I'm afraid we'll all be stir-crazy before too long.

[greytpups]

Best wishes for a speedy and complete recovery. Joe you need to heal up quickly so you can get a new brother or sister.

[OwnedBySummer]

Good luck and get better fast, Joe!

 

Re insurance: If the vet doesn't call it an "exam" and instead, you get him to break it down into individual tests with individual pricing... your insurance will probably cover it because now it's diagnostics.

[Time4ANap]

Feel better soon, Joe !!!! No craziness.

 

Word of warning for Mom and Dad - do not let him loose in the yard when it snows- he will probably do zoomies. Rocket is a nutcase for the first couple of snows, or anytime there is fresh powder on top of existing snow.

[tbhounds]

Is your hound limping?? Not sure why your vet didn't take survey rads to try to pin point his point of pain. At the very least he/she should take some spine films-- no seds required. What meds did they dispense??

Edited to add- wait 8 weeks??? Huh?? Don't mean to scare you but, what if there's some badness lurking about?

Edited November 11, 2011 by tbhounds

[Riverhound]

Is your hound limping?? Not sure why your vet didn't take survey rads to try to pin point his point of pain. At the very least he/she should take some spine films-- no seds required. What meds did they dispense??

 

Joe is very gimpy on his left hind leg, moderately gimpy right hind leg. My vet got a big pain reponse (scream) on the left knee, this guy got it on the right. We had films from our regular vet, which are on another thread & were sent to OSU -- they seemed confused, too. I have Rimadyl from the local vet, and can get more. The ortho guy/surgeon says to only use it "as needed" not 2x daily as my vet prescribed. I kinda get that, cause Joe's a lunatic when he feels good, and he needs to be calm now -- but I don't want him hurting at all. He did mention possibly using tranquilizers if Joe gets really nuts with all the resting. My vet's closed tomorrow, but I'll be calling her to see what she has to say, and to get painkillers. Joe's a crazyman. This is going to be HARD.

 

I'm thinking that if the pain is bilateral, it's more likely spinal/referred spinal pain than the knee/cruciate ligaments (and cruciate problems are rare with these guys). But, WTH do I know? I'm just the worried mom!

[tbhounds]

Might want to try him on gabapentin-- great for spinal/nerve pain.

Edited to add-- did the Dr evaluate your hound for a possible iliopsoas strain??

Edited November 11, 2011 by tbhounds

[Riverhound]

Might want to try him on gabapentin-- great for spinal/nerve pain.

Edited to add-- did the Dr evaluate your hound for a possible iliopsoas strain??

 

Thank you! That's a wonderful idea. "Iliopsoas strain" -- what's that? Here I come, Google!

[Guest Greyt_dog_lover]

We deal with broken leg hounds on a regular basis (all my fosters are recovering from some trauma), its not as difficult as you may think. Just get out the crate and be sure that the crate is in an area where you spend most of your time. They sleep pretty much all day anyway. Give them a few toys in their crate, a few days a week a raw bone or antler and they dont even realize they are in a crate.

 

Chad

[GeorgeofNE]

LS is easy to diagnose. A 100% confirmation is more tricky, but the treatment is exactly the same whether the vet suspects or is sure--I'm surprised he couldn't/wouldn't at least rule that out.

[Riverhound]

LS is easy to diagnose. A 100% confirmation is more tricky, but the treatment is exactly the same whether the vet suspects or is sure--I'm surprised he couldn't/wouldn't at least rule that out.

 

George has LS, right? What was it like early on?

 

I think this ortho-guy is good -- but I also feel he's looking for money. Like, let's not do more X-rays on the first visit, let's wait till I can charge another exam fee. (But I'm a very suspicious person in general!) I'm just really not pleased that the pricey vet gave no more insight into what's wrong with Joe than the local vet; and that he said the most likely problem is the one OSU ruled out (cruciate ligament injury). But again, WTH do I know!

[tbhounds]

LS is easy to diagnose. A 100% confirmation is more tricky, but the treatment is exactly the same whether the vet suspects or is sure--I'm surprised he couldn't/wouldn't at least rule that out.

 

George has LS, right? What was it like early on?

 

I think this ortho-guy is good -- but I also feel he's looking for money. Like, let's not do more X-rays on the first visit, let's wait till I can charge another exam fee. (But I'm a very suspicious person in general!) I'm just really not pleased that the pricey vet gave no more insight into what's wrong with Joe than the local vet; and that he said the most likely problem is the one OSU ruled out (cruciate ligament injury). But again, WTH do I know!

Don't sell yourself short--- you do know that acl injuries are super rare in gh's.

[JJNg]

I think this ortho-guy is good -- but I also feel he's looking for money. Like, let's not do more X-rays on the first visit, let's wait till I can charge another exam fee. (But I'm a very suspicious person in general!)

Just an observation...if the vet was looking for money, he would have done more x-rays on that first visit, while he had you in the office. Many clients never return for a follow-up appointment...

 

Sorry the specialist wasn't able to give you a more definite answer than your regular vet. Some cases are just difficult and 'don't read the book.' Hoping it's nothing serious and that Joe improves with rest. Are there any vets in your area that specialize in rehab and sports medicine? Any that do acupuncture or chiropractic work? Those may be other options to consider. Our local rehab specialist does a more thorough exam than most of the orthopedic surgeons I know.

[Finnsliz]

I went through similar scenarios with my late greyt Finn. I never got definitive answers. When the last exam's suggestion was a VERY COSTLY MRI that

is when I started to smarten up. My advice is to go with the path less invasive. Really rest him.

 

I trusted my local vet more than the surgeon expert and more importantly my local vet trusts me.

 

The other big issue with greyhounds is the "high drama vs shut down factor" Most greyhounds shut down in response to the big pain. Exams can show very inconsistant reactions to pain. They are sometimes very frustrating for their vets .....hard to weed out the stress shut down factor from real pain.

Good luck with your pup. It always sucks to see them in pain.

 

 

 

Oh btw... what the expert was suggesting was the problem that needed surgery... WASN'T

[Guest Swifthounds]

I'll second the gabapentin recommendation. . Has worked for nerve pain in several of my hounds.

 

I would also refer you to the LS test in Dr. Stack's literature. Someone here can post the link, I'm sure. It's the best way to get an LS answer.

 

I don't think the vet skipped the rads to make more money. I suspect he/she knew enough to know he/she wasn't finding a definitive answer and that you had already had rads that didn't.

[Riverhound]

I think this ortho-guy is good -- but I also feel he's looking for money. Like, let's not do more X-rays on the first visit, let's wait till I can charge another exam fee. (But I'm a very suspicious person in general!)

Just an observation...if the vet was looking for money, he would have done more x-rays on that first visit, while he had you in the office. Many clients never return for a follow-up appointment...

 

Sorry the specialist wasn't able to give you a more definite answer than your regular vet. Some cases are just difficult and 'don't read the book.' Hoping it's nothing serious and that Joe improves with rest. Are there any vets in your area that specialize in rehab and sports medicine? Any that do acupuncture or chiropractic work? Those may be other options to consider. Our local rehab specialist does a more thorough exam than most of the orthopedic surgeons I know.

 

 

I'll second the gabapentin recommendation. . Has worked for nerve pain in several of my hounds.

 

I would also refer you to the LS test in Dr. Stack's literature. Someone here can post the link, I'm sure. It's the best way to get an LS answer.

 

I don't think the vet skipped the rads to make more money. I suspect he/she knew enough to know he/she wasn't finding a definitive answer and that you had already had rads that didn't.

 

I'm glad to know you both think the vet's intentions were good! I'm ridiculously suspicious of any doctor, and for no good reason! Also lawyers, bankers, mechanics -- pretty much the whole human race. It's good to have the perspective of folks who aren't as loony as I.

 

It seems like rest and pain meds are the answer for now. Joe's not happy about the rest part, but he loooves the rimadyl tablets. And the extra pig ears, Kong stuffers, etc. Spoiled brat!

[Guest Scouts_mom]

I would really suggest that you look into a vet who does accupunture. My old girl Tia had problems with her hind legs and spine that we couldn't identify. The ortho person wanted to do MRIs and then surgery which I could not afford. I found a vet who did accupunture and decided to try that first. It was much cheaper and if it didn't work, at least it would not make anything worse, It took a couple sessions, but I really saw a vast improvement. Never did have to have the MRI.