Greyhound Suffering

[GreyTzu]

Dancer had her spleen removed and had no issues at all from it. She lived a healthy 8 years afterwards.

[pokealong]

Are you sure it is a TBD? My vet diagnosed my girl with immune mediated. Took her to OSU and Dr. Couto was convinced it was some bacterial infection, although she tested negative for everything, including valley fever. Note - Spleen not enlarged. Did a bone aspirate and she has leukemia. Dr. Couto was more than shocked.

[Guest 4greys]

Second opinion needed. Are you located near a University or referral center? Find it weird that they are relying on a fecal culture only w/o doing further diagnostics.

 

Yes I will be calling Dr. Couto at Ohio State University on this situation, hope we can get his file faxed to him for a consultation.

[duncan41]

Prayers for your pup. Please keep us posted on the progression of this mystery!

[Guest GentleHugs]

Valley Fever (also known as Coccidioidomycosis) is caused by a fungal spore that's found in the soil in the desert southwest. When the spores in the soil are disturbed, they go airborne. Usually they are inhaled so you can not see them, smell them or taste them.

 

Dogs do not have to race or stay in the southwest for any long period of time to contract VF. They could be just passing through during the season that VF spores are prevailent in the air. All it takes it one sniff of one spore and that one spore will grab hold.

 

VF can be treated with anti fungal meds but most generally it's a life long treatment. They can have relapses off and on. The hardest part to get through with a dog that's been diagnosed with VF is when they go anorexic. You have to force them until you can get them over that anorexic period.

 

Humans can contract VF but it really strikes the dogs hard.

 

A friend of mine had a Greyhound diagnosed with it a few years ago. She fought hard to get him through that anorexic stage but once he was through that part, he did fine and continued with meds until he went to the bridge a couple of years ago. It's been awhile since I did any research on VF but it can also mimmick bone cancer if the vet is not familiar with VF symptoms and what to look for. It can also strike the brain, too.

 

To test for VF, they have to do a special blood titer test. There's a few vets in Arizona who are well versed in diagnosing and treating VF.

 

Hope this helps and I hope they can find out exactly what's wrong with your baby, too, so they can administer the proper treatment.

 

 

[gracegirl]

In March of 2008, Ethan tested positive 1:80 for Babesia canis, treated with Doxy (incorrectly).

In April of 2009, Ethan tested negative 1:40 for Babesia canis..........

So with all this being said, what would you suggest? Run the tets again? Start treatment with the correct meds even though the test is negative at this time?

 

Where in Washington State are you? Which group do you work with to adopt your greys? You say your vet sees "a lot" of greys...but then was treated incorrectly for a TBD, which are fairly common in greys. In addition, a titer of 1:80 is still a pretty low titer for babesia. What symptoms of Babesia was Ethan showing when he was incorrectly treated with Doxy?

 

I used to live in Seattle and could recommend a place to take your grey for a second opinion if you'd like. In addition, I'd be happy to get you in touch with some friends affiliated with a group up there who have some fantastic vets they could also refer you to.

 

Best of luck with whatever you decide. After the incorrect treatment for the Babesia I'd be researching the heck out of anything my vet recommended at this point.

Edited May 12, 2009 by gracegirl

[Guest houndlover]

How do they know that the spleen is enlarged and that it has a fungal infection? I am dealing with a spleen issue with one of my dogs and they would like to remove his spleen too but I am not ready to do that either so I definitely understand your dilemma.

[Guest 4greys]

Valley Fever (also known as Coccidioidomycosis) is caused by a fungal spore that's found in the soil in the desert southwest. When the spores in the soil are disturbed, they go airborne. Usually they are inhaled so you can not see them, smell them or taste them.

 

Dogs do not have to race or stay in the southwest for any long period of time to contract VF. They could be just passing through during the season that VF spores are prevailent in the air. All it takes it one sniff of one spore and that one spore will grab hold.

 

VF can be treated with anti fungal meds but most generally it's a life long treatment. They can have relapses off and on. The hardest part to get through with a dog that's been diagnosed with VF is when they go anorexic. You have to force them until you can get them over that anorexic period.

 

Humans can contract VF but it really strikes the dogs hard.

 

A friend of mine had a Greyhound diagnosed with it a few years ago. She fought hard to get him through that anorexic stage but once he was through that part, he did fine and continued with meds until he went to the bridge a couple of years ago. It's been awhile since I did any research on VF but it can also mimmick bone cancer if the vet is not familiar with VF symptoms and what to look for. It can also strike the brain, too.

 

To test for VF, they have to do a special blood titer test. There's a few vets in Arizona who are well versed in diagnosing and treating VF.

 

Hope this helps and I hope they can find out exactly what's wrong with your baby, too, so they can administer the proper treatment.

 

Thank you your story has helped a lot! I am familar with Dr. Holland with Protatek Int'l Inc. who has done all the testing of Ethan's blood titer on ticks, I will discuss with her about that particular test.

 

 

How do they know that the spleen is enlarged and that it has a fungal infection? I am dealing with a spleen issue with one of my dogs and they would like to remove his spleen too but I am not ready to do that either so I definitely understand your dilemma.

 

They had an ultra sound done which showed the enlarged spleen, then at the same time did a biopsy from his spleen. The lab results showed the fungal which has a stumped currently at this time.

What are the symptoms your dog has?

[Guest LindsaySF]

I agree with Gracegirl. If your vet used the wrong treatment for the Babesia (for a low titer by the way), I wouldn't use them again.

 

I would get a second opinion pronto. Best of luck.

 

[Guest 4greys]

In March of 2008, Ethan tested positive 1:80 for Babesia canis, treated with Doxy (incorrectly).

In April of 2009, Ethan tested negative 1:40 for Babesia canis..........

So with all this being said, what would you suggest? Run the tets again? Start treatment with the correct meds even though the test is negative at this time?

 

Where in Washington State are you? Which group do you work with to adopt your greys? You say your vet sees "a lot" of greys...but then was treated incorrectly for a TBD, which are fairly common in greys. In addition, a titer of 1:80 is still a pretty low titer for babesia. What symptoms of Babesia was Ethan showing when he was incorrectly treated with Doxy?

 

I used to live in Seattle and could recommend a place to take your grey for a second opinion if you'd like. In addition, I'd be happy to get you in touch with some friends affiliated with a group up there who have some fantastic vets they could also refer you to.

 

Best of luck with whatever you decide. After the incorrect treatment for the Babesia I'd be researching the heck out of anything my vet recommended at this point.

 

Yeah I'm still trying to understand the medication issue. I live in Tacoma, grew up in Seattle. Last year he was panting a lot, acting stressed, couldn't get comfortable etc., this year he stopped wanting to eat and within about 3 weeks dropped 7 pounds. We got Ethan from the Emerald Pacific chapter of GPA in Sumner. Any help with local vets. that would be willing to give the reports/paperwork a look over/2nd opinion would be awesome. Our vet. is open in discussing his condition with another set of eyes, that really doesn't matter as I'm asking for the 2nd set of eyes due to the fact that the pathalogist can't id the biopsy of the spleen.

 

 

I agree with Gracegirl. If your vet used the wrong treatment for the Babesia (for a low titer by the way), I wouldn't use them again.

 

I would get a second opinion pronto. Best of luck.

 

Thank you, I hope we can find a solution quick!

 

Prayers for your pup. Please keep us posted on the progression of this mystery!

 

Thank you I appreciate your prayers...........I will share updates as the days go by.

 

Are you sure it is a TBD? My vet diagnosed my girl with immune mediated. Took her to OSU and Dr. Couto was convinced it was some bacterial infection, although she tested negative for everything, including valley fever. Note - Spleen not enlarged. Did a bone aspirate and she has leukemia. Dr. Couto was more than shocked.

 

I hear ya, it's like playing hide and seek at this point. I just don't want to waste anymore time or cause Ethan any delay on treatments either.

 

Dancer had her spleen removed and had no issues at all from it. She lived a healthy 8 years afterwards.

 

I understand, the cost is a huge issue at this point that has brought me to looking for any guidance from other Vets. on this mystery. I want to know what type of fungal is showing on the biopsy and in doing all this recent research I've also found out that the incorrect meds were used in his treatment of Babesia canis last year. So there is another new issue to deal with as well, could it still be Babesia canis even though a recent titer is showing negative as that is known to hide............

I'm glad that Dancer was able to live out 8 more years of retirement with her family!

 

I have a 9 year old male Greyhound (sire was EJ's Douglas, Greyhound Hall of Fame) who is suffering from an mystery fungal disease found in spleen.

Has been tested for all the Tick's, they all came out negative!

Our Vet would like to remove his spleen, very very costly could result in opening up an Pandora's box. Any input would be very much appreciated at this time.

We live in the Pacific NW, currently own 4 Greys and volunteered with rescues starting in 1991 through Portland Oregon. This breed has brought and continues to bring such joy to our lifes.

Can anyone advise on this or where to go for information. I have the edition of "Care of the Racing & Retired Grehound", copied several pages for our Vet. to refer to but the mystery is with the lab finding "fungal" what kind/where did it come from is where all the ??????? are.

 

I would get in touch with Ohio State University, and Dr. Couto IMMEDIATELY! Be sure to email him and his team anything pertinant to the case. They will be able to advise you, and you CAN trust them! couto.1@osu.edu (Dr. Couto's email); Greyhound@cvm.osu.edu (Dr. Marin). GOOD LUCK! I am sorry your baby is sooo sick! Dee

 

Thank you Thank you!

Who is Dr. Marin????????

[dmswartzfager]

Thank you Thank you!

Who is Dr. Marin????????

 

Dr. Marin is part of Dr. Couto's team.

[Guest mandm]

Maybe I am missing something, maybe I don't understand the whole story, but this is what I would consider doing:

 

First off, it's not unusual to treat a low TBD titer if the dog is showing symptoms, and Ethan was symptomatic when he was treated, incorrectly, for babesia Canis, right?

 

Mistakes happen. Most vets don't treat many TBDs. They are busy. They are not treating humans and not charging human medical fees. Although we humans have to watch out for dumb mistakes too, despite the high fees and safeguards.

 

OK, so it seemed you were on the right track when you treated suspected TBD, except poor Ethan got the wrong med. And now they have found that his spleen is enlarged, which I know for sure can be caused by babesia. And the spleen has some sort of fungus. I don't know anything about fungal infection of the spleen, but do know that TBDs cause all sorts of weird things, so maybe the fungal thing is related to TBD??? Seems that anything is possible with TBDs, often they don't follow a nice, neat textbook pattern of symptoms.

 

And since you don't want to sell off your kids in order to raise enough funds to pay for all kinds of expensive diagnostics, why not retrace your steps and treat the suspected b. Canis, but with the proper med this time. Imizol is no picnic, but I, and many others here on GT, have used it without incident. It's cheap, and, if the problem was b. Canis, it'll show results almost immediately, within days.

 

This assumes that Ethan is in pretty good shape because the Imizol shots are hard. You wouldn't want to give Imizol just for the heck of it. You want to be fairly sure the problems are caused by b. Canis. A high titer is best proof. But it is not uncommon to treat a symptomatic dog with a low positive titer.

 

You could get a PCR, a more sensitive test. But it will cost a few hundred dollars and you will have to wait 2-4 weeks to get results. Then, if the PCR comes back negative, you'd probably want to do another PCR, just to be sure he was truely negative for Babesia.

[seeh2o]

Valley Fever is a blood test, not a fecal test. My dogs were tested for it last week, so I can vouch for what type of test it is.

[Guest 4greys]

How long have you had Ethan??

 

We recently had an Oregon-bred foster come into our adoption system (raced in Arizona) who tested positive for Valley Fever. It's such a rare occurence here that the vet (a very greyhound-savvy doctor) had to educate herself about what it is and how to treat it. You may want to have your vet contact Dr Couto at OSU (not the Oregon one!) or maybe the vets at Michigan State???? There are a lot of diseases and parasites and ticks in other parts of the country that we don't have here.

 

Good luck!

greysmom

 

We've had Ethan for 5 or 6 years with owning 4 Greys at once I tend to lose count of the what/whens.

Yes the plan is that I'm going to contacty Dr. Couto and ask for him to review Ethans case.

[Guest argolola]

I will be praying.

[Guest trevdog]

yeah Ethan was treated for Babesia Canis with Doxecycline over a year ago. Tested again for ticks and came out negative on all!

How did they find the infection in Dallas?

 

Dallas was quite sick so we took her in. Initially they thought she had an obstruction, but through xrays and bloodwork and some other tests found out she had a really bad bacterial infection that compromised her entire digestive system. Enlarged spleen, liver and kidney issues. Don't think it's fungal, but the bloodwork revealed some really high values. Values were conistent with a lot of toxins present or even poisoning.

I'd go for a consult with OSU as well, there's got to be some idea of what fungal infection it is, especially if they did a biopsy.....doesn't sound like they know much....an enlarged spleen is often indicative of an infection and the body trying to fight it off, according to my vet...but sometimes they will have too much damage or a rupture, causing the need for removal. And sometimes it can be a culprit of the problem as well.

 

[Guest brandi007]

Good luck! I know how hard it is to have the run around medically with your dog....best of wishes for you and Ethan (beautiful name!\)

[Burpdog]

If they did a biopsy, they should be able to tell you which fungal! Do you have the biopsy report?

 

In April of 2009, Ethan tested negative 1:40 for Babesia canis..........

So with all this being said, what would you suggest? Run the tets again? Start treatment with the correct meds even though the test is negative at this time?

 

No I would not treat at this time--however, ask Dr. Holland. You must get a good answer on the fungal issue!

[Guest mandm]

The Babesia issue is real tricky. TBDs in general are real tricky. I'd join the Tick List. They were just discussing a greyhound with some similarities to Ethan. The 5/7/09 post by the List's DVM was very interesting. The greyhound had been a FL racer, had a 1:40 babesia Canis titer, had just been treated with Doxy for a different TBD, but was still displying symptoms. The conclusion was that 1:40 is NOT negative, but rather SUSPECT. Since FL tracks have a very high incidence of b. Canis, that raises the suspicion. And displaying symptoms consistent with TBD raises the suspicion up even more. Whether fungal infection of the spleen is consistent with TBD, I don't know. But the Tick List would probably be able to answer that. The treat/don't treat decision should not be based on titer alone, but rather, the whole package. And if the "package" raced in Florida and is showing symptoms . . .

[duncan41]

The Babesia issue is real tricky. TBDs in general are real tricky. I'd join the Tick List. They were just discussing a greyhound with some similarities to Ethan. The 5/7/09 post by the List's DVM was very interesting. The greyhound had been a FL racer, had a 1:40 babesia Canis titer, had just been treated with Doxy for a different TBD, but was still displying symptoms. The conclusion was that 1:40 is NOT negative, but rather SUSPECT. Since FL tracks have a very high incidence of b. Canis, that raises the suspicion. And displaying symptoms consistent with TBD raises the suspicion up even more. Whether fungal infection of the spleen is consistent with TBD, I don't know. But the Tick List would probably be able to answer that. The treat/don't treat decision should not be based on titer alone, but rather, the whole package. And if the "package" raced in Florida and is showing symptoms . . .

 

Tick List?

 

[Guest mike]

Just a few suggestions. A biopsy will tell the type of fungal. I read biopsies every day. Are you sure they know it's fungal? Also, TBDs are tricky. Some dogs need treatment at 1:40 if they show signs. 1:40 is considered low positive not negative. True, some vets don't have an indepth knowledge of TBD's but we as a whole are rapidly learning. Many vets are very intelligent with the TBD's and treatments. I do think it to be uncommon to treat a dog with babesia with doxy. I would recommend a second opinion.

[Guest mandm]

Tick List?

http://saluqi.home.netcom.com/ticklinks.htm

This page contains a link to subscribe to the Tick List and also links to articles about various TBDs.

[fritofeet]

I would also call your group and see if they have some other vet referrals. Usually they have several that they work with and can most likely get you a consultation.

 

Prayers for Ethan...

 

Fwiw, my Diesel had a titer of 1:80 and was very symptomatic. He was treated with 2 doses of Imizol and has his titer re-checked every year, but is not symptomatic now.

[Guest houndlover]

How do they know that the spleen is enlarged and that it has a fungal infection? I am dealing with a spleen issue with one of my dogs and they would like to remove his spleen too but I am not ready to do that either so I definitely understand your dilemma

 

They had an ultra sound done which showed the enlarged spleen, then at the same time did a biopsy from his spleen. The lab results showed the fungal which has a stumped currently at this time.

What are the symptoms your dog has?

 

Billy has had issues with diarrhea and loose stool for about 6 months. It gets better and then worse again. We have tested for just about everything that we can think of. I had an ultra sound done 6 months ago to see if there was a mass that was causing the problems and everything looked okay at that time. We repeated the ultrasound last Thursday and Billy's spleen is enlarged and has nodules on it. He also has liver and kidney issues and one of his lymphnodes is enlarged. The specialist that did the ultrasound suggested testing for babesia so I had the bloodwork drawn last nite. Hopefully we will know in a couple of days what the results are. I will probably do the same as you and have a fine needle aspiration done on the spleen to see if they can figure out what is going on.

 

What has the vet used to try to treat the fungal infection for Ethan?

[gracegirl]

If you are intersted in contacting a vet in Seattle, I used Dr. Fisher at Lien Animal Clinic in West Seattle. I love them! Lots of greys in Seattle go there.

 

Lien

 

You can also try contacting GPI and see who they suggest...they had a list of vets for me when Grace tested with a 1:160 babesia titer.

 

GPI