Let Me Show You Why They Give Us Those Muzzles

[Guest anneh]

Thank you both for explaining, I appreciate it, trying to learn and understand all I can

anne

Since I started this thread, I'd like to chime in here too. I agree with everything TurboTania said. I'd like to add that what happened to Bookie was NOT an attack! All four of my greys were playing in the yard, running fast; the two boys were growly-arguing about whose Frisbee it was and Bookie dove under them to steal the Frisbee away. Pere saw what she was doing and he bit her ONE TIME. He was as shocked as any of us when he saw what he had done. Greys have very thin skin - a nip results in a huge wound. If Pere had bit a Lab or Golden the same way I would probably not have needed a vet. Because greys are such laid-back dogs, we tend to give them too much freedom to do stupid things. My post was meant as a caution to remind others that they are dogs, not people, they get excited and hurt each other in play. It is the job of the human to take the necessary precautions to protect them.

As I write this, Bookie is curled up on the sofa next to me; Pere is asleep on the loveseat, Kixie & Devon are asleep on dog beds, as are both of my current fosters. Greys are indeed well-socialized, gentle creatures; but when you choose to be the "responsible adult" for a pack of greys you need to be an adult, not a kid who believes that your dogs would never (insert name of dog behavior here). If you choose to believe that it can't happen to you, your greys will probably pay the price.

[turbotaina]

You bet. Now go out and adopt yourself a hound

[Guest chris]

Anne, I remember being at exactly the same place before we adopted our hounds. Wonderful people here reassured me that not all greys have the problems you read about here, but they are dogs, not perfect beings. After reading more about the breed and reading more here in Cute & Funny, we decided to "foster with the option to adopt". Two big, beautiful hounds came to live with us on Saturday, by Tuesday, we had decided we couldn't live without them! Two years later, we adopted two more --seniors this time, one of which has already died. We're very glad we did, and we will continue to adopt as space allows (our city limits you to three pets).

 

One of the greatest resources for new greyhound owners is right in front of you. The people here are warm, kind, and very willing to share their experiences with new owners. More than once, they've kept me from going off the deep end over something with our puppers, God bless them all!

 

If you do adopt, we need pictures -- immediately!!

 

;-D

chris

[fourofem]

I am really upset about all these posts. You see I am planning on adopting a greyhound and everything I read other than here indicated they are sweet natured, gentle dogs. In my long life I have owned several dogs at a time on rare occasions and never have they attacked each other! I know its possible with any breed, I am aware of that, but I am shocked at what I am learning here on the forum about greys regarding sleep aggression, space aggression and now this. Why would they attack each other so mercilessly? I don't mean to sound critical but just trying to find out all I can. anne

You are only seeing the problems in this forum. Go out to Cute and Funny Things Greyhounds Do and see the upside of these awesome dogs. Incidents like what you've read here can happen w/ any breed. Greyhounds are just very thin-skinned so it doesn't take much of a nip to leave a nasty gash. I have four of these beautiful creatures...only one suffers from a small case of sleep aggression but she's the queen of the sofa; the other three have finally figured that out and if they do chose to try and share the sofa, they're careful not to disrupt her beauty sleep. I've had all kinds of dogs...from Scotties to coonhounds and I've loved all of them but there's something about these greyhounds that'll keep me coming back forever! You won't be sorry. Go read the good stuff!

[galgrey]

I am really upset about all these posts. You see I am planning on adopting a greyhound and everything I read other than here indicated they are sweet natured, gentle dogs. In my long life I have owned several dogs at a time on rare occasions and never have they attacked each other! I know its possible with any breed, I am aware of that, but I am shocked at what I am learning here on the forum about greys regarding sleep aggression, space aggression and now this. Why would they attack each other so mercilessly? I don't mean to sound critical but just trying to find out all I can. anne

 

I think you've asked a good question and in my rather long winded way, I'm going to tell you why.

 

Obviously most of us here love this breed and will joke that everyone should have a dozen or more , but no one breed is for everyone. Every pure bred dog has been selectively bred for a purpose and has characteristics, physical and behavioral, that reflect that purpose. Factor in what may be unique handling for the breed and what you get is a general breed stardard. Everthing about the racing greyhound is bred for speed and the desire to catch the "prey". I've read in more than one source that their thin skin with the blood vessels close to the surface makes them more aerodynamic and more efficient runners.

 

It isn't that greyhounds are more prone to attack each other than other breeds -- it's that their skin is so thin and tears so easily. What would bearly leave a scratch between, let's say, two weimaraners, can turn into a horrible gaping tear in a greyhound. Yard play between two adult weims can get really rough and tumble and mine used to sometimes end up with scrapes or scratches. The same incident would have likely resulted in a wound needing sutures between my greyhounds.

 

Also if this rough and tumble play was between two GSDs or two huskies, their hair would have further protected each other's skin from a stray tooth or nail. Weims are very short haired dogs, so I would often see little nicks on scratches or them, but their original purpose was to be an all terrain hunter they were bred to have tear-resistant skin.

 

Regarding the sleep space aggression issue, other breeds of dogs or mixed breeds can and do exhibit it, but data indicates it may be seen disproportionately in retired racers because of their early training -- being kenneled where they always have their own space and sleep alone. Even so, you see it in some retired racer and not in others. Many breeds of dogs have "space issues" and will defend their territory -- the herding breeds are a good general example and in my experience many weims exhibit it. A friend's shepherd mix lays in front of the pantry where the dog food is and dares any of the other dogs to come within 3 feet of her, for example.

 

Large groups or packs of dogs of any breed are in the end just dogs and when unsupervised and unencumbered by the human rules of behavior we impose on them many will revert to dog pack behavior. Dog parks are a good example. There are dog park fights between every day and sadly some end in tragedy. Sometimes (not always) the breeds involved here are the dogs who have been bred to fight -- these dogs are often genetically endowed with physical and behavioral attributes that make them superior fighters!

 

My point, in all of this, ( and I do have one ) is the importance of researching what makes each pure bred dog unique and then making an informed decision about whether or not it's the breed for you. Most of us are here on this forum because we adore the retired racers and can't imagine our lives without them. As responsible dog owners, we learn everything we can about them as a breed, and do everything we can to keep them safe and healthy.

 

I think it's great that you are reading this forum to gather information before making your decision. If more people did that sort of homework, fewer dogs of all breeds would be abandoned in shelters after the novelty of an impulse buy/adoption wears off.

 

I've been at meet & greets and had people ask me what are the negatives about retired racers. For those of us dedicated to this breed our first tendency may be to deny there are any negatives to greyhound ownership, but that's not true nor fair to the breed. One man's joy can be another man's "negative". It's a negative to some folks that they can never be trusted off leash in an unfenced area, that they can't live outside, that they may love your cat indoors, but chase the same cat down like prey in the backyard, or that a normal dog skirmish over a favorite toy can result in a trip to the E vet and require drains and stitches.

 

I think potential adopters should know these things and then weigh them against the many uniquely wonderful things about these dogs and make an informed decision.

[Guest greyhoundluv]

You are so right. Like you I learned the hard way. The E vet didnt stitch her up properly, sewed the dead skin together. So it meant surgery with our vet to correct it. Seemed like she had stitches and antibiotics forever. Muzzels, use them.

[Guest mom2greys]

I am really upset about all these posts. You see I am planning on adopting a greyhound and everything I read other than here indicated they are sweet natured, gentle dogs. In my long life I have owned several dogs at a time on rare occasions and never have they attacked each other! I know its possible with any breed, I am aware of that, but I am shocked at what I am learning here on the forum about greys regarding sleep aggression, space aggression and now this. Why would they attack each other so mercilessly? I don't mean to sound critical but just trying to find out all I can. anne

 

I think you've asked a good question and in my rather long winded way, I'm going to tell you why.

 

Obviously most of us here love this breed and will joke that everyone should have a dozen or more , but no one breed is for everyone. Every pure bred dog has been selectively bred for a purpose and has characteristics, physical and behavioral, that reflect that purpose. Factor in what may be unique handling for the breed and what you get is a general breed stardard. Everthing about the racing greyhound is bred for speed and the desire to catch the "prey". I've read in more than one source that their thin skin with the blood vessels close to the surface makes them more aerodynamic and more efficient runners.

 

It isn't that greyhounds are more prone to attack each other than other breeds -- it's that their skin is so thin and tears so easily. What would bearly leave a scratch between, let's say, two weimaraners, can turn into a horrible gaping tear in a greyhound. Yard play between two adult weims can get really rough and tumble and mine used to sometimes end up with scrapes or scratches. The same incident would have likely resulted in a wound needing sutures between my greyhounds.

 

Also if this rough and tumble play was between two GSDs or two huskies, their hair would have further protected each other's skin from a stray tooth or nail. Weims are very short haired dogs, so I would often see little nicks on scratches or them, but their original purpose was to be an all terrain hunter they were bred to have tear-resistant skin.

 

Regarding the sleep space aggression issue, other breeds of dogs or mixed breeds can and do exhibit it, but data indicates it may be seen disproportionately in retired racers because of their early training -- being kenneled where they always have their own space and sleep alone. Even so, you see it in some retired racer and not in others. Many breeds of dogs have "space issues" and will defend their territory -- the herding breeds are a good general example and in my experience many weims exhibit it. A friend's shepherd mix lays in front of the pantry where the dog food is and dares any of the other dogs to come within 3 feet of her, for example.

 

Large groups or packs of dogs of any breed are in the end just dogs and when unsupervised and unencumbered by the human rules of behavior we impose on them many will revert to dog pack behavior. Dog parks are a good example. There are dog park fights between every day and sadly some end in tragedy. Sometimes (not always) the breeds involved here are the dogs who have been bred to fight -- these dogs are often genetically endowed with physical and behavioral attributes that make them superior fighters!

 

My point, in all of this, ( and I do have one ) is the importance of researching what makes each pure bred dog unique and then making an informed decision about whether or not it's the breed for you. Most of us are here on this forum because we adore the retired racers and can't imagine our lives without them. As responsible dog owners, we learn everything we can about them as a breed, and do everything we can to keep them safe and healthy.

 

I think it's great that you are reading this forum to gather information before making your decision. If more people did that sort of homework, fewer dogs of all breeds would be abandoned in shelters after the novelty of an impulse buy/adoption wears off.

 

I've been at meet & greets and had people ask me what are the negatives about retired racers. For those of us dedicated to this breed our first tendency may be to deny there are any negatives to greyhound ownership, but that's not true nor fair to the breed. One man's joy can be another man's "negative". It's a negative to some folks that they can never be trusted off leash in an unfenced area, that they can't live outside, that they may love your cat indoors, but chase the same cat down like prey in the backyard, or that a normal dog skirmish over a favorite toy can result in a trip to the E vet and require drains and stitches.

 

I think potential adopters should know these things and then weigh them against the many uniquely wonderful things about these dogs and make an informed decision.

 

 

Wow... very well said!

Edited January 28, 2007 by mom2greys

[Houndess]

I am really upset about all these posts. You see I am planning on adopting a greyhound and everything I read other than here indicated they are sweet natured, gentle dogs. In my long life I have owned several dogs at a time on rare occasions and never have they attacked each other! I know its possible with any breed, I am aware of that, but I am shocked at what I am learning here on the forum about greys regarding sleep aggression, space aggression and now this. Why would they attack each other so mercilessly? I don't mean to sound critical but just trying to find out all I can. anne

 

I think you've asked a good question and in my rather long winded way, I'm going to tell you why.

 

Obviously most of us here love this breed and will joke that everyone should have a dozen or more , but no one breed is for everyone. Every pure bred dog has been selectively bred for a purpose and has characteristics, physical and behavioral, that reflect that purpose. Factor in what may be unique handling for the breed and what you get is a general breed stardard. Everthing about the racing greyhound is bred for speed and the desire to catch the "prey". I've read in more than one source that their thin skin with the blood vessels close to the surface makes them more aerodynamic and more efficient runners.

 

It isn't that greyhounds are more prone to attack each other than other breeds -- it's that their skin is so thin and tears so easily. What would bearly leave a scratch between, let's say, two weimaraners, can turn into a horrible gaping tear in a greyhound. Yard play between two adult weims can get really rough and tumble and mine used to sometimes end up with scrapes or scratches. The same incident would have likely resulted in a wound needing sutures between my greyhounds.

 

Also if this rough and tumble play was between two GSDs or two huskies, their hair would have further protected each other's skin from a stray tooth or nail. Weims are very short haired dogs, so I would often see little nicks on scratches or them, but their original purpose was to be an all terrain hunter they were bred to have tear-resistant skin.

 

Regarding the sleep space aggression issue, other breeds of dogs or mixed breeds can and do exhibit it, but data indicates it may be seen disproportionately in retired racers because of their early training -- being kenneled where they always have their own space and sleep alone. Even so, you see it in some retired racer and not in others. Many breeds of dogs have "space issues" and will defend their territory -- the herding breeds are a good general example and in my experience many weims exhibit it. A friend's shepherd mix lays in front of the pantry where the dog food is and dares any of the other dogs to come within 3 feet of her, for example.

 

Large groups or packs of dogs of any breed are in the end just dogs and when unsupervised and unencumbered by the human rules of behavior we impose on them many will revert to dog pack behavior. Dog parks are a good example. There are dog park fights between every day and sadly some end in tragedy. Sometimes (not always) the breeds involved here are the dogs who have been bred to fight -- these dogs are often genetically endowed with physical and behavioral attributes that make them superior fighters!

 

My point, in all of this, ( and I do have one ) is the importance of researching what makes each pure bred dog unique and then making an informed decision about whether or not it's the breed for you. Most of us are here on this forum because we adore the retired racers and can't imagine our lives without them. As responsible dog owners, we learn everything we can about them as a breed, and do everything we can to keep them safe and healthy.

 

I think it's great that you are reading this forum to gather information before making your decision. If more people did that sort of homework, fewer dogs of all breeds would be abandoned in shelters after the novelty of an impulse buy/adoption wears off.

 

I've been at meet & greets and had people ask me what are the negatives about retired racers. For those of us dedicated to this breed our first tendency may be to deny there are any negatives to greyhound ownership, but that's not true nor fair to the breed. One man's joy can be another man's "negative". It's a negative to some folks that they can never be trusted off leash in an unfenced area, that they can't live outside, that they may love your cat indoors, but chase the same cat down like prey in the backyard, or that a normal dog skirmish over a favorite toy can result in a trip to the E vet and require drains and stitches.

 

I think potential adopters should know these things and then weigh them against the many uniquely wonderful things about these dogs and make an informed decision.

 

 

Wow... very well said!

 

 

It isn't that greyhounds are more prone to attack each other than other breeds -- it's that their skin is so thin and tears so easily. What would bearly leave a scratch between, let's say, two weimaraners, can turn into a horrible gaping tear in a greyhound.

 

In a nutshell that's is the issue.

[Forevermybabies]

I used to muzzle whenever they went outside or at the dog park. Now that they are older (9 & 10), they don't play the way they used to with contact. At the dog park they mostly go their own way. Sometimes, if they are more energetic, I muzzle (I use wire muzzles as they chewed up the plastic ones too many times.)

[Guest 2greygirls]

I always muzzle my girls in open areas, even though they are now 11..when they get playing, especially sweet little old Marble..she gets all fired up and just can't help taking a swipe at her sister..sometimes they " joust" run at each other..leap in the air with their teeth bared and snap in the direction of each other, all in fun, but sometimes they misjudge the distance..muzzle. If it is just the two of them.. and the area isn't too big, I may not..but if there is even one more dog, that competitive spirit is just too strong.

To the poster who is a worried about this behavior...they ae not doing this to viciously attack each other..gyehound skin tears very easily..most of the pics here are the result of one bite, or nip..they instinctively nip at each other as they run..and sometimes they make contact, sometimes they want to grab hold, but it is not out of viciousness, more like kids who don't know their own strength...

 

with larger groups of dogs, there can be fights, and greys do tend to pack, but then again most dogs do. If the other dog truly intedned harm ,I can tell you from experience that the injuries would be way worse, and mulitple. Don't let this deter you. Just be informed. I wish non grey owners would be more aware of how rough their dogs played..greys just happen to be a little more fragile in the skin department.

[Guest Lacy]

The only time I've really muzzled is when treating an injury. Though he's always been tollerant of my treatment of knicks and dings, and even a lost toenail - I'd never risk it - dog might love you to bits, but an injured dog is a whole other thing. Lots of owners get injured treating injured dogs.

I used it to introduce our fella to my parents beagle.

When we used to go to playgroup - it's a requirement.

[Guest EMcElfresh]

We muzzle new fosters, we muzzle during any off leash play outside, we muzzle when the ferrets are out (even tho no one has gone for them, better safe than sorry!), we muzzle when more than one dog is in the car together...so mostly - we don't muzzle when doing walkies on leash, or if we are indoors (sans ferrets or dashing cats)...doesn't keep our pups safe from others (our greatest concern) but insures we won't be paying vet bills CAUSED by our dogs

 

oh - right now we are muzzling Gordon when he is not supervised, because his tail is bandaged...

Edited February 12, 2007 by EMcElfresh

[Guest laceyj]

I voted 'other' becasue all but the first option apply here. I muzzle in the car, in fenced in area, for introductions when a foster arrives ( I muzzle all the dogs not just the foster). I know a few people who only foster one of their dogs. Ya know cuz he's a good boy, and they do muzzle their female. Not becasue she is grumpy just cuz she's not as 'special' as thier male. Makes no sense to me to protect one dog and not the other. BTW the male has tried to attack my Scott, thankfully they were muzzled. Scott didn't get ticked off until the other dog had flipped him and pushed him across the grass while he was on his back. Thankfully Scott is lithe and limber or he'd have been more seriously hurt. As it is he was scraped and bruised. This same dog tried to bite my other grey Keiper at a M&G.

 

Sometimes I just can't figure people out.

[Guest CarriesMom]

Thank you for this real eye opener! I only have one greyhound but when we go anywhere, I always carry her muzzle, and always use it at our Saturday playgroup. If thre are other dogs at the enclosed park without a muzzle, I will just leave.

:!!

 

[Guest jupiterooos]

I couldn't vote for more than one option. I muzzle in the car, because I do not want a fight while I'm driving down the expressway! Also, fosters are muzzled until we are sure they are OK with the cat. When we left Jupiter out of the crate, he was muzzled, both to keep him from eating stuff and to protect the cat.

[Guest MrsDooLittle]

Ouch.....poor thing! A couple weeks ago, I was watching my boys play and decided since they were kind of rough maybe I should muzzle them. Well, next thing I know I hear a yelp and my poor Miami came running in the house. I discovered a gash on his side that seemed to open wider with each movement he made. Off to vet we went for about 8 stitches. Turns out that it was not a bite mark but a claw mark. When they were playing, Mr Green Jeans had jumped and as he came down his claws gashed Miami's side. Once the vet shaved the area, you could clearly see it was claws and not teeth.

 

In this case, a muzzle wouldn't have helped.......so what do I do? Make them wear protective booties outside? It did make me realize just how fragile their skin is. Mr Green Jeans' claws were not too long either so I can't blame it on that but I am watching those claws even more closely than before.

 

Cindy

[Guest Kitty_cat]

Stewie has started getting muzzled at the off leash park (in case a small dog arrives).

[Guest Spencers_Greyt]

OMG! How awful! I don't muzzle because I don't have a pack of Greys so I haven't seen a need. I do muzzle the new fosters but there has never been a incident and I don't have a big enough yard for them to get worked up over.

 

[Guest Jennifer4719]

I muzzle Xena everyday in the evening when the cat has free roam of the house. I also have been muzzling her when she goes outside because one of my barn cats has decided to take up residency under my deck and sometimes is sitting in the flower beds. I send her muzzle to the kennel because they sometimes let groups of dogs out together, depending on temperment of the group.

[Guest KennelMom]

Ouch.....poor thing! A couple weeks ago, I was watching my boys play and decided since they were kind of rough maybe I should muzzle them. Well, next thing I know I hear a yelp and my poor Miami came running in the house. I discovered a gash on his side that seemed to open wider with each movement he made. Off to vet we went for about 8 stitches. Turns out that it was not a bite mark but a claw mark. When they were playing, Mr Green Jeans had jumped and as he came down his claws gashed Miami's side. Once the vet shaved the area, you could clearly see it was claws and not teeth.

 

In this case, a muzzle wouldn't have helped.......so what do I do? Make them wear protective booties outside? It did make me realize just how fragile their skin is. Mr Green Jeans' claws were not too long either so I can't blame it on that but I am watching those claws even more closely than before.

 

I am really glad you brought this up (would probably make for a great new thread too). When we had a pack fight last year, Scout's main injury came from a dew claw that ripped her from her spine area down just about to her belly (a long vertical slash). She had some bite wounds too, but the major damage was done by a claw. The dog she was fighting with had been coming back from a foot/toe injury and she'd been so pissy about having that food handled I'd really let her nails go on that foot. They don't really grow fast, but they do grow sharply...especially the dew claws.

 

People are often vigilant about muzzling their dogs who are walking, playing and running around with weapons on every foot - nails that are unkempt, too long and/or too sharp. If you just take a dremel and blunt the ends of the nails that will help a lot. It seems that some dogs have nails that grow out into sharp little daggers - and those are the biggest concerns. A dremel is great for making sure the nails have nice blunt, smooth and rounded ends to them.

Edited December 3, 2007 by KennelMom

[Guest FireFae]

I muzzle when i leave the house and when I'm asleep for the first few weeks a new member has arrived. Oh, and if there is a new doggy coming over to play. Cant be too careful.

[Guest TriciasZoo]

I muzzle Flippy when we're gone or she'll get into everything. I muzzle them anytime they have a play date with other greys.

[GeorgeofNE]

My dog is not non-hound safe, so I muzzle him in public--travelling on the ferry to Nantucket, going to the pet store, etc.

 

He is fine at hound-only events!

[Guest NSGREY]

I muzzle Adora basically all the time except when I am home alone with her and she's just sleeping on the couch and I am super sure the cat is behind a closed door. When my kids are home and the potential is there that someone *might* open the wrong door or my kids could become too noisy for her I muzzle except if she's in her crate. Crate equals no muzzle. Now I definitely muzzle out in public and I cannot see me changing that even a year down the road because I'm not confident yet that she's small dog friendly either....I know she's not with my cat indoors!

 

Oh and Adora is our only one.

[Guest charmsmom]

Ask Charm and Paris what muzzles are for...This was during zoomies...

 

I will muzzle in the car if we're going long distances, but that's rare. Short trips are usually okay because it's just me and they have plenty of room in the back.