DunesMom

Thank you! He's a solid little ball of muscle and almost looks like a bulldog instead of a greyhound -- I guess at 65 short, thick, pounds, he was tiny but mity when it came to a long racing career.

Hi Dick, Thank you for de-coding all the track data for us. What is your take on our current foster, Mega Bat Boy? Thanks! V

For Kipper, I've found that I need to tape the hole. The worst two corns never, ever disappear, and within a day or two, that hole is a corn again. The tape keeps the hard "bed" of the corn and the new corn softer (and easier to hull again, and again, and again). His back paws have corns that sometimes won't reappear for months to a year. When I hull them, I retape immediately and check in two days. If there's no sign of a corn and he's not sensitive, I can leave them alone until the corn reappears at some point. We got 8 months corn-free on one paw last year. The others...never go away. Poor pup.

I am so very sorry to hear about Dylan. Nothing eases the pain, but it sometimes comforts to know that someone else understands. Everyone here does. Wishing you good memories and hugs.

Manuka honey...never heard of it, but I will be at Sprouts tomorrow. I have no idea on oatmeal. We never tested it. But it's worth a shot. He loves kippers, by the way.

FWIW, acupuncture helped my old boy Dune during his last few years dealing with LS. It also helped me with knee pain pre-surgery and now with TOS pre-surgery. It can't fix the problem, but it worked better than any pain meds, without any side effects.

He doesn't really get dairy, definitely not coinciding with these issues. He had no dairy issues in the past, and now he won't eat anything but goat cheese, so I save that for emergencies (like, if I have to go out of town and someone else needs to give him meds). Thus, he doesn't get dairy because I pill him. I think he'd happily drink cream if I offered, though. Sam's flagyl case sounds like an idea worth trying. So does the paper plate. Sadly, the green bag (or the red) is bad news with his allergies. He was on the green bag in adoption and had a dry, dandruffy, thin coat with red-rimmed eyes and pink skin, which is how we ended up doing a food trial and discovering that he was allergic to rice and grains and some meats. I have wondered if I couldn't find a magic kibble...but we've tried so many the past five years, it's really amazing. Maybe I will go back to a different one that worked, especially if he's IBD and I'm changing foods again. THAT is exactly what my life is like now! If I can get him to eat something, anything, then suddenly he realizes that the stuff he's refusing in his bowl is actually pretty tasty ground meat and chunks of meat, so perhaps he'll have a few bites, then a few more... I haven't tried the sardines yet but I have a ton of them for DH. Kip doesn't do well on salmon or "ocean white fish meal" (WTH is that?), not allergic but dry skin and coat. He won't eat salmon oil, and he's been refusing tuna in any form for a few months now, though he used to love it. It sounds like he might be IBD. I was so, so hoping that would not be the case. Poor little hound. On a bright note, we went to the park and he ran like a goofy happy normal hound with a limp, then came home and refused all food until I tempted him with a SARDINE (THANKS!), which led to that moment of "hey...this burger stuff in here isn't so bad...".

B12 and folate were normal last time, but on the "end of normal," so we're testing again tomorrow. We have tried probiotics but it's been hit or miss, since he won't eat much and definitely won't eat any powder sprinkled on anything. This is a dog who won't eat pill pockets or deli meat or most canned dog foods (ok, all) or even beef stew at grammy's, even before all this started. I think I need a capsule form I can poke down his throat. Know of any? No ultrasound (yet). Abdominal x-rays were normal (forgot those on the list). Yes for bacteria testing -- that was negative, also. Thanks! I'll ask for these. We are so hoping he's not IBD, but vet has that as a possible dx. Tried Pepcid and GasX, they sort of help a little bit but not much -- calms it down after 30 minutes, then it's back 30 minutes after that. For some reason, vet didn't think it was chronic pancreatitis (can't recall why), but since he's been bad today, I'll add that to tomorrow's testing.

I love your username! Kipper has a murmur, deemed normal by three greyhound vets (who are the vets for three different greyhound groups and have seen him at various points in his life). I've had two fosters with murmurs. Never had a vet do more than shrug and say, "Normal for greyhounds."

Kipper's become a conundrum. The horrible corns that we hull are not the issue now. He's got food allergies and we did a full-blown food challenge his first year to isolate the allergies. (most grains including rice, beef, mild intolerance for chicken but not duck or turkey, fish no allergies but poor coat and weight, pork great coat and weight, duck great coat and weight, turkey good coat and weight). For five years, all was fine except he's an extreme picky eater. His hero was the famous Breakfast with Bill. And veggies of any type -- even potatoes -- are disgusting in his opinion, in any form (Just try offering those sweet-potato or pumpkin treats every other dog loves, I dare you. He'll spit it in your face and give you the stink eye.) As my vet said, he's proof that some dogs really would starve themselves, because none of the usual tricks work (other dogs in the house, set meal times only, canned food, freshly cooked food, raw food, add-ins, etc). We get by mostly by switching to one of the other non-allergic foods when he gets bored and stops eating, tracking his volume and calories on a chart weekly, and using a lot of add-ins like ground or slow-cooked pork or duck or canned pork or duck. That worked until recently. Over the past six months, this has happened: He's lost 8 pounds. He started out 2 less than we'd have liked, but that was his normal for nearly five years. He's had a LOT of runny poop. Not diarrhea -- no urgency and straining -- just constant pudding. Not a huge volume. No blood. No evidence of any parasites or worms in all the tests. Sometimes mucous, mostly not. Just pudding about 60% of the time. His stomach makes a LOT of noise about every 2-3 days, and he won't eat anything, not even his favorite treats reserved solely for giving medicine. On the days his stomach is noisy, he won't eat and eats grass. On the days his stomach isn't noisy, he eats like "normal" for him -- like a horse every fourth or fifth day and not at all the others, or only a few bites. (Not eating/refusing even treats some days has always been normal for him, to be clear. He'll usually take the treats and hide them in his blankies for later; "bed snacks," we call them.) Sometimes on the noisy/grass-eating days, he vomits grass and clear fluid, but not often. Maybe once every 2-3 weeks. He acts normal on all but the worst noisy-stomach/grass-eating days. Most days, even if he's eating grass and refusing to eat, he's asking for the beach and dancing around trying to get us to notice him while we work. He doesn't act sick except about once every two weeks, and even then, he still begs and plays at the beach. What we've tried: Bloodwork was normal, but we're doing it again tomorrow since it's been six weeks and we're grasping at straws. Flagyl just in case, despite negative fecals. No change. Antibiotics (not for the GI, but they seem to help his inflamed front corn, leading us to suspect a foreign body in it, but that may or may not be related to this). We used cephalexin, which does not seem to upset his stomach (he's the same on it as off it, GIT-wise; no worse or better either way, and in the past it never upset his stomach). We moved him back to the last kibble that worked a year ago (high-end turkey and sweet potato grain-free). No change. We went back to what seemed to keep weight on him and give him his best coat, which was canned pork (Merrick). He stopped eating it. So we tried fresh pork and cooked it for him. Worked for a few days, then...No change. Half the time he won't eat, then suddenly it's the best thing he's ever seen cross his bowl. Same recurring GI symptoms, not seeming to be related to food type (as in, days he eats pork might be fine or followed by runny poop or gurgling, just like everything else we feed him or the days when he doesn't eat at all). His teeth were cleaned and had no problems 10 months ago, and the vet can't see any cracks or other issues that would cause him to refuse food, let alone soft ground meat. A veterinary nutritionist suggested that we re-do the food challenge because his allergies may have changed over time and she suspects this is allergic. We tried cooking 80% lean beef burger for him again, and this time he did not have an allergic reaction (five years later). But, no change to GI symptoms -- and half the time he won't eat it. We have not tried rice again since that was his biggest trigger five years ago. The vet and vet nutritionist both do not want us to try raw for various reasons (not because they're against raw). This is a relief, since I can't even get him to eat raw turkey necks -- I have to sear them first, or he won't touch them. Even then, half the time he won't touch them. We considered stress-related IBS, but he's had no new or ongoing stressors the past six months and exhibits no behavior changes or stress behaviors or stereotypies. Then again, he's always been a bit of a worrier -- the dog with the wrinkled forehead, a bit shy of new things. He was very, very shy when we first got him and people who knew him then can't believe he's the same dog, he's now so curious and exploratory and happy. He acts like himself -- if the corns have recently been hulled, he's as peppy and happy as always, begging for us to throw the ball. If the corns are bad, he still begs to go to the beach so he can just stand in the water. Any ideas? Should we just try prednisone as someone else suggested? Keep searching for a food cause? Try Panacur even though we have had three negative fecals? I'm at wit's end for the poor hound. He doesn't deserve to have GI issues all the time! Thanks for any ideas. Sorry it's so long.

Kipper has Therapaw boots. He hates them, like all boots. He either statues or does this weird foot-shaking duck walk and nearly falls. But they are incredibly cushiony compared with all the other boots we looked at or tried. He's more tolerant of the house slippers by Therapaws, but he still manages to lose them the minute you leave the room. Then he looks really innocent upon your return. Hope Sid is feeling better soon and the infection dies quickly!

Wow. Ear pets and treats for Sid. Please keep posting updates! Kipper is functionally a tripod most of the time now due to the worst corn (which is bizarre and most of the pad), but we are reluctant to do surgery because he's got corns on all four paws, and on all but one weight-bearing toe. The long healing time would put more stress on the other paws/corns. Hearing about Sid's experience is helpful. Thank you.

Checking in on your hound. Is she healed and feeling better? Have you noticed any negatives or issues beyond those you'd expect with loss of feeling? Hoping your girl found lasting relief and the tradeoff proves worth it for her.

From yesterday's paper. Notice the bold section near the end, about the researchers' desire to make the lymphoma and other drugs (cheaply) and "test market" them through sales to pet dogs -- they'd be human drugs that are already approved after testing them on dogs, but now manufactured in a vastly cheaper and different way, making them affordable for pets for the first time, according to the radio interview I heard this morning. Might be worth sharing with vets or watching for. I know it won't help those already suffering , but it's a bright spot on the horizon. Let's hope a vet pharm signs on (and keeps the drugs affordable rather than pocketing the 90% cheaper manufacturing process). San Diego Union Tribune 12/11/2012, Page A01 ALGAE CAN SLASH BIOTECH DRUG COSTS, PAPER SAYS Manufacturing method would bemuch cheaper, says scientist at UCSD BRADLEY J. FIKES • U-T Expensive biotech drugs now made in high-tech manufacturing plants can be grown much more cheaply in genetically engineered algae, according to a paper published Monday in the prestigious Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. Manufacturing costs can be reduced by 90 percent for these drugs, translating into half off their sales price, said Stephen Mayfield, a UC San Diego professor and senior author of the paper. The savings would provide financial relief to patients, health insurers and the federal government. The technology could make obsolete the manufacturing plants that grow specialized mammal cells in carefully monitored and chemically controlled vats, plants that cost hundreds of millions to build. SEE ALGAE • A9 UCSD’s Stephen Mayfield holds a colony of green algae specimens being cultured in his lab. JOHN GIBBINS • U-T Article Continued Below See ALGAE on Page A09 ALGAE • Dogswill be the first beneficiaries of the lower-cost drugs FROM A1 In their place would stand greenhouses containing transparent plastic bags filled with algae, water and diluted fertilizer. In Mayfield’s vision, scientists will design drugs on a computer, get the appropriate DNA by mail order from a manufacturer, then slip the DNA into the algae of choice. Ramping up production would be simply a matter of adding more bags. In the paper, Mayfield and colleagues demonstrated they could make an anti-cancer biotech drug identical to the original one now under development by a biotech company. Moreover, they tested it in mice and found that it had the same anti-cancer effect. David Hansen, chief executive of San Diego-based MabVax, said the algae method of manufacturing is of interest if it works. The company is developing antibody-based vaccines. “Any innovation in the area would be of benefit,” Hansen said. The paper is the culmination of seven years of work by Mayfield, director of the San Diego Center for Algae Biotechnology, and his colleagues. They used a common algae called Chlamydomonas reinhardtii, regarded by algae biologists as a model research organism. It’s found in soil and fresh water. The earliest biotech drugs, such as insulin, were made in genetically engineered bacteria. But more complicated medications developed later couldn’t be made in bacteria, so they are made in the cells of mammals, the most commonly used are derived from the ovaries of Chinese hamsters. These Chinese hamster ovary, or CHO, cells are grown in temperature-controlled vats and provided with sugars and other nutrients. But bacteria also grow on the nutrients, Mayfield said, so keeping the vats sterile is a top concern. Algae, by contrast, evolved in the open, under varying temperatures and conditions of acidity and alkalinity, Mayfield said. And the dilute fertilizer that nourishes the algae doesn’t spur bacterial growth the way sugars do. “Algae require only trace minerals, fertilizer, and sunlight to be grown at scale, giving them the potential to produce recombinant proteins, including therapeutics, very inexpensively,” the paper stated. Algae biologist Ursula Goodenough, a specialist in Chlamydomonas reinhardtii, said in an email she was impressed by the research. “Wow — well this is a most exciting paper,” said Goodenough, a professor of biology at Washington University in St. Louis. More specifically, she said, the paper “greatly advances the potential use of algae to produce complex biological molecules for therapeutic and other uses.” Mayfield and colleagues grew a two-part cancer drug in algae that cannot be completely made in CHO cells. It consists of a molecular missile called a monoclonal antibody designed to seek out specific cancer cells, attached to a cell-killing toxin “warhead.” Such drugs can’t be made in mammalian cells, because the toxin kills them, Mayfield said. The antibody part is grown in cells, extracted and purified, then chemically fused to the toxin, and the batch is once again purified. But the toxin doesn’t kill the genetically engineered algae, so the entire drug can be made in one step, making the process far simpler and cheaper, Mayfield said. The paper is titled “Production of unique immunotoxin cancer therapeutics in algal chloroplasts.” Its first author was Miller Tran, a postdoctoral student in Mayfield’s lab. When Mayfield began his research, there was a lot of uncertainty about whether algae were up to the task of making complex proteins, he said. SoMayfield and colleagues started testing the limits of algae by producing progressively more complicated drugs in them. In July, Mayfield’s group teamed with another from UC San Diego led by Joseph Vinetz to publish a paper about making a potential malaria vaccine in algae. The need for low manufacturing costs is critical to get mass malaria immunization in the countries that need it most, Mayfield said. Dogs will be the first beneficiaries of these lower-cost drugs, Mayfield said. “You have to go through canines anyway to prove they’re safe and effective,” Mayfield said of the drugs, which are typically tested in large animals before reaching humans. So instead of conducting clinical trials in animals as a milestone to human therapy, Mayfield is looking for a veterinary biotech company that would like to develop a treatment for animals directly from the research. “You would never do this with traditional technologies,” Mayfield said. “You can make the best canine drug in the world, but if it’s too expensive, you’ll never sell it. What we can do is make one for canine lymphomas, make it cheap enough to sell, and that is the proof of concept we should make these things for humans.” If dogs are able to get inexpensive treatments, the public will demand that they benefit from the same technology, Mayfield said. bradley.fikes@utsandiego.com (619) 293-1020 Twitter:@sandiegoscience UC San Diego professor Stephen Mayfield (left) and Miller Tran, a postdoctoral student in his lab, teamed up to write a paper. JOHN GIBBINS • U-T

No experience, but I'm hoping someone chimes in. I did see a vetmed paper a couple of years ago that compared surgery outcomes for corns in greyhounds, and found that a little over half of the surgeries resulted in "permanent" removal of the corn. (the dogs were still alive, so "permanent" is relative) But that means more than 45% of them came back. Plus, there's that healing time after surgery. Does anyone know the healing downtime for neurectomy? Or the potential side effects (besides loss of feeling)? I'd think an active hound would be more apt to sprain, tear, or even fracture the toe while running or spinning, just like an athlete who's lost feeling in a toe or foot. But, if the healing downtime is less than it is with corn surgery (I've heard it's long and painful?), we might be tempted to try neurectomy on the worst toe. We're in the same boat you are -- a year of hulling, dremeling, creams, duct tape, corn removers, and boots, and three corns on the two front paws remain intractable (four others disappeared for roughly 3-4 months after hulling, then returned; I just hulled them again two weeks ago and they seem to be "gone" again). Boots don't help, and hulling/dremeling doesn't even give 24 hours of relief on Kipper's front paws. If we didn't live by a nice soft beach, he'd probably never walk further than half a block. Very sad for a lively, coordinated little hound who lives for the days his paws feel good enough to catch his tennis ball in the air.

Good luck! I can't believe I didn't think of this before I started trying to make hard-soled boots from scratch. Kip tolerates baby socks pretty well, these are only a little more "weird" to him, so after a bit of awkward paw lifting, he forgot about them. I think neoprene would make squishy inserts, too -- I know Ikea sells neoprene mouse pads for 99 cents. And I realize you could skip the paper and trace on the cardboard inserts...dunno why I didn't think of that. Pricing for those interested -- the Plasti Dip I buy is about $13 for a quart. I think Ace sells kits where you can make it any color you want for $20, but I'm okay with the black or yellow HD usually has in stock here. Must charge camera battery first....but will do!

Since Kip's dropped toes made buying "real" boots impossible, I had to create something for his corn paw AND to protect him when we travel and he has to walk on hot pavement. This is a dirt-cheap, one-hour solution that is working so far. (Plus an hour to dry.) I make barefoot running socks for myself in a similar way and get 30 miles or so out of each pair, so I think they'll be fairly durable. Wish I'd thought of this before! Ready for Craft Hour? Great! Let's begin! Custom Dog Sockboots with Rubber Soles Supplies: One can of Plasti-Dip (Ace or Home Depot, in the tools section -- paint section only has aerosol, which you don't want) Shoebox or shallow pan, lined with plastic like a garbage bag Rubber or latex gloves to protect your hands Toddler socks, all cotton, 12-24 mo Ribbon or velcro straps (or ribbon and velcro tabs) for ankle straps Cardboard scraps Paper & pen Scissors Binder clips or clothespins and some sort of string/line to hang-dry the sockboots on Step-by-step instructions: 1. Trace your dog's paws on a sheet of paper: Put a sheet of paper on the floor, put the paw on it, then pick up the opposite paw to force them to put their weight on the paper. Trace close around the paw and nails. Label each paw (left front, etc). You will need to at least do one front and one back, even if your dog's paws are "normal" and uniform in shape. 1A. Give the hound a cookie for tolerating your craft project. 2. Draw a smoother line around the paw outlines to make an oval-ish outline for each sole. Be sure they're labelled! 3. Cut out the paper ovals and tape them to the cardboard. 4. Cut out the cardboard "soles." Label each one as you do (probably not needed if your two front and two back are similar, just label "front" and "back" -- Kip's weird toes required this labeling). 5. Place the cardboard "soles" inside of each toddler sock, the way the bottom of the dog's paw would fit in the sock. Optional: stuff the sock with another sock to give it more of the shape it will have with a paw in it. I did this and it worked great,but I don't think it's necessary. 6. Pour some Plasti Dip into your shallow pan or shoebox lined with plastic. You only need a thin layer. 7. Place the bottom of the sock in the Plasti Dip and use your GLOVED finger to run some around the edges, over the toes, and behind the heel. The Plasti Dip will dry to be flexible but waterproof and grippy, so you want it to come a bit up the sides of the paw outline all the way around. 8. Hang each sock to dry, with a few sheets of newspaper or a tray underneath to catch any drops. It takes an hour IME, but longer if you live somewhere humid. Keep the cardboard soles in place while they dry -- Plasti Dip shrinks a bit and you want to have the sock properly stretched. 9. Remove the cardboard inserts AFTER the Plasti Dip is dry. Use them to cut out any inserts you're using for padding (I used sheepskins and old gel shoe inserts). 10. Sew a ribbon or velcro strip or ribbon with velcro tabs to the sock's neck, to wrap and snug the sock around the ankle on each paw. First pair I did I just used ribbon to tie in a bow while I tested this; second pair I used nylon straps with velcro sewn on them to wrap around twice and then secure. Done! Try them on your hound! Wish I'd figured this out for Dune when he was old and struggled on our tile floors -- much cheaper than the 10 rubberized throw rugs I used to make runways for him.

Kip seems more sensitive to heat than Dune was, or any of the fosters I had. He takes longer to stop panting when it's even a little warm versus the winter. Cool cloths on the belly seem smart. If you can get one, try a CoolBed. Ours was a lifesaver when Dune was old and couldn't regulate his body temp, but it also became Kip's fave after a run on a hot day. Most of the year he won't touch it, but when we're in New England during the summer, he lives on it. He's a temperate-only kind of hound.

Big hugs. I went through this with Dune from 13 until we lost him at 14. Try the Adequan. Metacam helped Dune for a few years with his LSS (hind leg weakness/instability/pain is part of that), then stopped helping at 13. Tried the coriticosteroid oral and then injections -- not much help except appetite. The Adequan gave the best result and worked for us for his last six months. You give a loading dose (like 2-4 doses a week apart), then boosters -- it's just super-power glucosamine, essentially. As for panting, Dune did this, too, and it's hard to tell if it's pain or dementia or inability to cool. Cool air helped but not much. The CoolBed made a HUGE difference Dune's last two summers. They're not cheap, but it became his preferred place to lie most of the year -- it's like lying on a waterbed with a broken heater. It sucks the body heat out of you. Good luck, and more hugs to both of you!

Hmmm....Wonder if I could rubberize the bottoms of those and add a velcro strap to help them stay on better outside? Might be easier than creating from scratch. Or I could sew the Vibram to the sock by hand (ouch), then reinforce the edges with rubber glue and insert sheepskin padding. Thanks! I hadn't seen those. Must order a pair. I was thinking I'd need to run the sheepskin up the toe a bit on the inside, to help cushion the sides of the dropped toe. Good point.

Kipper has dropped toes on each front foot -- each sticks an inch+ beyond his other middle toe when standing and running (we've got pictures!). Because of this, we can't find boots that will fit, and I've asked Neopaws et al if they'd do custom, but they don't. Baby socks with tape work for hot pavement (short duration), but aren't durable or cushioned for his corn, and aren't feasible for summer travel. Do you know of anyone who makes custom boots? Or, has anyone MADE boots and have some tips? I've got 4mm Vibram outsole, a heavy-duty sewing machine, some old sheepskins and running-shoe inserts. I've got good weight-bearing paw tracings. I've studied Therapaws and Neopaws and Muttluks and some off brands at Petco. I think I can make something...but I've never attempted to create something like this. My biggest worry is that they will tear or rub the nails on those dropped toes. We Dremel them as short as possible, but they still poke straight out thanks to the lack of tendons holding them "up" and the flattened toe. Any ideas? Anything good or bad things about the boots you've used that I should consider in trying to make something? Thanks!!!

I'd agree with Philosopher -- fear. But the learned-response could be possible, also. Kipper shakes when he's nervous or afraid, and pants. He's 100 times better than when we first got him, thanks to desensitization training, but he vibrates like a personal massager during thunderstorms. Driving through last summer's brutal rainstorms created a new fear of driving in rain (snow triggers it, too, as do twisty mountain roads). But since he loves car trips overall and adores travel to new places and hotel rooms , we've been using desensitization training rather than stop taking him (car washes and hoses to simulate rain). When we first got him, this training worked on walks, dog parks, vet's offices, strangers, men in hats, babies, and most kids over the screeching-toddler stage. Sounds like fear to me. Have you read Patricia McConnell's The Cautious Canine? If not, pick up a copy -- it's a cheap booklet -- and try it. The key is to figure out the trigger, and start the positive treating just before the threshold triggers the shaking.

Agree on pharm-run trials, but as for peer review...there've been enough cases lately to expose how weak it currently is (Exhibit A is the doc who faked the autism-vaccine data and studies and got them through peer review in prestigious journals). Sadly, the system is broken, but I don't have an alternative except to stay cynical. The joy of SoCal, specifically a beach community. Friends swear their vets are cheaper if we're willing to drive 45 minutes inland. There are two greyhound-savvy vets within reasonable distance. One I used to see and still love, but her prices were always more expensive. The other (mine) was affordable until her clinic was sold to a younger DVM with an MBA three years ago. Prices for just about everything have doubled (it's now $52 to walk in the door, the Lyme was $38 the first two but $49 last year, plus needle-disposal fee). The other vet in my community is about 25% cheaper, but has no sighthound patients. Still, we're considering trying them out. The Sunshine Tax goes up each year, it seems. ETA: The diagnosis and doxy, by comparison, was a single office visit and a written scrip -- and doxy is cheap. Not the bloodwork, but sending it to Protatek yourself helps.