When To Spay?

[LakeshoreGreys]

Baby girl Molly is growing like a weed and she's now finished with her puppy shots. She will be 17 weeks old on Friday.

 

I missed her latest vet appointment (DH took her) so I did not have a chance to discuss when to spay Molly.

 

Before first heat? After? What about spay incontinence...there is such conflicting info out there!

 

HELP!

 

P.S. Pic of Molly - taken about 2 weeks ago sitting with DH:

 

[Batmom]

Are there still people who believe in waiting for a heat cycle? Yikes! You definitely want to do it before -- there's no benefit to waiting, and significant added risk.

[OwnedBySummer]

I've never waited for coming into heat. I, too, have heard there's no benefit to waiting whatsoever and that it increases the risk for cancer. And I've never ever had any difficulty with spaying before the first heat and I don't know anyone who has (had trouble).

 

Edit: Here's something I found, although I can't confirm that this is or isn't 100% accurate. But it matches up with what I've always thought. You need to schedule her appointment before her first heat cycle, the surgery should usually be done before six months of age. Several tragic things can happen to dogs who are not spayed. Quite often she will develop mammary cancer in her mid to later life. She has a near zero chance of this disease if she is spayed before her first heat, this increases to just under 10% chance after her first cycle, and increases yet again to about 25% chance after her second heat.

 

Edit #2: Good grief, how could I forget to also say... what an absolutely adorable puppy! Ooooo, the tummy!

Edited August 4, 2011 by OwnedBySummer

[seeh2o]

Back when I had a puppy, many years ago, I had a very who told me the best time was when they lose their first tooth. He said that was about the 6 month mark.

[Sambuca]

I'm a fan of the 6 month time period. Usually a month in either direction is fine, but with a female you don't want to push it off to long because they can go into heat. If they go into heat you need to wait at least 6 weeks until the spay at a responsible vet.

 

Where did you get her from? Did you sign a contract? Often when you adopt a puppy there will be something in the contract about the spay.

 

She is freakin adorable.

[kudzu]

Had this conversation with my vet when my staghound was a puppy. Both she & the other vet I spoke to, both in the same practice, believe it is best to wait until a dog is physically & mentally mature. Depending on the dog that may even mean waiting until after the first heat cycle but at least not before they are done growing. This is also the growing opinion of many involved in canine athletics. Am referring to vets who compete with their own dogs. Have heard them discussing this issue at events. In reading & research I also found this article "Early Spay-Neuter Considerations for the Canine Athlete" (link) by Dr. Chris Zink, a veterinarian, researcher & dog sport competitor.

 

Though I wanted to wait until she was 18 mos before spaying I chose to spay her at 15 mos to avoid a first heat cycle. There were many considerations involved in this decision including her health. (She has an issue that could be exacerbated by a heat cycle.) All we can do is gather & consider as much reliable information as possible then make the best decision we can. I've not had a GH puppy nor an unspayed GH bitch but have heard that GH bitches go into heat much later than many other breeds. You may want to inquire with some breeders to confirm this. Someone else, when making this same decision for her own dog, told me she'd heard of GH bitches not coming into heat until after 18 mos. Assuming that is true you have a good long time to ponder this questions.

 

Good luck & enjoy your little girl. Puppyhood doesn't last long. One day you'll look back & wonder where the time has gone. And thank your lucky stars you all survived.

 

Are there still people who believe in waiting for a heat cycle? Yikes! You definitely want to do it before -- there's no benefit to waiting, and significant added risk.

Can you provide the references you got this information from? I am sure it will help OP with her decision.

Edited August 4, 2011 by kudzu

[Batmom]

Reasons to spay before the first heat:

 

1. Greatly reduced incidence of mammary tumors, which are common in dogs spayed later and which are often malignant.

 

2. Possibly *reduced* rate of urinary incontinence. The old wisdom was that early spaying significantly increased incidence but more recent studies, such as http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11787155 , show either insignificant increase or decrease.

 

Dr. Howe provides a rebuttal of Dr. Zink's article here: http://www.columbusdogconnection.com/Documents/PedRebuttal%20.pdf . Although it's framed as a rebuttal, it provides a pretty good outline of the issues.

[kudzu]

Thank you, Batmom.

[LakeshoreGreys]

Thanks to everyone for their replies! Looks like the general consensus is before the first heat. I like the idea of the "first lost baby tooth" - that will be a good reminder.

 

Sambuca - no contract, just a verbal promise from us that we intend to honor.

 

It's been so long since we've had a GH puppy (almost 15 years), it's like learning everything new again. I don't remember much, and I'm sure a lot of advice has changed since then too as we learn new things.

 

Bonus Molly pic - kitty was sitting there first, and Molly shoe-horned her way in.

[Guest BrianRke]

Lakeshore,

 

Is that a statue of a greyhound on the fireplace? The bottom looks really good, I'd love to see the rest. Where did you get it?

 

 

(sorry to hijack)

[Sighthounds4me]

OMG... we have the same statue, also on our fireplace hearth!

 

The only benefit I have heard about waiting to spay till after the first heat is if she has a...what's the correct term...inverted (?) vulva (the type that would need surgery later, because it tends to retain urine, and cause vaginal infections). I have heard anecdotal evidence to suggest that allowing one season helps with this issue. BUT, it is only anecdotal evidence, I have only read it on internet forums like this, and I do not know the actuality of this. All in all, I agree with the others: no reason to wait, get it done ASAP.

 

The little brat is ADORABLE! Please blow raspberries on that tummy for me!

Edited August 5, 2011 by Sighthounds4me

[Guest RedTigerJazz]

I've been told by my vet (a Greyhound expert) and by NGA breeders that you should at least wait until the growth plates have fused - minimum of 9 months old, 12 months preferred.

 

~Lisa~

[Guest Swifthounds]

Had this conversation with my vet when my staghound was a puppy. Both she & the other vet I spoke to, both in the same practice, believe it is best to wait until a dog is physically & mentally mature. Depending on the dog that may even mean waiting until after the first heat cycle but at least not before they are done growing. This is also the growing opinion of many involved in canine athletics. Am referring to vets who compete with their own dogs. Have heard them discussing this issue at events. In reading & research I also found this article "Early Spay-Neuter Considerations for the Canine Athlete" (link) by Dr. Chris Zink, a veterinarian, researcher & dog sport competitor.

 

Though I wanted to wait until she was 18 mos before spaying I chose to spay her at 15 mos to avoid a first heat cycle. There were many considerations involved in this decision including her health. (She has an issue that could be exacerbated by a heat cycle.) All we can do is gather & consider as much reliable information as possible then make the best decision we can. I've not had a GH puppy nor an unspayed GH bitch but have heard that GH bitches go into heat much later than many other breeds. You may want to inquire with some breeders to confirm this. Someone else, when making this same decision for her own dog, told me she'd heard of GH bitches not coming into heat until after 18 mos. Assuming that is true you have a good long time to ponder this questions.

 

Good luck & enjoy your little girl. Puppyhood doesn't last long. One day you'll look back & wonder where the time has gone. And thank your lucky stars you all survived.

 

 

If you want a physically sound hound waiting until at least 12 months is the way to go. It would be a rare greyhound that would go into heat prior to 18 months or so, so anytime in between is usually safe if you're shooting for before the first heat cycle.

[LakeshoreGreys]

Hi Brian, here's the rest of the statue. My camera is not the best, so the pic doesn't do it justice. We got it about 8 years ago at a gift/patio furniture/furniture shop in Green Bay, Wisconsin. I've seen it online somewhere too. Around $100 IIRC - it's resin.

 

Sarah, "brat" is right! Did you get your statue from Taylor Creek to?! Greyt minds, LOL...

 

I did not realize gh's go into heat so much later than other dogs. Why is that?

Edited August 6, 2011 by LakeshoreGreys

[Sighthounds4me]

Did you get your statue from Taylor Creek to?! Greyt minds, LOL...

 

I did not realize gh's go into heat so much later than other dogs. Why is that?

 

Nope - ours came from Hancock Fabric.

 

My understanding as to why they come in later is due to body fat. Because sighthounds, especially larger sighthounds, have less fat than similarly sized breeds, they develop slower. Think of it like a marathon runner, and how her monthly cycles can be messed up.

 

My friend had an Afghan bitch who did not come in till about 18 months, IIRC.

 

*ETA: I am in the "wait for maturity" camp. Henley is 2 1/2 and is still intact. I don't plan to neuter him til at least next year. Manero was almost 8 when he was neutered (but then, he was shown, and possibly breedable).

Edited August 5, 2011 by Sighthounds4me

[Jenbo]

PUPPEH!

[Batmom]

I'm not aware of any significant difference in first heat between greyhounds and other dogs -- can occur any time after 6 months, usually 12 months or so in large breeds.

[onrushpam]

I've had several intact female greyhounds in my home, raised from puppyhood and have known many others raised in other homes. None have ever had a first season before 18 months, some well past 2 years old. That's not to say it doesn't happen... early heat has been the cause of more than one "oops" litter. But, the odds are very slim she'll go into heat before 12 months. There's a reason why greyhounds are moved from the runs to the training kennel at 12 months... that's when the growth plates close in most dogs.

 

I've seen a bunch of greyhounds that were spayed early (6 months or younger) that just look "odd"... they don't develop proper musculature. They tend to be tall and weedy.

 

I would never spay younger than a year.

[Guest BrianRke]

Hi Brian, here's the rest of the statue. My camera is not the best, so the pic doesn't do it justice. We got it about 8 years ago at a gift/patio furniture/furniture shop in Green Bay, Wisconsin. I've seen it online somewhere too. Around $100 IIRC - it's resin.

 

Sarah, "brat" is right! Did you get your statue from Taylor Creek to?! Greyt minds, LOL...

 

I did not realize gh's go into heat so much later than other dogs. Why is that?

Thanks, I'll keep my eyes open.

[Guest zoolaine]

Zali and Zuki both got spayed around 10 months. Love the picture of her with the cat! Cat looks a little peeved. "You dare come touch me" Just a warning - the cat will probably be out for revenge the sly creatures they are, and will probably try to get Molly in trouble. So the next time you walk into a big mess and think it is Molly responsible and the kitty is there trying to look all innocent - it was the evil kitty and not sweet baby Molly!!!!

[Guest lovemyhounds]

Here is a link to a blog on raising a greyhound puppy that sites some articles that might be of benefit to read in making your decision...http://greyhoundpuppy.blogspot.com/2010/10/8-months.html I hope you will find the time to read the articles as some of the information may be enlightening. Most of all, have fun with your pup...they grow up so fast!

Edited August 6, 2011 by lovemyhounds

[Guest LazyBones]

what a cute little girlie!

 

gumby came to me when she was a puppy (about 3-4 months old). she was spayed before ever having a heat cycle, which was around 6-7 months of age. pokey, my whippet, was spayed a bit later in life because my family had adopted her when she was an adult. she was about 3-4 yrs old when she was spayed.

 

my current dog (a BT) was spayed when she was about 5-6 months old.

[Guest Swifthounds]

I've had several intact female greyhounds in my home, raised from puppyhood and have known many others raised in other homes. None have ever had a first season before 18 months, some well past 2 years old. That's not to say it doesn't happen... early heat has been the cause of more than one "oops" litter. But, the odds are very slim she'll go into heat before 12 months. There's a reason why greyhounds are moved from the runs to the training kennel at 12 months... that's when the growth plates close in most dogs.

 

I've seen a bunch of greyhounds that were spayed early (6 months or younger) that just look "odd"... they don't develop proper musculature. They tend to be tall and weedy.

 

I would never spay younger than a year.

 

Well put.

[Guest SpicyMom]

Greys mature slower/later. Ditto what others have said about allowing them to finish their growth - somewhere between 1-2 yrs old. My grey was still actively growing (height and weight) right up to 18 months+ and still had not had her first heat. There is NO rush with a grey to spay at 6 months. That is the standard line from vets but not from those who know greyhounds. Given that greys mature slower, I'd love to see some greyhound specific statistics on spay date vs cancer. Kind of like medical studies done on men and generalized to women, I suspect there is a great deal of variation.

[greytlucy]

Our greyhound puppy was neutered at 8 weeks. The adoption group would not release him without a neuter. He had a very tall and lanky build...all leg, not much muscle even when he was running every day as a young dog. He was a healthy dog for the most part but at 9 developed spinal issues that were likely related to his build and at 10 developed osteo. Can't prove that the osteo was related to the early neuter but there is a lot of research starting to look into this connection in dogs.

 

Our standard poodle was neutered at 5 mos. He's 18 mos now. I regret neutering him so early - he had some dental issues we needed to take care of and agreed to go ahead and do the neuter then. He also has a lanky build (for his breed). He's had some development issues that the vet thinks might be related to early neuter. I'm nervous about his old age after what we went through with the greyhound.

 

If I were to ever have another puppy I wouldn't even begin to consider a spay/neuter before 12 mos but would probably wait until 18 mos. My experience is purely anectdotal but based on these two puppies I wouldn't do an early S/N again.