Thane Peeing Blood

[macoduck]

Thane peed bright red blood this morning. He didn't want breakfast, is panting. Took him to the E-vet who said there were neoplastic cells in his urine (catheterized).

He had a temp of 103.5.

He was given IV fluids, Baytril injection, Baytril pills, buprenorphine injection for pain.

I am going to a vet 1.5 hours away - the only one who has ultrasound - and beg them to scan him Monday. No ultrasound locally or anywhere nearby today.

 

Need interpretation:

WBC ..... 11.3 (high) gh normal range 3.5-6.5 .... 6.6 (6/22/09)....4.2 (2/24/09) ....6.74 (10/17/08)

HGB ...... 18.6 (low) gh normal range 19.0-21.5)..21.3 (6/22/09)...21.9 (2/24/09)...22.5 (10/17/08)

 

RDWA....53.3 (high) dog normal range 35-53 ....56.7 (6/22/09) ...57.9 (2/24/09) is greyhound normal same value as other dog normal?

RDW%...17.6 (high) dog normal range 11-16 ....18.3 96/22/09) ...18.2 (2/24/09) ...14.9 (10/17/08) is greyhound normal same vaule as other dog normal?

PLT ....136,000 gh normal range 80,000-200,000 ...148,000 (6/22/09) ...162,000 (2.24.09) ...56,000 10/17/08)

 

CREATININE 2.8 (high) gh normal range .8-1.6 ...1.3 (2/21/09) .... 1.2 (10/17/08)

GLOBULIN 3.8 (high) gh normal range 2.1-3.2 ...3.3 (2/21/09) ....2.8 (10/17/08)

 

ALK PHOSPHATASE.... 79 ....34 (2/21/09) ....85 (10/17/08)

ALT(SGPT) ...48 .... 34 (2/21/09) .... 57 (10/17/08)

ALBUMIN ...3.3 same as previous

 

They couldn't do bilirubin because machine was down

Urinalysis from dipstick:

Leucocytes negative

Nitrite negative

Urobilinogen normal

Protein >+++2000

Ph 7

Blood >1g

S.Gravity 1030

Ketone negative

Bilirubin 1g

Glucose normal

 

Lab work done in 10/08 was from when Thane first came to us and was deathly sick a week later with severe gastroenteritis.

Lab work done in 6/09 was from when he was lethargic, had painful belly, wouldn't eat, full xrays done all negative, given paid meds, Phazyme and Pepcid.

Edited August 5, 2009 by macoduck

[ahicks51]

RDWA....53.3 (high) dog normal range 35-53 ....56.7 (6/22/09) ...57.9 (2/24/09) is greyhound normal same value as other dog normal?

RDW%...17.6 (high) dog normal range 11-16 ....18.3 96/22/09) ...18.2 (2/24/09) ...14.9 (10/17/08) is greyhound normal same vaule as other dog normal?

 

RDW (don't know what RDWA is, and Google isn't helping) is a dimensionless measure of the "normal size" of red blood cells. Normally you want them to be all the same size; if you have some that are too big (megaloblastic cells) or too small, then that skews the average size.

 

I *think* RDW mainly goes out of whack due to nutritional reasons- failure to absorb this or that. The main one I know about is folic acid deficiency (folate deficiency), resulting in megaloblastic anemia.

 

While 53.3 is just a *hair* outside of the norms (35-53), and the RDW% is just a bit high (having dropped from your previous two measurements in 2009), I wouldn't worry about them quite so much. The values should be in line with those for other breeds of dog; they are not peculiar in sighthounds, best as I know.

[Guest greybookends]

Ducky I haven't a clue as to what that all means But a pray he is ok!

:hope :hope :hope

[Guest argolola]

I have him on my prayer list. God bless.

[Guest arlosmom]

[maryz]

Sending prayers for Thane and hoping you get some answers tomorrow. Good luck.

[crazygang]

Hope and pray he gets well soon....

[CaliforniaGreys]

I'm familiar with some of the values but not all, hopefully someone with more experience will chime in here.

Thane in tucked very tightly in my prayers. I love that boy!

[Guest Energy11]

Hey Ducky... hope this helps! Sorry to hear Thane isn't feeling well! MIGHT be a very bad kidney infection, and/or stoned. Love and hugs from us here! D

 

 

NORMAL VALUES FOR:

Greyhounds Other Dogs

 

RBC: 7.4 - 9.0 5.5 - 8.5

 

Hgb: 19.0 - 21.5 12.0 - 18.0

 

PCV: 55 - 65 37 - 55

 

Greyhounds have significantly more red blood cells than other breeds. This elevates parameters for RBC, hemoglobin, and PCV / HCT, and is the reason greyhounds are so desirable as blood donors. Most veterinarians are aware of this difference. Never accept a diagnosis of polycythemia - a once-in-a-lifetime-rare diagnosis of pathologic red cell overproduction - in a greyhound.

 

Conversely, never interpret a greyhound PCV in the 30's - low 40's as being normal just because it is for other dogs. A greyhound with a PCV in the 30's - low 40's is an anemic greyhound. Here in Arizona, a greyhound PCV < 50 is a red flag to check for Ehrlichia.

 

WBC

 

Greyhound: 3.5 - 6.5

 

Other dog: 6.0 - 17.0

 

Other greyhound CBC changes are less well known. The greyhound's normally low WBC has caused more than one healthy greyhound to undergo a bone marrow biopsy in search of "cancer" or some other cause of the "low WBC."

 

Platelets

 

Greyhound: 80,000 - 200,000

 

Other dog: 150,000 - 400,000

 

Likewise, greyhound platelet numbers are lower on average than other breeds, which might be mistakenly interpreted as a problem. It is thought that greyhound WBCs, platelets, and total protein may be lower to physiologically "make room" in the bloodstream for the increased red cell load.

 

Confounding these normally low WBC and platelet numbers is the fact that Ehrlichia, a common blood parasite of greyhounds, can lower WBC and platelet counts. So if there is any doubt as to whether the WBC / platelet counts are normal, an Ehrlichia titer is always in order. The other classic changes with Ehrlichia are lowered PCV and elevated globulin and total protein. But bear in mind that every greyhound will not have every change, and Ehrlichia greyhounds can have normal CBCs.

 

Chem Panel

 

T.P. = Total Protein

 

Globulin

 

Creatinine

 

T4

 

NORMAL VALUES FOR:

T.P. Globulin

 

Greyhound: 4.5 - 6.2 Greyhound: 2.1 - 3.2

 

Other dog: 5.4 - 7.8 Other dog: 2.8 - 4.2

 

Greyhound total proteins tend to run on the low end of normal - T.P.s in the 5.0's and 6.0's are the norm. While the albumin fraction of T.P. is the same as other dogs, the globulin component is lower.

 

Creatinine

 

Greyhounds: .8 - 1.6

 

Other dogs: .0 - 1.0

 

Greyhound creatinines run higher than other breeds as a function of their large lean muscle mass. A study at the Auburn University College of Veterinary Medicine found that 80% of retired greyhounds they sampled had creatinine values up to 1.6 times as high as the top of the standard reference range for "other dogs." As a lone finding, an "elevated creatinine" is not indicative of impending kidney failure. If the BUN and urinalysis are normal, so is the "elevated" creatinine.

 

T4

 

Greyhounds: .5 - 3.6 (mean 1.47+/- .63)

 

Other dogs: 1.52 - 3.60

 

These figures are from a University of Florida study of thyroid function in 221 greyhounds - 97 racers, 99 broods, and 25 studs - so it included both racers and "retired." While greyhound thyroid levels are a whole chapter unto themselves, a good rule of thumb is that greyhound T4s run about half that of other breeds.

 

Urinalysis

 

And lastly, the good news - greyhound urinalysis is the same as other breeds. It is normal for males to have small to moderate amounts of bilirubin in the urine.

 

 

 

 

[greyhndz]

Thane peed bright red blood this morning. He didn't want breakfast, is panting. Took him to the E-vet who said there were neoplastic cells in his urine (catheterized).

 

OH, CRAP, Ducky.

He had a temp of 103.5.

He was given IV fluids, Baytril injection, Baytril pills, buprenorphine injection for pain.

 

All sounds right so far.

 

I am going to a vet 1.5 hours away - the only one who has ultrasound - and beg them to scan him Monday. No ultrasound locally or anywhere nearby today.

 

I don't think you need one to be done urgently today. It really won't affect his treatment plan at this point. With a temp of 103.5 he's almost certainly got a UTI, so everything your vet did is on target and should take precedence. The U/S can wait for a day or two.

 

Need interpretation:

WBC ..... 11.3 (high) gh normal range 3.5-6.5 .... 6.6 (6/22/09)....4.2 (2/24/09) ....6.74 (10/17/08)

 

11.3 is really only minimally elevated. The normal range (depending on the lab) can go up to 10-12K

 

HGB ...... 18.6 (low) gh normal range 19.0-21.5)..21.3 (6/22/09)...21.9 (2/24/09)...22.5 (10/17/08)

 

Again, slightly low, but may actually be lower once he's been hydrated. I'd call this a "dry" hematocrit, so it may appear artificially higher than it really is. Expect it to be a bit lower the next time it's checked, if he's been given IV fluids.

 

RDWA....53.3 (high) dog normal range 35-53 ....56.7 (6/22/09) ...57.9 (2/24/09) is greyhound normal same value as other dog normal?

 

RDW%...17.6 (high) dog normal range 11-16 ....18.3 96/22/09) ...18.2 (2/24/09) ...14.9 (10/17/08) is greyhound normal same vaule as other dog normal?

 

The exact numbers aren't that crucial - when there's any degree of blood loss, the bone marrow will be pumping out new RBC, and depending on their stage of development, their size will vary. The RDW reflects that variation in size. A reticulocyte count gives a more precise measurement of how well the bone marrow is replacing RBC.

 

PLT ....136,000 gh normal range 80,000-200,000 ...148,000

 

Fine.

 

CREATININE 2.8 (high) gh normal range .8-1.6 ...1.3 (2/21/09) .... 1.2 (10/17/08)

 

High, but again, he's got a couple of problems which are affecting his creatinine: the fact that he's probably dry (volume depleted), and the fact that he's probably got a UTI. Hopefully when they recheck this in a couple of days (after he's been hydrated and on antibiotics) this will return to normal range.

 

GLOBULIN 3.8 (high) gh normal range 2.1-3.2 ...3.3 (2/21/09) ....2.8 (10/17/08)

ALK PHOSPHATASE.... 79 ....34 (2/21/09) ....85 (10/17/08)

ALT(SGPT) ...48 .... 34 (2/21/09) .... 57 (10/17/08)

ALBUMIN ...3.3 same as previous

 

None of these should be of concern at this point. And again, being dry make skew the results. The albumin being in normal range will be more important when he's having a renal workup in the next few days, to rule out protein-losing nephropathy.

 

Urinalysis from dipstick:

Leucocytes negative (interesting - this should be positive w/acute UTI or pyelonephritis - but I've seen many human UTI's which have a negative dipstick but a very positive micro exam and culture)

nitrite negative (usually but not always positive w/UTI)

Urobilinogen normal

Protein >+++2000 (can be very +++ with UTI, but of course also with proteinuria from renal disease)

ph 7 (a bit high, but this is consistent with UTI)

Blood >1g

S.Gravity 1030 (confirms his being volume depleted - this is pretty dry)

Ketone negative

Bilirubin 1g (many male greyhounds are positive for urobili or bili on dipstick)

Glucose normal

 

Did the vet do a microscopic exam, which is far more specific and accurate?

Did the vet send off a urine culture?

If proteinuria persists and/or urine culture is negative for infection, urine should be sent for urine protein-creatinine ratio to quantitate the amount of protein in the urine.

 

Ducky, please feel free to PM me if you need a brain to pick. I hope Thane recovers quickly and uneventfully!

 

Jordan

[macoduck]

"Did the vet do a microscopic exam, which is far more specific and accurate?" ........... I think so since she saw the neoplastic cells

"Did the vet send off a urine culture?" ................No

"If proteinuria persists and/or urine culture is negative for infection, urine should be sent for urine protein-creatinine ratio to quantitate the amount of protein in the urine."

..............I'll ask about that.

 

Thank you Jordan!

Edited August 2, 2009 by macoduck

[Guest 2greysinPA]

Many prayers for Thane

[Guest ss556]

Sending prayers for Thane.

[Guest IrskasMom]

 

 

More gentle Hugs and Prayers for Thane Ducky , I hope you can get to the bottom

of this and Thane is on it's way to getting better

[Burpdog]

Baytril may or may not be the drug he needs. Should have done a culture.

 

I don't recognize the letters you are referring to.

 

Has the blood slowed down?

[macoduck]

Baytril may or may not be the drug he needs. Should have done a culture.

 

I don't recognize the letters you are referring to.

 

Has the blood slowed down?

No, still pees blood. Starts off yellow then goes to bright red.

He's had a few sips of water, had a few bites of dinner.

Still hasn't pooped even though upon the rectal exam he had a load in there she could barely feel the prostate.

 

How long does it take to run the culture? I will getting a urine catch in the morning.

[CaliforniaGreys]

Baytril may or may not be the drug he needs. Should have done a culture.

 

I don't recognize the letters you are referring to.

 

Has the blood slowed down?

No, still pees blood. Starts off yellow then goes to bright red.

He's had a few sips of water, had a few bites of dinner.

Still hasn't pooped even though upon the rectal exam he had a load in there she could barely feel the prostate.

 

How long does it take to run the culture? I will getting a urine catch in the morning.

 

Ducky, usually if they grow a culture, it'll take an extra day, 2 days tops

Edited August 3, 2009 by cbudshome

[Burpdog]

Not sure if they can do a culture now. Ask vet in the morning.

 

If the letters I don't recognize are HCT greys should be minimum over 50 and can go up to 65 or even a little higher. Under 50 can be trouble for a grey.

 

Ultrasound sounds like a good idea.

[macoduck]

Not sure if they can do a culture now. Ask vet in the morning.

 

If the letters I don't recognize are HCT greys should be minimum over 50 and can go up to 65 or even a little higher. Under 50 can be trouble for a grey.

 

Ultrasound sounds like a good idea.

 

HCT was 53.2........previously on the dates shown above 59.3....61.9....60.9

[Guest PhillyPups]

Ducky:

 

You and Thane are in my

[Maddiesmom]

Thane and Ducky we are thinking of you.

 

Thane buddy- get better soon. I wants to see you at open house in October - Wubs MaDdie

[Guest greyhound1]

:hope

[kudzu]

I'm not much help. First thought reading it is UTI but some of the results don't make sense to me. Sorry, out of practice reading lab work. That was 3 dogs ago. Wish I had an easy explanation for that scary word neoplastic.

 

One thing I do know is that it doesn't take much blood in urine to make it look bright red. Also, UTIs can result in the "peeing blood" look. Been there. Done that. Anti-b's were the cure. Definitely do ask them to culture the urine. Try not to worry too much until you have more results.

 

Sending good thoughts for Thane.

[macoduck]

Back from vet. Nothing definitive. UTI or Transitional Cell Carcinoma

Urinalysis:

pH......... 6.5

Leu ........25

Pro ........500mg

Glu ........negative

Ket ........negative

Ubg .......normal

KET .......normal

BIL .......1mg

BLD ......250Ery

Specific Gravity .. 1/038

sediment:

WBC 2-10/hpf

RBC... TNTC

Bacteria.... cocci TNTC

crystals... calcium oxalate, small in size and some amorphous

casts....waxy/granular

Thane was given sub-Q fluids and injectable Convenia

 

He has an appt Tuesday with the out of town vet for an ultrasound in the afternoon.

 

 

[Guest greytbookert]

I have no advice or insight to the lab results but I want to send good healing thoughts for you and Thane!