Osteo Thread

[BauersMom]

 

I just re-read this and realized that I was quite harsh. I don't mean to say that all bone cancer would be caught in the early stages if "vets did their jobs". Obviously that is not the case, although it would be wonderful if all bone cancer could be caught early. I have just run across a few vets who didn't do x-rays because: a) they didn't think a little limp would be cancer; b ) it would be too soon for it to show up on x-rays if the dog just started limping; or c) if it is bone cancer there isn't anything that can be done anyway.

 

This is my take, too. It's not that vets are incompetent, but I have seen so many cases where they dismiss osteo because of the reasons you state above (usually a, in my limited experience). A slight limp CAN be osteo. A limp that resolves and comes back CAN be osteo. No indication of pain at the bone CAN be osteo. None of that stuff can be used to rule out osteo, yet it happens all the time it appears.

 

 

 

RIP Gypsy - I'll never forget your incredible sense of humor and your joy in teasing me. I miss you sweetheart, every single solitary day.

 

Cancer does suck. I lost my first greyhound, Bauer, to hemangiosarcoma. We didn't know he had it until it ruptured - we were out of town, so he died at the kennel, which thankfully was attached to a vet so at least he had medical treatment when he went into crisis. I still feel guilty about leaving him. We can only do so much, and it hurts when we feel like we've failed them. Gypsy knows you loved her dearly.

 

 

 

I'm feeling so guilty. I can't find the right combination of meds to make him feel consistently good (never mind meds that would actually make him well). If he seemed to feel consistently bad, I'd know what to do for him, but I hate feeling that he's hiding his discomfort from me. And is he hiding it because he's not ready to go, or because he's looking after me?

 

 

Sam is gorgeous. I hope you can get the meds figured out.

 

And good news about Pinky's hair growth! Berkeley's peach fuzz is still holding strong.

[krissn333]

I would classify Pinky's as peach fuzz, but the individual hairs are pretty long considering its just been 4 weeks since her surgery.

[BauersMom]

The odd thing is his peach fuzz is totally a different color.

 

Here he is - this would be 4+ months post-amp.

 

He had a great time at the CGA reunion. He was feeling much better and the timing was within his usual "good" week post-chemo, so I'm glad he got to go. He got lots of attention, and met a few new friends.

[krissn333]

Looks like his sabling just needs to come in. How interesting!

 

A kitty that I rescued was clearly a tiger kitty...you know how their hair is kind of the same mix of colors as a wild rabbit? I could tell this guy had been shaved within the last couple of months because his mane and tail were that variegated color while his body was just long, grayish hair. I bet the same will happen with Berkeley pretty soon, especially since he's done with chemo

[BauersMom]

That's what I think it is - the hair that's come in is very soft and light-colored, and he's missing the darker, coarser part of his coat.

 

We joked at the vet Friday that he might need some Just for Men hair dye.

[krissn333]

[KF_in_Georgia]

That's what I think it is - the hair that's come in is very soft and light-colored, and he's missing the darker, coarser part of his coat.

 

We joked at the vet Friday that he might need some Just for Men hair dye.

 

I'm a dog groomer, and this is common on dogs that are shaved. The darker the sable hair was (or the thicker it was), the less likely it is to come back thoroughly. We see dogs that get shaved just once a year or so, and you can still see the difference in their hair the next year when they come in. The new hair is long; it's just the wrong color. (It's why I try to talk owners out of shaving German Shepherds or Huskies or small dogs--like Pekingese or Pomeranians--that have sabled coats.) The new hair coming in probably will stay very soft.

[cmc333]

God, I hate cancer. It is just so damn unfair and it hurts the innocents so very much. We can at least understand their pain and ours, but they can't. They just know they hurt and momma/daddy are NOT making it better. And that's the guilt I carry around every single day - the feeling that I failed Gypsy and disappointed her.

 

Your post has me in tears.

 

Sam (lung cancer...and arthritis in his spine) is having a bad day, sometimes coughing and hacking as if he has something caught in his throat.

 

He eats fine. He jumps around and wants to play with Silver (who's still ignoring him). But in between those moments, he just lies on his bed--often not sleeping. (If he slept more, I'd feel better; a sleeping Sam is a normal Sam.) Or he coughs a tickle-in-the-throat kind of cough. He usually seems fine in the evenings when I get home from work, but I'm starting to suspect that he's just playing up to me. Lately, my days off work--when I can be home with him--have been Friday and Sunday, so at these times I'm seeing him in his new-normal mode. My vet is going to think I'm crazy. I keep taking Sam in on Monday or Tuesday, and Sam seems fine in the office...but I think he's just "up" for the visit.

 

We increased the methocarbamol last week. Today, he'll be betting an extra gabapentin (and I'll be watching to see if he's steady on his already-wobbly legs or if it's going to cause the same problems valium caused).

 

I'm feeling so guilty. I can't find the right combination of meds to make him feel consistently good (never mind meds that would actually make him well). If he seemed to feel consistently bad, I'd know what to do for him, but I hate feeling that he's hiding his discomfort from me. And is he hiding it because he's not ready to go, or because he's looking after me?

 

I think we're maybe okay for another week, anyway. And my days off are changing this week; I'll be home Tuesday and Sunday this next week, so we'll see how it goes.

 

Sam in September, pre-diagnosis

 

Trust me, I know all about guilt. Whether it's merited or not, you can't help feeling like you could have done something sooner, better, more, different, and on and on. And you will know it when he is ready to go. That is such a nebulous phrase "you'll know when it's time", but you WILL. There will be a look in his eyes that is totally unmistakeable, even if you've never seen it before. It's sorta weird, like a primal knowledge, but you will be sure. Enjoy every moment you have and store up memories for after. The memories are wonderful to look back on and a way of holding onto him forever in your heart.. And Sam is beautiful...I love how he fades from white to light fawn - he looks like he gets his hair colored by a Beverly Hills hairstylist!

[KF_in_Georgia]

I did okay making the decision with Jacey. We fought for nearly four days when she was sick in August. We maybe left it a few hours late--we tried a blood transfusion, but we had misleading information on her blood count so we thought the transfusion was worth a try. (If we'd gotten accurate numbers on the blood count, we wouldn't have tried the transfusion, but we thought her condition might be turning around.) But she was 8 years old, and she had something that isn't usually fatal, so we were in fighting mode.

 

Sam is eleven and a half. He has spinal arthritis that keeps him in some degree of pain pretty much all the time, but he gets by on meloxicam and methocarbamol. He's got a secondary cancer we know about in his lungs, and there's probably a primary cancer somewhere that we haven't located. We're fairly certain there's no osteo, but we don't know how painful the cancer is being or where he might be hurting. So for Sam, it's not fighting mode; it's just keeping him comfortable. I don't want to go until he can't do the things he likes best: it's my feeling that that will be too long. We need to stop before he gets so miserable he can't/won't eat, before breathing is painful or difficult; with luck, before whatever else is lurking ruptures or hemorrhages, or whatever it might do. Sam is a truly dedicated sleeper, so when he's not sleeping, it's clear he's uncomfortable.

 

Today has been a better day than yesterday. He's slept a lot, and very comfortably. He's licked the pillow in his sleep. (He loves to do that.) I've sat in the floor all day to work, so he's been next to me on a dog bed and snuggled up to my side. He got an extra dose of gabapentin today, and he'll get more meds before bedtime. Since I can't rely on him to let me know when he's really hurting, I want to find a dose of meds that gets on top of the pain without leaving him staggering.

[GreytHurleyDawg]

I'm just popping in for a minute, I have not been around lately and I have a few days off coming up butI have to shower and leave for work after this posting and I wanted to catch up!

 

Hurley is doing greyt, we bought another rug and there are rugs within reach all around. He is a bit lethargic but all 3 greys are right now: we haven't taken any walks or gone anywhere but the vet's lately. Boo.

 

Anyone is welcome to use the "I always win the 3 legged race" and i certainly hope you weren't waiting for apporval! Ha ha...I don't know if we'll ever mass market or even locally market anything, it was just a thought!

 

Thank you for all the continuing conversations palladia and other post-chemo or during-chemo drugs. We were not made aware of anything he might need during chemo, so that's interesting. I don't want to sound paranoid though and I think i sort of bring that out sometimes. Fortunately, we are all very reasonable here on gt.

 

As for the vets that do not xray limps, I think part of it is that they don't want to scare people away by xraying everyone that walks in the door and then leaves with a clear diagnosis. Money is ever the issue and some people would rather not shell anything out unnecessarily. We have had many limps that were just sprains and took home some rimadyl and waited with good results. I certainly don't want to always pay $100 or more each visit I make with 3 greyhounds. But, on the other hand, we decided at the very last minute to skip our regular vet and go directly to the er vet where we knew they give us quality care. They xrayed immediately...Hurley did express pain when she tugged at the bone the right way. As soon as she said xrays, the thought of osteo came into my brain for the first time and it never left. I know she saw the moment of recognition in my eyes. Camcer is Always the enemy and knowing more about it is well and good but we ALL want there to be less of it. The worrying about it is very stressful and if I could take that away, i would. I don't want to stir up any flames but vets are what they are: people YOU pay to evaluate your pets. It is up to you to make them work for it if they are all too willing to write it off as an unknown diagnosis. It's when you trust them fully that you run into a problem........I shudder to think what would have happened if we took Hurley to the regular vet and they could have sent him home undiagnosed!!!!!!!

 

 

SO sorry and unexpected to hear about Faye Oops......big, giant hugs and a wish for Faye Oops to find contentment and no pain across the bridge.

Edited December 5, 2011 by GreytHurleyDawg

[greysmom]

Carol Morris (GreyKarma) makes embroidered bandanas through her etsy store. She sent Dude one that says "Tripods Do It On Three Legs!" Cracked everybody at the hospital up completely when he would wear it in for visits!

[krissn333]

My friend's girl was just diagnosed . She was my first full adoption as a rep. They are still trying to decide what to do as they are just devastated. She said she'd been in here reading, so hopefully she will make an account and join us.

[BauersMom]

My friend's girl was just diagnosed . She was my first full adoption as a rep. They are still trying to decide what to do as they are just devastated. She said she'd been in here reading, so hopefully she will make an account and join us.

 

 

One of our adopted dogs was recently diagnosed, and they were in that "what the hell do I do?" stage, so I called and talked to them. It's one of those things I'd rather not be "knowledgeable" about but it is what it is, so I will always try to help someone else going through it. At least that information goes to good use then.

[krissn333]

I will see her in person on Sunday, so maybe they will have had a little more time to process and assess their feelings by then. She was actually at the e-vet with her OTHER girl the night that Pinky was there for observation after her surgery and she has known about Pinky from the beginning. Their girl is almost 12 I think, and I haven't seen her in a while because she does not enjoy meet and greets anymore after she was attacked by another dog So, I'm not sure what kind of shape she is in physically for a 12 year old. I know that if my Carrie were diagnosed, we couldn't go the amputation route - she does fine with 4 legs but her sense of balance is not awesome. Of course, she's had a stroke, so that plays a role. I'm rambling. We'll see what happens.

[KF_in_Georgia]

Yeah, a dog in our local group had a severely broken leg and was facing an amputation. I sent the mom over here to read up. She was grateful--said it made her aware of a lot of things she hadn't considered.

 

Her boy seemed to do well--back on his feet the day after surgery, and the biopsy revealed no sign of cancer. (The break was severe, though; the bone had shattered and the surgeon judged it unrepairable.) But her boy kept having bleeding issues--even with amicar on board before the surgery--and they lost him.

[krissn333]

This is kind of weird but I'm actually excited for Pinky's chemo on Thursday. I think it's because I'm just anxious to get the ball rolling. I hope that she tolerates it well. Of all of my dogs, she is the one that ALWAYS eats. I think in the 5 years I have had her, she has only skipped one or two meals-and those were in the same time period. She had hookworms. So, I am interested to see how her appetite fares in the wake of her chemo treatments. I hope that we are as lucky as we were with her surgery and recovery.

[krissn333]

Dr. Thomsen just called - Pinky's bloodwork from a week ago showed that her white count is a tad low - 2700? And the neutrophils were just around 2000. He hopes that the CBC we do tomorrow morning will show improvement or we might have to put off her first treatment

[BauersMom]

Dr. Thomsen just called - Pinky's bloodwork from a week ago showed that her white count is a tad low - 2700? And the neutrophils were just around 2000. He hopes that the CBC we do tomorrow morning will show improvement or we might have to put off her first treatment

 

Oh no - that would stink to have to delay chemo before she even starts!

[BauersMom]

We had our first winter-related tumble. We had rain yesterday but the temperature dropped overnight - I really didn't think the porch was that icy, but it was and Berkeley came flying back onto the porch and fell, and then slid into the patio furniture. :(

 

No cuts or anything, but I'm sure he'll be sore after that.

[tbhounds]

Dr. Thomsen just called - Pinky's bloodwork from a week ago showed that her white count is a tad low - 2700? And the neutrophils were just around 2000. He hopes that the CBC we do tomorrow morning will show improvement or we might have to put off her first treatment

That may be completely normal for your hound. A WBC in a gh can run as low as 1800. Maybe send the blood work to OSU to see what they think??

Do you have baseline bloodwork you can compare too??

[vjgrey]

Gabe had his second chemo session yesterday, and so far (knock on wood) he's had no side effects. My chunky monkey IS on a semi-diet, though, because he's gained four pounds. Must be all the whipped cream we're giving him to get the pills down.

[krissn333]

Pinky is up to 52 lbs again

[LisaB]

Yeah! Good to be starting at "normal" --hope all goes well! Looks like the temperature has crept above freezing, so that the precipitation we get tonight is minimal, and the sun shines as forecasted for the next few in case she's feelin' yucky.

[Guest mattbta]

I wish you all nothing but the best in your journey.

[Charlies_Dad]

Sorry to read about Berk's wipeout....it does happen. Charlie did this last night on a small open area of wood floor and unfortunately he kind of panics. This time he went down hard and DW had to hold when he got back up as his remaining back leg wouldn't hold him. We gave him a good massage and put him to bed and all was fine even though he did give me a heartattack! I hope Berk is not too bruised up.

 

Kristin, you'll be fighting the WBC battle all through chemo. Charlie was up and down but never too low that he could not have his chemo. I hope all continues to go well and it's great Pinky is gained weight.

 

Way to go Gabe! Sounds like he is doing fine on the chemo. Gained four pounds??? Yikes! We can't get a pound on our Jack who is too skinny (68lbs) but then again we give him raw meat with his pills, not whipped cream!

 

Matt, again very sorry about your pup. Osteo is a horrid disease that sometimes you never realize your pup has until it's too late.