Training To 'stop' In Mid Walk

[Guest Parsniptoast]

Hello all

I've had Reggie for a year. I want to start to train him to stop when in mid-walk either towards me or moving away but I can't seem to get into the right position to do this. There is only me, I have no helper to assist me when I am training. Can someone give me some suggestions for the best way to do this?

 

I tried it today by calling him using different hand signals and saying stop but he did what he always does and sat in front of me for his treat

 

My plan is to get to the point where he will stop and wait on command and not be egged on to run and chase other dogs (he does this occasionally and it seems to depend totally on the personality of the dog who incites him to chase).

If there are other ways I can achieve the same goal please do pass on some information - I'm open to any suggestions.

Oh, and I appreciate that this is going to be no mean feat - Reg got his second bite from a collie yesterday. I can't decide whether being muzzled is good or bad but he always seems to be the raw end of it all. I'm hoping that teaching him manners by stop and wait when at a distance from me will help to minimise these incidents.

 

Thank you!

Edited August 14, 2010 by Parsniptoast

[Guest Mom2Shiloh]

It sounds like you're taking him to a dog park? otherwise why would he be in a situation to get bitten?

 

First of all NEVER muzzle your dog unless Every dog present is muzzled. It takes away their only defense and makes them more insecure.

 

Secondly, these interactions are a combination of how two dogs are interacting -- not just how your dog behaves. Your dog could behave perfectly and still get bitten-- even a well trained dog is not necessarily going to be able to focus on you and your commands in a highly charged atmosphere such as a dog park. I can't imagine why it would be worth it to continue to expose him to the stress and the injuries.... some good long walks or greyhound only playgroups, where they all are supervised And muzzled, seems like it might be both safer and healthier. I imagine you've been doing it because you think that it is somehow good for him-- it doesn't sound like it's very good for him.

 

Even if you had someone to help you with the kind of training you're trying to describe -- I don't think it would work the way you envision it. Some breeds of dog can be trained for reliable recall in all but the most intense situations --- but what you seem to be asking for is possibly beyond your dogs ability in a multi-dog environment.

Edited August 14, 2010 by Mom2Shiloh

[Guest Parsniptoast]

It's such a shame that you didn't ask more questions to determine more information before making your comments. I simply posted for some advice about training and didn't expect to have judgement passed.

Never mind, I'll seek information elsewhere and hope that someone with a bit more confidence in their dogs' ability to respond to commands will be able to help.

Thank you.

[Guest sheila]

It's such a shame that you didn't ask more questions to determine more information before making your comments. I simply posted for some advice about training and didn't expect to have judgement passed.

Never mind, I'll seek information elsewhere and hope that someone with a bit more confidence in their dogs' ability to respond to commands will be able to help.

Thank you.

 

Well don't pack up your toys and go home in a huff just because you didn't like one person on the playground!

 

If I understand what you are trying to do correctly, I would start by training a STAY command. Get your dog into a Sit or Down. Then begin to move away using whatever command you want to use such as Stop/Stay/Wait and use the hand signals if you wish. When you begin to move away and the dog gets up to follow you, just say 'EH!' and move him back to the original position and start over until he remains in place. Start with moving distances of 10 ft away and then walking back, giving him a treat and do the exercise over. If the dog gets up to greet you as you are walking back, that's the same as following and you start over. .

[Hubcitypam]

If the collie has bitten him twice I'd focus more on avoiding the collie and/or reporting it to animal control than trying to train "stop" into a dog that keeps being on the wrong end of bitten. If Reg is getting bitten it's the collie that needs to learn stop, not him.

 

Guess I can't get a picture of exactly what is happening but it seems like if the dogs are off leash and the collie keeps biting him all you'd be teaching him is to stand and wait to get chomped on.

[Guest LindsaySF]

If the collie has bitten him twice I'd focus more on avoiding the collie and/or reporting it to animal control than trying to train "stop" into a dog that keeps being on the wrong end of bitten. If Reg is getting bitten it's the collie that needs to learn stop, not him.

 

Guess I can't get a picture of exactly what is happening but it seems like if the dogs are off leash and the collie keeps biting him all you'd be teaching him is to stand and wait to get chomped on.

That's what I got out of it too. I don't really see the correlation between a wait command and another dog biting him? Maybe if we had some more information to go on we could be more helpful.

[Guest mcsheltie]

You want him to stop, wherever he is, when you give that command. So if you see him headed for trouble you have a chance to intervene...right?

 

If so, clicker training would be the way to go. Research it. You first charge the clicker, so the dog knows that a click equals a treat. Then you can start having fun with your training!

 

With your dog on lead right next to you start in an area with no distractions (your living room) say stop ONCE and then you stop. Give the dog no leash corrections or any other cue. The minute the dog stops moving all four feet, click and treat. Keep the leash loose, do not use it as a cue for him to stop. Don't worry if he walks around for a bit. You just stop and wait. You want him to figure out what he should do. You want him to become a thinking dog! Do that until you have 80% reliability with him right next to you. Then let the leash out farther. Continue doing this on a six foot lead until he stops no matter where you are. Increase distractions, then when he is reliable increase distance. Use a long line when you get to the end of the leash.

[GeorgeofNE]

Well, I'll just answer your question:

 

Don't use "stop" as your command. Stop is something you probably say more often than you realize. Try "halt."

 

You need to work this, first of all, without distraction and ON LEASH. Never give a command you cannot enforce; you cannot enforce "halt" unless the dog is leashed.

 

I would start training this from the "heel" position. Walk the dog at heel, and every 25 yards or so say "halt" and top walking simultaneously. Repeat, repeat, repeat.

 

Then once you think she's got the meaning of "halt," walk her some more, but let her go out in front of you to sniff or whatever. Have your leash reeled in to the point that it is NEARLY taught. Use the command "halt," and stop dead in your tracks. If she doesn't, then she hits the end of the leash, and is compelled to stop. Repeat, repeat, repeat.

 

This is one of those things that takes a lot of work, and frankly, I don't see sighthound at a public place, off lead, being very reliable with this--but that's how I taught my last dog.

 

Training is best done in short sessions, say 15 minutes. I did them morning and evening. For a looooooooooooong time! I also used a whistle once he knew the verbal commands, as well as hand signals. Mind you, this was NOT a greyhound.

[cleptogrey]

when i use the stay command during a recall, which we have done in obedience classes it was after many, many different variation of stay and the dog really knows what it means.

 

to start teaching a good stay one needs to go through many many baby steps and perfect ALL of them. you can start teaching stay on lead first. try the standard sit,stand or down stay and walk around your dog, then leave them and return. try as many variations of stay as possible. one instructor had us doing jumping jacks and bouncing balls, throwing toys, bait(food) ect. just reinforcing the stay.

 

can your dog do a 3 minute down stay? that's a start, also a 15 min to 30 min down stay? it isn't that hard, the long stays are easier, do it while you are watching t.v. or reading a book. but do time them and wake them up at the end of the 30 minutes and remember the reward. that really reinforces what you want. also if they break a stay, start all over again. once the stay is really mastered then you can consider trying to add it in to a recall. the 30 minute down stays need to be practiced at least 3xs a week to penetrate.the is a major difference in their stays after the exercises mentioned above are practiced.

 

i had difficulty adding stay to the recall since felix comes back to me at full speed (he loves recalls tooo much and loves me as much- every recall is ,"oh, i haven't seen you in such a long time!"and i literally have to run into him so i don't get knocked down. but i did add the stop/stay in. i do a really quite "felix come" and a shhhhh....sound/ sloooowwww..... and he will walk back to me. then i throw in the stay...not stop. but this was after quite a few rounds of organized obedience training.

 

you also have to have your recall polished as well as the stay command.

 

in a situation where dogs are interacting it's a different story. animal instinct comes into play. there are many different opinions out there. i personally am very careful about letting ANY dog interact w/ another unknown dog. i have witness too many dogs who became totally spooked after negative interactions at dog parks.

 

i hope some of my instructions help.

[Guest Parsniptoast]

You want him to stop, wherever he is, when you give that command. So if you see him headed for trouble you have a chance to intervene...right?

 

Right! Thanks for this. I admit to only having tried clicker training once or twice and we never really continued with it. I'm not sure why except that Reg is very treat orientated and I never seemed to get the same response from him. Thanks for this suggestion though, I think this would be worth trying.

[Guest Parsniptoast]

Don't use "stop" as your command. Stop is something you probably say more often than you realize. Try "halt."

 

You need to work this, first of all, without distraction and ON LEASH. Never give a command you cannot enforce; you cannot enforce "halt" unless the dog is leashed.

 

I would start training this from the "heel" position. Walk the dog at heel, and every 25 yards or so say "halt" and top walking simultaneously. Repeat, repeat, repeat.

 

Then once you think she's got the meaning of "halt," walk her some more, but let her go out in front of you to sniff or whatever. Have your leash reeled in to the point that it is NEARLY taught. Use the command "halt," and stop dead in your tracks. If she doesn't, then she hits the end of the leash, and is compelled to stop. Repeat, repeat, repeat.

 

raining is best done in short sessions, say 15 minutes. I did them morning and evening. For a looooooooooooong time! I also used a whistle once he knew the verbal commands, as well as hand signals. Mind you, this was NOT a greyhound.

 

Halt is an interesting word. I'd not considered this. We use 'stop' to wait before crossing the road and to prevent actions at home so it's a word that is used in training. I'm not someone who uses the word in conversation with the dogs ie " stop doing X or Z" and so on. We use it for training. It's my word of choice for this action but one that's linked to the stop in midwalk as you suggested, on leash. It's the transition to off-leash that I struggle with.

[Guest Parsniptoast]

try as many variations of stay as possible. one instructor had us doing jumping jacks and bouncing balls, throwing toys, bait(food) ect. just reinforcing the stay.

 

can your dog do a 3 minute down stay? that's a start, also a 15 min to 30 min down stay? it isn't that hard, the long stays are easier, do it while you are watching t.v. or reading a book. but do time them and wake them up at the end of the 30 minutes and remember the reward. that really reinforces what you want. also if they break a stay, start all over again. once the stay is really mastered then you can consider trying to add it in to a recall. the 30 minute down stays need to be practiced at least 3xs a week to penetrate.the is a major difference in their stays after the exercises mentioned above are practiced.

 

i had difficulty adding stay to the recall since felix comes back to me at full speed (he loves recalls tooo much and loves me as much- every recall is ,"oh, i haven't seen you in such a long time!"and i literally have to run into him so i don't get knocked down. but i did add the stop/stay in. i do a really quite "felix come" and a shhhhh....sound/ sloooowwww..... and he will walk back to me. then i throw in the stay...not stop. but this was after quite a few rounds of organized obedience training.

 

you also have to have your recall polished as well as the stay command.

 

in a situation where dogs are interacting it's a different story. animal instinct comes into play. there are many different opinions out there. i personally am very careful about letting ANY dog interact w/ another unknown dog. i have witness too many dogs who became totally spooked after negative interactions at dog parks.

 

i hope some of my instructions help.

 

This is really excellent advice. We do a two minute stay but I'd *never* considered doing jumping jacks or anything exciting during this time. But on reflection this is *exactly* what we need: stay during exciting things happening elsewhere.

This is so helpful, thank you. I am to do training every day for ten minutes or so. Life often gets in the way however but these prolonged stays with other things going on.. well.. we can certainly fit that in.

 

So very helpful, thank you!!

 

Regarding the interaction with other dogs, I am aiming to get all three of my hounds standing quietly when other dog(s) approach. This is a new thing we've just introduced on our walks and it means that our walk lasts twice as long without any decent 'walking' periods (we're constantly stopping to let others pass) but I believe it is teaching 'respect' for other dogs. I've seen others do it and I'm impressed with the results - we can but try

 

Thanks again, I appreciate your input.

[Guest LindsaySF]

in a situation where dogs are interacting it's a different story. animal instinct comes into play. there are many different opinions out there. i personally am very careful about letting ANY dog interact w/ another unknown dog. i have witness too many dogs who became totally spooked after negative interactions at dog parks.

Agreed.

 

 

Found this thread by the OP: Muzzling And Etiquette. OP is in the UK where off-leashing dogs (including Greyhounds) is more common. Might put this all into perspective.

 

 

Now for my advice. Please please stop muzzling your dogs if they are interacting with other off-lead dogs. It only makes your dogs defenseless. You said it right here: "Reg got his second bite from a collie yesterday. I can't decide whether being muzzled is good or bad but he always seems to be the raw end of it all." Obviously muzzling is not working for you, and Reggie is getting hurt.

 

I realize that the UK is different from the US with the frequent off-leash walks, but if a dog bites another dog isn't the biting dog's owner still responsible? In your case, if the Collie was also off-leash shouldn't the Collie's owner be at fault for the bite? Or was the Collie on-leash?

 

 

I'm hoping that teaching him manners by stop and wait when at a distance from me will help to minimise these incidents.

From just this sentence, it sounds to me like this is an off-lead training issue. I would keep your dogs on-leash until they are reliable in their recall training, and have any stay/wait commands down pat. Once they are reliably waiting/staying on-leash, even in exciting situations (other animals around), then and only then can they be off-leash. I would train each dog separately too, which can get time-consuming if you have three. It sounds like your dog(s) are rushing at other dogs they encounter on walks? They might just be excited, but I can see how some dogs would take offense to this (mine would).

 

 

I would also seriously reconsider letting Meg off-leash around other dogs, just based on this thread: Meg Has Become A Terrorist. Has she been any better since that thread? Muzzled playdates with other Greyhounds will probably be safer and more enjoyable for all, Meg seems to want to engage in a chase game anyway. Some other breeds don't appreciate the chasing that Greyhounds like to do, they would rather wrestle, play bite, chase a ball, etc.

 

Good luck.

 

 

 

 

~Lindsay~

[cleptogrey]

oh, now that i have clearly read that you are trying to get all three of your hounds to stand quietly when other dogs approach,(not just reggie- i thought you had one grey). i now say you are dealing w/ pack mentality and they are reacting towards both other breeds as well as protecting their territory. the pair of salukis i had decades ago did that all the time. my current male will try to protect the female grey when we walk, yet when he is by himself it's a totally different story.

 

practice your stays, long downs and always think twice when you see another dog. read all of the dog's body language- the outsider and your pack's, it will help.

[Guest mcsheltie]

You want him to stop, wherever he is, when you give that command. So if you see him headed for trouble you have a chance to intervene...right?

 

Right! Thanks for this. I admit to only having tried clicker training once or twice and we never really continued with it. I'm not sure why except that Reg is very treat orientated and I never seemed to get the same response from him. Thanks for this suggestion though, I think this would be worth trying.

Clicker training is a blast once you get into it. I had a dog ten years ago that really should have been trained this way. I got some books and decided it was too tedious. WRONG! Now that I am training this way I see all things I could have accomplished with that dog and all the others since then.

 

I handle show dogs professionally. My specialty is difficult, shy and dogs that hate to show. People wonder how I get them to work so well. I retrain them using a clicker and different cue words. They enjoy working for me because clicker training is totally voluntary on their part. A dog that has put thought into a new behavior learns it much better than one who is lured or coerced into position. Creating a thinking dog is so much fun. I have to hide clickers and treats around the house now. Because if I get them out the dogs go nuts, they love to work. Once the dog knows the click/treat routine they start offering behaviors to get the click. You take what they offer you and shape a behavior. All dog training really is, is teaching tricks.

 

One example is I'll sit in my living room watching TV and train sit and down from start to finish in one evening. Nothing is happening so they either sit or lay down. When they do I C/T. I throw the treat so they have to stand up to get it. Nothing else is going on so the next thing they will do is either sit or down again. I just repeat the pattern and once they catch on I add a verbal cue as either their but or chest hits the ground. Voila!

 

You don't have to get perfect responses or even consistent responses in the beginning. Once they figure out the behavior then you can start modifying it. Say if you wanted them to shake, you would C/T any movement of the right paw. Once they figure out what you want, you only C/T the higher paw movements. And you shape shake from that point. For what you want to do I would start using a verbal cue right away. C/T the minute all four paws stop moving. Then expand from there.

 

Just remember dogs are good discriminators, but poor generalizers. What they learn in the living room will have to also be taught in the yard and again with distractions present. They are also very keen to the tone of your voice, the expression on your face, the smallest body movements. So if you are consistent you can use their keen discrimination to your advantage.

[Guest mcsheltie]

I am getting too long winded... but for stop, once you get the basic stop at your side, start adding distance and duration at the same time and mix it up. Avoid a pattern so they keep thinking. For instance stop them two steps from you, C/T right away. Stop them right next to you, wait a minute before you C/T. Stop a foot away, wait two minutes C/T. Stop right next to you, wait four minutes C/T. That will work toward the goal of keeping their attention on you instead of the dog across the road.

 

There is no need to say no or "eh" when they move. And it actually slows the training. Absence of the click tell them they did not offer the right things.

 

Okay... I'll shut up now

[Guest amethyst]

Hello all

I've had Reggie for a year. I want to start to train him to stop when in mid-walk either towards me or moving away but I can't seem to get into the right position to do this. There is only me, I have no helper to assist me when I am training. Can someone give me some suggestions for the best way to do this?

 

I tried it today by calling him using different hand signals and saying stop but he did what he always does and sat in front of me for his treat

 

My plan is to get to the point where he will stop and wait on command and not be egged on to run and chase other dogs (he does this occasionally and it seems to depend totally on the personality of the dog who incites him to chase).

If there are other ways I can achieve the same goal please do pass on some information - I'm open to any suggestions.

Oh, and I appreciate that this is going to be no mean feat - Reg got his second bite from a collie yesterday. I can't decide whether being muzzled is good or bad but he always seems to be the raw end of it all. I'm hoping that teaching him manners by stop and wait when at a distance from me will help to minimise these incidents.

 

Thank you!

[Guest amethyst]

I recommend an obedience class. My dog just received her CGC certification (Canine Good Citizen). There are lots of other dogs in class learning control and good manners plus you can get one on one expert advice.

[rschultz]

we use "heel" and the dog either stands or sits by my side.

[Guest Audeamus]

You could always do a search on Giselle's LAT (look at that) training threads with her dobie Ivy. I think that might be what you're shooting for too.