Counter-Surfing All Of A Sudden

[Guest Fluffy]

I haven't posted here for a long time, because things with Badger have been going very well, but suddenly we've got a new issue. In the two years since Badger has lived with me, he's never been allowed in the kitchen - I block the doorway off with furniture (raised food bowls, end table, heavy vittles vault - my kitchen doorway is oddly-shaped and I've never been able to find a baby gate that fits it) to make that clear to him and it was never a problem. However, in the past two months, it's like some switch flipped in his mind and not only has he been sneaking into the kitchen, he's been helping himself to everything he can grab. In the past four weeks we've been to the emergency vet twice. First, because he ate an entire styrofoam meat tray, plastic wrap and all (no meat, which was cooking in the crockpot), out of the garbage can while we weren't home. We think we had left a gap between the food dish and the vittles vault and he wandered through, enticed by the scent of meat. We got him to vomit that up, had a fun few barfy and farty days while his stomach settled, and proceeded to get a heavier garbage can with a full lid and make sure to block the kitchen off better.

 

Then, last night, we were out of the house for literally three minutes, moving a car in the driveway, and when we came back in we found him on his bed with a wrapper from a package of Trader Joe's 70% dark chocolate - all that was left was shredded wrapper and a few tiny splinters of chocolate . This time, he has to have limboed under the food dish to get into the kitchen, and *quickly*. So, another trip to the e-vet, another few hundred dollars and a puddle of doggie vomit (luckily, we seem to have gotten it out of him quickly enough to keep him from harm - believe me, I know just how bad dark chocolate could have ended), and a resolution to start crating him whenever we leave the house in the near future until we can get this under control. And then this morning, I left the house to go to work, my boyfriend turned his back for about twenty seconds to lock the door and pull the blinds behind me, and when he turned back around, Badger was standing in the kitchen again! He knows he's not supposed to be in there - the once or twice he's forgotten himself and gone in while we were home, as soon as we catch him his tail goes between his legs and he slinks out - but he seems to have decided that the risk is outweighed by the food rewards he can grab.

 

Obviously this is getting worse, but at this point the "crate him when he's alone" solution is almost unworkable - if we had to crate him every time we weren't staring right at him, he'd spend almost his entire life in his crate, and that's no good. I guess I have two questions now:

 

1) Is there any sort of medical problem that could have rendered him, all of a sudden, so starving that he feels he has to desperately hunt for more food? I know a vet is the best person to ask this, but my vet budget is strained this spring due to, you know, styrofoam and dark chocolate (and a checkup plus dental in February - ouch, my wallet!), and I'm hoping you guys can give me some idea whether a medical issue is a possibility before I go and spend more vet budget to find out that no, he's just sort of being a jerk. His weight is normal - in fact, he's two or three pounds more than he ought to weigh (He came to me at 72lb, looking just a smidge skinny. This summer, he was up to above 80 and visibly pudgy due to me over-treating. We cut down on that and he's now down to 76lb, which my vet says is only a tiny bit more than would be perfect for him), and the vet didn't see any physical problems at his checkup last month (which was about a week before the meat tray incident). They did standard stool test, tickborne disease blood test, and urine test at his checkup, all of which came up with no problems indicated.

 

2) I'm aware of the soda-can booby trap idea, but I've never had to try it - could someone just refresh my memory on the ideal way to set this up? Are there other alternatives to help train counter-surfing out of him, given that he usually sneaks in to do it when we're not in the house? We're obviously committing to a kitchen counter overhaul as a baseline, since no barrier will keep him 100% out of the kitchen if he wants in, but the honest truth is that we're lacking in both kitchen space and organizational instinct, and food will probably eventually end up being on the counter sometimes, no matter how hard we try.

[GeorgeofNE]

Well, I'm lucky that I don't have this problem, BUT! I don't keep ANYTHING edible out. Ever. Someone flamed me once for saying to someone maybe they should try that--as if it were a completely unreasonable thing to suggest. I don't think it is--but that would for sure solve the problem!

 

Where to put it? If your cupboards are full, I know someone here on GT had to stash things in their microwave to foil their dog! Sounds like you got a new trash can already to keep him from trash edibles..

 

Regarding gating him out of the kitchen--you could get an x-pen, and instead of folding it into a pen, use it as a wire wall. I had to do that to block George out of one area of my old condo.

[rallyp]

Some dogs really really love food, it's as simple as that. He's learned that the kitchen is where the food lives, so now he's motivated to get in there. Really, the best thing you can do is to teach him that he doesn't get rewarded by going into the kitchen. Essentially, this means that you can't have food out. He has to learn that now, when he goes into the kitchen, he doesn't actually get rewarded with finding food.

 

I have one of those dogs. Believe me, she can get into anything. You mentioned having a vittle vault... , Lima Bean opens them. Her vittle vault used to 'live' in the bathroom, because it was the only room in my old apartment that had a door I could close (luckily, I now have a garage). What I have to do is to ALWAYS PUT ANYTHING EDIBLE (or seemingly edible) AWAY. At one time, this included nothing below the top of the refrigerator and if it was, it had to be behind a closed door with a baby lock.

 

The good thing is that over time, Lima Bean tends to not go scrounging through the kitchen as much because I'm generally good about not leaving stuff out. I actually don't bother baby locking my higher cabinet doors 'cause she doesn't bother trying to get into them anymore. But I think you'll have to accept, to a certain extent, that leaving food out is just way too tempting for normal food-loving dogs.

Edited March 19, 2012 by rallyp

[CherylB]

I agree with GeorgeofNE, remove the temptation if you can. I had a counter surfer, and the things that that worked were 1) getting a trash can he couldn't break into and 2) training ourselves never to leave anything edible (or that had once contained something edible) on the counter. It was a pain at first, but eventually became second nature to us and wasn't so bad. Any time we forgot to put food away, he was all over it, right up until the week before he died . These memories make me smile now, but they weren't so fun at the time.

 

I can't answer your question about a medical condition that could make him hunt for food, no experience there. But, I will say that I've seen my hounds start to test boundaries as they settle in and become more comfortable. Could be yours has taken this long to try raiding the kitchen.

[BootsyCollins]

It can't hurt to check him for worms. That is what started Bootsy on counter surfing, and he's never stopped. Once they get hooked, they are hooked. You'll learn over time to hide things and it will become second nature. Until then, you can try muzzling when you're not home.

 

My brother had a lab that knew how to open the cabinet drawers so he could use them as stairs to get to the counter. He also knew how to open doors, including the refrigerator. My brother's kitchen looked like an insane asylum, with straps around the refrigerator and padlocks on doors.

[Guest Fluffy]

It can't hurt to check him for worms. That is what started Bootsy on counter surfing, and he's never stopped. Once they get hooked, they are hooked. You'll learn over time to hide things and it will become second nature. Until then, you can try muzzling when you're not home.

 

He came up clean for heartworm in February - would other types of worms have been included in that test? If not, what worms should I be checking for?

[BootsyCollins]

A fecal test for hookworms, tapeworms, etc. Heartworm is a blood test - you need a poopie sample

[Guest Fluffy]

A fecal test for hookworms, tapeworms, etc. Heartworm is a blood test - you need a poopie sample

 

Ahhh. They did do a stool test at the same time and said it looked just fine when they analyzed it - I assume they'd have mentioned if there were worms wriggling around in it

[Guest mariah]

Have there been any changes in his appetite? Have you noticed an increase in foraging-type behaviors on walks/around the rest of the house? That to me would indicate a possible medical issue. If he's just suddenly decided that counter-surfing is a lot of fun, I'm guessing he must have gotten a taste for the forbidden fruit while you were out some time and keeps coming back for more.

 

I agree that the only way to prevent it from happening in the future is to make sure he doesn't have any opportunities to do it. Counter-surfing is extremely rewarding to the dog. The more he's able to do it, the more he'll want to do it. I think getting in the habit of putting food away (or x-penning, etc) is the way to go. I don't think a booby-trap would deter a dedicated scavenger for very long, personally.

[Guest Fluffy]

Have there been any changes in his appetite? Have you noticed an increase in foraging-type behaviors on walks/around the rest of the house?

 

Yes, actually he's recently started doing what we refer to as "crumb patrol", snuffling along the floor looking for any sort of dropped material. He'll try to eat nearly anything he finds doing that - dried leaves, pretzel crumbs, dust bunnies, and once he even tried to eat a used tissue that had missed the garbage can.

 

And we *are* definitely going to try the no-food-within-grabbing-range thing - I realize that that's the easy first-line step and hey, my kitchen needs a good cleaning anyway. I'm just hoping to have some backup method that I can also implement, so that if one of us forgets someday, he's less likely to grab the opportunity.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Fluffy

[Guest mariah]

Have there been any changes in his appetite? Have you noticed an increase in foraging-type behaviors on walks/around the rest of the house?

 

Yes, actually he's recently started doing what we refer to as "crumb patrol", snuffling along the floor looking for any sort of dropped material. He'll try to eat nearly anything he finds doing that - dried leaves, pretzel crumbs, dust bunnies, and once he even tried to eat a used tissue that had missed the garbage can.

 

 

Hmm...has he been drinking more water than before?

[BootsyCollins]

Butt worms can be notoriously difficult to diagnose. If he has lost weight and his appetite has increased, you may want to do a round of drontal or panacur just to be certain. But I warn you - once they learn counter surfing, they don't unlearn it. The onus is now on you to make it as unrewarding as possible.

[Guest Fluffy]

Have there been any changes in his appetite? Have you noticed an increase in foraging-type behaviors on walks/around the rest of the house?

 

Yes, actually he's recently started doing what we refer to as "crumb patrol", snuffling along the floor looking for any sort of dropped material. He'll try to eat nearly anything he finds doing that - dried leaves, pretzel crumbs, dust bunnies, and once he even tried to eat a used tissue that had missed the garbage can.

 

 

Hmm...has he been drinking more water than before?

 

For about a week after his styrofoam-and-then-dental weekend (three days apart, two or three weeks ago), we thought he was drinking (and peeing) a lot more than usual, but that seems to have returned to normal recently and we're back to only having to fill his water bowl on his regular schedule.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Fluffy

[greytpups]

Well, I'm lucky that I don't have this problem, BUT! I don't keep ANYTHING edible out. Ever. Someone flamed me once for saying to someone maybe they should try that--as if it were a completely unreasonable thing to suggest. I don't think it is--but that would for sure solve the problem!

 

Where to put it? If your cupboards are full, I know someone here on GT had to stash things in their microwave to foil their dog! Sounds like you got a new trash can already to keep him from trash edibles..

 

Regarding gating him out of the kitchen--you could get an x-pen, and instead of folding it into a pen, use it as a wire wall. I had to do that to block George out of one area of my old condo.

 

 

This was exactly what I was going to say.

[Guest mariah]

Have there been any changes in his appetite? Have you noticed an increase in foraging-type behaviors on walks/around the rest of the house?

 

Yes, actually he's recently started doing what we refer to as "crumb patrol", snuffling along the floor looking for any sort of dropped material. He'll try to eat nearly anything he finds doing that - dried leaves, pretzel crumbs, dust bunnies, and once he even tried to eat a used tissue that had missed the garbage can.

 

 

Hmm...has he been drinking more water than before?

 

For about a week after his styrofoam-and-then-dental weekend (three days apart, two or three weeks ago), we thought he was drinking (and peeing) a lot more than usual, but that seems to have returned to normal recently and we're back to only having to fill his water bowl on his regular schedule.

 

I hope someone who has personal experience with this will chime in, because I do not...but I do know that sudden increased thirst and appetite (to the point that he's trying to eat non-food items) are the two hallmark symptoms of Cushings disease. Diabetes would also cause that, although I think that would have shown up in the urinalysis. Hopefully not the case, but I would lean towards this maybe being a medical issue of some kind. Could also still be worms or some kind of nutritional deficiency.

Edited March 19, 2012 by mariah

[greysandmollie]

I agree with Christie....I would ask for a round of panacur to be safe....intestinal worms definately increase the calling to raid the kitchen!

[Guest Wasserbuffel]

'm aware of the soda-can booby trap idea, but I've never had to try it - could someone just refresh my memory on the ideal way to set this up? Are there other alternatives to help train counter-surfing out of him, given that he usually sneaks in to do it when we're not in the house? We're obviously committing to a kitchen counter overhaul as a baseline, since no barrier will keep him 100% out of the kitchen if he wants in, but the honest truth is that we're lacking in both kitchen space and organizational instinct, and food will probably eventually end up being on the counter sometimes, no matter how hard we try.

 

Put some pennies in an empty soda can. Tie it to something like a stale bagel, large enough that he has to grab it and won't actually be able to bolt it down before you can respond. If needed bait the bagel with something smelly and enticing. Set up the booby traps and leave the kitchen, but don't leave the house (he can't get to come back and eat the bagel). Ideally he'll pull it down and get a good fright from the can.

 

Jayne fell for it exactly twice and hasn't counter surfed since.

[GeorgeofNE]

Have there been any changes in his appetite? Have you noticed an increase in foraging-type behaviors on walks/around the rest of the house?

 

Yes, actually he's recently started doing what we refer to as "crumb patrol", snuffling along the floor looking for any sort of dropped material. He'll try to eat nearly anything he finds doing that - dried leaves, pretzel crumbs, dust bunnies, and once he even tried to eat a used tissue that had missed the garbage can.

 

And we *are* definitely going to try the no-food-within-grabbing-range thing - I realize that that's the easy first-line step and hey, my kitchen needs a good cleaning anyway. I'm just hoping to have some backup method that I can also implement, so that if one of us forgets someday, he's less likely to grab the opportunity.

 

 

No, not "no food withing GRABBING range," because if he can SMELL it, he'll try to get it. Like Rally said. Even on top of the fridge is no good. You really have to put it away! Fridge, freezer, cupboard.

 

 

I don't think your dog has worms. I think your dog discovered there is FOOD in the kitchen! Most dogs will eat anything they can.

[NevadasMom]

I'd think Cushings disease. My Nevada's first signs were ravenous appetite, increased water intake, weight gain & then she suddenly became incontinent while sleeping. Talk to your Vet & start treatment ASAP.

[GreytNut]

The first time he counter surfed was probably just curiosity. Then he got rewarded for his efforts. Now he's a food-seeking missile.

 

To give you an idea of how determined they can be, Tiny was able to steal a loaf of bread from the top of the refrigerator. I have no idea how. I just came in to see him dragging the loaf across the floor toward his bed. The only real fix is to put all food, dishes, wrappers, etc. where they are completely inaccessible. You may have to hide stuff in the microwave, or put child locks on your cabinets (even the upper ones, if you have a real hardhead). And if you have a genius like my first hound Argus, you may find it necessary to bungee-cord the refrigerator door. I now have a fridge with recessed handles which are nearly impossible for a mouth to grasp and pull, as well as a locking trash can.