Summit Chewed A Hole In The Door Frame!

[krissy]

Don't get in a tiff. You asked for advice and all Jen was doing was giving another piece of advice that hadn't been mentioned. Only you know what you can and cannot do. My parents owned an obedience training school and the motto was "If you don't train 'em, don't blame 'em". Pretty much sums up everything and anything people get annoyed with about their dogs. Jen just stated the obvious that the rest of us just didn't think about yet. The dog was alone for a very long time and got bored. She offered a few suggestions. I don't see anything that she posted that was derogatory at all. Good luck with the rest of the externship.

 

I don't think I said that anything she said was derogatory. She of everyone who replied here knows what kind of training Summit and I do, and that he is among the best trained and entertained hounds on this forum. I simply was explaining our situation and how her suggestions are really not possibilities at the present time, in case anyone in light of her comments thinks that I don't or that I simply ignored her ideas.

 

I'm not blaming my dog for chewing a hole out of something. I clearly said it was probably because I had such a long day. All I wanted were suggestions to prevent him from destroying things because I can't afford to replace this whole house. I was going to crate him, but on the suggestion of the majority here I decided to try him with the muzzle and leave the crate as a last resort.

 

And I do actually train him fairly intensively, so I guess according to the motto I could blame him. I suppose that motto was really only intended for poorly behaved AND poorly trained dogs. lol

[Yamaha_gurl]

Dont feel judged, people dont know you until they walk in your shoes, so you do what you need to do.

 

 

+1. Very well said. Krissy is a super hard working woman...she is doing the best she can + another 100%.

 

She never said anything derogatory and she didn't get in a tiff, she's just stating the situation.

 

I'm sorry I'm no good with giving advice for this situation Krissy, just hoping the long days go by fast for Summit and you.

[kamsmom]

This is exactly why the web is difficult sometimes It's tough to express emotion.

 

Sorry to have gotten involved now.

[Guest iconsmum]

Just curious about something. You're on a veterinary internship, right? Where you're surrounded with classrooms about animals? And you're gonna be surrounded with animals the rest of your working life? Well, take him with you, for pete sake! i.e. , "he's mine, we belong to each other...it's not negotiable - It's kind of weird that you have to leave him behind and lonely to learn to do him good, if you get what I mean. Why would anyone freak if you turned up with him ? the difference between us animal people and the rest of the world is - animal people always have some (damn dog attached to their left leg - go for it -celebrate it!!

[NeylasMom]

Dont feel judged, people dont know you until they walk in your shoes, so you do what you need to do.

 

 

+1. Very well said. Krissy is a super hard working woman...she is doing the best she can + another 100%.

 

She never said anything derogatory and she didn't get in a tiff, she's just stating the situation.

For the record, I wasn't judging Krissy - like she said, I know very well the amazing work she does with Summit on a regular basis, and I'm sure Beth knew that too and didn't want me to be misunderstood (thanks Beth ). No one meant any harm, so let's move on.

 

Krissy, I'm sorry you've been sick on top of your ridiculous schedule. In case it's not clear, again, I am not judging you. I'm just stating what seems obvious to me, that he needs more interaction or exercise to deal when you have a really long day like that. If you can't do it, you can't do it, just recognize that the behavior may get worse, or manifest in another way when he can't use his mouth. Or he may be just fine.

 

Here's my suggestion (once you're recovered from your illness) - when you know you're going to have a long day like that, fit in at least one training session of 10-15 minutes before you leave or in between absences. Doesn't matter what you do - practice agility behaviors, teach some new tricks, brush up on your obedience - and see if it makes a difference. 15 minutes seems like a reasonable amount of time out of your day on top of his exercise if it will ease his boredom/anxiety, whatever may be going on, and I strongly suspect that he is missing that mental stimulation and that may be enough to alter his behavior. And maybe also think about making his yard time more interactive if you can - I know you were working really hard on teaching him to retrieve. If you worked a little of that in as well, it would probably help.

 

I may end up being off base here, but there are a lot of similarities b/w what's going on and what I've dealt with with Zuri, which is where I'm coming from.

[JJNg]

You're on a veterinary internship, right? Where you're surrounded with classrooms about animals? And you're gonna be surrounded with animals the rest of your working life? Well, take him with you, for pete sake!

I did an externship at a clinic where the vet and staff brought their own dogs to work with them daily, but in general, this is not the norm for the majority of vet practices, especially busy, fast-paced hospitals. The clinic where everyone brought their dogs was a small, low-volume practice where the vet was essentially practicing as a hobby. They often only saw 3-4 appointments a day, and it was rather chaotic with 5+ dogs milling around the back treatment area all the time.

 

At my current practice, my staff and I occasionally bring our pets to work, but it's on a limited basis, and usually only on slower days. On busy days, they would be in the kennel all day to keep them from getting in the way, and they're more comfortable at home. Plus, there's always the risk of exposure to disease in the hospital setting, so not always the best solution.

[TheFullHouse]

It's only for a few more weeks so I'd muzzle him, give him a kong or two to keep him entertained and just muddle through until the end. I think he and you will survive just fine.

[krissy]

This computer won't let me multiquote for some reason, so please excuse that most of these quotes are "unnamed".

 

Just curious about something. You're on a veterinary internship, right? Where you're surrounded with classrooms about animals? And you're gonna be surrounded with animals the rest of your working life? Well, take him with you, for pete sake! i.e. , "he's mine, we belong to each other...it's not negotiable - It's kind of weird that you have to leave him behind and lonely to learn to do him good, if you get what I mean. Why would anyone freak if you turned up with him ? the difference between us animal people and the rest of the world is - animal people always have some (damn dog attached to their left leg - go for it -celebrate it!!

 

I did an externship at a clinic where the vet and staff brought their own dogs to work with them daily, but in general, this is not the norm for the majority of vet practices, especially busy, fast-paced hospitals. The clinic where everyone brought their dogs was a small, low-volume practice where the vet was essentially practicing as a hobby. They often only saw 3-4 appointments a day, and it was rather chaotic with 5+ dogs milling around the back treatment area all the time.

 

At my current practice, my staff and I occasionally bring our pets to work, but it's on a limited basis, and usually only on slower days. On busy days, they would be in the kennel all day to keep them from getting in the way, and they're more comfortable at home. Plus, there's always the risk of exposure to disease in the hospital setting, so not always the best solution.

 

At my old clinic our vets often brought their two dogs to work and sometimes staff did as well. But the vet's dog's hung out in their office and the rest of the staff dogs had to be caged or kenneled. I brought Summit to work with me the day after his destruction because I hadn't decided what to do yet. I thought it would be alright for him to hang out in the staff room with a baby gate for one day. I was wrong and was told to move him to a kennel. If this was my old practice I wouldn't mind because there's lots of traffic through the kennel area (not distruptive traffic but people do walk by now and then) and the kennels are all in well-lit, well ventilated areas. The majority of the kennels at this practice (and all of the runs... i.e. anything big enough to hold Summit) are downstairs in the basement. It's cold, it's dark, it's completely isolated because no one goes down there for any reason other than to get an animal. I would not want him down there and wasn't happy about having to put him down there even for the one day. I thought we could deal with the inconvenience of the baby gate for ONE day, nope. I'd rather he be at home where it's warm and he has a soft bed to sleep on, since he'll be isolated and alone either way.

 

In general I don't like the idea of bringing him to work with me anyway because it's a good way to pick up diseases.

 

Interestingly, of all the "vets" (I use quotations because I'm including myself but I'm not graduated yet) I'm the only one who has a dog. And of all the people who work at this clinic only myself and the lady I'm staying with have dogs. Go figure.

 

NeylasMom - I know. I just wanted to clarify why I wasn't already doing those things. Busy as I am, I do try to be a good parent. Up until I got sick we were running through all of his tricks a few times every night before bed. I was so miserable honestly that I could barely get up just to let him out into the backyard. It was bad. I had to go around a few days later to pick up out there because I didn't pick up after him the few days I was sick. But I'm feeling a lot better. I've been training the beagleX as well, and Summit thinks it's great fun to show her up. Maybe I'll teach him a new trick though just to give him something new and different to do. I may work on his retrieving in the backyard. We may have to go back to basics. He just gets so worked up and excited that when you throw something he tends to just go crazy and do zoomies. So maybe I'll take him out on a leash and teach him from square one outside. I wish the weather would improve though as it's been a big issue. It just keeps raining and neither of us likes that. We're princesses. lol

[krissy]

So I just got a call at work from the husband of the couple that I'm staying with (the wife is here at work with me) to let me know that Summit knocked down the babygate and was wandering around the house with his muzzle on. He was just calling to tell me he was taking the muzzle off and that everything was okay. In spite of the fact that last night and this morning he got long walks, we've gone back to training, and I leave him plenty to do. So I guess it's back to the crate. [sigh]

[greytluck]

Why cant he roam free in the persons house your staying with? Have you discussed this option with them? I cant imagine he would get into ti much trouble and he would probably be so much happier.

[krissy]

Why cant he roam free in the persons house your staying with? Have you discussed this option with them? I cant imagine he would get into ti much trouble and he would probably be so much happier.

 

He's not allowed free roam at our home because we're not there yet with him. I don't feel comfortable asking for him to be free roam in their house when he isn't even at our house yet. I was happy enough that they didn't expect him to be crated. And also, like I said, this is a fairly high traffic house with children in and out quite often. I don't want them to feel responsible if Summit gets out and something bad happens. I'd rather be safe and have him not be as happy than be dead on the road. I would worry far too much about a potential escape to make that at all possible.

[krissy]

So now get this. Yesterday afternoon I went to the pet store. I bought some wet dog food to use in his Kongs because I've been using peanut butter every day. He loves peanut butter but usually at home I rotate through a couple of things to keep it interesting. I also bought him some "marrow bone" cookies to spice up his training treat options, and I bought this thing called a "Tug a Jug" which I had looked for in Guelph but couldn't find. It's a bottle with a rope through the opening. You unscrew the bottom, fill it with treats and kibble, screw the lid back on, and then the dog has to get the food out through the opening of the bottle (which is partly blocked up by the rope). I figured that's some new entertainment for him, even with his muzzle on. I tightened the baby gate so there was NO WAY he was knocking it down.

 

I was gone for three hours. You'll never believe this. Sam (husband of the couple I'm staying with) tells me he came home and found Summit wandering around the house. Baby gate is still up, door to the basement is shut. Muzzle still on. So he jumped the baby gate and opened the door at the top of the stairs. The door is usually open if the puppy is in her crate, but Sam forgot to open it when he went out today. And people say greyhounds are dumb dogs. Although, to be fair... he figured out how to get out of a babygated room and how to open a door, but he can't figure out how to get his muzzle off. Anyway, bf is coming in a few hours and will bring the crate. I'm starting to think maybe he'll figure a way out of that too... but I doubt it. We'll see if he still feels so smart now that he's back to being in a crate when he could have happily stayed in a comfy bedroom.

 

[sigh]

 

I found a playground near by that I can use to keep his agility skills sharp though which is nice. And a place to go hiking which we did yesterday.

[robinw]

Even when muzzled, if he wants something badly enough, he can still get at it. Treasure ate three pounds of onions and an avocado while muzzled. Muzzle never came off.

[Guest carmasims]

wasn't summit freaked out in an xpen/crate over the holidays while visiting family...? i've heard some pretty scary things about dogs getting injured breaking out of crates because of SA...

 

is it possible to buy a second baby gate and put it on top of the baby gate that is already there? we do this at my mother in law's house while visiting to keep our very high prey dogs away from her kitty.... looks funny, and it's not really ideal, but it worked for us!

[krissy]

I honestly don't even think it's SA. I mean he'd probably rather I stay home, but he's not over the moon when I come home. He's happy but not exactly ecstatic. I think he just is making a fuss about being gated. Problem is I can't explain to him that he can't have the whole house because it isn't ours and it could be a potential dangerous situation for him. He's never had a problem with his crate, we just graduated him from it. He escaped an x-pen over the holidays because he wanted to get up on the bed. The door to the room was closed and he never cared. Just wanted to sleep in bed. I wouldn't put him in an x-pen now though because he knows how to get out of it.

 

A second baby gate is a possibility. A PITA, but a possibility. BF is bringing up the crate today anyway though so we'll just use that. If he decides to smarten up and behave then we'll try some other option later. And we will reinforce alone training this weekend even though I think it's not really an SA issue, just in case.

[Guest carmasims]

i would think that part of what's motivating him to 'escape' your room is that he knows there are other people and another dog in the house and he just wants to be with them rather than be alone... if i gated our dogs in the basement but someone was upstairs walking around, my dogs would probably do whatever they could to get to them.

 

he's also in a strange place and is alone a lot more there than at home while you're at school... nothing to be done about it, but you should try to not get too frustrated with him- he's not doing anything to be a brat, it sounds like he's just lonely and wants to be with whomever he hears walking around upstairs.

Edited May 28, 2011 by carmasims

[Batmom]

i would think that part of what's motivating him to 'escape' your room is that he knows there are other people and another dog in the house and he just wants to be with them rather than be alone... if i gated our dogs in the basement but someone was upstairs walking around, my dogs would probably do whatever they could to get to them.

 

he's also in a strange place and is alone a lot more there than at home while you're at school... nothing to be done about it, but you should try to not get too frustrated with him- he's not doing anything to be a brat, it sounds like he's just lonely and wants to be with whomever he hears walking around upstairs.

 

Exactly so. That's a miserably difficult position for a dog to be in. Any chance of daycare for him?

[JAJ2010]

What about a long puppy sitting situation for the next few weeks? I'm assuming your no where near Wilmington de?

[krissy]

I wouldn't say he's alone longer than when I'm at school. Except Tuesdays when I have to go back to work. I typically work 9-10 hours, and school is usually 9 hours. We do actually have people who live upstairs at home too, so he hears them moving about, but they have no interaction with him. I think the difference too is that at home he only wants to be in that one room. He doesn't like the floors throughout the rest of the apartment, but here there's carpet almost everywhere. I know he is probably lonely to some degree, but the last time he escaped his room there was actually no one home. I don't think the other dog was even home. Sam came home and found him on the couch.

 

I don't get paid this summer and I live entirely off a line of credit, so daycare is not an option. Besides that he has dog issues and I wouldn't feel comfortable having him around other dogs that I don't know.

 

BF brought his crate up so he'll just have to go in that from now on. I feel bad but he's sort of done it to himself. I've tried all the other feasible options that are open to me at this point. He's been getting plenty of exercise the last few days, bought him new toys that require brain power, training him again in the evenings... tried the muzzle and gate. So I don't know. He's not happy about this crate thing. I could send him home with my boyfriend but the reason Summit came with me in the first place is because BF is already looking after the 3 rabbits while I'm gone. I normally look after everyone, and I can guarantee with 4 animals they're all going to get neglected and have things forgotten. But if he starts to really cause trouble he'll just have to go home and fend for himself with dad.

[Guest carmasims]

try the double gate thing and muzzled if he's really upset about the crate-- he could really do some damage to himself if he's determined to break free of it while you're not there!!

[Guest RichardUK]

I had a bitch that was absolutely fine with another dog for as long as you like - When I had to take the other dog to the vet - I came home to find she had eaten a large hole in the lath and plaster wall! I adopted another bitch so she was never alone again at home - she never did any further damage.

 

Took her to the kennels and left her in a paddock which had thick welded wire steel framed door - that had withstood the onslaught of 100s of dogs over many years - I was working in the kennels and heard an enormous racket from the dogs - Looked round - there she was quietly sitting behind me - she had ripped the thick welded mesh out of the door to join me - allowing my other two to 'escape' to run around the kennels!! A year later she did the same to another steel door - so was banned from the paddocks - she was fine just following me around didn't even sniff or look the dogs - she would simply sit about a yard away from me. Finally she actually tore the lock off one of the outside kennels when put in it as we had a delivery of new dogs - She had grabbed the door and shook it until the lock had been torn off - and she was such a gentle dog too!

[robinw]

i would think that part of what's motivating him to 'escape' your room is that he knows there are other people and another dog in the house and he just wants to be with them rather than be alone... if i gated our dogs in the basement but someone was upstairs walking around, my dogs would probably do whatever they could to get to them.

 

he's also in a strange place and is alone a lot more there than at home while you're at school... nothing to be done about it, but you should try to not get too frustrated with him- he's not doing anything to be a brat, it sounds like he's just lonely and wants to be with whomever he hears walking around upstairs.

 

Exactly so. That's a miserably difficult position for a dog to be in.

Poor guy is lonely and bored. It has nothing to do with "smartening him up".

[krissy]

i would think that part of what's motivating him to 'escape' your room is that he knows there are other people and another dog in the house and he just wants to be with them rather than be alone... if i gated our dogs in the basement but someone was upstairs walking around, my dogs would probably do whatever they could to get to them.

 

he's also in a strange place and is alone a lot more there than at home while you're at school... nothing to be done about it, but you should try to not get too frustrated with him- he's not doing anything to be a brat, it sounds like he's just lonely and wants to be with whomever he hears walking around upstairs.

 

Exactly so. That's a miserably difficult position for a dog to be in.

Poor guy is lonely and bored. It has nothing to do with "smartening him up".

 

I buy that he's lonely, but I don't buy that he's bored. I leave him with several toys requiring brain power to get food, and he's a chow hound. He's been fine in his crate so far. Haven't left him for a full day, but been working on his alone training a bit leaving him for 15 minutes up to about 2 hours. He's been great compared to the 3 hours I left him yesterday and he broke out of his room. I realize it's a less than ideal situation, but the unfortunate fact is that we're moving around a lot this summer because of school things. He just needs to learn to settle and deal with change. He's done it twice already in his life... retirement and then coming to a second family (us) with really no major issues, so I have faith that he can learn to do it again. In retrospect when being introduced to those new situations he was crated. I think he needs his freedom limited a bit in new situations/strange places. Hopefully in another couple of weeks he'll settle better and we can go back to trying a double gate and muzzle.

 

I'll see if we can do some drop in obedience classes here and there as well. He had a run with a couple of other greys today, though it was too hot for them to make much of the opportunity.