Does Crate Size Really Matter?

[Guest racergirl435]

We got Ike on December 11th in the afternoon. During his first day with us, he had an accident in the dining room. Mind you he was nervous and had drunk a large volume of water. We put him in his crate while we cleaned up the mess and then took him outside again. The following day, he attempted to mark, again in the dining room. We put him in his crate while we cleaned up the mess and took him outside. DH and I discussed how we would handle the work week and thought it best just to put Ike on our schedule because we figured he we get used to it faster that way so on Monday (December 13), we got ready for work and put him in his crate for the day. That was the routine throughout the rest of that week and he did really good with no accidents. Then we were back to the weekend routine. The weekend routine is only different in that they get taken out 1 more time during the day than they do during the week. The following Monday (December 20) we were back to the work week routine until Thursday (Dec. 23rd). My DH got sick on Christmas Eve and was home through Monday, the 27th so Ike was on the weekend routine for 6 days. December 29th, my DH said when he got home he saw Ike had had an accident and that there was so much pee he couldn't believe a dog that size could pee that much. He basically just put the dog bed in a garbage bag. On December 30th, I had been planning to go to the casino after work so DH got home early and Ike's crate not only had pee, but also pooh. Again the dog bed goes straight into the garbage. We just chalked it up to his routine being screwed up and the fact that he hadn't really had enough time to get used to it. Again, Ike had a long weekend routine (New Year's holiday) so we were a bit skeptical about leaving him in his crate all day again. We agreed that I would go home on my lunch hour to check on him and let him out. Monday through Thursday (Jan. 3-6) I did so and he did really well so we decided we leave him Friday and see how he did. He did good. No accident. So again, we thought we would leave him this week and see how he did. Monday he did really good and didn't have any accidents and was quite happy to see me when I got home. But Tuesday and Wednesday I came home to pee in the crate. After his big accident on the 30th, we were out of old dog beds so we have been using an old blanket and dog bed cover during the day. DH asked me this morning if I was going to come home on my lunch hour and I said "Why? That will only confuse him." DH says "Well what if he has another accident?" I said "Well then I guess I'll clean it up again."

 

After all that, my question is this...because DH has brought it up multiple times....does the size of the crate really matter? The crate we have now is really big and could easily fit 2 dogs. He has enough room to where he can have an accident but not spend all day laying in it. To me, that's a benefit in one way because it's easy to wash a blanket. It's a lot harder to wash a dog. lol Would he have a better chance at success if he had less room? What are y'alls opinions on that? I don't want to crate him at all but until he can prove he can hold it all day it'll be the crate for him. If the general consensus is that he would be more successful in a smaller crate, what is the right size?

 

Another side of this is that when he does have accidents in his crate it stresses our lab. I come home to find that she's been laying on the rug in the kitchen so I just wonder if Ike's in his crate whining all day because of the stench.

 

And to top it off, when I got home yesterday and let the dogs out Ike pooped and seemed fine. The usually firmness and amount. He ate his food fine too, drank the usual amount of water. At 8:00PM, when I usually take them out for their evening treat, there were a few deer behind our yard in the back and Ike went running up to the fence to scare them, as usual. After he was done doing that he went #2 and I could actually hear it coming out so I knew it wasn't good. I went over to look at it and it was definitely diarrhea. Not soft stool but a big pile of runny pudding. Ike did not get an evening treat. My DH wasn't home at the time so I left him a note and told him to keep his eye on Ike when he took the dogs out and that if Ike had diarrhea not to give him a treat. He said he only peed but said he didn't give him a treat anyway, just in case. This morning when I took the dogs out, he still had diarrhea but it didn't look as bad as last night. I decided to be on the safe side and not give Ike breakfast. When I took the dogs out prior to leaving for work, he did not pee or pooh and I have a feeling I'll be coming home to another mess. So not only is our new boy not taking to his new schedule very well or quickly, he seems to have caught a bug or something so on a chicken and rice diet he will go.

 

Doggie daycare is in the back of my mind but we don't have one within a 10 mile radius so it would take me a LOT longer to get work if I did that. The other side to that is if we do that once or twice a week, wouldn't that make it even harder for him to get used to his schedule? The same idea with having someone come over to let them out during the day. In my thinking, we shouldn't do anything different until he gets used to this new schedule and is successful at it for a period of time. I don't know. Seymour was really good pretty much from the get-go so this is a bit challenging for us being 2 working people.

 

All this being said, we love him dearly and just want him to be successful and happy so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Jess

[Batmom]

How long is he left during the day?

[Guest racergirl435]

9-10 hours.

[Batmom]

That's a long time. Possible to come home at lunch or have a mid-day dog walker for a couple months?

 

Most dogs *can* learn to wait that long but they need a chance to settle in and get used to your schedule first. I would vote for the mid-day dog walker (or turn-outer if you have a fence) for a month or two. Then, if he's been accident free for that time, you could try gradually pushing back the time that the dog walker comes.

 

I usually don't leave mine for more than @ 6 hours without a chance to potty, but plenty of people do and seldom come home to accidents.

 

Good luck!

[Guest Avisher224]

9-10 hours.

 

We leave our grey Orion for about 9 hours during the work week and he's fine. However, we did have a lot of trouble with accidents when we first got him (both in and outside of the crate) and here's what I found.

 

First, it took at least two months for him to get used to our schedule. Now that he understands that he'll be in the house for the day during the week, he's pretty good at regulating his own water intake but I definitely had to keep an eye on him and sometimes limit his water at first. Also, I make sure to feed him at least an hour before I'm going to leave so he'll have time to digest and do what he needs to do.

 

Second, take a week or so and observe his pottying behavior and schedule. I was finding that Orion was fine most of the time during work days but he'd often have accidents if we went out at night or during the weekend when we were gone for much less time. What I realized is that Orion LOVES to mark (I'm talking 8 to 10 times per walk) and he sometimes does this in the yard as well. SO, if I let him out in the morning for the day and he only does a couple squirts, he'll likely have to go again in a couple hours and if I'm at work, it'll be in the house. I corrected this by giving treats for going in the yard for a couple days, then refusing to give them until he'd walked around the whole yard and I'd observed him really emptying out.

 

Have some patience, he's still learning (which believe me, I know can be frustrating) but he'll catch on and get there.

[Hubcitypam]

If you don't want to crate him at all, Try baby gating him in the kitchen or somewhere if possible.

 

He might be peeing and pooping in crate because it stresses him out. Not sure a smaller crate is going to solve your problem. True, you don't want to put an 8 week old puppy in an XL crate because he can poop in one end and pee in the other, but I have honestly never seen a crate big enough where an adult male grey could effectively get far enough away from his poop/pee for comfort. This is a different ballgame.

 

10 hours is a long time to be crated. Some dogs can hold it that long and some can't. When I worked 10 hour days pre dog door here I had a neighbor let my (uncrated) guys out 1/2 way through my shift. When I worked at dog daycare we never had a grey that enjoyed it. I'd opt for having someone come in as opposed to daycare, but that is just me. It would take less time money.

 

If you are dead set on crating I wouldn'd be obsessed with sticking to a "forever" routine right now -- go home at lunch or have a turnout person -- establish that interem routine. Later when if he calms down you can eliminate that step.

 

 

[Guest racergirl435]

We've thought about asking one of the neighbors to go over and let them out but none of them are greyhound savvy. Unfortunately none of my greyhound friends really live close enough for it to not be an inconvenience. I know if I took the time to help the neighbors understand about greyhounds it would be fine. Our neighbors to the right of us absolutely love the dogs and I think the Mom is home during the day. I would be more inclined to trust our neighbors across the street as we've known them longer. That is definitely a consideration. I will talk to the neighbors across the street this weekend.

 

As far as going home at lunch...I did it 4 days last week so it is doable. However it is extremely inconvenient as I work downtown and park in a parking garage. When the weather is nice, it's not a problem. When it's bad...it takes too long to get in and out and it becomes very stressful. I don't know about you, but in Buffalo the weather's not so nice in the winter months.

 

Thank you for that perspective though. I hadn't thought of it that way. Because Seymour was so successful when he came to us, I'd never really thought of it that way. There were times in the winter when we had Seymour that we'd get stuck in the weather and wouldn't get home until an hour or so after he was used to going out and he was always fine. But Ike is not like Seymour at all so we have to change our way of thinking.

 

The only fear I have with having one of the neighbors come over is that he'll be too cautious or nervous to do his business in front of them. He's kinda funny that way. When we got him, he wouldn't go if you were standing there watching. Now he doesn't care but he still takes a LONG time to do his business.

[Guest Jubilee251]

I also think 9-10 hours is a LONG time to not have a potty break. A lot of dogs can't hold it that long, and even if they can on some days, might not be able to everyday. I would seriously look into getting a dog walker. My husband and I both work from 8:30 - 5:30, and while Molly has held it up to 12 hours before, we hired a dogwalker to take both dogs out just for our own sanity, cleanliness, and peace of mind.

[Hubcitypam]

Are we just talking turn out in the yard or leash walking?

[Guest racergirl435]

9-10 hours.

 

We leave our grey Orion for about 9 hours during the work week and he's fine. However, we did have a lot of trouble with accidents when we first got him (both in and outside of the crate) and here's what I found.

 

First, it took at least two months for him to get used to our schedule. Now that he understands that he'll be in the house for the day during the week, he's pretty good at regulating his own water intake but I definitely had to keep an eye on him and sometimes limit his water at first. Also, I make sure to feed him at least an hour before I'm going to leave so he'll have time to digest and do what he needs to do.

 

Second, take a week or so and observe his pottying behavior and schedule. I was finding that Orion was fine most of the time during work days but he'd often have accidents if we went out at night or during the weekend when we were gone for much less time. What I realized is that Orion LOVES to mark (I'm talking 8 to 10 times per walk) and he sometimes does this in the yard as well. SO, if I let him out in the morning for the day and he only does a couple squirts, he'll likely have to go again in a couple hours and if I'm at work, it'll be in the house. I corrected this by giving treats for going in the yard for a couple days, then refusing to give them until he'd walked around the whole yard and I'd observed him really emptying out.

 

Have some patience, he's still learning (which believe me, I know can be frustrating) but he'll catch on and get there.

 

I get up at 4:45 AM (don't ask - it's a LONG story lol) and the dogs eat shortly after that. I don't leave for work until 8:00 AM so he has plenty of time to digest his breakfast (which is smaller than his dinner) and he generally does not drink a lot of water in the morning.

 

I have been observing his pottying behavior and routine since we got him. He is not a marker (except for the one time in the dining room). I'm sure that will change once I can start walking the dogs again. During the week when we go out in the morning Ike goes #2. They get their breakfast. We go out before I leave for work and he usually at least pees. Sometimes he poops again. If I go home at lunch he will just pee (and not a lot). When I get home from work (and he's been good) he will poop first, then will pee a lot. When I get home from work (and he's had an accident) he will poop but not pee. When they go out for their evening treat, he will usually pee a little. The same before bed time. So I would say that his pottying is pretty on par with what he gets fed/watered during the day.

 

I'm not frustrated and we do realize that he's still learning. We just want him to be successful. We know he'll get it eventually. We just want to help him along.

[Guest racergirl435]

If you don't want to crate him at all, Try baby gating him in the kitchen or somewhere if possible.

 

He might be peeing and pooping in crate because it stresses him out. Not sure a smaller crate is going to solve your problem. True, you don't want to put an 8 week old puppy in an XL crate because he can poop in one end and pee in the other, but I have honestly never seen a crate big enough where an adult male grey could effectively get far enough away from his poop/pee for comfort. This is a different ballgame.

 

10 hours is a long time to be crated. Some dogs can hold it that long and some can't. When I worked 10 hour days pre dog door here I had a neighbor let my (uncrated) guys out 1/2 way through my shift. When I worked at dog daycare we never had a grey that enjoyed it. I'd opt for having someone come in as opposed to daycare, but that is just me. It would take less time money.

 

If you are dead set on crating I wouldn'd be obsessed with sticking to a "forever" routine right now -- go home at lunch or have a turnout person -- establish that interem routine. Later when if he calms down you can eliminate that step.

 

Putting him in the kitchen might be an option. I don't think he's stressed out by the crate because he does not whine or cry when he's in it unless he knows we've just gotten home. Then he howls bloody murder. lol I should take a picture of him in the crate. Trust me, it's big enough for him to get away from the pee and/or poop. He's not a big boy and can curl up pretty small.

 

Are we just talking turn out in the yard or leash walking?

 

I'm talking turn out. Our streets/area are in no condition for leash walking right now and likely won't be for a couple of months.

[Hubcitypam]

Honestly, the person that opens the door to let your dog out in the yard doesn't have to be grey savvy. Maybe dog savvy if he and your lab sometimes have issues in the yard, but otherwise a responsible warm body you can trust not to let then out the front door would probably do. It is a well kept secret greys are really dogs.

 

As far as pottying in front of others -- could turnout person let dogs out and watch from window? Or go outside and be informed to pretend not to notice?

 

 

[Guest Greyt_dog_lover]

From what my wife tells me, "size doesn't matter". For some reason I don't believe her. =}

 

sorry, had to be said with a title like that.

Edited January 13, 2011 by Greyt_dog_lover

[Guest racergirl435]

Honestly, the person that opens the door to let your dog out in the yard doesn't have to be grey savvy. Maybe dog savvy if he and your lab sometimes have issues in the yard, but otherwise a responsible warm body you can trust not to let then out the front door would probably do. It is a well kept secret greys are really dogs.

 

As far as pottying in front of others -- could turnout person let dogs out and watch from window? Or go outside and be informed to pretend not to notice?

 

Our yard is fenced but not directly connected to the house so Ike goes on lead from the house to the yard. It's only about 5' but you can't be too careful. I am going to talk to DH tonight and see how he feels about putting him in the kitchen if we cannot get someone to let him out during the day. Though I really don't think his crate is stressing him out.

 

Have any of you had any experience with a hound who "gets" diarrhea when he/she is really excited. One of my girlfriends mentioned that so I thought I'd ask. I've not heard of or experienced that before but then again, every dog is different. Premature ejaculation of the butt. lol

[Guest Gemma]

I have to agree with those who think 9-10 hours is just too long for him. Our boy has a cast iron bladder and CAN hold it for 10 hours when he feels like it but we try never to leave him for longer than 7, especially as he gets older. Our fosters go out more frequently because it is a big adjustment for them. I totally understand why it is hard for you to come at lunch and let them out; it would be impossible for us due to traffic/public transport. Any chance a local dog walking service might offer just a let out service? These tend to be pretty affordable, IMO, and I have used this a lot for some of my fosters.

[Guest racergirl435]

From what my wife tells me, "size doesn't matter". For some reason I don't believe her. =}

 

sorry, had to be said with a title like that.

 

:sigh:

[Guest IrskasMom]

Leash Walking or Backyard is a whole different Ballgame. When I go to the Park ,he makes a hundred Pee's, in the Backyard only one. So we go to the Park twice a Day. Morty had only once an Accident in the House and I was to blame.

[Guest racergirl435]

I have to agree with those who think 9-10 hours is just too long for him. Our boy has a cast iron bladder and CAN hold it for 10 hours when he feels like it but we try never to leave him for longer than 7, especially as he gets older. Our fosters go out more frequently because it is a big adjustment for them. I totally understand why it is hard for you to come at lunch and let them out; it would be impossible for us due to traffic/public transport. Any chance a local dog walking service might offer just a let out service? These tend to be pretty affordable, IMO, and I have used this a lot for some of my fosters.

 

Well personally I think my husband should let me quit my job so I can work from home. I agree but unfortunately it's a fact of life in our house. Ike has done it so I know he can do it but he may just be the type of dog that can't do it as a rule. If I can get one of the neighbors to come over and let him out, I will do that. I'm less inclined to use a dog walking service because I just have a hard time trusting people with my pets. That being said, I will have to consider it if something else doesn't work out.

[PrairieProf]

Frankly, I would never expect my dog to hold it that long (or stay in a crate that long without a chance to stretch her legs) -- though I presume she could hold it in an emergency. Fortunately I'm a professor and don't have to be gone that long most days, but on the day I am I have a petsitter come to walk Beth midday (yes, she is crated).

 

And for what it's worth, we leash walk 3-4x a day in all weather -- snow, ice, whatever. The walks may be short if it's subzero, but we still do it. Even if I had a bigger yard we'd still walk at least twice a day. A pair of Yaktrax helps a lot if it's slippery. If the road is plowed, a dog can walk.

[Guest racergirl435]

Frankly, I would never expect my dog to hold it that long (or stay in a crate that long without a chance to stretch her legs) -- though I presume she could hold it in an emergency. Fortunately I'm a professor and don't have to be gone that long most days, but on the day I am I have a petsitter come to walk Beth midday (yes, she is crated).

 

And for what it's worth, we leash walk 3-4x a day in all weather -- snow, ice, whatever. The walks may be short if it's subzero, but we still do it. Even if I had a bigger yard we'd still walk at least twice a day. A pair of Yaktrax helps a lot if it's slippery. If the road is plowed, a dog can walk.

 

Well unfortunately both my husband and I work away from the house so it's just a fact. We've never had a dog that couldn't hold it so this is a new experience for us. Hence, why I'm asking for suggestions. The pet sitter/dog walker is something we will talk about. The crate Ike is in is big enough for 2 dogs so he's got plenty of room to stretch his legs.

 

It's nice that you can walk your dog no matter what. Not everyone can. We live on a VERY busy street and even when the streets are ploughed I would not walk (myself or my dogs) on the street. It's too dangeorous and people are too unattentive when they're driving so I prefer not to take that risk. When I can walk on the sidewalks and in the park the dogs get walked 2 times a day. More on the weekends. That's just the routine in our house. It's been successful for us so far and I'm sure in time it will be for Ike as well.

[Guest Gemma]

I have to agree with those who think 9-10 hours is just too long for him. Our boy has a cast iron bladder and CAN hold it for 10 hours when he feels like it but we try never to leave him for longer than 7, especially as he gets older. Our fosters go out more frequently because it is a big adjustment for them. I totally understand why it is hard for you to come at lunch and let them out; it would be impossible for us due to traffic/public transport. Any chance a local dog walking service might offer just a let out service? These tend to be pretty affordable, IMO, and I have used this a lot for some of my fosters.

 

Well personally I think my husband should let me quit my job so I can work from home. I agree but unfortunately it's a fact of life in our house. Ike has done it so I know he can do it but he may just be the type of dog that can't do it as a rule. If I can get one of the neighbors to come over and let him out, I will do that. I'm less inclined to use a dog walking service because I just have a hard time trusting people with my pets. That being said, I will have to consider it if something else doesn't work out.

 

Yes, working from home would be the ideal situation! *nudges your husband*

 

I totally hear you about not trusting people with your dogs. I did a ton of reading before choosing our dog walkers and had them round for an interview in our home, and so they could meet my boy. I lucked out because they are as awesome in real life as they are on paper. If you are more comfortable with a neighbour, that works too. Hopefully, one of them will be amenable. Good luck!

[greyhead]

We got Ike on December 11th in the afternoon. During his first day with us, he had an accident in the dining room. Mind you he was nervous and had drunk a large volume of water. We put him in his crate while we cleaned up the mess and then took him outside again. The following day, he attempted to mark, again in the dining room. We put him in his crate while we cleaned up the mess and took him outside. DH and I discussed how we would handle the work week and thought it best just to put Ike on our schedule because we figured he we get used to it faster that way so on Monday (December 13), we got ready for work and put him in his crate for the day. That was the routine throughout the rest of that week and he did really good with no accidents. Then we were back to the weekend routine. The weekend routine is only different in that they get taken out 1 more time during the day than they do during the week. The following Monday (December 20) we were back to the work week routine until Thursday (Dec. 23rd). My DH got sick on Christmas Eve and was home through Monday, the 27th so Ike was on the weekend routine for 6 days. December 29th, my DH said when he got home he saw Ike had had an accident and that there was so much pee he couldn't believe a dog that size could pee that much. He basically just put the dog bed in a garbage bag. On December 30th, I had been planning to go to the casino after work so DH got home early and Ike's crate not only had pee, but also pooh. Again the dog bed goes straight into the garbage. We just chalked it up to his routine being screwed up and the fact that he hadn't really had enough time to get used to it. Again, Ike had a long weekend routine (New Year's holiday) so we were a bit skeptical about leaving him in his crate all day again. We agreed that I would go home on my lunch hour to check on him and let him out. Monday through Thursday (Jan. 3-6) I did so and he did really well so we decided we leave him Friday and see how he did. He did good. No accident. So again, we thought we would leave him this week and see how he did. Monday he did really good and didn't have any accidents and was quite happy to see me when I got home. But Tuesday and Wednesday I came home to pee in the crate. After his big accident on the 30th, we were out of old dog beds so we have been using an old blanket and dog bed cover during the day. DH asked me this morning if I was going to come home on my lunch hour and I said "Why? That will only confuse him." DH says "Well what if he has another accident?" I said "Well then I guess I'll clean it up again."

 

After all that, my question is this...because DH has brought it up multiple times....does the size of the crate really matter? The crate we have now is really big and could easily fit 2 dogs. He has enough room to where he can have an accident but not spend all day laying in it. To me, that's a benefit in one way because it's easy to wash a blanket. It's a lot harder to wash a dog. lol Would he have a better chance at success if he had less room? What are y'alls opinions on that? I don't want to crate him at all but until he can prove he can hold it all day it'll be the crate for him. If the general consensus is that he would be more successful in a smaller crate, what is the right size?

 

Another side of this is that when he does have accidents in his crate it stresses our lab. I come home to find that she's been laying on the rug in the kitchen so I just wonder if Ike's in his crate whining all day because of the stench.

 

And to top it off, when I got home yesterday and let the dogs out Ike pooped and seemed fine. The usually firmness and amount. He ate his food fine too, drank the usual amount of water. At 8:00PM, when I usually take them out for their evening treat, there were a few deer behind our yard in the back and Ike went running up to the fence to scare them, as usual. After he was done doing that he went #2 and I could actually hear it coming out so I knew it wasn't good. I went over to look at it and it was definitely diarrhea. Not soft stool but a big pile of runny pudding. Ike did not get an evening treat. My DH wasn't home at the time so I left him a note and told him to keep his eye on Ike when he took the dogs out and that if Ike had diarrhea not to give him a treat. He said he only peed but said he didn't give him a treat anyway, just in case. This morning when I took the dogs out, he still had diarrhea but it didn't look as bad as last night. I decided to be on the safe side and not give Ike breakfast. When I took the dogs out prior to leaving for work, he did not pee or pooh and I have a feeling I'll be coming home to another mess. So not only is our new boy not taking to his new schedule very well or quickly, he seems to have caught a bug or something so on a chicken and rice diet he will go.

 

Doggie daycare is in the back of my mind but we don't have one within a 10 mile radius so it would take me a LOT longer to get work if I did that. The other side to that is if we do that once or twice a week, wouldn't that make it even harder for him to get used to his schedule? The same idea with having someone come over to let them out during the day. In my thinking, we shouldn't do anything different until he gets used to this new schedule and is successful at it for a period of time. I don't know. Seymour was really good pretty much from the get-go so this is a bit challenging for us being 2 working people.

 

All this being said, we love him dearly and just want him to be successful and happy so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Jess

Going back to the original information, between the diarrhea and the "accidents" and the "stench," I'm wondering if your dog got an intestinal bug, and then licking transferred it to the urinary tract. This doesn't sound very much like a behavioral issue to me. And of course if he does have a UTI, he's not going to be able to hold it; in fact, his attempts to hold it will just keep the bugs inside him longer to do their mischief. You sound like a really busy working couple, now with added stress. But a trip to the vet, and possibly a C&S for a UTI, sound like a good idea to me. If it's something like that and you can knock it out, your lives will return to peacefulness!

 

Btw, we've just been going through this with one of our dogs. Turns out he wasn't "incontinent" but had a UTI. It involved E. coli. We gave him two rounds of antibiotic, only to have the problem return two weeks after the antibiotic was stopped. Then we found out about his having one full anal sac, which explained why he was licking his bum more than usual. We figure that's what has been happening, the E. coli are getting spread from the one place to the other by licking. (Oh, and you have my fullest sympathy about all the extra laundry entailed in this problem!)

 

ETA: There shouldn't be "stench" involved in wet bedding for a few hours. Healthy urine, for lack of a better term, shouldn't really smell bad. If there really is stench, that's another good reason to have his urine checked.

Edited January 13, 2011 by greyhead

[Guest sheila]

have you considered extending the fence and putting in a dog door or is there any way to create a fenced turn-out area that the dogs have access to? Having a dog door does have it's drawbacks, but all in all it's been a good thing for us.

[sarabz]

DH and I both work full-time, so typically Bella is on her own approx 10 hours.

 

The first week we had her she was crated, with either DH or I coming home at lunch to take her for a walk (no yard here)

The first full weekend was the only time she peed in our apartment- she was doing her now-normal "gotta pee" moves of stretching several times and pacing around and we just weren't paying enough attention.

 

The second week she was baby-gated in our bedroom, with midday walks

The third week, we were coming home at lunchtime and waking her up, so stopped coming home midday for walks.

 

As of December, she's had the run of the apartment when we're gone. We were having challenges with her getting into mischief in the late afternoon/early evening as it was getting dark - she'd shred books and anything else paper (tissues, tissue paper, etc), empty anything in the trash can, pull slippers from under our bedside tables, do zoomies on our bed, etc. Then a couple of times when I knew I'd be leaving last & getting home first I left the baby gate down, and no problems since. She's much happier being able to snooze on HER sofa during the day.

 

HOWEVER - to tag on to what others have said, I do think you should have Ike checked out by the vet. Make sure there are no medical issues and then look at behavioral. Then go back to lots of praise when pottying outside (I avoid the treats because Bella started asking to go out, peeing a tiny amount and then looking for a treat), immediately correcting and taking out if he starts going in the house (clean up after taking him out, not before), etc.

 

Good luck!!

[Guest racergirl435]

We got Ike on December 11th in the afternoon. During his first day with us, he had an accident in the dining room. Mind you he was nervous and had drunk a large volume of water. We put him in his crate while we cleaned up the mess and then took him outside again. The following day, he attempted to mark, again in the dining room. We put him in his crate while we cleaned up the mess and took him outside. DH and I discussed how we would handle the work week and thought it best just to put Ike on our schedule because we figured he we get used to it faster that way so on Monday (December 13), we got ready for work and put him in his crate for the day. That was the routine throughout the rest of that week and he did really good with no accidents. Then we were back to the weekend routine. The weekend routine is only different in that they get taken out 1 more time during the day than they do during the week. The following Monday (December 20) we were back to the work week routine until Thursday (Dec. 23rd). My DH got sick on Christmas Eve and was home through Monday, the 27th so Ike was on the weekend routine for 6 days. December 29th, my DH said when he got home he saw Ike had had an accident and that there was so much pee he couldn't believe a dog that size could pee that much. He basically just put the dog bed in a garbage bag. On December 30th, I had been planning to go to the casino after work so DH got home early and Ike's crate not only had pee, but also pooh. Again the dog bed goes straight into the garbage. We just chalked it up to his routine being screwed up and the fact that he hadn't really had enough time to get used to it. Again, Ike had a long weekend routine (New Year's holiday) so we were a bit skeptical about leaving him in his crate all day again. We agreed that I would go home on my lunch hour to check on him and let him out. Monday through Thursday (Jan. 3-6) I did so and he did really well so we decided we leave him Friday and see how he did. He did good. No accident. So again, we thought we would leave him this week and see how he did. Monday he did really good and didn't have any accidents and was quite happy to see me when I got home. But Tuesday and Wednesday I came home to pee in the crate. After his big accident on the 30th, we were out of old dog beds so we have been using an old blanket and dog bed cover during the day. DH asked me this morning if I was going to come home on my lunch hour and I said "Why? That will only confuse him." DH says "Well what if he has another accident?" I said "Well then I guess I'll clean it up again."

 

After all that, my question is this...because DH has brought it up multiple times....does the size of the crate really matter? The crate we have now is really big and could easily fit 2 dogs. He has enough room to where he can have an accident but not spend all day laying in it. To me, that's a benefit in one way because it's easy to wash a blanket. It's a lot harder to wash a dog. lol Would he have a better chance at success if he had less room? What are y'alls opinions on that? I don't want to crate him at all but until he can prove he can hold it all day it'll be the crate for him. If the general consensus is that he would be more successful in a smaller crate, what is the right size?

 

Another side of this is that when he does have accidents in his crate it stresses our lab. I come home to find that she's been laying on the rug in the kitchen so I just wonder if Ike's in his crate whining all day because of the stench.

 

And to top it off, when I got home yesterday and let the dogs out Ike pooped and seemed fine. The usually firmness and amount. He ate his food fine too, drank the usual amount of water. At 8:00PM, when I usually take them out for their evening treat, there were a few deer behind our yard in the back and Ike went running up to the fence to scare them, as usual. After he was done doing that he went #2 and I could actually hear it coming out so I knew it wasn't good. I went over to look at it and it was definitely diarrhea. Not soft stool but a big pile of runny pudding. Ike did not get an evening treat. My DH wasn't home at the time so I left him a note and told him to keep his eye on Ike when he took the dogs out and that if Ike had diarrhea not to give him a treat. He said he only peed but said he didn't give him a treat anyway, just in case. This morning when I took the dogs out, he still had diarrhea but it didn't look as bad as last night. I decided to be on the safe side and not give Ike breakfast. When I took the dogs out prior to leaving for work, he did not pee or pooh and I have a feeling I'll be coming home to another mess. So not only is our new boy not taking to his new schedule very well or quickly, he seems to have caught a bug or something so on a chicken and rice diet he will go.

 

Doggie daycare is in the back of my mind but we don't have one within a 10 mile radius so it would take me a LOT longer to get work if I did that. The other side to that is if we do that once or twice a week, wouldn't that make it even harder for him to get used to his schedule? The same idea with having someone come over to let them out during the day. In my thinking, we shouldn't do anything different until he gets used to this new schedule and is successful at it for a period of time. I don't know. Seymour was really good pretty much from the get-go so this is a bit challenging for us being 2 working people.

 

All this being said, we love him dearly and just want him to be successful and happy so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Jess

Going back to the original information, between the diarrhea and the "accidents" and the "stench," I'm wondering if your dog got an intestinal bug, and then licking transferred it to the urinary tract. This doesn't sound very much like a behavioral issue to me. And of course if he does have a UTI, he's not going to be able to hold it; in fact, his attempts to hold it will just keep the bugs inside him longer to do their mischief. You sound like a really busy working couple, now with added stress. But a trip to the vet, and possibly a C&S for a UTI, sound like a good idea to me. If it's something like that and you can knock it out, your lives will return to peacefulness!

 

Btw, we've just been going through this with one of our dogs. Turns out he wasn't "incontinent" but had a UTI. It involved E. coli. We gave him two rounds of antibiotic, only to have the problem return two weeks after the antibiotic was stopped. Then we found out about his having one full anal sac, which explained why he was licking his bum more than usual. We figure that's what has been happening, the E. coli are getting spread from the one place to the other by licking. (Oh, and you have my fullest sympathy about all the extra laundry entailed in this problem!)

 

ETA: There shouldn't be "stench" involved in wet bedding for a few hours. Healthy urine, for lack of a better term, shouldn't really smell bad. If there really is stench, that's another good reason to have his urine checked.

 

You know, my girlfriend here mentioned the possibility of a UTI as well. I've not noticed him licking himself at all, if any, when we're home but who knows what he's doing during the day. Anyway, I suppose that is a possibility. And it would make sense. When I said stench, I meant more to our lab's nose than mine/ours. It doesn't smell bad, per say. It just smells like pee. But I do notice that his urine is pretty much always very golden in color. I will call his vet tomorrow morning and see if I can drop him off on my way home. They're right downtown where I work so that would be easy.