Need Advice On Using Milk Thistle/canine Antler Products

[Guest houndlover]

Casey, my 8 yo male, was recently diagnosed with arthritis in his spine. He has been on glucosamine supplements for over a year and the pain/stiffness has gotten to the point where he was having A LOT of trouble walking. Much to my dismay, the vet suggested Rimadyl. Casey has been on the Rimadyl for a few weeks and I hate to say it but...it really is helping him. Someone had suggested using milk thistle to help support liver functions and then a holistic vet told me to try canine antler products and acupuncture. I am not oppossed to taking a holistic approach (my vet is not a holistic vet) but I am not interested in taking Casey for acupuncture. Does anyone have experience with milk thistle and/or canine antler products? If so, could you please clue me in?!

[TheFullHouse]

Saint gets milk thistle to help him with his seizure meds. It helps support the liver from toxins.

[Guest BoomerMom]

 

 

What is the correct dosage for milk thistle?

[TheFullHouse]

Saint gets 250 mg. twice a day.

[patricia]

Saint gets 250 mg. twice a day.

How much does Saint weigh? Thanks.

[greyhoundgang]

Greyhound Gang has a booklet called When I Am Older.

It details many natural ways you can help your hounds age well and stay healthy.

 

some suggestions that have worked for the hounds coming thru Greyhound Gang.

 

This info and more is on the Greyhound Gang's site, and in the When I Am Older Booklet.

 

1. Joint supplements - Try a different brand. They can help, and your hound is very young, and so they should definitely help. Gang offers Get Up & Go. You need to give 1500 mg a day of Glucosamine, Chondroitin, MSM. Less of Vit C.

CMO can help some hounds too.

2. Adequan shots - it's basically intensive glucosamine given twice weekly for a month, and then once a week. No side effects.

3. Acupuncture. don't know why you aren't interested in it - but it REALLY REALLY helps. I personally do it now that I've seen the good it does for the hounds. List of holistic vets here

 

Rimadyl can help. But it can hurt too. You want to watch poop for blood. You want to get Bloodwork done before he goes on it, and while he is on it - often.

Milk thistle can help support the liver, as you are doing.

 

best of luck. this is so sad as he's so young.

[GeorgeofNE]

Saint gets 250 mg. twice a day.

How much does Saint weigh? Thanks.

 

 

Your new siggy if FABULOUS!!

[sweetdogs]

Here is a site on arthritis: Dogaware.com - arthritis. It lists TONS of things to try for Casey, holistic & non. Info on deer antler is under "Supplements & Natural Therapies". (There is some controversy over how it's harvested, just in case that matters to you.) There's also a section on NSAIDS that's helpful. They can be hard on the stomach so make sure you keep that in mind as well as watching his liver function. Here is an article on milk thistle including dosages.

 

FWIW, I took my boy for acupuncture last year when he had some sort of back problem. The vet used electo-acupuncture & it didn't seem to bother him. He eventually went to sleep each time. I don't know that it specifically helped him but he gradually improved greatly after that. He had been in pain for almost a year up to that point.

 

Good luck with Casey. I'm sure you'll be able to come up with a good treatment plan for him.

 

 

[ozgirl2]

Milk thistle is great stuff! I start taking it if I have to take ibuprofen for extended amounts of time...

[TheFullHouse]

Saint gets 250 mg. twice a day.

How much does Saint weigh? Thanks.

 

 

He bounces between 97 - 100lbs.

[Guest MZH]

Our Cullen took milk thistle twice a day, also for liver support due to his taking phenobarbital. He took the same amount as Saint but he weighed only 75-80.

 

It did awesome things for his liver values. They were cut by almost 50%!

[Guest houndlover]

Greyhound Gang has a booklet called When I Am Older.

It details many natural ways you can help your hounds age well and stay healthy.

 

some suggestions that have worked for the hounds coming thru Greyhound Gang.

 

This info and more is on the Greyhound Gang's site, and in the When I Am Older Booklet.

 

1. Joint supplements - Try a different brand. They can help, and your hound is very young, and so they should definitely help. Gang offers Get Up & Go. You need to give 1500 mg a day of Glucosamine, Chondroitin, MSM. Less of Vit C.

CMO can help some hounds too.

2. Adequan shots - it's basically intensive glucosamine given twice weekly for a month, and then once a week. No side effects.

3. Acupuncture. don't know why you aren't interested in it - but it REALLY REALLY helps. I personally do it now that I've seen the good it does for the hounds. List of holistic vets here

 

Rimadyl can help. But it can hurt too. You want to watch poop for blood. You want to get Bloodwork done before he goes on it, and while he is on it - often.

Milk thistle can help support the liver, as you are doing.

 

best of luck. this is so sad as he's so young.

 

I didn't know about the adequan shots. I will have to look into that further.

 

I am not interested in acupuncuture b/c Casey is a very shy dog and he does not like unfamiliar people touching him. He had some type of accident when he was at the track which injured one of his rear hind legs (may also be contributing to the problems that he has now) and as a result he is very reluctant to let anyone touch his hind end.

 

I realize that Rimadyl can have negative side effects and I really do not want Casey to be on this long term, that is why I thought that I would come here and ask what people knew about different types of treatment.

 

Thank you for the info. I really appreciate it and will look further into other options as this course of treatment is not my first choice.

 

Here is a site on arthritis: Dogaware.com - arthritis. It lists TONS of things to try for Casey, holistic & non. Info on deer antler is under "Supplements & Natural Therapies". (There is some controversy over how it's harvested, just in case that matters to you.) There's also a section on NSAIDS that's helpful. They can be hard on the stomach so make sure you keep that in mind as well as watching his liver function. Here is an article on milk thistle including dosages.

 

FWIW, I took my boy for acupuncture last year when he had some sort of back problem. The vet used electo-acupuncture & it didn't seem to bother him. He eventually went to sleep each time. I don't know that it specifically helped him but he gradually improved greatly after that. He had been in pain for almost a year up to that point.

 

Good luck with Casey. I'm sure you'll be able to come up with a good treatment plan for him.

 

 

Thanks for all of the info. It does matter to me how the deer antler is harvested so I would have to look into that. The products that I saw for the canine antler products all seemed to be something that the dogs would have to chew and Casey is not really a big chewer so I don't know if that would be a good option for him.

[GreyTzu]

I find it sad that you will not consider acupuncture because you have a shy dog. I have taken two spooks to my holistic Vet and both responded positively to the treatment. It's as much the Vet as the handling. Dixie was a spook through and through. I remember when we adopted her, the seasoned greyhound adoption gal made the comment that if she ever gets loose, she will never be caught. Yet, 5 minutes in my Holistic Vet's office and Dixie was settled down and letting Dr. Keller touch and feel her all over.

 

Dylan saw Dr. Keller every 3 weeks during his cancer surgery and chemo. He enjoyed the time we spent in her office and seemed to look forward to her loving and gentle touch. We would stop at her office for a balancing treatment after his chemo. Very often I would have Dancer and sometimes JD with us as they needed treatments also. Dylan's oncologist was 100 miles from home and Dr. Keller was on the way home. She always had the front office set up with dim lights and soothing music for us. Many times she would do the treatment on Dancer, Dylan and JD and just close the door and let us relax. We all napped in that room. I remember one stressful day when I just laid on the floor with Dylan and Dancer and we slept for like an hour. Dr. Keller said she opened the door, saw us all on the floor and quietly closed the door again. She is an awesome Vet and person. It the Vet as much as the treatment that your dog will respond to. I will not hesitate to take our current spook to her if the need arises.

 

We also had a Vet once who was very "enthusiastic" when dealing with my greyhounds. He used "big" movements and had a loud voice. Neither Dylan nor Dixie liked it at all and I quickly found another Vet. After, with our traditional Vet, I would tell techs as we got into the exam room that Dixie or Dylan was a spook and to please ask the Vet to enter the exam room quietly. Both Vets were always more than happy to comply.

 

Any Vet should be happy to modify their behavior to assure maximum comfort levels for each dog. If not, I would find another Vet, as I have done in the past. Some many dogs benefit from both acupuncture and chiropractic treatments.

 

We used milk thistle when Dylan was going through chemo. I do not remember the does.

[ZoomDoggy]

My Chancy was a terribly shy girl who greatly benefited from acupuncture when she had LS flare-ups. She was also on joint-support supplements and milk thistle for her compromised liver values.

[Guest houndlover]

My Chancy was a terribly shy girl who greatly benefited from acupuncture when she had LS flare-ups. She was also on joint-support supplements and milk thistle for her compromised liver values.

 

Maybe I was misled about the acupuncture. I had been told that my dog would probably not do well with acupuncture b/c he is so shy and doesn't like to be touched. Did you find that it took Chancy a while to relax once she got there? What did they do with her so that she wouldn't spook?

Edited April 21, 2008 by houndlover