Moon Rises With The Sun

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Hi again everyone. Moon continues to do great, but I'm at my wit's end with one issue.

 

When I first got Moon, she got up at 6:30. This was disagreeable, but now I WISH I could sleep that long. Now, Moon rises consistently at 5am, with the sunrise. If she sleeps with me, she gets up and paces until I get up. If I crate her, she cries and it's absolutely heartbreaking (I can hear her from the next room even with my door closed, and she cries even if the crate is in my room).

 

I've tried moving her evening walk to a later time, but the goof paces and pants and insists upon being taken out no later than 8:30. So right now our walks are 5:00am-ish, 2:30pm-ish, and 8:30pm-ish. She finds this schedule very agreeable. I don't. I'd LIKE it to be 7:30am-ish, 5:00pm-ish, and 11:00pm-ish. The intervals would be more or less the same, but I'm having a hard time getting her onto this schedule.

 

I don't expect to 'sleep in,' but right now I'm pretty seriously sleep-deprived. Her internal clock may change when sunrise gets later, but I can't wait that long.

 

Any advice, greyhound people?

[Batmom]

3 times isn't many to go out in one day. I'd take her out *again* at 10:30 or 11:00 pm.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

I've been seriously considering that. Will try that tonight and report on the results.

[JohnF]

Yes, the extra late walk should help and give a slice of bread last thing too as there then won't be stomach acid issues so soon in the morning. But what I reckon would really fix it is to hang thick dark curtains in your room to keep out the early morning sun and the sound of the wildlife waking up. Blinds don't cut out the sounds enough.

[Guest KatyC]

Hi,

 

We had this problem for about 3 months. It kept getting earlier and earlier. We tried all sorts of things feeding her later, letting her out last thing later, letting her sleep in various rooms.

 

Eventually what worked is having her gated in the spare room with all her beds and things. Then you just have to ignore them!

We had a week of howling from 3am-5.30, and crying and jumping at the walls. It is very hard to ignore, but you have to because it really does work!

 

After 4 days, she slept until we got up to wake her. And we haven't had any more problems with crying in the night since then.

You just have to teach them that them crying doesn't get you up.

 

Good luck, feel free to ask more questions if needed as I went through this recently.

 

[Feisty49]

Hi again everyone. Moon continues to do great, but I'm at my wit's end with one issue.

 

When I first got Moon, she got up at 6:30. This was disagreeable, but now I WISH I could sleep that long. Now, Moon rises consistently at 5am, with the sunrise. If she sleeps with me, she gets up and paces until I get up. If I crate her, she cries and it's absolutely heartbreaking (I can hear her from the next room even with my door closed, and she cries even if the crate is in my room).

 

I've tried moving her evening walk to a later time, but the goof paces and pants and insists upon being taken out no later than 8:30. So right now our walks are 5:00am-ish, 2:30pm-ish, and 8:30pm-ish. She finds this schedule very agreeable. I don't. I'd LIKE it to be 7:30am-ish, 5:00pm-ish, and 11:00pm-ish. The intervals would be more or less the same, but I'm having a hard time getting her onto this schedule.

 

I don't expect to 'sleep in,' but right now I'm pretty seriously sleep-deprived. Her internal clock may change when sunrise gets later, but I can't wait that long.

 

Any advice, greyhound people?

 

Do you walk her 3 times a day without additional going outside for a P&P? In this weather, my girl is lucky if she gets more than one walk a day. She suffers when it's humid, even if the temp is only 50 degrees. She is taken out several other times a day in the backyard to P&P and just sniff around.

 

My advice about Moon insisting on the times she wants to walk is: She's a dog. You're a human. If you had a child, would you let the child dictate to you the times she ate meals and when she went to bed? If you want to walk later, do it. Perhaps try making each walk a bit later by half an hour every couple of days so it's not a big shock. Your girl will adjust.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Feisty49

[XTRAWLD]

I'm not sure how new she is to you, so she is still getting used to everything as well. They LOVE routine.

 

To gradually change the schedule in the am, agree to take her out at 515, instead of 5. Do this for about 4-5 days, and then agree to take her out at 530. I find that changing the schedule gradually by 15 minutes really did make a difference to Ryder's psyche. Just wait when you have to adjust for DST!!! The other thing is you are also bowing to her command by taking her out when she whines. She may be completely in the right to do so because she might have to go, but your job is to ensure her bladder is as empty as possible before she goes to bed, and with hold water from her for an hour before bed. Don't forget to give her a bedtime cookie so her tummy isn't completely empty in the AM.

 

I know it might be difficult to take her out for breaks in between 7&5 because you are likely working and not home? That happened with us too. So I ensure Ryder would get a nice long walk JUST before I had to leave (it was the very last thing I did before I got in my car to leave) and he'd get a long walk when I got home. He'd get a pee break after dinner like 730ish and 9ish and then in for bed around 10ish. I would drag him out to have a later pee if I had a feeling the next morning might be a little rushed with my schedule. Even an hour helps greatly. He'd also sometime make that decision by drinking. I'd make sure he'd have enough time to have a drink of water with breakfast, but would withhold it an hour before he'd have to be crated, then he hopefully wouldn't be desperate to pee while I wasn't home. Even still, he really had to go at 530 when I got home.

 

It'll get better, but you just have to hang with it. It's worth it. We're here to help you.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Thanks so much everyone. For some reason the quote function isn't working for me at the moment, so I'll just respond to each of you.

 

JohnF: I'm not familiar with the piece of bread business or the morning stomach acid, but I put black curtains up two days ago. No effect the first morning, and last night I had her in her crate, so it was irrelevant. I may try having her in bed with me again tonight and we'll see what the curtains do.

 

KatyC: As I live in an apartment, letting her bark or howl really isn't an option. It would be seriously rude, especially at that time of day. Believe me, I've considered it. I don't know if they can hear her whining upstairs, but I worry. Still, you didn't know that, so thanks.

 

Feisty49: Moving her afternoon walk back hasn't been hard, it's the evening walk that she's dead set on. Your latter point is well taken, but the truth is, I loathe children and have an easy time ignoring their complaints. With my Moon, I'm a sucker! That face! I know, I need to be stronger of will.

 

XTRAWLD: On June 27th, I will have had Moon for two months exactly, so she's still very new. I've been trying hard to push the schedule back with varying degrees of success, but I'm always hesitant because in the very beginning, the first time I tried to put my foot down, she had a little accident. Now I guess you could say I'm gun-shy, afraid that if I don't listen to her, she'll have another accident. Though sometimes I know that she can't have to go--if she pees at 4, no way she needs to go at 8, not when she regularly holds it twice as long. I dunno, it's a tricky business. The truth is, her pacing and panting and refusal to settle down at evening walk time also makes me uncomfortable, and so I have a hard time saying no for more than half an hour.

 

Thanks again everyone. I figured this was a fairly common problem and I seriously appreciate your help. With any luck, I'll eventually be able to provide advice to someone rather than just ask for it! But for now, as a greyhound noob, the help means a lot to me.

[fsugrad]

First, I love the title of your thread!

We had similar problems with Dakota when we first got him. He was pacing all around the house several times a night and waking me up at 5:30 ready to play. We solved the problem thanks to GT'ers advice. We now sleep soundly every night, thank God!

 

read about it here:

 

http://forum.greytalk.com/index.php/topic/295037-partying-at-530-am-how-to-make-it-stop/?hl=dakota

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Fsugrad, thanks, but it's easy when your dog has such a pun-able name! We go for Moonwalks, she sleeps in her Moonbase (crate), etc. I even have a round nametag the front of which is a picture of the Moon. Mine is the only dog I know of whose name could be deduced by an illiterate person.

 

I'm checking out your thread now. Just out of curiosity, does Dakota sleep in bed with you, or in a crate?

[GeorgeofNE]

Most dogs have to go out after a meal. Dogs, when they're new, may need to go out after playing, sleeping for a long time, chewing a bone...

 

Here is my schedule

 

5 AM--quick out for a pee

5:45 AM--2 mile walk

 

Go to work

 

3:45 PM--quick out for a pee

5 PM--stroll about the condo complex

8 PM--last outs

 

George woke up at 4 AM when I got him. I felt lucky I was able to shift him to 5.

[fsugrad]

Fsugrad, thanks, but it's easy when your dog has such a pun-able name! We go for Moonwalks, she sleeps in her Moonbase (crate), etc. I even have a round nametag the front of which is a picture of the Moon. Mine is the only dog I know of whose name could be deduced by an illiterate person.

 

I'm checking out your thread now. Just out of curiosity, does Dakota sleep in bed with you, or in a crate?

Our hounds are not allowed in our beds or on our furniture (yes, I know, we're mean doggy parents ) Nor does Dakota use a crate. He and Toby sleep on their doggy beds in our room, and we have a small piece of plywood which I store behind the door until it's bedtime. Then when all 4 of us are in there. I put the small piece of plywood in front of our open bedroom door, and it's time to sleep! The piece of plywood is so small, it's definitely no more than 2 feet tall. Either of them would easily be able to clear it if they were jumpers--which they're not.

 

Edited to add: Our hounds now sleep all night long, until 6:15 a.m. Not a minute later. 7 days a week. This is the time I need to get up in the mornings on weekdays. On weekends, I just let them out, feed them, and we all go right back to sleep.

Edited June 17, 2013 by fsugrad

[Guest cvdrumsta]

Most dogs have to go out after a meal. Dogs, when they're new, may need to go out after playing, sleeping for a long time, chewing a bone...

 

Here is my schedule

 

5 AM--quick out for a pee

5:45 AM--2 mile walk

 

Go to work

 

3:45 PM--quick out for a pee

5 PM--stroll about the condo complex

8 PM--last outs

 

George woke up at 4 AM when I got him. I felt lucky I was able to shift him to 5.

 

Ha, I can't imagine taking Moon for a two mile walk. She starts lollygagging after ten minutes.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

So for the past two days Moon has risen at five and I've played dead until five thirty. This morning she actually cried, which she normally doesn't do when she's near me in one capacity or another. We'll see how this goes. To be honest, I kind of look forward to sunrise getting later.

[fsugrad]

So for the past two days Moon has risen at five and I've played dead until five thirty. This morning she actually cried, which she normally doesn't do when she's near me in one capacity or another. We'll see how this goes. To be honest, I kind of look forward to sunrise getting later.

What time was her last pee break before bad last night? It's really hard but completely ignoring them works. As I learned, if we just kept getting up to feed Dakota at the time "he" wanted to get up -- 5:30 a.m.-- we were rewarding him for his behavior by giving him just what he wanted--breakfast at 5:30! Which is not what we wanted! You're probably going to have to ignore her/play dead for a few more days.

[Guest cvdrumsta]

What time was her last pee break before bad last night? It's really hard but completely ignoring them works. As I learned, if we just kept getting up to feed Dakota at the time "he" wanted to get up -- 5:30 a.m.-- we were rewarding him for his behavior by giving him just what he wanted--breakfast at 5:30! Which is not what we wanted! You're probably going to have to ignore her/play dead for a few more days.

 

Last pee break was at 10:30 pm. Seems like a long time, but Moon regularly goes nine to ten hours without a pee break, so I refuse to believe that her bladder is exploding by five.

[Batmom]

if she pees at 4, no way she needs to go at 8, not when she regularly holds it twice as long.

 

Well ... that's not true. She might indeed have to go at 8 -- regularly, or on some particular day due to excitement, got thirsty and drank some extra water, didn't get totally empty the last time she was out, had a treat that irritated her bladder .....

 

Most dogs need to go out more than 3 times a day. Mine go out at least 4 times, even when it's murderously cold or raining cats and dogs. I've also had more than one dog who needed to go out both right after a meal and again 1.5-2.0 hours later ......

[fsugrad]

 

Last pee break was at 10:30 pm. Seems like a long time, but Moon regularly goes nine to ten hours without a pee break, so I refuse to believe that her bladder is exploding by five.

10:30 seems like a late enough final pee break to me. Especially if she's not drinking tons of water in the hours leading up to the final pee break at 10:30.

[Guest chickenpotpie]

My girl and I go out for last call between 11 and 12,otherwise she does the waking up at 4am to go pee. So now she wakes up 6:30-7am to go pee. She will pee and poo on walks which she gets 2 a day, then go pee 3-4 more times in the yard. She is so weird about pooing in the yard, she doesn't like it because apparently there's not enough trees and bushes to hide her doing her business. She only likes to go poo under a bush or in the woods or something crazy, but thats another thread...

[Guest cvdrumsta]

So I'm away for a couple of days and I warned my dog-sitting friend that Moon would get her up at the crack of dawn only to hear that she was still snoozing on the couch at 8:15 am. Did my friend just sleep through the crying, or does my dog only torment me?

 

This kind of thing happen to anyone else?

[Guest blueberri]

I think they get used to the routine... like babies before they learn to sleep through the night. The baby wakes, mama nurses them and they go back to sleep. They wake expecting a feed, and their hormone system tells them it's time for a feed, but they don't *need* a feed. Remove the "endorsing" behaviour and baby sleeps longer. Ditto with us and our bladders. If we woke at 4 every night needing a pee, you keep waking at 4 needing a pee. It's a hard habit to break! It may be your houndie had a sleep-in because of the different circumstances, her "bladder-clock" didn't go off.

 

And while the "can make it for 10 hours without peeing" can stand true, it's the same with us! We go overnight not peeing, but during the day need to pee regularly. Same with our houndies. Daytime is active time, and part of that is peeing.

 

(I say this from the very, very fortunate position of having hounds that sleep through the night without pee breaks!)

[Guest iconsmum]

 

Well ... that's not true. She might indeed have to go at 8 -- regularly, or on some particular day due to excitement, got thirsty and drank some extra water, didn't get totally empty the last time she was out, had a treat that irritated her bladder .....

 

Most dogs need to go out more than 3 times a day. Mine go out at least 4 times, even when it's murderously cold or raining cats and dogs. I've also had more than one dog who needed to go out both right after a meal and again 1.5-2.0 hours later ......

 

I completely agree here:

You'll forgive my bluntness but I'm looking at this original question with my mouth open; I would never ever limit a dog to three times a day out. You're wondering why she's looking stressed, pacing and panting?? ALL of my dogs would do that if I ignored them when they wanted out! My bet is that you are totally missing her indications that she needs out, she knows you're not going to comply, which means she knows she's in for a long bladder-splitting wait and that stresses her out...you probably have a beautifully housebroken dog there because she's holding on as hard as she can! Minimum 5 times in a 15 hour day - each trip out for five minutes at a time with you at the very end of a 6 ft long leash to do her business as she wants to...without you bugging her to hurry up or whatever. I can't even imagine what would make a person think that it's ok to force a dog into such a tight schedule and as a professional trainer it seems inhumane to me. Sorry if that's not terribly political but I think it needs saying here.

[Guest GreyHawk]

I'm stunned - the idea of forcing your dog to pee only 3 times a day seems like some sort of physical/mental torture regime.

 

I am aghast that you seem to think it's ok to treat your dog like this.

 

Try this restriction yourself for a week and see how relaxed you are.

 

This is a living animal we are talking about here, not a bit of scheduling software.