Guest greytsunshine Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Our 11 1/2 year old grey, Max, has been drinking & peeing more for the past couple weeks. It's gotten so he can't make it through the night or be left alone more than ~ 3 hrs without having to go. He drinks at least twice as much as he used to. He has been on a special urinary diet for a couple years due to previous crystals but has had no problems with that. His only other symptom is, at least once a day, after drinking water, he gags a little & spits up. There's never any food in it & it's usually just a teaspoon or so of water & it's not every time he drinks. We've been to the vet, they drew blood & did a urinalysis. His urinalysis came back fine, so it was sent for culture & we're still waiting on that. His blood test was normal except for a low T4, so that was sent for more in depth analysis. The results came back for that as low T4 and high TSH. The vet said that was odd (not sure if she knows about greys & thyroid levels) & we'll wait for the urine culture before proceeding. I've been doing some reading about the thyroid testing in greyhounds and am now more confused than ever! He exhibits non of the symptoms of hypothyroidism and his excessive drinking & peeing is not listed in the symptoms. The vet said that if his urinalysis comes back ok, then maybe do an abdominal ultrasound to check for other problems and x-ray to check for kidney stones. I'm not sure these tests are necessary because he seems fine otherwise, lots of energy, happy, eating ok, etc. I'm calling the vet back today so what are some things I can ask her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaryJane Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 What were the results of the urinalysis and the blood work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SusanP Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Has the vet considered testing for diabetes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAJ2010 Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Acid reflux? I suspect Sunshine has a little bit of this. After adding in some slippery elm twice a day she does the spit up thing less often. Maybe once every 2 to 3 weeks... Quote ------ Jessica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galgrey Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Did they check his kidney values (BUN, creatinine, etc.)? Quote Cynthia, & Cristiano, galgoAlways in my heart: Frostman Newdawn Frost, Keno Jet Action & Chloe (NGA racing name unknown), Irys (galgo), Hannah (weim), Cruz (galgo), & Carly CW Your Charming Princess http://www.greyhound-data.com/d?i=1018857 "It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life, gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are." -- Unknown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAJ2010 Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Go reading comprehension! I totally missed the excessive drinking and peeing.... The spit up thing could be unrelated... Hope he feels better soon Quote ------ Jessica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest greytsunshine Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 What were the results of the urinalysis and the blood work? Urinalysis came back clear & we are waiting for culture results. Blood work came back good except for the wonky thyroid values described in original post. Has the vet considered testing for diabetes? This was part of the blood work & came back ok. Did they check his kidney values (BUN, creatinine, etc.)? I think this was part of the blood work, also, & came back ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaisyDoodle Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 I'd want to know about diabetes, Cushings, and kidney disease. Quote DonnaMolly the Border Collie & Poquita the American-born Podenga Bridge Babies: Daisy (Positive Delta) 8/7/2000 - 4/6/2115, Agnes--angel Sage's baby (Regall Rosario) 11/12/01 - 12/18/13, Lucky the mix (Found, w 10 puppies 8/96-Bridge 7/28/11, app. age 16) & CoCo (Cosmo Comet) 12/28/89-5/4/04 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest greytsunshine Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 I'd want to know about diabetes, Cushings, and kidney disease. Diabetes & kidney disease were part of the original blood work & checked out ok. I'm not sure about Cushings. I'll ask the vet when I call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbhounds Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Fwiw-my girl became pu/pd too (urinating and drinking excessively). Turned out she had a thyroid tumor-Thyroidcarcinoma). So, check that thyroid gland. Interesting enough she became hypothyroid after her surgery to remove the mass and her left thyroid gland. Her most recent thyroid panel had her T4@ 0.5 and her cTSH @ 0.07 (just w/I the normal reference range). Dr Couto is happy with the results and I'm to continue her current dose of soloxine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OPointyDog Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 The excessive drinking and peeing in our dog Star (grey mix) turned out to be Cushings. She was 12 when that started and I think it is more commonly seen in older dogs. There are a few specific blood tests they can do to help sort that out. There's two forms - adrenal and pituitary. The pituitary form usually responds well to medication and is the most common form (about 80% of dogs). The adrenal form can be fixed surgically, but it's a risky procedure and not often performed. Plus the adrenal form can be caused by tumors on the adrenal glands - they should be able to see these with an ultrasound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burpdog Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 I'm a little concerned by your vet's comment: The results came back for that as low T4 and high TSH. The vet said that was odd (not sure if she knows about greys & thyroid levels) & we'll wait for the urine culture before proceeding This is a basic principle -- not just greys (true for humans also) TSH Level: This blood test measures the amount of TSH in the bloodstream. In a hypothyroid dog, the level will be elevated because the body is trying to stimulate the thyroid gland to produce more thyroid hormone. If the Baseline T4 and Free T4 by Equilibrium Dialysis are low and the TSH is elevated, a diagnosis of hypothyroidism can be made. Where are you located? Quote Diane & The Senior Gang Burpdog Biscuits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest greytsunshine Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Fwiw-my girl became pu/pd too (urinating and drinking excessively). Turned out she had a thyroid tumor-Thyroidcarcinoma). So, check that thyroid gland. Interesting enough she became hypothyroid after her surgery to remove the mass and her left thyroid gland. Her most recent thyroid panel had her T4@ 0.5 and her cTSH @ 0.07 (just w/I the normal reference range). Dr Couto is happy with the results and I'm to continue her current dose of soloxine. Hmmm...how did they finally diagnose the tumor? Glad to hear that she's ok now! The excessive drinking and peeing in our dog Star (grey mix) turned out to be Cushings. She was 12 when that started and I think it is more commonly seen in older dogs. There are a few specific blood tests they can do to help sort that out. There's two forms - adrenal and pituitary. The pituitary form usually responds well to medication and is the most common form (about 80% of dogs). The adrenal form can be fixed surgically, but it's a risky procedure and not often performed. Plus the adrenal form can be caused by tumors on the adrenal glands - they should be able to see these with an ultrasound. Good points & info, thank you! I'm a little concerned by your vet's comment: The results came back for that as low T4 and high TSH. The vet said that was odd (not sure if she knows about greys & thyroid levels) & we'll wait for the urine culture before proceeding This is a basic principle -- not just greys (true for humans also) TSH Level: This blood test measures the amount of TSH in the bloodstream. In a hypothyroid dog, the level will be elevated because the body is trying to stimulate the thyroid gland to produce more thyroid hormone. If the Baseline T4 and Free T4 by Equilibrium Dialysis are low and the TSH is elevated, a diagnosis of hypothyroidism can be made. Where are you located? Wow, that makes sense when you explain it like that. I just called the vet's office & a different dr will call back (other vet isn't in today) so I can discuss the results again. I want to be sure I didn't mix things up but I'm pretty sure she said high TSH & low T4. Would hypothyroidism cause excessive drinking/urinating? Oh, and I'm located in suburbs of Denver, CO, US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burpdog Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Probably not but who knows. The thyroid is the engine for the body. You should have good vets there. What were the kidney values? (BUN and creatine) Quote Diane & The Senior Gang Burpdog Biscuits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest greytsunshine Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Ok, just talked to the vet & Max does have a urinary infection so we'll be starting antibiotics for that. Also, an x-ray is in order to rule out kidney stones since he has a history of urinary crystals and he's male. As for the thyroid, the first vet had noted in the chart the hypothyroidism based on the low T4 value and high TSH. The vet I spoke with today reiterated what Burpdog said above and will be prescribing thyroxine for that. Thank you all for replies and wisdom! My baby resting comfortably: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaryJane Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Can you actually list the urine and blood results? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest greytsunshine Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Can you actually list the urine and blood results? I don't have a copy of the results but he said all was within normal range even the T4 which was 1 (on the low end of normal) but that was enough for a more in depth thyroid panel. The results from that thyroid panel showed that "free T4s (circulating) were low and the TSH was elevated." Don't know the exact values of those but he said the elevated TSH is enough to diagnose hypothyroidism. The vet also said that untreated hypothyroidism can suppress the immune system and lead to infections. That may be why Max has the urinary infection but we'll do the x-ray next week to rule out kidney stones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaryJane Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Can you actually list the urine and blood results? I don't have a copy of the results but he said all was within normal range even the T4 which was 1 (on the low end of normal) but that was enough for a more in depth thyroid panel. The results from that thyroid panel showed that "free T4s (circulating) were low and the TSH was elevated." Don't know the exact values of those but he said the elevated TSH is enough to diagnose hypothyroidism. The vet also said that untreated hypothyroidism can suppress the immune system and lead to infections. That may be why Max has the urinary infection but we'll do the x-ray next week to rule out kidney stones. Next time get copies of all the results. Most cases in an UTI, the bacteria will usually show up in the urinalysis when they look at it under a microscope - they won't be able to tell what type but, they can usually see the bacteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burpdog Posted September 15, 2012 Share Posted September 15, 2012 Opt for Soloxine if you are going to medicate for thyroid. You can buy it at Omaha Vaccine cheap compared to the vets, or Allivet Quote Diane & The Senior Gang Burpdog Biscuits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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