Intra-Dermal (Skin) Allergy Testing

[Guest itsagreytlife]

I did a search on this topic and didn't find anything recent, so I thought I'd throw it out there again.

 

Selah came to us in July with some pretty bad all-over skin problems--red spots, open sores, and pustules. Was able to get it under control with Pred and antibiotics fairly quickly. Since then its been a frustrating time of changing food, going on & off Pred and trying Benadryl, especially at night when she tends to lick and keep me up. BTW,her coat is great (TOTW Salmon) along with salmon oil supplement in kibble, with frequent brushings, etc.

 

My vet said to wait out the season to see if they were seasonal; obviously since she still has them thru January, they aren't--although I have heard this year to be really bad for outdoor allergies. In the meantime, I keep trying to wean her off the Pred, only to put her back on it. This last time a couple weeks ago when she came back to us from staying at a house and getting fleas--baaaddd reaction. Obviously has flea allergy, but that doesn't explain the rest of the time when she's at home and doesn't have fleas and still itches (neck), licks (stomach & butt), and bites (base of tail). I have been able to control it so that she doesnt break out with any sores, but am now trying to wean her off the Pred AGAIN. It seems worse than ever at nighttime now--last night she started the dreaded licking at 12:30 a.m.!! Usually she starts at 4 a.m. I wipe her down with cool washcloths and have a spray the groomer recommended called Zymox (has hydrocortizone) and give her benadry. Not working as of the last several nights and she developed a red slightly raised spot between her legs (assumed from all the recent licking--also assuming more of them to come).

 

Called a vet dermatologist yesterday and got the lo-down on skin testing. Probably when all is said and done (assuming we go with the shots)will cost us $1400 for 1st year (maybe a bit more). Don't want to get blood test since I've read several times it comes up with all these false positives (and negs) particularly with food. I am so sick of having to restrict her diet as it is! Also, she would have to be off the Pred for 4 weeks and antihistamines 2 wks before testing. Ugh!

 

I was having luck with the benadryl, but not now. She weighs about 63 lbs. Was giving her 50mgs. Wondering if I could safely give her 75mgs at night?

 

She is the most perfect dog in the world! So friendly, sweet, and adorable. This is just driving me nuts (oh! and did I mention how horrible her breath gets when she's been licking herself? Can smell it across the room!!) Anybody have the skin test done with the vaccine? And if so, any luck??? Thanks for your help.

[MaryJane]

I would suggest three things - get a culture of one of the pustules - she could have a staph infection and if so, you might need to get a culture and make sure she is on the right antibiotic. Next. try adding some oatmeal to her food - oatmeal can help keep the skin from being itchy and it can help to grow hair - my dogs get it every day. Third, try switching to Z/D - it is a food for dogs with allergies. You can see after a week if the Z/D and oatmeal have made any difference and in that time, the culture would be back.

[tbhounds]

She sounds like the perfect candidate for Atopica.

[Guest itsagreytlife]

I would suggest three things - get a culture of one of the pustules - she could have a staph infection and if so, you might need to get a culture and make sure she is on the right antibiotic. Next. try adding some oatmeal to her food - oatmeal can help keep the skin from being itchy and it can help to grow hair - my dogs get it every day. Third, try switching to Z/D - it is a food for dogs with allergies. You can see after a week if the Z/D and oatmeal have made any difference and in that time, the culture would be back.

 

She doesn't have any pustules anymore--that was last July and the antibiotics cleared it up (it was a staph infection BTW). Not on antibiotics--so far been able to keep her looking pretty good.

 

How much oatmeal do I add? She's just shy of 63 lbs and I feed her 2x a day. How do I know she's not allergic to oatmeal? (arrgh!) I'd be happy to give it a try. Will look into the Z/D.

 

Thank you.

 

She sounds like the perfect candidate for Atopica.

 

Yes, my vet has mentioned that--after recommending the blood test. He says it is quite expensive. Anyone have experience with this drug?

[MaryJane]

Give her about 1/2 cup of cooked oatmeal (5-minute cooking type) at her first meal and add a bit of molasses in. Decrease the kibble by about 1/4 cup.

 

Most of the commercial dog foods that are "sensitive stomach/skin issues" contain oatmeal so she is unlikely to be sensitive to it but, it could happen. If she gets diarrhea within 24 hours of eating her first meal of it then it would probably be from the oatmeal. Ad a side bonus, I find that oatmeal firms up the poops since it has fiber in it.

[tbhounds]

Atopica is pricey but, you can always use the generic form. I have seen some amazing results with Atopica.

[Guest Timo]

The vet had suggested the skin allergy testing for Timo if things didn't get better. Once we got rid of chicken and grains from his diet and started using Advantage for fleas, the itching completely subsided. The frontline wasn't really working for the fleas, and he was severely allergic to flea bites. And he is on a all fish, grain-free diet.

 

We use to put shorts on him to prevent chewing on his tail... he was chewing it raw.

 

Instead of benadryl, we gave him chlor-trimeton. It worked much better. The benadryl made him drowsy, and made him lose his appetite. Now that we eliminated all of his allergens, he no longer gets antihistamines.

 

He was never on prednisone, but he did have to get a hydrocortisone shot, which helped tremendously while it lasted.

[Guest itsagreytlife]

The vet had suggested the skin allergy testing for Timo if things didn't get better. Once we got rid of chicken and grains from his diet and started using Advantage for fleas, the itching completely subsided. The frontline wasn't really working for the fleas, and he was severely allergic to flea bites. And he is on a all fish, grain-free diet.

 

We use to put shorts on him to prevent chewing on his tail... he was chewing it raw.

 

Instead of benadryl, we gave him chlor-trimeton. It worked much better. The benadryl made him drowsy, and made him lose his appetite. Now that we eliminated all of his allergens, he no longer gets antihistamines.

 

He was never on prednisone, but he did have to get a hydrocortisone shot, which helped tremendously while it lasted.

 

Hmm... chlortrimeton? What is the dosage for that? We have Selah on frontline and the vet did suggest that maybe we could try another flea control med. I guess we could try advantage (of course, this is after I bought almost a year's worth of frontline!). She also is on all fish, grain-free diet, but I will be trying the oatmeal here soon. Thanks for sharing your experience. Makes me feel there is hope.

[GeorgeofNE]

You're assuming it's a food allergy--but it could be ANYTHING.

 

My brother had a dog that was allergic to GRASS.

 

I've heard iffy things about the allergy testing--but since you've seen a dermatologist already, and that's what he recommends, I'd go for it.

 

Poor dog! My last dog had HORRIBLE allergies--they were seasonal, but as he got older, they got worse and worse and worse until they were 11 months of the year. It was a nightmare for both of us--and he was such a saint about it all!

[joejoesmom]

Have you tried her on a diet without any fish? Taste of the Wild is a very good food, but it is not a limited ingredient diet. Food allergies are caused by proteins. Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream has the following protein sources: Salmon, ocean fish meal, sweet potatoes, potatoes, salmon meal, smoked salmon, potato fiber, natural flavor, dried chicory root, tomatoes, blueberries, raspberries, and yucca schidigera extract (not sure if this extract would have protein). I know that in humans, fish and tomatoes are common allergens.

 

Before I spent lots of money on testing (unless your vet has ruled out a food allergy); I would try a true limited ingredient diet. You can purchase prescription allergy diets from your vet. Your allergy vet could recommend one. When I had a foster with suspected allergies, the allergist recommended I do a trial with either kangaroo and oat, or rabbit (can't remember the other ingredient). He preferred to stay away from duck (too similar to chicken), fish (most dogs have had fish before), and hooved animals (too similar to each other I think). Of course, this was for my situation and also took into account the foods that were available at the time (2 years ago). I have heard that the Royal Canin Prescription Allergy diets (which is what he recommended) may now contain soybean oil (I have not confirmed this). Soy is a common allergen and it is possible that the oil contains some protein. Theoretically, oil doesn't contain protein so is not allergenic -- however, it is possible that some trace of the protein remains.

 

Common allergens include: various grain glutens, corn, soy, dairy. However anything containing a protein can cause an allergy (my mom was allergic to celery).

 

Dogs are rarely allergic to sweet potato, so that is usually a good carbohydrate to try. Mashed sweet potatoes can be used to give pills, and dried sweet potatoes make good treats.

 

You might also ask your vet about switching to one of the Natural Balance formulas. They are touted as being limited ingredient. I've used sweet potato and venison with the allergy foster. He didn't like the taste that much so I added mashed sweet potato. It includes the following ingredients:

 

Sweet Potatoes, Venison, Potato Protein, Pea Protein, Canola Oil, Dicalcium Phosphate, Potato Fiber, Flaxseed, Natural Flavor, Calcium Carbonate, Sodium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Taurine, Natural Mixed Tocopherols, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Proteinate, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B-1), Manganese Proteinate, Manganous Oxide, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Biotin, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B-6), Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Riboflavin (Vitamin B-2), Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Folic Acid.

 

If this helps the problem, then you know you are dealing with a food allergy (doesn't rule out environmental allergies but reducing the food allergy might alleviate enough symptoms). You can then start adding foods back in one at a time. The goal here is to be able to move to a less restrictive and more affordable food. If that isn't an issue, then you could stay on the limited ingredient diet.

 

During the two month trial, they also emphasized that it was important not to let the dog lick other dogs food dishes, have any treats other than what was in the limited ingredient diet, and even avoid flavored medicines.

 

FYI, in humans at least, they do not do shots for food allergies -- just environmental allergies. You must simply avoid the food.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Jane (a very allergic person)

 

 

[XTRAWLD]

Been there done that. Kasey is allergic to everything.

 

We visited numerous vets, tried numerous things, trial and error through the wazoo.

 

When we first realized something was wrong, Kasey developed incredibly red bleeding sores on his head and ears. At first it was diagnosed simply as hot spots. I wasn't satisfied with that. Later we thought perhaps he had a severe case of scabies. Negative there. You really have to rule out what those spots are first. He scratched incessantly, so much that he would make himself bleed. Then it would heal for a day and he'd open it up again, potentially opening the site for infection.

 

First, while blood testing is less accurate than skin testing, but it will give you an idea of the kind of things she is allergic to. I would recommend starting there first once you have ruled out any other reasons for the spots. Thankfully, meds can be given and she can still be tested. Kasey would need to be off all meds for up to 6 weeks prior to skin testing. That was not something I was willing to put him through because at the point we started discovering these problems, he couldn't go for more than a couple days without a med to help control his itching. So that's the first thing to consider. Secondly, the dog will need to be sedated to do this. Not sure how you feel about sedation, but for us, the less the dog is sedated in general, the better and safer we feel. It was discovered earlier this year at Kasey's dental that he had trouble coming back after sedation - it is a risk you will have to weigh as well.

 

We briefly visited the Atopica situation. Super expensive, and a bit of a PITA but you of course need to go through skin testing first. You also get a new formula ever 3 months I believe, so lots of extra visits for that too. Again, no meds I believe for a certain time before first administering it. I was also not comfortable with injecting. Sure I could learn, or I could bring him 1.5 hours to the special vet clinic to have them do it.

 

We tried a slew of meds to make him feel more comfortable. It really was try this and try that. We got pills to help increase circulation to the skin to create a better barrier against the environmental allergens. We tried hair growth, we tried shampooing often (find a soothing shampoo without oatmeal!), we tried creams, heavier steroids, mild ones, etc. Benadryl did squat. A combination med of steroid and benadryl did squat. But your dog might react to those meds better and/or different than mine. That's the crappy thing of it all, it takes time to learn what works and what doesn't. He would have unwanted side effects on one drug, and not the other, and I just didn't want him on 5 different pills for this and that.

 

I will admit after getting the blood test done we really did make a huge effort to make his life more comfortable. Vacuumed more regularly, trial with food, wash bedding/coats more often, we even moved, and the latest effort - changed out all the carpet in the house to laminate (he has a dust allergy too). I scour all consumable foods to make sure even the tiniest amount of chicken (I don't care if they say poultry fat isn't discernable, I'm not giving him an ounce!). After all of our efforts, Kasey's food and environmental allergies are controlled with 10 mg of prednisone in as little as 7-10 day doses.

 

He will be on pred for life, however we are comfortable with the fact that a low dose is making him comfortable and it is cheap to buy and give. Now seemingly, he's on Pepcid to control acid since he's been on pred for the last 4 years and has likely developed small ulcers etc from the pills, but again a small price.

 

Feel free to PM me for anything. We've been through a lot and seems like you will just be on your way with it soon. It really does suck, but eventually you'll get there. I wish you the best of luck and I hope you find a great team of vets and dermatologists to help you.

[Batmom]

I would make sure your pup has had a thorough bath since any contact with fleas, and keep her on a good flea medication year-round. Then I would do a trial of either Z/D Ultra or a novel protein and NOTHING else, 3 weeks minimum and preferably 12.

 

Some folks seem to get useful results from the blood allergy tests. I haven't done them myself.

[Guest itsagreytlife]

I would make sure your pup has had a thorough bath since any contact with fleas, and keep her on a good flea medication year-round. Then I would do a trial of either Z/D Ultra or a novel protein and NOTHING else, 3 weeks minimum and preferably 12.

 

Some folks seem to get useful results from the blood allergy tests. I haven't done them myself.

 

Thanks, I got her into a groomer and she got a good soothing shampoo and condition a couple days after we returned. Yes, definitely she is on flea meds all year. I am considering the Z/D or similar food now. (ugh--hate changing food).

 

Thanks for your input!

[Guest itsagreytlife]

Been there done that. Kasey is allergic to everything.

 

We visited numerous vets, tried numerous things, trial and error through the wazoo.

 

When we first realized something was wrong, Kasey developed incredibly red bleeding sores on his head and ears. At first it was diagnosed simply as hot spots. I wasn't satisfied with that. Later we thought perhaps he had a severe case of scabies. Negative there. You really have to rule out what those spots are first. He scratched incessantly, so much that he would make himself bleed. Then it would heal for a day and he'd open it up again, potentially opening the site for infection.

 

First, while blood testing is less accurate than skin testing, but it will give you an idea of the kind of things she is allergic to. I would recommend starting there first once you have ruled out any other reasons for the spots. Thankfully, meds can be given and she can still be tested. Kasey would need to be off all meds for up to 6 weeks prior to skin testing. That was not something I was willing to put him through because at the point we started discovering these problems, he couldn't go for more than a couple days without a med to help control his itching. So that's the first thing to consider. Secondly, the dog will need to be sedated to do this. Not sure how you feel about sedation, but for us, the less the dog is sedated in general, the better and safer we feel. It was discovered earlier this year at Kasey's dental that he had trouble coming back after sedation - it is a risk you will have to weigh as well.

 

We briefly visited the Atopica situation. Super expensive, and a bit of a PITA but you of course need to go through skin testing first. You also get a new formula ever 3 months I believe, so lots of extra visits for that too. Again, no meds I believe for a certain time before first administering it. I was also not comfortable with injecting. Sure I could learn, or I could bring him 1.5 hours to the special vet clinic to have them do it.

 

We tried a slew of meds to make him feel more comfortable. It really was try this and try that. We got pills to help increase circulation to the skin to create a better barrier against the environmental allergens. We tried hair growth, we tried shampooing often (find a soothing shampoo without oatmeal!), we tried creams, heavier steroids, mild ones, etc. Benadryl did squat. A combination med of steroid and benadryl did squat. But your dog might react to those meds better and/or different than mine. That's the crappy thing of it all, it takes time to learn what works and what doesn't. He would have unwanted side effects on one drug, and not the other, and I just didn't want him on 5 different pills for this and that.

 

I will admit after getting the blood test done we really did make a huge effort to make his life more comfortable. Vacuumed more regularly, trial with food, wash bedding/coats more often, we even moved, and the latest effort - changed out all the carpet in the house to laminate (he has a dust allergy too). I scour all consumable foods to make sure even the tiniest amount of chicken (I don't care if they say poultry fat isn't discernable, I'm not giving him an ounce!). After all of our efforts, Kasey's food and environmental allergies are controlled with 10 mg of prednisone in as little as 7-10 day doses.

 

He will be on pred for life, however we are comfortable with the fact that a low dose is making him comfortable and it is cheap to buy and give. Now seemingly, he's on Pepcid to control acid since he's been on pred for the last 4 years and has likely developed small ulcers etc from the pills, but again a small price.

 

Feel free to PM me for anything. We've been through a lot and seems like you will just be on your way with it soon. It really does suck, but eventually you'll get there. I wish you the best of luck and I hope you find a great team of vets and dermatologists to help you.

 

Wow! You certainly have been 'round the block (or mile) with this! I've only been at it six months or so and its driving ME crazy! Thanks so much for sharing your experience. Makes me feel not so weird having this issue...

 

We are pretty sure its an allergy of some sort since she responds so well to the Pred. I'm sure she is allergic to more than one thing. Am reluctant to do the blood test b/c it will definitely come up with lots of stuff that I may not have to worry about. The vet tech at the dermatologist told me how they were testing the labs that do the blood work (apparently there are good labs & not so good labs) and one of their trials came back as having tested allergic to WATER. So, I'm guessing that would be a BAD lab.

 

My vet has suggested the trial of prescription food, and I guess I will do that first. I am still on the fence about the skin testing/vaccine. Hubby is going back & forth on it too (he is absolutely gaga over her). They say there is a 65% chance of it making a difference, and therefore a 35% of it doing nothing. And that wouldn't be until at least a year of shots. (My 11 yr old son is doing very well with his allergy shots!)

 

I guess I really want to know if she is allergic to any foods more than anything, so I don't have to worry so much about what she gets on a daily basis (and stuff like licking other dog's food bowls like joejoesmom mentioned.) I find the food thing to be really annoying. She is very food motivated and it has been very helpful with her training. If its environmental we will just try to medicate/clean up/shampoo as best we can. Would love to adopt another grey, but not until we get this under control (a bit), since it does take up a lot of my time. She is such a sweetie--low maintenance personality, but high maintenance skin condition.

 

Does anyone know if giving her 75mg of benadryl is okay (she's just about 63lbs), ie. any neg effects? I would only do it at night since that is the amount that seems to help her (I guess it knocks her out. We aren't having too bad a time of it during the day--I am home during the day, so I keep an eye on her). I would try other OTC meds but don't know any other dosages. Anybody have ideas about other meds/dosages?

 

Thanks to everyone for their input! Sweet Selah & her mom

[kickchick2000]

I feel your frustration. My bulldog Sweet Pea is an allergic mess. I've left the vets before in tears b/c there is no easy fix. Our vet is fantastic it's not about the vet it's just I feel so sorry for Sweet Pea sometimes. We consulted NC State's vet school for allergy testing and we found it to be just a little out of our budget, we were talking thousands. Our vets felt at her age we could certainly manage the condition if we were willing to be very aggressive and consistent. If her current regiment stops working allergy testing will be our only option and we will pursue it at that point. Treatment is so dog specific and what works for one may not work for all. Here is what we do.

 

Once a week medicated baths

We use a medication called Temeril (sp?, I never get it right) - dosage varies depending on symptoms.

Each night we spay her feet with a malaseb spray, this helps with the feet licking.

 

Occasionally we have to treat with antibiotics, anti fungals etc...

 

 

Have you tried medicated baths or Temeril??? We have found it to work wonders.

[tbhounds]

Temaril P is an antihistamine and prednisone. It can work well but, basically is treating the symptom not the cause. Bathing will help by reducing the topical allergens and a medicated shampoo like Ketochor will address a secondary staph infection-- again only addressing the symptoms.

Food trials may be of benefit for those hounds that may indeed have a food allergy however, the sad truth is many of these hounds also have environmental allergies too-- mold, grass, dust mites....

I have had heard of very mixed reviews of allergy testing and allergy injections-- most of them being negative.

Not wanting to repeat myself here but, I feel it's warranted- please consider or at least discuss the use of Atopica further with your veterinarian. Yes, it's expensive but, it works. If wish I could show you before and after pictures of dogs I have seen using the medication.

It's not without risk- no medication is. Bloodwork will be required or at least it should be to its continued use.

Upset tummies is a reported side effect however- here's a trick taught to me by a local Derm Vet-- keep the capsules in the freezer--reduces the tummy upset.

Allergies are awful and I encourage all having to deal with that condition to seek out a dermatologist in your area-- while you may love your vet allergies are best dealt with a specialist.

Edited January 30, 2012 by tbhounds

[joejoesmom]

I would definitely check with your vet about the Benedryl (diphenhydramine). It is contraindicated in dogs with certain health issues (such as high blood pressure or glaucoma). Also be sure to use pure benedryl with no decongestant. Be careful using liquid preparations as they may contain xylitol or other sweeteners. Best to stick with a capsule that is all diphenhydramine. I believe the recommended dosage is 0.5 to 2 mg per pound of body weight, given up to 3 times per day (i.e. every 8 hours). But please check with your vets. They really should be the ones monitoring the medications and looking for any possible interactions between the drugs she is taking.

 

Jane

[Guest Timo]

Hmm... chlortrimeton? What is the dosage for that? We have Selah on frontline and the vet did suggest that maybe we could try another flea control med. I guess we could try advantage (of course, this is after I bought almost a year's worth of frontline!). She also is on all fish, grain-free diet, but I will be trying the oatmeal here soon. Thanks for sharing your experience. Makes me feel there is hope.

 

When I gave him chlor-trimeton (generic brand), I gave up to 2 pills twice a day when he was really itchy. I believe they were 4mg tablets. For maintenance, I lowered it to one pill twice a day, and then down to one pill a day. Now that we seemed to have taken his allergens out of the picture, we don't give him any. We were lucky in that we figured out it was food and flea allergies within the first six months, but if it had been environmental allergies, then testing might have been the best option.

 

We actually still use Frontline and Advantage. We just don't put them on in the same weeks. I only use Frontline for potential ticks because it really did not work for fleas. Based on our new vet's recommendation, we are planning on switching to Trifexis next month (once I'm out of interceptor and advantage). We'll still be using Fromtline or the Preventic collar for ticks.

[Guest itsagreytlife]

Temaril P is an antihistamine and prednisone. It can work well but, basically is treating the symptom not the cause. Bathing will help by reducing the topical allergens and a medicated shampoo like Ketochor will address a secondary staph infection-- again only addressing the symptoms.

Food trials may be of benefit for those hounds that may indeed have a food allergy however, the sad truth is many of these hounds also have environmental allergies too-- mold, grass, dust mites....

I have had heard of very mixed reviews of allergy testing and allergy injections-- most of them being negative.

Not wanting to repeat myself here but, I feel it's warranted- please consider or at least discuss the use of Atopica further with your veterinarian. Yes, it's expensive but, it works. If wish I could show you before and after pictures of dogs I have seen using the medication.

It's not without risk- no medication is. Bloodwork will be required or at least it should be to its continued use.

Upset tummies is a reported side effect however- here's a trick taught to me by a local Derm Vet-- keep the capsules in the freezer--reduces the tummy upset.

Allergies are awful and I encourage all having to deal with that condition to seek out a dermatologist in your area-- while you may love your vet allergies are best dealt with a specialist.

 

I will be asking the dermatologist about Atopica. I read about the tummy upset and it said it usually resolves itself within a week or so. I agree about the specialist part too. General vets are great, but nobody knows skin like a dermo.

 

Will check on benadry dosage too.

 

Thanks all!

[tbhounds]

Keep us posted!!!