Raw Feeding Basics

[Guest Gert]

I've got a question for the raw feeders... .

 

Two of my pups, the littermates, have bad teeth. They are missing enamel on their teeth, mainly on their canines (their former trainer said the whole litter's teeth are like that...she believes due to antibiotics, or some other meds, they received as pups).

 

Because of this missing enamel, I'm a little concerned about giving them RMBs. I'm worried that the bones might cause them to lose more enamel.

 

Anyone have any thoughts/opinions on this?? Do you think I should be concerned??

 

I know I have the option of feeding ground products like this, but, then we won't get any teeth cleaning benefits.....

[Guest RWM]

I've got a question for the raw feeders... .

 

Two of my pups, the littermates, have bad teeth. They are missing enamel on their teeth, mainly on their canines (their former trainer said the whole litter's teeth are like that...she believes due to antibiotics, or some other meds, they received as pups).

 

Because of this missing enamel, I'm a little concerned about giving them RMBs. I'm worried that the bones might cause them to lose more enamel.

 

Anyone have any thoughts/opinions on this?? Do you think I should be concerned??

 

I know I have the option of feeding ground products like this, but, then we won't get any teeth cleaning benefits.....

 

Aside from the loss of enamel, are your hounds' teeth otherwise sound? Perhaps an opinion from your vet about this might help. Assuming their teeth are otherwise sound, I wouldn't think that RMB would be too problematical. The RMB will provide teeth cleaning benefits, and this might offset any negative effects that RMB might cause to teeth missing some enamel.

[Guest Ola]

As long as you're using fully consumable bones (I avoid most beef bones due to hardness) I would imagine you will be just fine. Also, dogs mostly use their back teeth to do the crunching - this is why even raw fed dogs will often get a bit of buildup on their canines. Those teeth don't really do much unless you feed really big food, and by that I mean bigger than the dog's head.

[Guest Gert]

Aside from the loss of enamel, are your hounds' teeth otherwise sound? Perhaps an opinion from your vet about this might help. Assuming their teeth are otherwise sound, I wouldn't think that RMB would be too problematical. The RMB will provide teeth cleaning benefits, and this might offset any negative effects that RMB might cause to teeth missing some enamel.

 

I thought about asking my vet....but, I figure, like most folks' vets, she's probably opposed to raw. I haven't talked with her about it, though...so, I could be wrong.

 

As long as you're using fully consumable bones (I avoid most beef bones due to hardness) I would imagine you will be just fine. Also, dogs mostly use their back teeth to do the crunching - this is why even raw fed dogs will often get a bit of buildup on their canines. Those teeth don't really do much unless you feed really big food, and by that I mean bigger than the dog's head.

 

Yeah, I thought about that after I posted. Their canines seem to be the worst, with the most obvious enamel lose. I have seen some dark spots in the crevices on their back teeth, even after a cleaning.....but, I don't think it's enamel lose.

[Wonder]

I picked up 80 lbs of meat today and got all the chicken packaged and into the freezer The gr beef came in 5# tubes so I thawed 1 out and weighed and bagged that. The other 7 tubes are in the freezer.

It wasn't as bad as I thought. The boxes smelled really bad but the meat didn't smell and I hate the smell of meat.

[Guest RWM]

Aside from the loss of enamel, are your hounds' teeth otherwise sound? Perhaps an opinion from your vet about this might help. Assuming their teeth are otherwise sound, I wouldn't think that RMB would be too problematical. The RMB will provide teeth cleaning benefits, and this might offset any negative effects that RMB might cause to teeth missing some enamel.

 

I thought about asking my vet....but, I figure, like most folks' vets, she's probably opposed to raw. I haven't talked with her about it, though...so, I could be wrong.

 

As long as you're using fully consumable bones (I avoid most beef bones due to hardness) I would imagine you will be just fine. Also, dogs mostly use their back teeth to do the crunching - this is why even raw fed dogs will often get a bit of buildup on their canines. Those teeth don't really do much unless you feed really big food, and by that I mean bigger than the dog's head.

 

Yeah, I thought about that after I posted. Their canines seem to be the worst, with the most obvious enamel lose. I have seen some dark spots in the crevices on their back teeth, even after a cleaning.....but, I don't think it's enamel lose.

 

I think you merely want to ask your vet if your hounds' teeth are sound. Those dark spots in the crevices might be signs of decay and that could mean their teeth are not sound. In any case, RMB shouldn't be a real problem, particularly since their canines are the worst, and they won't use their canines to work on the RMB.

 

I picked up 80 lbs of meat today and got all the chicken packaged and into the freezer The gr beef came in 5# tubes so I thawed 1 out and weighed and bagged that. The other 7 tubes are in the freezer.

It wasn't as bad as I thought. The boxes smelled really bad but the meat didn't smell and I hate the smell of meat.

 

If the meat smells funny when you take it out of the tubes, I'd chuck it. That beef should have a clean, fresh, smell. While dogs may have a higher tolerance for bad meat than we do, why chance it?

[Guest Ola]

I thought about asking my vet....but, I figure, like most folks' vets, she's probably opposed to raw. I haven't talked with her about it, though...so, I could be wrong.

 

I would think that as long as your vet hasn't told you to not give them any chewies or nylabones it would be fine.

 

The boxes smelled really bad but the meat didn't smell and I hate the smell of meat.

 

I find when I get cases of meat they have that yucky "damp cardboard" smell as they thaw. That's way worse than the smell of raw meat. I don't like the smell of cooked meat much either so I'm lucky I can feed it raw.

Edited August 19, 2010 by Ola

[Josie]

I started adding Grizly salmon oil in Tuffy raw meals...

looks like it makes Tuffy poop more orange... not bright orange.. just a little...

[Guest greyhound9797]

I started adding Grizly salmon oil in Tuffy raw meals...

looks like it makes Tuffy poop more orange... not bright orange.. just a little...

Hmmmm, interesting. I never noticed a change in Piper's stools and I don't recall anyone every mentioning a color change. You're not feeding carrots by any chance? Did you start out with a small amount of oil? Some dogs don't tolerate a full dose all at once so maybe cut it in half for several feedings then gradually increase it. Like anything "new", there's always a chance of things changing throughout the body.

 

Sandra in FL

[greylyn]

One of my concerns when I started feeding raw (almost 6 weeks ago now!) was to be sure I was giving them enough to eat. We were at the vet a couple of days ago to get Kieran's corns hulled, and as I always do at the vet clinic,I weighed them - perfect! So I think we'll just continue what we're doing. My vet is happy and is actually quite supportive. Both dogs' teeth look good, their coats are beautiful (Otis is black so he's especially shiny!), and their general health is good, so we'll keep doing what we're doing. I keep a close eye out for specials in the meat department and we even bought an upright freezer strictly for the dogs' food! The vet had asked what meal preparation I do, and I told her I take the meat of the day out of the fridge, hand it to them, and wash my hands! When I bring home meat (for example, I had the meat dept. in the local supermarket bring in a case of turkey necks for me), I do spend a short time dividing it into daily portions and freezing them, so that all I have to do is remember to take the next day's meals out of the freezer the night before and put them in the fridge. I have a kitchen scale, so if I'm not sure, I weigh what I'm giving them, but I'm finding that I'm getting pretty good at eyeballing the size of the portions, and now since I've weighed them, I'm even more confident that they are getting adequate amounts of food.

[Guest Swifthounds]

Sounds like you're on the right track!

[greylyn]

My DH has become a convert too - he even tells random people about the improved dog breath and nice firm small poops!

[Guest Jerseysmom]

Our pets love the raw diet, they hav been on it for about 3 years. We actually sell it here in MPLS, but for those of you who are in other parts of the country try local butcher shops etc, as they have trim etc they don't use but are fine for animals.

[Guest BlingDogs]

Is there any specific changes needed for seniors? Would it disturb a senior grey's stomach if I 'jumped right in' like you suggest? Thanks!

[Guest Swifthounds]

Nothing specific for seniors. I increase the fish oil I give to theraputic levels (helps with inflammation) if I haven't done it by that time for other reasons. I also sometimes give extra chicken feet to supplement with natural glucosamine.

 

 

Other than having a longer history of eating kibble, there isn't much difference between switching a young dog and switching an older dog. Comet was 10.5 when I switched him along with then 8.5 year old Vixen and the crew. Trojan came home just after turning 12. That night I put him in a crate and gave him a split chicken breast. He looked at me like I was crazy, but 15 minutes or so later he began chomping away. The next morning he was looking for more.

[Guest KennelMom]

We're kicking around the idea of going back to raw, but feeding once a day. Part of me thinks (once they make the transition) it will ultimately be better for them.

 

It is going to be hellacious to switch their twice a day feeding routine.

 

Any thoughts on raw once vs twice a day feedings?

Edited October 1, 2010 by KennelMom

[Guest Ola]

We went to feeding once a day shortly after we switched to raw. I still give them a cookie in the morning (usually when I leave for work but even if we're staying home) so there's still a routine there but the meal is in the evening. It was a surprisingly smooth transition, I thought my crazy food-obsessed mixed breed would put up much more of a fuss.

[Guest KennelMom]

Thanks Ola...that's what we've been talking about doing - just giving a cookie in place of a second meal. We're trying to find ways to minimize the work in feeding raw and having to wash bowls and clean up twice a day is, well, twice the work for us

[Guest mcsheltie]

My intention is to feed twice a day. But with my crazy schedule more often than not I am feeding once a day. My dogs really haven't gotten jacked about it.

 

I am curious as to what other raw feeders do and have been thinking about starting a raw feeding poll. My girls have high metabolisms. They need 2600+ kcals per day or they start to loose weight (that is 6 cups of most kibble) I was concerned because I keep hearing recommendations that if you want your dog to gain weight you should feed two to three times a day. So I posed the question to the two nutritionists and the board certified vet specialist I work with. They all said it was bunk. If the dog is healthy it doesn't matter if they get the calories in one sitting or ten.

 

They get fed once a day at the track.

[Guest Swifthounds]

My crew is fed once a day. I started with two meals and after two weeks switched to one meal per day. With one larger meal you can feed larger, more interesting foods and they get a bit more of a workout, so they enjoy it more. I randomize the feeding time a bit, so that their meal isn't at the same time everyday, and that helps keep the rumbly "anticipation" tummy at bay.

 

I do occasionally give the IGs a breakfast snack (often a tin of sardines split between the two or a small piece of red meat). My seniors also will get a second meal if they are hungry (sometimes a few hours before or after the main meal and sometimes in the morning, depending). My almost 13 year old, Comet, has always been a lean hound as as he has aged and muscle is harder to maintain, the bit of extra helps him hold muscle. Trojan (who's 13 and 3/4) will get a bit extra as well, though he doesn't need it for weight, just so that Comet has a breakfast partner. (Nothing motivates a hound to eat like seeing another eat your favorite food!)

 

Wash bowls? You ambitious woman!

[Guest yankeedownsouth]

My intention is to feed twice a day. But with my crazy schedule more often than not I am feeding once a day. My dogs really haven't gotten jacked about it.

 

I am curious as to what other raw feeders do and have been thinking about starting a raw feeding poll. My girls have high metabolisms. They need 2600+ kcals per day or they start to loose weight (that is 6 cups of most kibble) I was concerned because I keep hearing recommendations that if you want your dog to gain weight you should feed two to three times a day. So I posed the question to the two nutritionists and the board certified vet specialist I work with. They all said it was bunk. If the dog is healthy it doesn't matter if they get the calories in one sitting or ten.

 

They get fed once a day at the track.

 

 

My boy has the same metabolism - on kibble, he was eating 6 cups and 1 can a day and was finally at a decent (although still skinny for a grey) weight. I was feeding him twice a day on kibble. He suddenly stopped eating kibble, no matter what it was, and canned. So I switched him back to raw. I had fed him raw for a couple years and then took a couple years off when I got divorced. On raw, I feed once a day, about 2 1/4 lbs. He is perfectly fine with it and doesn't bug me for food in the morning. I think he's still full from the night before!

[Guest KennelMom]

We have 400lbs of chicken being delivered today!

[Guest Swifthounds]

We have 400lbs of chicken being delivered today!

Yay! So glad my hounds can't read. They'd be very excited. Any guess how long that'll last your crew?

 

I've been asked how much I feed per month and I really don't know. We have multiple freezers, order through bulk suppliers, and supplement with deals from local grocery stores, so there's always some variety of food.

[Guest Gert]

Sorry to bring up an old thread....but, I think this is the kind of thread that could "live on"!

 

I'm am thinking of switching to raw. I have fed a few raw meals...mainly chicken quarters and had mostly good results. I say mostly because I had observed a couple of things that make me a little hesitant.... .

 

First, one of my boy's stool had visible bone in it. Small pieces. But, he did seem to strain and even yelped when he went. I'm assuming that I probably should have added a little more meat to the meal??

 

Second, all 3 of my dogs have yacked up bone (2-3 inch pieces, with sharp edges) well after their meal. I know if they swallow a big piece, they might yack it up and re-chew. However, this was like 6-7 hours later. Anyone else ever had this happen??

[Guest greyhound9797]

Sorry to bring up an old thread....but, I think this is the kind of thread that could "live on"!

You're right, it could, and I hope it does!

 

I'm am thinking of switching to raw. I have fed a few raw meals...mainly chicken quarters and had mostly good results. I say mostly because I had observed a couple of things that make me a little hesitant.... .

It's actually rare to get bad results so you're off to a good start.

 

First, one of my boy's stool had visible bone in it. Small pieces. But, he did seem to strain and even yelped when he went. I'm assuming that I probably should have added a little more meat to the meal??

This is very common and not totally because he had too much bone as you suggested. It happened to Piper when I first started feeding her (but she went 100% raw cold turkey so the "side effects" went away much quicker than they may if you only feed raw irregularly) but went away after no more than 2 weeks. Sometimes you DO have to play around with the amount of meat to bone ratios but the bone in the stool is most likely because it was something new in the diet and his digestive tract was "learning" how to digest it. Also, bone will cause harder stools but most kibble fed dogs have stools that are too soft (I'm a professional pet sitter so I'm VERY accustomed to different types of poop!!) , so he will strain a bit at the beginning or anytime he has eaten a bit too much bone. After 3 years it still happens to Piper from time to time.

 

Second, all 3 of my dogs have yacked up bone (2-3 inch pieces, with sharp edges) well after their meal. I know if they swallow a big piece, they might yack it up and re-chew. However, this was like 6-7 hours later. Anyone else ever had this happen??

Again, this is common in the beginning but goes away rather quickly. Piper did the same and it kinda freaked me out but others reassured me that it was normal. After about 10 days she stopped the bony vomit and all has been well since. Besides, you know that your dogs aren't chewing bones into 2-3 inch pieces so that's just proof how fast the digestive in dogs works.

 

Your concerns are very valid and it's good that you have questions so you know that what you are doing is right. Keep those questions coming - we're here to help!

 

Sandra in FL