B 12 Shots Other Things

[RobinM]

I was told that B-12 shot is a deep muscular shot that could have side effects. Beau is being tested tomorrow for SIBO/B-12 deficiency/pancratic deficiency however the test take 7-10 days to return complete. She wants to wait for the results before administering B12.

 

What are the side effects of this for any of you who had B12 shots for their greyhounds?

 

I know Lynn M answered that her greyhound was on Budesonide (Entocort EC)

Is there anyone else who's greyhound was on it and what was the end result.

 

My vet does not want to do this. She feels it's too experimental and especially with greyhound who are so sensitive to steriods to begin with. too much of a risk and should only be considered if pred does not work. She is willing to do a pred trial but has expressed concern that IF he still doesn't respond he would need a biopsy anyway and IF there was a lymphoma, the chemo treatments would be less effective due to the pred. She is not trying to scare me, but she is trying to cover all basis... just in case.

 

All of DH reading, he feels we should be giving prophylatic doses of B12 after the testing and if that doesn't work Budesonide.

 

I disagree with the Budesonide at this point as there is not enough clincial research for greyhounds.

 

 

[AngelWhispers]

Fields was on B-12 shots for 6 weeks. The vet sent me home with the B-12 in the syringes and I administered the shots in the rear hip muscle each week. It was easy and the difference in Fields was remarkable after the first shot. His appetitie increased, he had more energy and wasn't lethargic. Made me want to share his B-12. He had no side effects at all from the injections.

 

Fields has chronic IBD/SIBO so Tylan and a single source protein is what keeps him healthy. If I so much as think about doing a food change, even if it's the same protein and a different brand, he has a flare-up. Most dogs with IBD or SIBO can't tolerate food changes, and some vets believe it's an allergy, so they recommend a single protein, and/or a food with no grains. It works for Fields.

 

No experience with budesonide, so I can't help.

 

Also, I don't know why it would take a week or more to determine B-12 or pancreatic insuffiency. When Fields was tested the results were back in 24 hours.

Edited January 11, 2009 by AngelWhispers

[dmswartzfager]

There are several people on here who will tell you budesonide worked great with their greys. For Blitz, it made his stool looser, and he got UTI's. However, Blitz appears to be more sensitive to medications than most.

[RobinM]

Fields was on B-12 shots for 6 weeks. The vet sent me home with the B-12 in the syringes and I administered the shots in the rear hip muscle each week. It was easy and the difference in Fields was remarkable after the first shot. His appetitie increased, he had more energy and wasn't lethargic. Made me want to share his B-12. He had no side effects at all from the injections.

 

Fields has chronic IBD/SIBO so Tylan and a single source protein is what keeps him healthy. If I so much as think about doing a food change, even if it's the same protein and a different brand, he has a flare-up. Most dogs with IBD or SIBO can't tolerate food changes, and some vets believe it's an allergy, so they recommend a single protein, and/or a food with no grains. It works for Fields.

 

No experience with budesonide, so I can't help.

 

Also, I don't know why it would take a week or more to determine B-12 or pancreatic insuffiency. When Fields was tested the results were back in 24 hours.

 

What food/ single protein is working for Fields?

[Guest IrskasMom]

 

 

 

Sending you more Hugs to find the right Medicin for Beau

[AngelWhispers]

What food/ single protein is working for Fields?

 

Fields eats Nature's Recipe Venison and Rice, and Innova canned Venison. I tried just about every food including a raw diet before I found that Nature's Recipe worked for him and for Warlock, who has allergies and will chew himself up. The ingredients are just OK, but hey, it works for them, and if they're happy and healthy..I'm happy. Warlock is a 77lb boy and he eats 3 cups a day...any more than that and he starts packing on the lbs. Fields is only 70lbs and he eats 2 1/2 cups or he gets chubby, and they both get a tablespoon of canned venison at each meal.

Edited January 11, 2009 by AngelWhispers

[tbhounds]

My boy has been taking Budesonide for a little less than 3 years. It was prescribed by a Board Cert. Vet and I have never had a problem with it nor have a seen any side-effects. He initially was taking 3mg's once daily but, he has since weaned down to taking to every 3rd day. It's a lot more expensive than pred but, IMO it's worth it's weight in gold--it literally saved my boy's life--intially he was given a rather grave prognoses.

He did have the B-12 injections with no problems too.

Today he's doing wonderfully. He has his appetite back (almost too fat now)-NORMAL stools and for a 10yr old greyhound-decent energy level

He's currently eating Natural Balance Duck and Potato top dressed with raw ground rabbit. Believe me, I tried them all but, so long as I don't alter his diet and/or meds we are stable--so, N.B it is

[montgomery2524]

We give Smokey a B12 shot every 10 days currently. You mention giving it intramuscularly but our vet has us giving Smoke's subcutaneously. He did have prednisone and did not do well on it at all. So far he has been holding his own so we have not had to try th Budesonide.

 

tbhounds is right when she says, 'as long as I don't alter his diet'. Anything out of the norm and his poo immediately shows the result. My guy gets Wellness Fish and Sweet Potato and the treats in the same line along with dried sweet potatos/apples/bananas. We dehydrate our own and I buy the big Sams Yams for his 'rawhide' experience.

[ahicks51]

I wouldn't know about greyhounds specifically, but I'd say that with humans, Entocort (budesonide) has fewer and milder side-effects than prednisone. But it doesn't have the "strength" of pred, either. Budesonide acts primarily on the gut, and if it works, it can be a blessing. In your case, it's a toss-up but I wouldn't go switching around between drugs right now. Try something and give it a chance.

 

Made me dizzy. I was a fussy-baby and stopped taking it after 3 weeks, right after I started my diet.

[tbhounds]

Actually Budesonide is a very potent steroid but because it's not metabolized like pred and stays for the most part in the GI tract side-effects are lessened.

[ahicks51]

Actually Budesonide is a very potent steroid but because it's not metabolized like pred and stays for the most part in the GI tract side-effects are lessened.

 

No argument- I think my dose was 3 mg, 3x/day. For pred it would have been many times that.

 

What I was alluding to is while prednisone has side effects like depression, mania, weight gain, "chipmunk cheeks," ulcers, infections, osteoporosis, avascular necrosis, and cataracts, budesonide's issues run more along the lines of sore throat, mild dizziness, rash, and upset stomach. While certainly either drug can have severe effects, given the choice between the two (with equivalent outcomes, of course), guess which one I'm going to pick.

 

Pred is a wonderful drug, but BOY can those side-effects cause problems.

[lothianjavert]

Both budesonide and prednisone are steroids. Budesonide is often administered in different ways -- i.e. inhaler form, etc. Per mg, it is much more powerful than pred, but it's not metabolized quite the same way. It's very effective for treating specific inflammations (i.e. lungs) w/o getting the systemic effects of prednisone. Or at least effects as severe as on an equivalent dose of pred. It CAN cause cataracts, osteoporosis, etc., with a high enough dose over a long period of time, but in that sense it is much safer than pred, and those side effects are seen much less often. One thing to also keep in mind-- many of the people on budesonide may occasionally need a boost w/ a systemic steroid like pred, so that can also skew results. Thrush can be an issue though, as can infections, just like with any steroid.

 

I would be more concerned w/ long term prednisone than with budesonide. Pred is a LOT cheaper. If the pred works, it might be worth it to try budesonide.

 

BTW, budesonide is used frequently in humans for treating intestinal inflammation and asthma (Pulmicort & Symbicort are the two budesonide inhalers that I use) and is very effective.

[Guest KeesMom]

Kees was recently diagnosed with PLE (protein losing enteropathy) after losing about 17 pounds. At the height of trying to figure out what was going on, Doc also sent us home with 6 weeks worth of vit B to administer subcutaneously as well. Our vet said the B12 is better utilized by the body when given subcutaneously instead of intramuscular. He is currently only on Prednisone and has so far gained back 7 pounds but stools are still soft. We are currently feeding Royal Canin Venison and Duck both canned and dry, along with cottage cheese, scrambled eggs, some yogurt, cooked beef, salmon, and chicken.