3greytjoys
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That photo is adorable! Seems that Luka is really beginning to come out of his shell fairly well (and much more confident feeling secure walking on rugs).
A quick hello to Greyhounds at a Meet and Greet would be fine; however, M&Gs can be a bit too much direct human sitmulation for new, shy dogs. It's often better to wait a bit longer before volunteering for an official "shift" until Luka is feeling more confident with you, and especially with strangers.
Too bad the GH group class is full, but probably just as well for you and Luka to continue taking baby steps from your personal trainer first.
Oops, I didn't mean to suggest that you foster. I was simply sharing one of our hounds' story. I only meant that it would be nice for you to invite a friend's confident, calm long retired Greyhound visitor over for an afternoon (or short term visit). I doubt if you need a brand new foster right now.
Another option is meeting another Greyhound owner friend for a Greyhound group walk.You and Luka keep up the great work!
(Btw, once people post 50 times on Greytalk, they are also allowed to "private message" (PM) other members. A couple of forums don't count though, like Cute and Funny.)
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I agree with above posters. Yes, your hunch to give your new hound more personal safe space is excellent and important (especially not stepping over her near doorways, if she lands near a doorway, happily call her to encourage her to her own dog bed on floor). Remember that Greyhounds didn't grow up inside family homes, that sort of close contact is foreign to them. Instead, they had their own safe personal resting space. Five weeks in a new home is much too soon to have that sort of close contact. Even after years of living with our hounds, we usually let them come to us when they want attention, otherwise our attention towards them is in brief spurts so they don't ever feel uncomfortable with us.
Below is an interesting article by the late, Kathleen Gilley. It offers a glimpse into racing Greyhounds' lives before retirement, and is shared often on GT. (Some adoption groups include it in their new adopter information packets.)
"This breed has never been asked to do anything for itself, make any decisions or answer any questions. It has been waited on, paw and tail. The only prohibition in a racing Greyhound's life is not to get into a fight----------or eat certain stuff in the turn out pen.
Let us review a little. From weaning until you go away for schooling, at probably a year and a half, you eat, grow and run around with your siblings. When you go away to begin your racing career, you get your own "apartment," in a large housing development. No one is allowed in your bed but you, and when you are in there, no one can touch you, without plenty of warning.
Someone hears a vehicle drive up, or the kennel door being unlocked. The light switches are flipped on. The loud mouths in residence, and there always are some, begin to bark or howl. You are wide awake by the time the human opens your door to turn you out. A Greyhound has never been touched while he was asleep. You eat when you are fed, usually on a strict schedule. No one asks if you are hungry or what you want to eat. You are never told not to eat any food within your reach. No one ever touches your bowl while you are eating. You are not to be disturbed because it is important you clean your plate.
You are not asked if you have to "go outside." You are placed in turn out pen and it isn't long before you get the idea of what you are supposed to do while you are out there. Unless you really get out of hand, you may chase, rough house and put your feet on everyone and everything else. The only humans you know are the "waiters" who feed you, and the "restroom attendants" who turn you out to go to the bathroom. Respect people? Surely you jest.
No one comes into or goes out of your kennel without your knowledge. You are all seeing; all knowing. There are no surprises, day in and day out. The only thing it is ever hoped you will do is win, place or show, and that you don't have much control over. It is in your blood, it is in your heart, it is in your fate-- or it is not.
And when it is not, then suddenly you are expected to be a civilized person in a fur coat. But people don't realize you may not even speak English. Some of you don't even know your names, because you didn't need to. You were not asked or told to do anything as an individual; you were always part of the "condo association?; the sorority or fraternity and everyone did everything together, as a group or pack. The only time you did anything as an individual is when you schooled or raced, and even then, You Were Not Alone.
Suddenly, he is expected to behave himself in places he's never been taught how to act. He is expected to take responsibility for saying when he needs to go outside, to come when he is called, not to get on some or all of the furniture, and to not eat food off counters and tables. He is dropped in a world that is not his, and totally without warning, at that.
Almost everything he does is wrong. Suddenly he is a minority. Now he is just a pet. He is unemployed, in a place where people expect him to know the rules and the schedule, even when there aren't any. (How many times have you heard someone say, He won't tell "me when he has to go out. What kind of schedule is that?) Have you heard the joke about the dog who says "My name is No-No Bad " Dog. What's yours? To me that is not even funny. All the "protective barriers are gone. There is no more warning before something happens. There is no more strength in numbers. He wakes up with a monster human face two inches from his. (With some people's breath, this could scare Godzilla.) Why should he not, believe that this someone for lunch? (I really do have to ask you ladies to consider how you would react if someone you barely knew crawled up on you while you were asleep?) No, I will not ask for any male input.
Now he is left alone, for the first time in his life, in a strange place, with no idea of what will happen or how long it will be before someone comes to him again. If he is not crated, he may go through walls, windows or over fences, desperately seeking something familiar, something with which to reconnect his life. If he does get free, he will find the familiarity, within himself: the adrenaline high, the wind in his ears, the blood pulsing and racing though his heart once again--until he crashes into a car.
Often, the first contact with his new family is punishment, something he's never had before, something he doesn't understand now, especially in the middle of the rest of the chaos. And worst of all, what are the most common human reactions to misbehavior? We live in a violent society, where the answer to any irritation is a slap, punch, kick, whip, or rub your nose in it. Under these circumstances, sometimes I think any successful adoption is a miracle.
He is, in effect, expected to have all the manners of at least a six-year old child. But, how many of you would leave an unfamiliar six-year old human alone and loose in your home for hours at a time and not expect to find who knows what when you got back? Consider that if you did, you could be brought up on charges of child abuse, neglect and endangerment. Yet, people do this to Greyhounds and this is often the reason for so many returns.
How many dogs have been returned because they did not know how to tell the adopter when they had to go out? How many for jumping on people, getting on furniture, counter surfing, separation anxiety, or defensive actions due to being startled or hurt (aka growling or biting)? So, let's understand: Sometimes it is the dog's fault" he cannot fit in. He is not equipped "with the social skills of a six-year old human. But you can help him."-End quote.
Btw, growling (or an air snap) is a dog's caution/warning communication, and usually should not be reprimanded. (If reprimanded repeatedly, some dogs might become more likely to skip a cautionary growl or air snap in the future for a bite.) Good to pay attention to their growl, avoid repeating those circumstances. The dogs' growling between each other is likely canine cautionary language as they adjust to sharing their home together. That usually subsides, but it's recommended to separate dogs when feeding meals or very high value chews, etc.
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I agree with Susan (GeorgeofNE) and others that Greyhounds do very well with leashed walks.
In our case, we take "power walks" with our younger hounds that include periodic stops for hounds to leave pee mail and get excessive sniffies done. We all benefit from the exercise. When we used to do more Greyhound play dates, it was a bit of a bummer for the humans because the hounds were too tired to go hiking (or power walking) later. Thus, our lousy excuse for humans to be lazy on those days.
Whatever you do, enjoy your time with Sherlock.
It's great fun to watch their personalities grow as they learn about their new forever people and retirement. As a_daerr knows well, obedience training is great for the hounds and helps their bonding process with us too. Nose work is fun, as is agility - if agility is in a fenced location. -
Good advice above.
Just to add, I've not used "Antiseptic Blood Stopper" powder you mentioned, but I agree with Pam re: powders (like Quick Stop). Most of the powders I've seen are just for nail quicks.
I'm always looking for painless blood clotting products. Clotisol works great for us with three diagnosed "excessive GH bleeders." Clotisol worked great for a happy tail injury that bled profusely (but didn't need stitches). (Clotisol label states that it can be used for docked tails.) We use it for hounds' nail quicks too. It's always stocked on our shelf.
Positive thoughts for Lydia's quick recovery. If time, please let us know how she's doing later.
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I'm so sorry about your first special boy's diagnosis. Wishing you as much quality time together as possible. Great news that your boy is still happy, active, and eating well. Time with our hounds is a wonderful gift to live in the moment.
(I've seen a human live much longer with lung cancer than doctors originally estimated. One of our hounds has survived hemangiosarcoma five times longer than we expected, so far...)
Many of us agree with MP_the4pack's comment:
"What most people say is that they tell you when they're ready to cross to the Bridge."
It helps our hounds for us to remain strong and positive, thereby reducing our hound's stress level from picking up on our sadness. Try to enjoy all your time together... he's still doing well now.
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I'm so sorry about Beanie's struggle. Our thoughts are with you and Beanie.
(We've lost a pet to lymphoma also.)
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Has the greyhound community thought about seeking to develop better dog park designs? I know in the past I had to reserve park slots for baseball and soccer practice, why not dog parks?
Good idea re: design improvements dividing larger parks, particularly in areas with higher Greyhound population. Could be worthwhile to approach your city planners. (It would cost money, and some dog parks are last on the priority list.)
I completely agree re: reserving dog park time. Since dog parks are "public" parks, I was told we could not reserve a dog park strictly for Greyhound play dates. The city was okay with us unofficially arranging a weekly Greyhound only (muzzled) play date early one weekend morning in one of the city's least busy dog parks. Humans stood near the gate to politely ask other breed owners to use the empty secondary fenced space (designated for small dogs) during that hour. Dog park regulars were understanding, realizing they had every other hour throughout weeks/weekends to use the large dog space. Any rare time others became upset, the Greyhound group politely leashed up all hounds and departed calmly (sometimes taking a fun group leashed walk instead).
Ideally, if your Greyhound adoption group has any members that own a fairly large safely fenced property, some people will welcome hosting members of their GH group once a week or twice a month. (If strong interest, a sign-up sheet can keep the number of hounds to a safe number.) Donations and/or volunteer time can be offered to help owner with land maintenance.
Other options: Any fully fenced enclosure with safe, level ground material (grass or dirt). Possibly rent fenced yard space from a humane society, kennel, fairground fenced space, dog training facility, etc.
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Hope Fenway is continuing to do well in your absence.
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Thank you for asking. Yes, variety of opinions. My view in a nutshell: Humans can't run 45 miles per hour in an attempt to prevent a dog fight. Outside environments = game on. It's our legal responsibility as dog owners to keep our own dogs under control to ensure the safety of others. (BTW, after a lifetime of training, recall is never guaranteed for any dog breed, particularly a sighthound in prey tunnel vision zone. This includes chasing a plastic bag carried by a breeze).
1. Per your request: Thread re: Greyhound's play style at dog park. (My post #68, page 4.)
http://forum.greytalk.com/index.php/topic/277897-should-i-be-concerned/page-4
2. The Lexus Project was originally founded to help a Greyhound on death row: http://thelexusproject.org/
3. Freddy was recently attacked (not in a dog park) but the photos illustrate how a Greyhound's thin skin can rip easily. http://www.greyhoundrescuerehab.org/freddy.html
Other GT threads will populate if searching dog park attack, etc. in "forums".
(Some GH adoption groups make it an easy decision for new adopters by requiring their adopters avoid public dog parks. Greyhound only play dates where all Greyhounds are muzzled are a safer option.)
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Yea for Freddy! Hoping a photo update or two will be posted here (or on Greyhound Rescue & Rehab's Web site).
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Remember that each life change is an adjustment. Luka was shy when he initially arrived into his foster home too. The biggest change now for Luka (as you know) is learning to adjust as a "single" dog for the first time ever in his life. Again, time will help. Many hounds live successfully as only dogs.
I'm so glad you were able to spend time in his previous foster home. I hope you were strongly encouraged by seeing a glimpse into Luka's personality in his familiar environment. Following you around as "his" person (in presence of other dogs) is a wonderful sign that Luka's becoming bonded to you as his new momma!
He probably felt safer walking around there without having had scary slip incidents too. I'm very encouraged from your last post. I would encourage you to invite another Greyhound friend over for temporary visits inside Luka's home. That could help increase his comfort level, by being doggie "host" in his home. Our first Grey was so reserved and didn't know how to play with toys... until our next foster arrived. The temporary foster quickly brought him out of his shell. I understand you may not be allowed overnight visitors, but maybe an afternoon hound visit would be permitted(?).
Answer to your cat question: I'd give Luka more time to adjust on his own first. We do have indoor only cats. (When sitting down, we usually have a cat in our laps.) If you decide to adopt a cat, I strongly recommend adopting an older cat well over 5-7 years old. (Cats can live into their mid teens - early 20s.) Although it's nice to have another living creature inside the home to help an "only" animal, our hounds don't love/snuggle with cats. They do tolerate them. Our current two kitties arrived under age 1. One cat has been "overly active" for our hounds' comfort for nearly 4 years now. Very young kittens can go crazy terrorizing hounds, pulling 6' tall plants over on dog beds, etc. Young, quickly darting kittens can be viewed as prey. We have a baby-gate installed about 5-6" above floor level as a cat escape route from hounds. (Our hounds were much happier with our senior cats.) Many other cat owners are on GT to chime in too...
Hope your live training sesson went well this weekend!
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Thank you so much for sharing your story to help others learn from your unfortunate experience.
Yes, Greyhounds are hunting sighthounds. Outside = game on.
Even small animals standing still outside can be viewed as prey.
Deeply bred instinct has nothing to do with an owner being viewed as alpha. Humans can't change instinct.
You hit the nail on the head with this quote:
"I shudder when I think this could have occurred there~~while I'm 50 feet or more away; where I have no leash, no control, and couldn't possibly run, never mind with anything resembling speed."
I'll add that dog "pack mentality" is usually involved in a dog park attack; most dogs fly over to join in the attack. Imagine 10-25 dogs in a pile with teeth flying in every direction. Some GH adoption groups have strict rules against attending public off-leash dog parks. All breed dog fights happen too often in dog parks, not to mention incorporating thin-skinned sighthounds into the mix.
Thank goodness the little dog survived, and that Bonnie showed her interest when you were within arms reach of the situation. Thanks again for sharing.
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Oh, I'm so very sorry to see your sweet, handsome boy, Joseph has passed. He was so fortunate to have become your family member, living under your loving, caring wing. Our deepest heartfelt sympathy is with you all during this most difficult time.
Godspeed Joseph...
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Oh, I am so very sorry for your loss of Gweneth, your first Greyhound girl. Their impact on our hearts is forever. Looks like she had a wonderful seven years with you. (My eyes are leaking along with you.)
Godspeed Gweneth as she joins her angel friends over the bridge...
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Batmom's mention of watching Snowy during potty outings is very important. Many hounds try to come back inside before doing their business. Addition to teaching do "business," I teach different commands for pee and poop. They DO understand the differences. Two of our girls often try to come back inside before they've peed. I make direct eye contact with them, and tell them to go "PEE" (or poop), and they do it! If I missed seeing my broodie pee, she makes tight circles then stands at the door to tell me she's already done that! They are sooo funny!
When your night video recording began, seemed Snowy was near the door(?) leading outside. Her nightime initial awakenings may have been from lack of daytime exercise (or potty needs), then not finishing her business during the 2:15 a.m. outing, or hearing a wild critter outside, etc.
Many Greyhounds truly do smile. (Some people are frightened by seeing a Greyhound's lips raised with teeth showing - not realizing their dog is simply showing great happiness/joy.) Snowy reminds me of our brood matron, who also smiles when very, very happy. Snowy was likely thrilled with her new fun puzzle!
Great that she's playing so well with your other dogs. It's clear you are long time animal lovers, and I think you've scored an exceptionally great girl in Snowy! Continue to have fun with her, and please do take her to obedience training classes, and continue studying deeper canine language. Both should be positive, life-changing bonding experiences. -
Hard not seeing everything going on in the room (assuming she's not reactive to video camera), not knowing the time, how long before she had eaten, and her last potty, etc. But she's intensely trying to communicate something to you in both videos, but her communications aren't being understood, thus higher frustration in night video. (She even got my senior brood matron riled up while listening to the video. lol)
My guesses:
She needs to go potty. (Even if our hounds go potty just before a meal, they often need to go back out within about 20 minutes later, especially if we just opened a new bag of their usual food.)
She's bursting at the seams with bottled up energy, desperate for physical exercise - cabin fever(?).
She's hungry.
In general, she needs more mental stimulation. She strikes me as a VERY intelligent Greyhound.
I'm not sure what the short bursts of high-pitched noises were in the day video, for a moment I wondered if that was setting Snowy off but it stopped and she didn't stop barking. She appeared more playful in day video - again maybe pinned up energy trying to entice you to play, but she might have been asking you to let her outside too. Or maybe she was mad that she was left behind when the person mentioned in the video left the house (maybe in a car?) without her.
Interestingly, our hounds don't come up just asking for attention often. They do come to me when they need something. If I can't figure it out right away, I stand up and walk to the nearest intersection of the room/s. I stand there asking the dog what he/she needs. I watch them for their answer. They usually glance or point their head in the direction of "the issue".
If one hound is hungry, he touches the food bin with his nose, sometimes combined with a temper tantrum where he stomps his front paws and does the digging motion that Snowy did. His paw stomps mean that he's really serious.
Or he will "look" at a dog bed if he wants "the one" that one of his sisters is using.
If it happens when we are traveling (without a door bell) they will glance at a door leading outside (means they need to go potty).
Our brood mom will stand in the direction she wants to go, then she'll turn only her head back to look at me. That means "follow me". She does the same with her offspring, and her pup understands to follow mom.
Agree with posters above re: not reinforcing her barking. I can also see that Snowy needs you to keep watching her closely to develop an understanding of her language (not her barking, but the root cause of her barking) so you can both communicate effectively.
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I'm so sorry for this sad loss of your boy, Pop. He's surrounded by many greyhound angels at the bridge. Such nice photos, especially the one of you with both hounds together... a nice memory of Pop curled towards you.
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Glad he was well enough to come home overnight. Good for him to be in his own relaxed environment with you.
Aww, what a sweet photo of both of your babies. Positive thoughts and prayers are being sent your way for Jabari.
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Oh good, happy that Max is back where he belongs, I imagine he is too! Thanks for the photo of your sweet boy, at least it looks like a nicely carpeted basement.
Glad that staircase is bocked off now. I wonder where he was headed in the first place - silly boy. -
Good to muzzle any dog that may be in pain before handling.
After hubby gets home, might work to have one adult on each side of belly holding up the towel (sling) under belly. A strong cloth bag with sewn handles can work well, but needs to be cut open to create sling design.
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I am so very sorry for your loss of Hero. Heartbreaking.
May Hero rest in peace, knowing he was so deeply loved by his family.
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Congratulations to you and your family!We'll look forward to reading more about your handsome new boy, Starz Arctic Sun! We love pictures!
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Obedience classes with a positive method instructor (hopefully Greyhound savvy) would be great. The trainer should respect that Greyhounds should not be allowed off leash, and modify exercises for Snowy. You are right to not allow her off leash.
If a bed growl happens again. Please keep your distance. Go into another room to happily call Snowy into the other room for a super yummy treat or toy. If she doesn't respond (by moving off the bed), take a smelly treat (like meat, tripe, etc.) to show her while calling her off the bed. Best to let Snowy follow the treat without any human touching her. If that doesn't work, try showing her the leash (from a distance) as if she's going for a walk or ride, etc.
Growling is a dog's way of communicating displeasure. If dogs are scolded for growling (might have happened in her previous life), they are more likely to skip a "warning" growl in the future and go directly to a bite. Therefore, a human keeping a respectful distance away from a growling dog is very important.
Many dogs with sleep startle, space issues, and some dogs with a questionable past are much safer not being allowed on human's furniture.
I agree with suggestions for a veterinary check, and to start fresh with housebreaking (and being sure to thoroughly eliminate urine odor from floor/carpet). Try to keep Snowy in the same room with human/s to keep a watchful eye open for any pacing behavior and/or floor sniffing (vs. allowing her full house freedom for now).
I taught all of our Greyhounds to "touch" target a door bell when they need to go potty. It has been a wonderfully effective clear communication method in our home for years. The key is to respond to the dog's bell ring immediately, so they are assured it works (for their bodily function needs) every time.
If interested... Teaching dog to ring a bell for elimination outings (not to exceed 3-5 minute total):
If bell has any sharp edges, cover edges with felt.
1. First, only let dog see/smell extra smelly high value treat (best if never dog tasted it before).
2. Hide treat under bell (on floor). Wait for dog to touch bell with nose = instantly reward with treat.
Repeat a couple of times adding words like "touch bell".
3. Then person holds bell (with hidden treat) on flat open hand near door knob (of potty exit door). Nose touch = reward with treat.
4. Then hang bell on door knob, hiding treat under bell. Nose touch = reward with treat.
5. Thereafter, reinforce daily by having dog touch the (hanging) bell every time that door is opened for an elimination outing. Dog is now receiving a double reward for each bell touch. First reward is a treat, combined with the door magically opening every time dog touches bell. After the bell ring is well ingrained in the dog's mind (within a week or two) you should be able to stop the food treats, then simply consider the door opening (and dog relieving herself) the dog's reward.
FWIW, a couple of our hounds have a play style of barking when trying to encourage others to play. We get a single or double bark from the others when they're trying to tell us something important.
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Yea, happy to read Luka is walking on your new rugs!
He should continue to feel much more confident moving around the house with secure carpet under his paws. (Funny, I almost mentioned to check his nail length, but didn't want to overwhem you with one more thing. Glad to know they're trimmed now.) During the coming days/weeks continue with gentle rewards when he shows interest in you.Quick comments re: car
If you're giving Luka a bully stick to encourage him to jump inside the car, please be careful to not let him eat while the car is moving. They can be a choking hazard, more so in a moving vehicle. Yes, bites of meat (tripe or soft smelly treats) are great for car entry/exit practice (if you don't want to wait for him to finish a bully stick).
The back half of our SUVs looks like a flat mattress. Flat, dense foam fits wall-to-wall and offers some stability in a moving vehicle. (Some dogs have trouble keeping their balance on overly pillowy beds, especially if driver hits the breaks suddenly.)
Here's a similar example (ours were reasonably priced from a foam/futon store). Costco often sells an orthopedic foam dog bed in summer.
I'm so sorry about your recent loss of Kei. I can tell she was a very special girl. I'm glad Luka is there to help keep you company now, and you're patiently helping him learn to trust and eventually feel love. It's a heartwarming experience.
Glad you'll have a trainer coming in person. Please let us know how it goes. Yes, it would be great to pop over in person!
Another option is meeting another Greyhound owner friend for a Greyhound group walk.
Congratulations to you and your family!
Throwing Up - Should Have Trusted My Gut
in Health and Medical discussion
Posted
Ugh, sorry about your boy. Several of our hounds vomit bile when their tummy is empty. One refuses to eat when she's gone too long without food too. Meat only Gerber baby food (stage 2) sometimes spurs her to eat a few bites of bread or rice. Better not try Pepcid since it can be problematic combined with other medications. His timing does seem like empty tummy troubles vs. kibble stemmed illness. Hope he feels better soon.