Another Raw Question

[Busderpuddle]

I am slowly thinking about trying raw feeding again with Ruby because she is losing weight and is so picky. She now weighs 58 lbs. How do I calculate how much to give her a day ?

Do I feed her once or twice a day ? Frozen or thawed meat ? Any worries about any of the raw bones, such as pork ? She is allergic to beef so we won't be trying that.

Also, is it safe to feed fish ? With the bones ? It seems so lean that I worry she would not get enough. I am always hungry after eating it.........lol. Is fish skin safe to feed ?

Thanks

[CharlieRhea]

http://dialogs.bravorawdiet.com/howmuch.html

 

scroll down to bottom of page to see the percentage to feed-it says 3 percent for weight gain. You don't have to feed Bravo but can still use this calculator. My dogs get the full amount calculate divided by two as they are fed twice a day which i think is healthier than once, a lot to digest at one sitting. I thaw mine out over night and keep it refrigerated for no more than 2 days. When i make Salmon i always give them the fish skin. Sardines are good too as is salmon oil and coconut oil

[Remolacha]

1 1/2%-2% for maintenance, so 3% would be a good start for weight gain. You can adjust as you go, depending on your dog's metabolism. For example, I am feeding 73lb Conner as much as I fed 90lb Fletcher because Conner has a harder time keeping weight on. I feed thawed food, some people like partially frozen. Choice is yours, and what Ruby prefers. Pork can be a little rich, but I have a friend whose dog is allergic to beef who feeds mainly pork with no problem. If you can find baby back ribs on sale that would be a good start, ribs are pretty soft bones. Pork necks are also an option, but both will need some more meat added. Fish is fine if she will eat it. Some dogs love it, some don't. Small fish (sardines, etc) can be give whole. Skin, bones are fine.

 

It seems complicated at first, while you are fine tuning what your dog prefers and what works for you, but it really is easy once you get started

 

and yes, you can mix kibble & raw!

[RedHead]

 

Do I feed her once or twice a day ? Frozen or thawed meat ? Any worries about any of the raw bones, such as pork ? She is allergic to beef so we won't be trying that.

Also, is it safe to feed fish ? With the bones ? It seems so lean that I worry she would not get enough. I am always hungry after eating it.........lol. Is fish skin safe to feed ?

I would feed the meat thawed (I give occasional frozen for a treat in the summer). I feed pork ribs but they are heavy on bone content so I don't feed them daily. If I did it would have to be balanced with boneless meat.

 

Most fish is safe to feed, however I believe it is raw salmon that is a no-no due to a parasite it can carry. I have bought the little bags of frozen smelt or sardines, but most of my dogs won't eat it. I feed canned fish 2-3 times per week, and if I ever buy salmon I bake it for them.

 

It might be easier for you to try a raw/kibble mix. You could start by adding some ground chicken or turkey into some kibble to see if there is improvement. A lot of people find this less intimidating, especially in the beginning. Most dog's will eagerly eat their food like this.

[Guest Lillypad]

Curious.. you mentioned... "she is allergic to beef, so we won't be trying that" How have you concluded this. Is she allergic to fresh raw beef? or do you mean a beef kibble? There is a big difference between how your hound will react to fresh beef as opposed to a beef kibble. Would it be beneficial to try her on fresh beef? Pork is great, I get some great sales on pork. It is important to not buy any enhanced, smoked, or salt brine pork products though. Pork is rich so go easy at first. It really should be one of the last proteins introduced in a new to raw diet. I would give small pieces as a supplement to chicken or beef. Build your hounds bowel tolerance, perhaps trim the fat from the pork. My concern (since you are just newly transitioning) is rich foods such as fish and pork will cause bowel upset. Although pork for human consumption has been proven parasite free, I still freeze it for 3-4 weeks (just me, l like the extra assurance) I don't feed much fish, but that is only because I don't have much access to fresh fish. I recommend feeding twice a day since you are just starting raw and especially since you are trying to add weight.

[Busderpuddle]

She was given raw burger at a kennel tice and both times had explosive diarrhea when I brought her home. Not a fun time for either of us.

[Guest Lillypad]

IMO, (just me perhaps I am stubborn, naive or both... LOL) I would like the full scenario, before I completely ruled out beef. So many factors to consider. I feed ground burger beef with no problems, BUT there are things to consider with ground burger beef (and this is true for all ground meats and mixes) 1. Ground "can" have a higher bacteria load. (I always feed cold and freshly unfrozen) So you have to ask, how was the ground at the kennel fed, perhaps it was left out too long, perhaps it was warm, perhaps it was old. 2. Ground is a fatty meat. Was the ground fed at the kennel a low grade quality, was she fed too much. I choose only lean and if possible extra lean ground. I will feed regular (if I get a great sale or in a pinch) in very small amounts and with a bony meal. 3. A dog has to develop a bowel tolerance for fats. Did she get an overload at the kennel. 4. Was the ground pure meat with no fillers. (Some burger grounds have fillers and seasoning because they are designed for human (hamburgers) consumption.

 

If it were me I would try beef again in a situation that I was in control of, before I truly ruled out beef all together or concluded there was in fact an allergy. I would not feel confident going by a kennel's recommendation. My guess she had an overload at the kennel. This could be remedied and managed with a slow introduction to the fats. Adding ground to a bony meal, such as a chicken thigh or bone in breast.

 

When budgeting for a raw diet, ground (burger) beef can be a good economical protein in the diet, but should be part of the variety not the mainstay. Beef chunks such as stew beef and beef brisket is a better way to introduce beef protein to a newly raw feed dog than work into that diet, ground (burger) beef.

 

Hope this helps. It is possible she truly has an allergy to beef (I feel this is unlikely). More often than not, it is the type of beef, what the beef was fed, and the source rather than the actual beef protein. Prehaps, venison would agree with her. It is important to have variety in a dog's meals, chicken is great (white meat) but dogs require red meats (beef, pork, venison, lamb, goat) in their diet. A small amount of dark meat can be found in turkey, but hardly the best source. If you find for some reason she is allergic to red meats than turkey, duck, goose are alternatives to add variety.

 

Ultimately, it is up to you. Is it important enough to make the effort and absorb the costs. Are you seeing the results you hoped on a raw diet. Nothing is more important than health, you have nothing if you don't have health. I like to think the effort (or aggravation if one chooses to call it that LOL) is worth it. When we first got our girl, her BM's were less than ideal. When she developed a UTI we took her to the E-VET. (of course everyone knows you pay twice as much for that service, but never-the-less, I was not prepared to cause her any undue suffering) The vet prescribed antibiotics and told me she would most likely have re-occurring UTI's (it was just the way it seems to be, he said, and he really could not advise why or suggest preventative measures) I decided then and there, no more kibble. Well, in the end.. who really knows for sure if it is the diet or not, but she has (knock on wood) never had a second UTI in over 2 years. Her teeth are clean, her breath is sweet, her coat is silky, no flaky skin, her foot pads are healthy (no yeast). Her eyes and ears are clear (no gook, no smell) her BM's are great. She turned six February 1. I have incurred no vet expenses other than the routine annual visits recommended. I like to think that the extra I pay for raw, has paid for itself by keeping me out of the vet office. Am I just lucky ??? could things turn sour for us... who really knows for sure, but I like to think the diet is beneficial and a factor in her well-being. Best of luck with whatever you decide. I know you are working hard to make Ruby happy.

Edited February 24, 2015 by Lillypad

[Guest kisstherain]

Hi, someone above already mentioned a good proportion of raw meat to body weight. As for feeding one or two times a day, I personally feel like it is easier on my hound’s stomach if I split the meat into two meals instead of giving it to her all at once. Raw bones are fine though you might feel alarmed at first when hearing them crunching through the bones. Do NOT feed them cooked bones however, as they can splinter and cause serious problems. I don’t thaw my meat in order to make mealtime last longer and my girl enjoys all the chewing. I’m not sure whether fish with bones is fine, I usually buy canned Alaskan salmon for my girl, which has no bones. Fish skin should be safe, they even make chews from dried fish skin. I would suggest finding a good butcher shop and buying your meat in bulk and portioning the food yourself if you have the freezer space..you will save a lot of money that way!

[Guest LauraB]

We've been feeding raw for 3 years. Here's what we do. It helps that we have a freezer. I buy chicken gizzards, thighs, legs and chicken quarters when they are on sale. $1.00/lb for legs and thighs, 69 cents for quarters, $1.69 for gizzards. I buy pork trimmings for $1.49, and beef heart, cut in chunks for $1.69. A friend who hunts gives use venison ribs, Occasionally I find duck, or lamb heart, or chicken hearts. We get liver from our hunter friend. I freeze it all. Every few weeks we have Dillard Food Bag Day.

We put an assortment in plastic bags. There is always a chicken thigh or leg, sometimes a bit or liver, and some of everything else. The venison bones are only given as treats. A chicken quarter is one meal and only given once in a while because I try not to feed too much bone.

We freeze the bags, defrost 2 a day, and we are all set for few weeks. I do freeze parts before the day we bag, since I don't buy everything at once, and I refreeze the bags. Preparing the bags takes a little time, but the rest is easy. Dillard has only been to the vet for his booster shots and his teeth are perfect. For treats he gets peanut butter on his kong, small bits of hot dogs, and small bits of cheese. He turns away from most fruit, but does like watermelon.

I did a lot of reading on the Raw Feeding site on facebook. It is a little extreme for me, since I won't do road kill or butcher a deer, but the guidelines are excellent. I do follow their advise to keep his food in as large a piece as I can, so I don't cut meat up or grind. Beef heart comes in cubes and pork trimmings in large chunks.

I know this is not for everyone, but it is working for us. Good luck whatever way you go.