Undercover Vet Segment On 20/20.

[JJNg]

And now my vet is charging $3 PER VACCINE for "Sharps disposal." Excuse me. But you're already marking up the cost of the vaccine by about 400 percent. And I'm SURE that the $56 charge for the visit more than covers the cost of having your Sharps emptied weekly. Imagine the profit! Every client paying $3 per needle, week after week!

 

How do you know how much profit your vet is making from those charges? Do you know what your vet clinic's overhead costs are? How much they spend on rent/mortgage, utilities, payroll, supplies, equipment, taxes, worker's comp, insurance, etc, etc...as well as those biohazard fees? As I mentioned above, very few people seem to understand how small the profit margin is in an average veterinary practice. Especially as more and more people turn to online pharmacies, low-cost spay/neuter and vaccine clinics (many run by local shelters), vets will increasingly have to raise fees elsewhere to cover costs to even stay in business.

 

There is also the phenomemon of what the industry has termed "no-lo practices" - clinics that have the cash flow to stay in business, but where there is very little to no actual profit. These low value clinics become impossible to sell when owners eventually start to think about retirement. This is a problem that is being seen more and more in the profession in recent years. On top of this is the issue of educational costs that are increasing at a rate that is proportionally much higher than average or starting salaries.

 

There are a lot of concerns regarding the future sustainability of the veterinary profession, and it really frustrates me to see people who assume that vets make a lot of money and do what they do because they are trying to rip people off to make more profit. I'm not saying that never happens, but the majority of the time, that's not the case. The reality is that this profession is made up of lots of vets and practices that are just struggling to stay afloat. Honestly, it's at the point where I'm reluctant to encourage anyone to pursue a career in veterinary medicine unless they understand that it's something most of us do out of passion and not necessarily financial success, despite (or because of) the long and expensive educational investment.

[Hubcitypam]

There is also the phenomemon of what the industry has termed "no-lo practices" - clinics that have the cash flow to stay in business, but where there is very little to no actual profit. These low value clinics become impossible to sell when owners eventually start to think about retirement.

I think my older vet is in that situation. He is retirement age and is basically a solo practice with a relief vet on Tuesdays. His recommendations are always spout with my other vets recommendations. There is not a computer in front of the house or in the exam rooms. All patients records are either hand written or typed on client cards. When I walked in it was the first time I'd seem a typewriter in probably 15 years, but he came highly recommended by several rescues. I'm thinking maybe he plans on retiring soon & will just adjust the price so whomever buys it can choose the system that they want. Is there talk of making vets go to electronic records like human doctors have to do by next year?

 

The older guy is on his game and I go to him for lots of small things but if it is big I drive 20 minutes to the vet that has regular and cold lasers, the ability to show you radiographs in the exam room using a John Madden pointer and lots of other bells and whistles.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Hubcitypam

[JJNg]

Good response article from a vet:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/donna-solomon-dvm/true-confessions-of-a-vet_b_4341146.html

[DofSweetPotatos]

I understand the sharps disposal fee. Not only is it a fee, but it is also a way to show the regulatories that sharps are supposedly being disposed of accordingly. Just another record tracker. Some vets oversell and over charge and some don't. Having worked ins vets office, I've seen both sides of that coin. The office I worked in, vets made a "commission" on services sold. Some vets were like car salesmen and others just practiced good medicine. I no longer work there because I had issues with the upselling, especially when they started pushing the techs to do it. I can't, makes me uncomfortable. I can educate a client, but I can't push them to buy.

I like to go to a more transparent practice, so I do. I have a very open line of communication with my vet and know who I wish to see at the practice. There is one doc I avoid because she did the "oh, he needs a dental" while barely lifting the lips. I informed her that he only has his 4 canines. To which she. Rapidly changed subjects. After the visit I spoke with the office manager about it and the problem has been addressed. There is a note in my file that I will not see that doc.

[Hubcitypam]

. There is a note in my file that I will not see that doc.

OMG - I'm not the only one!!!!!

 

Printed on the front of our folder in black sharpie is "Client does NOT want to see Dr. Susan".

 

The practice has always been very good to me but five years ago when Poodle had his first stroke we ended up with her. She said he most certainly had a stroke so we needed to do tests that were over $1K. I told her I was on food stamps and she said "Well, if it is a matter of spending as little as possible on this dog you can try aspirin". How crappy did that make me feel? Poodle and I have been through a lot in the last 13 years and even when I pretty much living on beans. rice, pasta etc. He never went without heartworm meds or flea/tick as needed. There was a very low time he had to eat Dog Chow but we made it out alive.

 

Contrast that to my main vet Dr. Josh. When we had to let Buddy go I swear he was really having a very very hard time...maybe harder than me.

 

Poodle just seems to have strokes (3 so far) on Josh's day off but Dr. Joe was really good,

Poodle went to Dr. Josh this week He peeing on all the dog beds and had other problems. He didn't charge the $129 radiograph but did bill the $60 for the ultrasound. Poodlum started out at 17 units of insulin, has gone down as low as six and noe we are going back to 12,

Edited November 29, 2013 by Hubcitypam

[DofSweetPotatos]

Pam, it is just good client service for them to note things like that.

The practice I worked in did the same thing for several clients.

Pam, glad Poodle has found a good doc, sorry you were treated so crappily. Some vets, just like human docs, have zero bedside manner .

I think we, as pet guardians, have to remember that when we visit the vet we are making decisions regarding care based on information and statistics and guts. Much like an HMO does for humans (minus the guts). When it boils down to it, it is all managed care.

[KF_in_Georgia]

ABC's "house vet" Marty Becker has severed his relationship with ABC. The 20/20 producers pressured him into delivering a statement they could use in support of their pre-determined slant for the article, and Dr Becker won't be doing business with ABC any more. Becker discusses the details here. Other vets comment here. Apparently, 20/20's other "expert" quoted at length is an ex-veterinarian with a for-profit website with a "free DVD"; after 30 days, there's a subscription charge just to view his website.

 

ABC did a disservice to honest vets and their clients with this report.

[inugrey]

Thank you for the link, Kathy. I'll be sharing that. I'm also sending my vet a treat basket.

[Guest Giselle]

- Average veterinary student loan debt upon graduation: Around $150,000

- Average starting salary for small animal practitioner: Around $50,000-$70,000

Meanwhile, those with dollar signs in their eyes are opening more and more veterinary schools, accepting more and more veterinary students, and, some argue, are fundamentally devaluing the profession. With a debt 3X the size of our average salary, becoming a veterinarian is financial suicide. None of us get into this for monetary gain. We are told this from the outset. We know this. We know it's pretty much a dumb idea.

 

So, why do we do it? Because we're all a little idealistic, a little naive, really hopeful, and, mostly, we just love the field so darn much. We also know that the state of current affairs is unsustainable. And we are driven to change it and guide it in ways that will benefit animals, their humans, and the profession in the long-term.

 

However, I won't deny that most of the general public does not understand what exactly goes into running a veterinary clinic and how advanced veterinary medicine has become. We are offering cutting edge services at a fraction of the price that human medicine offers it. But, regardless, to the average client, the price tag seems exorbitant. I don't have answers, and I fully understand clients' frustrations because I have always shared the same sentiments. So, I do empathize with folks who are taken aback by vet bills. A local vet once charged me $30 to express my dog's anal glands, a 5-minute service that my classmates and I could perform for free. But I also understand that vet clinics these days often struggle and that newly minted vets are struggling even worse. I don't think the current state of veterinary medicine in America is sustainable, and I honestly cannot wait to see it change. I think these recent negative articles about vet medicine are just the tip of the iceberg, and I'm actually looking forward to some fundamental changes to the way things work in American vet med.