Home Cooking - Quantities?

[Guest OPointyDog]

I've posted about our poor guy Mika and his chronic diarrhea before. We're still having problems, and so far he's done the best on home cooked meals. The main question I have is how much to feed him - I can't find any information about how much food he should get.

 

Background: We got Mika in December, and he was a bit underweight (68lbs; racing weight 72lbs) and having pudding poop while on the food his foster family gave him (Purina One Lamb & Rice). I tried gradually switching him onto Iams Lamb & Rice (which our other grey eats) and when that didn't work, tried the green bag of Iams. Basically he just had MORE diarrhea with that. We've tried grain free (Wellness, Nutro), novel protein (venison, fish, buffalo), etc. Starting in late February, the loose stools turned to almost complete liquid, and we tried Flagyl and boiled hamburger and rice. For 5 days he had perfect poop! But then it deteriorated again. Since then we've tried low fat novel protein (Solid Gold Wolfking), and most recently, even a hydrolyzed hypoallergenic food (Purina HA). We tried Flagyl again. We've tried Tylan Powder. He's had a round of Panacur. He has control of his bowels, but what comes out is bright yellow, mucus and frequently liquid.

 

He had tapeworms when we got him, and he's been treated for those.

 

He's been tested for SIBO and B12 deficiencies. SIBO was negative, but B12 was low, so he's on supplement shots, once a week. He's dropped down to about 64 lbs and we can see his ribs. His coat is shiny and he still has lots of energy. All other bloodwork is normal.

 

Saw the vet again yesterday, and we decided to go back to hamburger and rice for a few days before trying a prescription high-fiber food. So last night he got hamburger and rice and Tylan powder, and this morning, he had the first solid poop in 2 months. I don't know if it will last, but I'm beginning to think maybe he will need home cooking.

 

My big question is this - how much should I give him?? He LOVES food of all kind and will absolutely eat until he pops if given the chance. He even eats his food with the Tylan powder on it. So his appetite is no indication.

 

Mixing rice and hamburger about 1:1 for volume, how many cups should a 70 lb dog get? Do you measure it by packed cups? And should I feed more to get his weight up? We split his food into 3 meals a day to try to keep the volume per meal lower.

 

Any other useful hints or ideas would be appreciated!!

 

Here is the culprit:

 

[Guest FinnsMom]

Here is a calculator to help figure it out.

 

http://www.raw4dogs.com/calculate.htm

 

 

Have you thought about trying a raw diet with him and see if that helps any.

Edited May 2, 2013 by FinnsMom

[mom2four]

When our late Lab, Heidi, was on home cooked food for a while due to food allergies the vet gave us a formula of 1/4 hamburger, 1/4 veggies (usually canned green beans) and 1/2 rice, plus supplements that she gave us. Heidi got 1.5 cup in the AM and 1.5 cup in the PM if I remember correctly if she seemed hungry I gave her 2 cups in the PM....Raw might be something you could try too? She was big for a female Lab, bigger than some boys, at 75 lb.

[Guest Scarter55]

Since he is about 8lbs underweight, I'd give him basically whatever he will eat (within reason). How often do you feed him? You might consider three feedings a day if you aren't already, just to get him back up to weight. I'm always careful not to feed to much at one time. And also, I would invest in a good kitchen scale and weigh how much you are giving him. That way you can get much more precise both with the overall amount and the proportion of each ingredient.

 

When we got Lady (at 8 weeks old), she was pooping a little loose as well. It might have been the stress from the travel, or just from her being a puppy. We got Fruitables, which is a veggie supplement (http://fruitablespetfood.com/), and gave that to her to get a little extra fiber in her food. You may not need it if you are giving him home cooked vegetables, but just some food for thought (pun intended).

 

Good luck!

[MaryJane]

Try giving about 1/4 to 1/2 cup of hamburger with 1/4 to 1/2 cup of cooked veggies with about 2 to 2 1/2 cups of white rice twice a day. You will also have to give a multivitamin once a day and about four 500mg calcium (oyster shell WITHOUT Vitamin D). If you want a little more variety, you can give hamburger (about 1/4 to 1/2 cup) with about 1 to 1 1/2 cups of cooked oatmeal (5 minute type, NOT the quick) and about 1/2 cup rice for the morning meal - mix in some milk (or almond milk) to give it a stew like texture.

[TheFullHouse]

Here is what worked for Bullitt, boiled potatoes and hamburger. He is on a low protein kidney diet and had constant runny pooh until I tried potatoes. Those worked like a charm. Just boiled with the skin on, chopped or mashed after they were done with the hamburger added.

[Batmom]

I'd give minimum 1/2 cup cooked beef and 1.5 cups rice (white, cooked very soft) twice a day. Better would be 3/4 - 1 cup beef. I'd probably increase the rice to 2 - 2.5 cups after a few days if the 1.5 cups went through well. I wouldn't give him other things until you establish whether he can digest those two.

 

1/2 cup cooked beef is usually 2.5-3.0 oz (unless you REALLY pack it into the measuring cup). For a dog his size, you want at least 4 oz. twice a day to meet his body's minimum protein requirements. It's OK to start at a bit less for a few days to see how his digestive system responds, but if you're trying to get weight and condition back on him, more is better. I'd shoot for 6-8 oz twice a day, with rice to make up the rest of the calories.

 

Keep in mind that even in his condition (liquid poop), what you see coming out the back end is likely the meal you fed 24 hours ago, not the one you just fed this morning.

Edited May 2, 2013 by Batmom

[Guest OPointyDog]

Thanks everyone for the suggestions - I have thought about raw, but I'm really not ready to go down that road yet. I'm also concerned that given the delicate state of his digestive flora, that cooked is probably going to be easier for him to digest in the short run.

 

He has been on an elimination diet for a few weeks - he got nothing but Purina HA and Tylan powder for almost 3 weeks. So I agree with Batmom that right now we're just going to do cooked beef and white rice and the tylan powder until we're sure that's being digested OK. Then I can add new things (like vegetables) one at a time and see how it goes. The potatoes are a good idea and eventually I agree that I need to add a vitamin and calcium supplements.

 

Judy - how much do you feed Bullit per day of the hamburger and potatoes?

 

In the past when we've done hamburger and rice, I've given him about 1.5 cups of rice and 0.5 cup hamburger at breakfast and dinner, and then an additional 0.5 cup of hamburger with another cup of rice before bed. So he is already eating 3 x per day. It sounds like I should increase the protein a bit, so I'll do that.

 

I don't want to feed him too much at once, since I'm afraid it will overwhelm his colon. He will eat ANYTHING, though. Which is kind of his problem, really.... His middle name should be "dietary indiscretion."

 

Thanks, all!

[RedHead]

Just wanted to point out (as MaryJane said) you will need to add a multivitamin (for the short term it should be fine without), especially calcium to balance the phosphorus in the meat. If you like, you can use ground up eggshells. I have fed homecooked in the past and was told to do about 900 mg of calcium per pound of meat (which works out to about 1/2 tsp ground eggshells or calcium per pound of food). I honestly can't even remember how much I fed, I just filled up the bowl to what I thought was right

[Guest daniellering]

Chelsea is having the same issue--doing great on homecooked sweet potato and ground beef, but gets runny poo with mucous if I give her any kind of kibble (which would be soooo convenient). When she was more underweight, I also fed her 3x day. She's only about 2-3 pounds underweight now, so I've reduced it to 2x. I give about 2 cups sweet potato and 1/2 cup beef/vegetable mixture.

 

For me, it's a shorter term solution until I can find a filler that will give her more calories (right now I'm giving her 85% beef and adding some oil). I'm expecting in September, and I'm trying to plan for the possibility that I will not be able to keep up the homecooking to feed her as the only option. A few people gave me some good advice from the time I was trying to figure out what the issue was (under post Anyone Having Issues with Sorbitol and Diarrhea?). I got her in January, and she's had issues since then. She had tapes too, but several tests and dewormers later (as well as antibiotics) she seems clear. So it's got to be food-related, which is the tougher, more time-consuming problem!

 

Good luck!

[Batmom]

If you're having loose poop issues, better to add more beef and/or some egg and cut out the oil. I'm assuming it's some type of vegetable oil. Over the years most of my dogs have done poorly with any type of vegetable oil, either as an additive out of the bottle or as the main oil in a kibble.

[Guest OPointyDog]

Yes, I do think I'll see about adding potato or sweet potato and see if that helps. I've upped the quantities to about 6 cups of rice and 10 oz of boiled beef per day, split into 3 meals.

 

Peanut butter would probably be the best thing for getting weight up quickly, but I'm concerned that too much fat would bring a resurgence in the diarrhea - ditto with the cooking oil. So I'm thinking pasta and potatoes... Adding more beef is another possibility, I guess.

 

I've read about people giving their ailing dogs Ensure, but I'm not sure if that's a good idea, given that it's probably got all kinds of things in it that he might react to.