Still Wont Come In Front Door And Now Doesnt Want To Come In From Gard

[Guest KatyC]

Peggy still wont come in through the front door without being dragged or carried, we did some desensitizing to it on Saturday morning which worked after a while but she has obviously just reverted back again now.

 

Also she has taken to not wanting to come in from the back garden after she has been let out, even though she knows she gets a treat when she comes back in. Sometimes lately she has just looked at us and sat down in the middle of the garden! She wont come when we call her and even when we say 'treat' which used to work all the time. She doesn't still need the toilet as we wait for her to do it all and then let her wander around for a bit most times as well. Even if we go out and clip her lead on and walk her back, she will get as far as the back door and then stop and have to be lifted or dragged!

 

I'm pretty sure nothing has happened at either door to make her dislike them or fear them. She also does it with both me and my boyfriend now.

 

Is she just being stubborn and trying to be naughty?! When she sits down in the garden after we have been calling her for 5 minutes it certainly makes it seem like that!

 

It's proving difficult! Especially as the conditioning or densensitizing to the door works but only whilst we are doing it and then it's back to square one.

 

Any ideas or help?

 

Thanks

[Batmom]

What happens when she's inside? Ceiling fans, noises? Do you fairly often take her out and then leave? Does she get into things she shouldn't and get some scolding? (I'm not suggesting you're doing anything wrong -- just imagining what might be going on from her point of view. Dogs can be pretty weird about seemingly ordinary things.)

[Guest KatyC]

No we don't have fans or any noises going on in the house. She never gets scolded or told off when she comes back in. In fact she rearely gets told off at all. She tried to escape out of the garden once (over the fence) and I had to stop her but this wouldn't have any relevance to her coming in would it? It was right at the other end of the garden as well.

 

She goes out into the garden at all different times, not only when we leave and it's never usually right before we leave, but I suppose we do let her out or take her out before we go somewhere to let her go toilet.

She gets 2 walks a day and will come in the front door after the evening one because she knows that she gets her dinner. Should we try in the morning walking her before her breakfast so she can look forward to coming back in and getting it?

 

Not sure how to sort the back garden issue out though, I am going to order a whistle and try and start recall training to the whistle I think to see if that will help.

My dad thinks she is starting to get more confidence and being a bit of a teenager trying to push the boundries! do you think this is right and if so, how do I correct her?

 

She has been learning some basic obedience commands so maybe this has given her more confidence in herself! I don't know! It's very confusing!

[cleptogrey]

a couple of questions;

is the entry way open and clear? no tables, coat hanging on the walls or coat rack, shoes on the floor?

is it well lit?

have you tried the technique running her in w/ a ton of treats from another person(or you have another person run her in and you have the treats) using a happy recall?

 

when we worked this out w/ annie the doors were left open

dh ran her from the garden up the stairs into the kitchen at leat 20xs a trainig session.

it didn't happen immediatly, we practiced and practiced. we did have a set back, kept on working towards her bolting into the house.

 

do it fast so she doesn't have time to think.

do review the instructions in my first instructional post, i hope it helps. annie has/still does strange stuff like that. we call her jeckly & hyde...sometimes she steady sometimes a flake. i tell her to get a grip, she doesn't mind having me hold her collar and escort her, she knows i'll just kiss her to death(which she now loves).

Edited February 26, 2013 by cleptogrey

[Guest KatyC]

Yes we tried the running with both of us and one of us already in the house tempting her in with treats as well at the weekend.

 

The running helped a couple of times, but now she seems to have worked it out! Maybe we just need to practice doing it more, just don't want to stress her out either. I feel like we are always trying to balance teaching her new things to help her and stressing her out!

 

We do have some wellies by the door, I'll try moving these and see if it makes any difference

 

The light is usually on in the hallway so it is well lit.

 

Thanks for your advice so far, if we can master this and get her over it I'll be very happy as it will give me the confidence that we can change the unwanted behaviours into good things.

 

She's doing so well with in other things - she will now sit and wait for her dinner

 

Although, I'm convinced she is another breed of dog in a greyhounds body, as she isn't nearly as lazy/sleepy as other greyhounds and she can walk for miles without getting tired at all! She still hasn't got on the sofa to cuddle yet either, I hope she does in time!

[cleptogrey]

not all greys are couch potatoes...some are lively critters! all i have to say is walk in a sentence and my hounds are at the door- wide awake from a dead sleep. keep on walking! and stay patient. it took annie 9 months to learn how to get into the car! how long are you working on this?

[Feisty49]

I think she's trying to see how much she can get away with. In other words, I think she's being stubborn.

 

I've got one of those. Even after all this time she sometimes plants herself at the bottom of the stairs leading to the terrace. What gets her moving? Making her move. Gotta get their feeties/body moving. Most of the time she knows that when I say very firmly, "Come now, Annie!" she comes, but not always. Sometimes I have to give a gentle push on her neck. If that doesn't work, I use my thighs to push on her side. A gentle push usually does it but sometimes it takes 2 of them, with meaning behind them. Once her feet are unplanted, she always comes.

Edited February 26, 2013 by Feisty49

[a_daerr]

It's hard to say, but for a lot of greyhounds there is a significant change in behavior when you hit the 4-6 week mark. Shy and timid dogs will begin to gain confidence and push the boundaries a little bit. If she appears distressed and you notice her trembling, panting, or giving calming signals, then I would do a little bit more investigation to see if something is contributing to her fear... However, from what you've described in this post and other posts (that she has a silly streak and she's now just plopping down in the middle of the yard) it does sound like a touch of obstinance. Almost like, "I'm not ready to come back inside, and you can't make me!" I've found that the key to training statue dogs is to keep them moving. Take her out on a leash, and if you feel her starting to lag behind, increase your pace or turn in circles so she doesn't have the chance to freeze up. One thing you can work on training-wise are the cues "easy" (meaning, slow down), and "hurry!" (meaning, speed up). It's a form of heel, where you reward her for changing pace to keep up with you. Also, is there anything that will entice her to come back inside that's not food related? Perhaps a favorite toy? Does she like to play chasing games? I taught Truman recall by running away from him. Maybe you could initiate a game of "I'm gonna get you!!" and get her to chase you back inside?

 

If Peggy were my dog, I would just try a few different things and gauge her responses. Dragging or carrying should be a last resort (I understand it's sometimes necessary if she is being unresponsive and you have somewhere you need to get to). But sometimes, they can get used to being carried, and it adds to their reluctance to do things on their own. Truman had me believe that he was incapable of jumping in and out of the car on his own. He would just stand outside the car door and wait to be lifted. Henry went through a stage where he sprained his leg and had to be carried up the stairs for a period of time. Even when his leg healed, he still had us fooled to believe he couldn't go up on his own. Be careful, because they can "train" you just as easily as you train them. Be patient with darling Peggy and keep trying until you find something that works.

[Guest KatyC]

Thanks, I think she might be being stubborn too as at lunchtimes in the garden she always wants to come back in! So she isn't scared of the door.

 

We did it for a few minutes over and over with the fron door.

But have also been doing it as we come in from walks, it's hard though as we can't get her through the door usually.

We probably should be doing it more but it's so cold to have the door open for more than 30 seconds at the moment, especially after work (I know this is a lame excuse, I apologise!)

We will persevere with it

Peggy still wont get in the car either! I'm glad that you got their eventually, well done!

 

Today we were doing some clicker training at lunch, so we went in and out of the patio doors into the garden using the command 'in' and gets a click and treat when she comes in. Maybe this will help as she is picking up things with the clicker training quite quickly now. So if I can get her to learn it, it might help?! Or she might just decide to keep being a stubborn madam!

 

Here's the serial offender!!

 

[Guest KatyC]

It's hard to say, but for a lot of greyhounds there is a significant change in behavior when you hit the 4-6 week mark. Shy and timid dogs will begin to gain confidence and push the boundaries a little bit. If she appears distressed and you notice her trembling, panting, or giving calming signals, then I would do a little bit more investigation to see if something is contributing to her fear... However, from what you've described in this post and other posts (that she has a silly streak and she's now just plopping down in the middle of the yard) it does sound like a touch of obstinance. Almost like, "I'm not ready to come back inside, and you can't make me!" I've found that the key to training statue dogs is to keep them moving. Take her out on a leash, and if you feel her starting to lag behind, increase your pace or turn in circles so she doesn't have the chance to freeze up. One thing you can work on training-wise are the cues "easy" (meaning, slow down), and "hurry!" (meaning, speed up). It's a form of heel, where you reward her for changing pace to keep up with you. Also, is there anything that will entice her to come back inside that's not food related? Perhaps a favorite toy? Does she like to play chasing games? I taught Truman recall by running away from him. Maybe you could initiate a game of "I'm gonna get you!!" and get her to chase you back inside?

 

If Peggy were my dog, I would just try a few different things and gauge her responses. Dragging or carrying should be a last resort (I understand it's sometimes necessary if she is being unresponsive and you have somewhere you need to get to). But sometimes, they can get used to being carried, and it adds to their reluctance to do things on their own. Truman had me believe that he was incapable of jumping in and out of the car on his own. He would just stand outside the car door and wait to be lifted. Henry went through a stage where he sprained his leg and had to be carried up the stairs for a period of time. Even when his leg healed, he still had us fooled to believe he couldn't go up on his own. Be careful, because they can "train" you just as easily as you train them. Be patient with darling Peggy and keep trying until you find something that works.

 

 

Thanks, this is great advice.

 

Yeah she doesn't show any signs of being distressed. I might be able to lure her in with the temptation of favourite raw hide bone, but even then sometimes I don't think she'd bother! Maybe I'll cut up some cheese into cubes and try this as an extra special treat that she only gets when coming in from the garden!

 

It's mainly Jay that goes and picks her up, because he is a bit less patient than me (it is quite amusing to watch ) I'll try the game idea tonight when she does it. But we do both end up dragging her in after about 5 minutes of her standing there, especially in the mornings as we have to get ready for work etc. I'll tell Jay this isn't the best idea.

 

I've tried the leash idea to get her moving and it works up until we get to the door and then she wont budge!

[a_daerr]

I've tried the leash idea to get her moving and it works up until we get to the door and then she wont budge!

 

Peggy, you brat! I think the cheese is a good idea. Or at least some type of really enticing, special, high-value treat that you only reserve for this command. Another thing I'm wondering about... do you leave the house for work soon after she comes inside? Maybe she's starting to catch on that going inside = mom leaving. In that case, she's creating a diversion to get you to stay longer. So I wouldn't be too mad, because that means that (1) she loves her mom and doesn't want you to leave, and (2) she's clever. I know several people whose dogs have excellent recall EXCEPT when it's time to leave the dog park, then they have "selective hearing."

[Feisty49]

OHhh. she's B&W, one of my favorites. Looks like she's thinking, "You shouldn't share family problems with outsiders!" LOL

[Guest KatyC]

Peggy, you brat! I think the cheese is a good idea. Or at least some type of really enticing, special, high-value treat that you only reserve for this command. Another thing I'm wondering about... do you leave the house for work soon after she comes inside? Maybe she's starting to catch on that going inside = mom leaving. In that case, she's creating a diversion to get you to stay longer. So I wouldn't be too mad, because that means that (1) she loves her mom and doesn't want you to leave, and (2) she's clever. I know several people whose dogs have excellent recall EXCEPT when it's time to leave the dog park, then they have "selective hearing."

 

I suppose so, although she seems to do it the worst when we let her out during the evening and before bed, especially when it's dark, Then we aren't going anywhere - silly girl!

We will try the cheese and hope for a miracle!

 

OHhh. she's B&W, one of my favorites. Looks like she's thinking, "You shouldn't share family problems with outsiders!" LOL

Lol, definately, that's her 'excuse me woman, what are you doing' face

[JohnF]

Our Peggy went 'backwards' and into cussedness a few weeks into her rehoming. I think is because they actually become confident enough to rebel and then when they rebel they get worried about it. We got around it with Calming Signals and letting her know we understoood and it was OK - then she gradually became more sociable.

These doors must not be seen as room traps. Go back in the house and get on with something without worrying about her then she will come back in because it is nice to come back in. (Uless it is a slippery floor issue, in which case get a carpet runner.)

Reserve the hard pulling on the lead only for real danger situations like getting her out of the road or away from a fire etc.

[cleptogrey]

btw- getting our annie into the car....we have a 2 door no less- point her head into the car, insert front feet and a knee up the butt to push her in. the gentle pressure of the knee pushed her in and a verbal praise. she even mastered our pickup truck w/ a jump seat. having 2 greys back there was always a joke! when we inherited a 4 door car she couldn't figure how to get in and we had to start all over again! yes, be patient w/ peggy

[Guest KatyC]

We are still really struggling with this and have tried all the suggestions. Rarely we can get her in with some cheese, but I think that is just when she was going to come in anyway. This morning she just layed down on the grass in the garden and it's only 3 degrees c, it just seems strange behaviour to us and we can't seem to get around it.

Any more ideas or magic solutions welcome please?!

 

Thanks in advance.

[Guest KatyC]

anyone got any ideas?! Please

[Batmom]

Clip on the lead, turn away from her, bright cheerful "Let's go!" If she stops when you get to the door, still turned away from her, repeat your bright cheerful "Let's go!" And if she is still planted there after a minute or two, don't drag or lift. Get your legs behind her butt, keep your hand on the collar to steer, and push. "Good girl!" and a party when she's in.

 

Don't do that every time. When time and weather allow, go out, take a toy with you, and play with her for a bit. Then you go back in the house by yourself. Go back out a little later to bring her in.

[Guest KatyC]

Clip on the lead, turn away from her, bright cheerful "Let's go!" If she stops when you get to the door, still turned away from her, repeat your bright cheerful "Let's go!" And if she is still planted there after a minute or two, don't drag or lift. Get your legs behind her butt, keep your hand on the collar to steer, and push. "Good girl!" and a party when she's in.

 

Don't do that every time. When time and weather allow, go out, take a toy with you, and play with her for a bit. Then you go back in the house by yourself. Go back out a little later to bring her in.

 

 

Thanks will try this tonight.

Do we treat her when she gets in the house if if I have had to push her bum to get her in?

 

There is a small step up to the back doors so how do you think is best to push her up it?!

 

Have tried playing before, and she wagged her tail to start with bu then refused to play!! At lunchtimes when I go home for 30 minutes we go out and play in the garden and she wants to come back in when we're done easy peasy - maybe becuase her routine is she then gets a dentastick just before I leave again?

 

Should I try and get her into a routine where when she comes in each time she gets to chew on her bone for 5 - 10 minutes?

 

She's a lovely pooch apart from this, but it is starting to stress us out as we don't know how best to handle and fix the situation, and my boyfriend hasn't got as much patience so we end up squabbling about which would be the best way to do it etc!! We want her to want to come back in with us happily, it makes me feel bad that she would rather stay outside in the cold!

[Batmom]

For your small step, I'd lift up her front legs if need be. Then if you push gently from the back she should step up and go on in. You could say, "In the house, please!" just before she goes in the door (regardless of how she goes in). I would give her a treat whether you had to push/carry/whatever or not -- sort of like when you're teaching an adult dog to go up stairs, at times you have to do most of the work but you still reward.

 

If she seems to like chewing the bone, that would be a good reward. You might want to have some alternative rewards, tho, for when you can't watch her with those types of things.

 

I'd play even if she doesn't want to. She might not play with you, but you could have some fun dancing around with or throwing/fetching a squeaky toy in the garden, and maybe she'll get the idea. You want her to think that you're lighthearted and fun people to be with. Which I'm sure you are, but sometimes you have to over-demonstrate .

[Guest KatyC]

For your small step, I'd lift up her front legs if need be. Then if you push gently from the back she should step up and go on in. You could say, "In the house, please!" just before she goes in the door (regardless of how she goes in). I would give her a treat whether you had to push/carry/whatever or not -- sort of like when you're teaching an adult dog to go up stairs, at times you have to do most of the work but you still reward.

 

If she seems to like chewing the bone, that would be a good reward. You might want to have some alternative rewards, tho, for when you can't watch her with those types of things.

 

I'd play even if she doesn't want to. She might not play with you, but you could have some fun dancing around with or throwing/fetching a squeaky toy in the garden, and maybe she'll get the idea. You want her to think that you're lighthearted and fun people to be with. Which I'm sure you are, but sometimes you have to over-demonstrate .

 

Thanks awesome advice as always.

I will try all of this tonight! I'll let you know if we have any success at all.

[Batmom]

It could take some time. After the first couple times, I'd put her on the leash, get her up close to the door, say your "in the house" words, and give her a minute or two to contemplate and do it herself. If she doesn't, then proceed as usual. Dogs are weird, and it can take them awhile to get over whatever's bugging them.

[Feisty49]

I've already posted but seeing that it's still an ongoing thread thought I'd toss in that I know what the president of my group would say if this was presented to her: "Give her a good push and don't take no for an answer. She'll get over it." She's a bit more abrupt than I am but, IMO, sometimes we go overboard treating them as if they're going to break or have egos that will deflate.

 

I think Greyhounds are relatively intelligent -- but there are many more breeds who are quicker and brighter -- but I think Greyhounds are very clever and, though many will not agree with me, will not do what you want just because they don't want to, with the best example being how so many plant themselves on a walk. When Annie used to plant herself frequently in the beginning (and occasionally now) I learned pretty quickly that sweet talk and treats didn't work. She wasn't going to move if she didn't want to move. Ya think? I'm the human; you're the dog. What worked was getting firm and giving a push on her side to get her feet moving. She used to give me BIG stink eye, but oh well. It got her moving. Same with learning the stairs. She shook. She whined. She hung her head. She held back. But she didn't want to stay downstairs at night by herself so there was no choice in the matter. She learned them because I got firm, instead of being wishy washy as I was right after adoption, and made her do them. Within 10 minutes she was a pro, and I think my no-nonsense attitude helped a lot.

[Guest KatyC]

I've already posted but seeing that it's still an ongoing thread thought I'd toss in that I know what the president of my group would say if this was presented to her: "Give her a good push and don't take no for an answer. She'll get over it." She's a bit more abrupt than I am but, IMO, sometimes we go overboard treating them as if they're going to break or have egos that will deflate.

 

I think Greyhounds are relatively intelligent -- but there are many more breeds who are quicker and brighter -- but I think Greyhounds are very clever and, though many will not agree with me, will not do what you want just because they don't want to, with the best example being how so many plant themselves on a walk. When Annie used to plant herself frequently in the beginning (and occasionally now) I learned pretty quickly that sweet talk and treats didn't work. She wasn't going to move if she didn't want to move. Ya think? I'm the human; you're the dog. What worked was getting firm and giving a push on her side to get her feet moving. She used to give me BIG stink eye, but oh well. It got her moving. Same with learning the stairs. She shook. She whined. She hung her head. She held back. But she didn't want to stay downstairs at night by herself so there was no choice in the matter. She learned them because I got firm, instead of being wishy washy as I was right after adoption, and made her do them. Within 10 minutes she was a pro, and I think my no-nonsense attitude helped a lot.

Thanks for this! I've just been on the phone to the trainer/rescue that we got her from to see if she had any advice and she said something similiar. She said that sh'e doing it for attention/being stubborn and to pull her in by her harness without saying anything to her and then once in take off the harness still not saying anything and not making a deal of it or treating her and then get on with cooking the dinner or whatever etc. Basically just ignore her, make her do it and she said she thinks she'll get over it pretty quickly once she knows that she doesn't get anything out of acting up!

 

Completely different to the approaches we've been trying, but we noticed when we first got her and she was spooked by everything that being firm and not coddling worked well so maybe she will respond better to this type of treatment.

 

Dogs are so confusing!!!!

[Feisty49]

Thanks for this! I've just been on the phone to the trainer/rescue that we got her from to see if she had any advice and she said something similiar. She said that sh'e doing it for attention/being stubborn and to pull her in by her harness without saying anything to her and then once in take off the harness still not saying anything and not making a deal of it or treating her and then get on with cooking the dinner or whatever etc. Basically just ignore her, make her do it and she said she thinks she'll get over it pretty quickly once she knows that she doesn't get anything out of acting up!

 

Completely different to the approaches we've been trying, but we noticed when we first got her and she was spooked by everything that being firm and not coddling worked well so maybe she will respond better to this type of treatment.

 

Dogs are so confusing!!!!

 

 

Good luck. I'm sure it will work because you want it to and have the confidence.

 

I don't know if you have kids, but pretty much I treat Annie Bananie Whisker Face (her verryyy long "love" name) as I did my son: "Spoil" with lots of love and positive attention and with the expectation that rules and good behavior will be adhered to. I took to motherhood easily, but it took me a couple of months after adopting Annie in July 2011 to relax enough to treat her like a dog, not some fragile, breakable china figurine.

Edited March 4, 2013 by Feisty49