How Often Do You Walk Your Grey?

[Guest SoulsMom]

Please listen to what I’m saying. Fear is an emotion. It’s primal and quite often genetic. No amount of counter conditioning or learned behavior can completely control it. When a dog reacts to the emotion of fear, all learned behavior is forgotten (fight or flight response) Allowing dog (who has already demonstrated a propensity to react to the emotion of fear) off her leash could have disastrous results, for the dog and possibly others (your bike incident). Especially a dog who can reach top speeds of up to 45mph in three strides.

 

I’m going to say no more on this subject, but I do hope you will take these words to heart. You know the consequences that can result from letting Shelby off lead. And if you continue to do so, I hope you can live with the end result should something unthinkable happen.

 

[Guest Mommydog]

Two 30 min walks a day, plus a 10 min potty walk round the block at night, and potty breaks in the garden. Winter they'll have a 1-2hr walk on a Saturday afternoon out in the country. In summer that increases to two or three 1-2hr walks.

[Guest Che_mar_Cody]

I didn't take anything as pointed to me directly, but since I fell under "these words of structured" wanted to clarify my view, so people might understand how I was thinking. Sometimes I just write and it really doesn't come out clearly as it's meant. That's the thing I hate about words, they can be typed with meaning something totally different then people read.

 

 

I was always taught with commands & talking with my police K-9 all the time. He followed my commands and body language/position as we were taught. My life & his depended on it. I too had to be aware of his body language as he was ready to "attack". He did this at work, and even when we were at home.

He was killed in training by some speeding person in a car. My fellow officers and I were more concerned about our fellow partner then getting a speeding car so we lights & sirened him to the vet.

Scooby died at the vet shortly. I've trained Cody similar to how I was taught with Scooby. Learning and reading my dogs language is very important to me, I've learned a very hard lesson about not being in tune with my dog. I blame myself for Scooby's death but it will not be in vane.

 

 

My walk with Cody involved commands, sniffing and US having fun. Who says you can't have it all.

I thought so much about this thread as I was walking him but came to realize we may not agree all on some issues, but we all agree on saving these beautiful souls.

We all care more about them then most dogs get treated or cared about.

Should we feel guilty for not walking our dog(s) everyday or how I walk him, no.

I feel for the poor dog that isn't part of the family. Who's kept outside alone day in and day out and never gets the walk and who's kept on a chain that they can barely drag around.

 

I've been on this board for some time and have realized that all of us... well our world revolves around our pups.

What else could any dog ask for.

Edited February 13, 2009 by Che_mar_Cody

[Guest Winterwish]

Che mar Cody I just wanted you to know none of my questioning this was with regard to you at all. Especially about talking to the poopsters! I've gone near loopy not having my own poopster to talk to. So I didn't want you to think I thought it was off somehow to talk to da' puppers.

My sympathies to you,so much so,about your beloved Scooby Che mar Cody.

 

 

You are absolutely right about the importance of reading our dogs language and being in tune with them,it's vital,just for the basic things like,maybe the dog is afraid,and may only show that by an upturn of their eyes.

Or maybe thay have stopped looking at their person as often when a new sibling comes in. Sometimes their communication is so subtle,a gentle note saying, "I don't like this."

 

shelbygirl07 my concern is the misreading of that communication.

Edited February 13, 2009 by Winterwish

[Guest md7nd]

I just want to thank everybody for their comments and pictures. I dont disagree with what most if not everybody said, tho i will add that Nina is happy and thats what matters to me. The walks will come, and hope camping with Nina will come this summer too. Which, I'll be glad to hear suggestions about camping with greys

[Guest Winterwish]

Che mar Cody...You are absolutely right about the importance of reading our dogs language and being in tune with them,it's vital,just for the basic things like,maybe the dog is afraid,and may only show that by an upturn of their eyes.

Or maybe thay have stopped looking at their person as often when a new sibling comes in. Sometimes their communication is so subtle,a gentle note saying, "I don't like this."

 

 

shelbygirl07,my concern here is the misreading of that communication.

Edited February 13, 2009 by Winterwish

[Guest KsFrets]

The M&M's are my distance running partners, and we go at least 5 miles of structured running every day. We go out every morning and every evening, rain or shine. Magnus lives for our runs, almost as if it's his job, as he takes it very serious, and leads the way and knows the courses. I swear that he smiles and is at his happiest during these runs. Maggie just follows and get her exersize. We don't stop and mess around while running. However, we also have a 1/2 mile cool down walk when we are done, and that's when they are free to roam and sniff stuff and pee everywhere.

Edited February 13, 2009 by KsFrets

[Guest Winterwish]

So,it's 2 1/2 miles every morning and 2 1/2 miles every evening?

I'm curious whether or not heat and humidity would effect that? Also,how old are your greyhounds? And one other question if you don't mind KsFrets,what if they did not live for their runs? and if they truly could clearly be understood as not wanting to run 5 miles each day?

I'mnot asking in a confrontational way,just wanting to know these kinds of answers if you're willing. Thanks!

Edited February 13, 2009 by Winterwish

[Guest shelbygirl07]

The M&M's are my distance running partners, and we go at least 5 miles of structured running every day. We go out every morning and every evening, rain or shine. Magnus lives for our runs, almost as if it's his job, as he takes it very serious, and leads the way and knows the courses. I swear that he smiles and is at his happiest during these runs. Maggie just follows and get her exersize. We don't stop and mess around while running. However, we also have a 1/2 mile cool down walk when we are done, and that's when they are free to roam and sniff stuff and pee everywhere.

 

see, to me, those 2 dogs look happy!

[Guest longdogs]

What does migrating have to do with walking your dog?

 

There's a theory that in their "wild state", canines migrate as a pack on a regular basis (daily?), and that further, the organization and leadership required in this activity helps cement the pack structure and relationships. The theory goes on to posit that humans can re-create this activity, and thereby reap the benefits of being the leader of the pack and having stronger relationships between their dogs, by going on vigorous walks with their dogs, with the human firmly in the lead and in control. Cesar Millan promotes something along these lines.

If that's the theory, someone needs to go back to the drawing board because it doesn't fit any reasearch I've read. First, some canines are non-migratory, most foxes and jackals for instance don't have regular migrations. Others such as Cape hunting dogs are based around a den location while there are pups, then can be broadly described as nomadic within a large home range. Wolves follow a similar pattern with considerable variation according to season and habitat. Wolves are one of the most widely distributed mammals. They are found in many places and have adapted to different ways of living. Some wolves form packs to hunt large game and some wolves could be said to 'migrate' in so far as they follow migrating herds of caribou and other game. The movement of individual or groups of wolves on a daily basis is not referred to as migration.

[Guest KsFrets]

So,it's 2 1/2 miles every morning and 2 1/2 miles every evening?

I'm curious whether or not heat and humidity would effect that? Also,how old are your greyhounds? And one other question if you don't mind KsFrets,what if they did not live for their runs? and if they truly could clearly be understood as not wanting to run 5 miles each day?

I'mnot asking in a confrontational way,just wanting to know these kinds of answers if you're willing. Thanks!

 

We actually have a 2 mile morning course and a 3 mile evening course. We've been at it a year, and weather changes things like dress and pace and bringing water, but it's never stopped us. Magnus has never missed a run. Several times in the cold winter, Maggie has simply not gotten up when I took the leashes off the wall, and was more than happy to stay home, and I don't mke her if she doesn't want to go. Mangus goes crazy weather it's 5 degree or 105 degrees, he's always rairin to go! Magnus will be 5 this year and Maggie will be 4. I run as part of my own fitness, and bringing the dogs has been a big plus, and super motivator... especially on days I don't feel like going, Magnus won't let me off the hook!

Edited February 13, 2009 by KsFrets

[Guest EmilyAnne]

For newbies out there with greyhounds, I just want to mention, greyhound's endurance needs to be gradulaly built up. They can not start out at 5 miles. Greyhounds are good at speed, and with time can develop endurance as well. Also, make sure you take in account the age and physical condition of your greyhound.

[Guest Winterwish]

...Several times in the cold winter, Maggie has simply not gotten up when I took the leashes off the wall, and was more than happy to stay home, and I don't mke her if she doesn't want to go.

 

I run as part of my own fitness, and bringing the dogs has been a big plus, and super motivator... especially on days I don't feel like going, Magnus won't let me off the hook!

Yes,I saw how old your beautiful greyhounds are when I clicked on your links.

 

What's important is that if they did not want to do it,they wouldn't be made to.

Another is the ages,of 3 to 4 1/2 years old.

The poll does not cover whether or not people have older dogs,and having them do things that are too much for them to do would be very wrong,so I wanted to ask about that and appreciate your responding!

Edited February 13, 2009 by Winterwish

[Guest Winterwish]

I say,just enjoy being with your dog! Walk him or her,have fun,enjoy,play with them outside,explore,if you're lucky enough to have a yard,have fun,enjoy,play with them outside,and explore there.

It's not such a big deal really,I think I got involved with this thread because I honestly don't understand it!

Edited February 13, 2009 by Winterwish

[Guest ArtysPeople]

What does migrating have to do with walking your dog?

 

There's a theory that in their "wild state", canines migrate as a pack on a regular basis (daily?), and that further, the organization and leadership required in this activity helps cement the pack structure and relationships. The theory goes on to posit that humans can re-create this activity, and thereby reap the benefits of being the leader of the pack and having stronger relationships between their dogs, by going on vigorous walks with their dogs, with the human firmly in the lead and in control. Cesar Millan promotes something along these lines.

If that's the theory, someone needs to go back to the drawing board because it doesn't fit any reasearch I've read. First, some canines are non-migratory, most foxes and jackals for instance don't have regular migrations. Others such as Cape hunting dogs are based around a den location while there are pups, then can be broadly described as nomadic within a large home range. Wolves follow a similar pattern with considerable variation according to season and habitat. Wolves are one of the most widely distributed mammals. They are found in many places and have adapted to different ways of living. Some wolves form packs to hunt large game and some wolves could be said to 'migrate' in so far as they follow migrating herds of caribou and other game. The movement of individual or groups of wolves on a daily basis is not referred to as migration.

 

I never said it was a good theory! Just repeating what I've understood people to be saying from books and online. Cesar Millan in particular talks about it a lot, though not always explicitly. Here's an excerpt from an online post he did last year:

 

In Nature: Dogs experience the world by walking. They have to earn food and water by migrating in search of it.

 

At Home: You can recreate this experience at home by taking your dog on a walk before providing food and water in the morning. It gives your dog three things vital to her happiness: 1) a chance to bond with you, the pack leader, 2) much-needed primal exercise, and 3) a "migration ritual" that offers a sense of purpose.

 

He also talks about it in his book Be the Pack Leader (first chapter available free online here)

Every dog likes and needs to walk with a pack leader in migration mode — how much, again, depends partly on breed and partly on energy. Every dog needs to be useful, to work for food and water — to be a helpful, productive member of your pack. Dogs are not solitary like many species of cats — they are social carnivores and their deep social needs are hardwired into their brains. Being social means they need the pack to be happy and fulfilled. Because we have domesticated dogs, we have become their default pack members throughout our long history together. If we were not around, they would still form packs. During the Katrina crisis, some of the dogs left behind did exactly that temporarily, in order to survive. But we’ve been “pack leaders” to them and/or their ancestors for at least tens of thousands - and perhaps as long as hundreds of thousands - of years, so although they absolutely realize that we are not dogs but humans, they will naturally follow us if we provide them with the correct direction.

 

The "wild state" and "back to nature" stuff may be utter hogwash, and for me they aren't really important. I have used some of Cesar's methods (some, people, I said SOME!) and found them to work for us and our dog to strengthen our relationship and create a peaceful and happy home, and in the end that's what's important.

 

That doesn't sound like anxiety to me. Sounds like she really enjoyed walking on the bike path and sniffing pee-mail, and she couldn't wait to get there!

 

I'd have to say that it definitely was anxiety. She would be ok for a minute and shake violently when she came up on one of her spots and she would go into statue mode when she would smell that spot. She basically shut down on me and i couldn't easily snap her out of it. She would just tremble and shake not to mention her eyes would pop out of her head (not litterally lol) and it was breaking my heart because i wanted her to enjoy her walks, not be anxious about them. I never fully believed in the "migration theory" either until i felt i had no other option but to try it. When i did, the world bloomed for my girl. The violent shaking stopped and she started smiling on her walks, head held high and her confidence returned to the point that it exceeded what confidence she had previously.

 

I've been thinking about your descriptions of Shelby for several days now, and I wanted to make several points. First, I acknowledge I wasn't there and I don't know your dog. I also acknowledge I've never met you or seen you and your dog interact, so I have no idea how to gauge your perceptions. HOWEVER, all your descriptions of Shelby acting "anxious" sound exactly like how Arty acts when he gets very excited (in a good way) and happy about something. When we're in the car and approaching a place he associates with good things, he starts pacing and whining. When he's sniffing pee-mail, he gets very focused and could be said to "statue". And when he gets very, very excited, he chatters a LOT, and could be said to be "trembling". The big tip-off that someone taught me about how to tell if a greyhound is happy or not is the tail -- the higher the tail, the more likely the dog is really enjoying whatever is going on. And in all of these situations his tail is waving proudly. I have seen him anxious and upset, and his behavior is very different. I am saying all of this as "food for thought", nothing more. As I said in an earlier post, I like to hear different peoples' theories and ideas about dog behavior and then "road test" them for myself. I hope you can take this idea in the same spirit.

[Guest shelbygirl07]

What does migrating have to do with walking your dog?

 

There's a theory that in their "wild state", canines migrate as a pack on a regular basis (daily?), and that further, the organization and leadership required in this activity helps cement the pack structure and relationships. The theory goes on to posit that humans can re-create this activity, and thereby reap the benefits of being the leader of the pack and having stronger relationships between their dogs, by going on vigorous walks with their dogs, with the human firmly in the lead and in control. Cesar Millan promotes something along these lines.

If that's the theory, someone needs to go back to the drawing board because it doesn't fit any reasearch I've read. First, some canines are non-migratory, most foxes and jackals for instance don't have regular migrations. Others such as Cape hunting dogs are based around a den location while there are pups, then can be broadly described as nomadic within a large home range. Wolves follow a similar pattern with considerable variation according to season and habitat. Wolves are one of the most widely distributed mammals. They are found in many places and have adapted to different ways of living. Some wolves form packs to hunt large game and some wolves could be said to 'migrate' in so far as they follow migrating herds of caribou and other game. The movement of individual or groups of wolves on a daily basis is not referred to as migration.

 

I never said it was a good theory! Just repeating what I've understood people to be saying from books and online. Cesar Millan in particular talks about it a lot, though not always explicitly. Here's an excerpt from an online post he did last year:

 

In Nature: Dogs experience the world by walking. They have to earn food and water by migrating in search of it.

 

At Home: You can recreate this experience at home by taking your dog on a walk before providing food and water in the morning. It gives your dog three things vital to her happiness: 1) a chance to bond with you, the pack leader, 2) much-needed primal exercise, and 3) a "migration ritual" that offers a sense of purpose.

 

He also talks about it in his book Be the Pack Leader (first chapter available free online here)

Every dog likes and needs to walk with a pack leader in migration mode — how much, again, depends partly on breed and partly on energy. Every dog needs to be useful, to work for food and water — to be a helpful, productive member of your pack. Dogs are not solitary like many species of cats — they are social carnivores and their deep social needs are hardwired into their brains. Being social means they need the pack to be happy and fulfilled. Because we have domesticated dogs, we have become their default pack members throughout our long history together. If we were not around, they would still form packs. During the Katrina crisis, some of the dogs left behind did exactly that temporarily, in order to survive. But we’ve been “pack leaders” to them and/or their ancestors for at least tens of thousands - and perhaps as long as hundreds of thousands - of years, so although they absolutely realize that we are not dogs but humans, they will naturally follow us if we provide them with the correct direction.

 

The "wild state" and "back to nature" stuff may be utter hogwash, and for me they aren't really important. I have used some of Cesar's methods (some, people, I said SOME!) and found them to work for us and our dog to strengthen our relationship and create a peaceful and happy home, and in the end that's what's important.

 

That doesn't sound like anxiety to me. Sounds like she really enjoyed walking on the bike path and sniffing pee-mail, and she couldn't wait to get there!

 

I'd have to say that it definitely was anxiety. She would be ok for a minute and shake violently when she came up on one of her spots and she would go into statue mode when she would smell that spot. She basically shut down on me and i couldn't easily snap her out of it. She would just tremble and shake not to mention her eyes would pop out of her head (not litterally lol) and it was breaking my heart because i wanted her to enjoy her walks, not be anxious about them. I never fully believed in the "migration theory" either until i felt i had no other option but to try it. When i did, the world bloomed for my girl. The violent shaking stopped and she started smiling on her walks, head held high and her confidence returned to the point that it exceeded what confidence she had previously.

 

I've been thinking about your descriptions of Shelby for several days now, and I wanted to make several points. First, I acknowledge I wasn't there and I don't know your dog. I also acknowledge I've never met you or seen you and your dog interact, so I have no idea how to gauge your perceptions. HOWEVER, all your descriptions of Shelby acting "anxious" sound exactly like how Arty acts when he gets very excited (in a good way) and happy about something. When we're in the car and approaching a place he associates with good things, he starts pacing and whining. When he's sniffing pee-mail, he gets very focused and could be said to "statue". And when he gets very, very excited, he chatters a LOT, and could be said to be "trembling". The big tip-off that someone taught me about how to tell if a greyhound is happy or not is the tail -- the higher the tail, the more likely the dog is really enjoying whatever is going on. And in all of these situations his tail is waving proudly. I have seen him anxious and upset, and his behavior is very different. I am saying all of this as "food for thought", nothing more. As I said in an earlier post, I like to hear different peoples' theories and ideas about dog behavior and then "road test" them for myself. I hope you can take this idea in the same spirit.

 

I have to agree with most of what you said. I have been doing lots of testing myself on a bunch of different subjects. I have the ability to do that. If it doesn't work, i either scrap it all together or start over with it and change the way i use the information.

Shelby would have her nubby tail tucked between her legs and you could clearly see she wasn't happy. I mean, clearly see it. She is such a crystal clear dog to read. She is extremely expressive and communicates to me constantly. I've seen this reaction with furry critters, she would actually hide behind me and shakes violently if she comes in contact with a rabbit or squirrel in the beginning. She hated them and wanted no part of them. Sometimes she would shove her head between my legs so she blocks her view of them. People think it's funny that a retired racing greyhound doesn't want any part of small furry critters. I bought her a squirrel toy and she gave it to my pom to play with because she wanted no part of it.

Now, she tollerates being around them. I can walk her over to the small animal habitat at a pet store and she just glances once and ignores them. No more anxiety but she still has no interest in them.

 

Shelby will only play with toys that do not resemble animals. She plays with her kong and her nylabone but won't play with stuffed animals. I have gotten her stuffed toys that don't resemble animals and she plays with them but she will only cuddle with those toys that look like animals. I don't know if that is because my pom looks so much like a stuffed animal and she can't tell the difference (one would think she would be able to tell the difference between a stuffed animal and a living breathing animal). But anything that resembles an animal, she won't play with or even put her mouth on. She paws them across the floor. Does anyone have any thoughts on that behavior?

[Beautybabe]

Just responding to the poll...Last year we walked the boys twice a day, 1.5 miles each time. Nice walks, sometimes fast, sometimes slow. Mostly places around our neighborhood or over at the campus. When Emmet started to have major problems with his corn, our vet told us to lay off the walking on pavement. We got Martin last summer and started walking, with a Therapaw on Emmet. Then Martin broke his toe and we stopped walking again. We added Yogi and the three houndies run around our back yard in a way that Martin and Emmet would never run around with just the two of them. (Right now the ice is a problem in the back yard so no one is getting much exercise there.)

 

I fell twice last winter on ice and there is no way I'm going to risk walking them if it's not safe for them or me. On nice days like yesterday, when the ice and snow had melted from the road, my daughter and I took all three out for a great walk. We'll probably do the same today. They enjoy it and it's good for all of us. Next week, who knows?

 

My point is that it all depends--not just on the hound but on the people, too.

[Guest zoolaine]

I have been very lazy lately with the cold weather but am starting in on the walks again this week. The problem since bringing Zali home is that she brings all kind of chaos into the walks. I used to be able to walk my three older dogs no problems but now it is two at a time.

[Guest GretaDad]

I notice a difference with and without walking Greta & Frannie. When we miss our walks, I see more paper shredding that stops as soon as the walks resume.

 

I think there may be some confusion is using the term migrate vs. traveling. If we look at Dingoes, their hunting range can be as large as 150 square miles. A wolf can travel as far as 12 miles a day. While neither canine is technically migrating, they do cover quite a bit of ground on a daily basis.

 

This is why CM recommends the controlled walk for your dog. He exercises his for 6-8 hours a day. The walk is a bonding experience for a dog, and it can have the benefit of teaching the dog how to behave in all situations.

[Guest Morgaynn]

I voted as if I were healthy and not currently recovering from surgery. As it stands right this very Moment, I only take Nike out for quick potty breaks, however DH does walk her while I am out of commission. Once I am feeling at least 80% I will start pushing for our regular walks.

[Guest pedalmasher]

In that you equate walking the dog heavily to exercise as an important reason for so doing, I'm surprised that you fail to add a choice something to the effect, "I don't walk my dog often, but I take it to the dog park for exercise everyday (or other choices)." I don't walk my dog that often, but she plays in the dog park daily and follows me around the park for 1 to 2 hours. It enhances exercise, bonding, or whatever new age result one would seek.

[Guest PA_Greys]

This is a really interesting thread. I am really enjoying the different

view points. A great exchange of ideas that I am learning

from. It's definitely making me think of possible new ways to look

at our greys exercise routine. We currently walk leisurely

for around 40 minutes daily but maybe they would benefit

from a more purposeful walking routine.

Thanks.

[jenn8]

People need to tailor the walk to the individual dog. There's nothing I hate more than seeing someone power-walking down the street, forcing the dog to heel with its head raised, not letting them stop to sniff, etc. At that point the walk is more for the person than it is for the dog, I doubt the dog is having any fun.

 

 

 

~Lindsay~

 

ditto

 

Jenn

Edited February 25, 2009 by jenn8

[Guest learnbygoing]

Obviously it depends on weather conditions, but we walk twice a day, with quick potty breaks 2-3 times in between. I take the morning walk when I get DD to the bus stop. DS and I take her to the bus stop, then we walk Oscar for 20-30 minutes (closer to 20 in the winter/rain, 30-40 in nicer weather). DH does the evening walk, which is usually dictated by how tired Oscar is. Sometimes it's 10 minutes, sometimes 20-30. Oscar won't poop unless he's walked, and he poops twice a day, so his pooping schedule has set the timing on his walks.

 

In the nicer weather, we'll sometimes add an extra walk in the mid afternoon because my kids love going to the park. Either way, I love walking with Oscar. It's fun, he loves it, and it's good exercise for me. Win-win situation!

[Guest TBSFlame]

I say,just enjoy being with your dog! Walk him or her,have fun,enjoy,play with them outside,explore,if you're lucky enough to have a yard,have fun,enjoy,play with them outside,and explore there.

It's not such a big deal really,I think I got involved with this thread because I honestly don't understand it!

 

 

Same here. I just want to say one thing. When I look into Memmie's eyes as she lays on the sofa with her sweet head in my lap she looks more like my child than a wolf.