Eating Issues With New Grey - Feeding Too Much?

[Guest ladyann]

I recently adopted a new grey 2 yr old boy named Max. I am having feeding problems and looking for some suggestions on what to do cause I'm starting to rethink the adoption. My first grey Lady went to the bridge in June because of cancer. She was only 7. It's just me at home so no other dogs or people sharing the space with him.

 

Max goes out for a walk 4-5 times a day. For the past 10 days, EVERY time we return to the house, he races in the door and runs to his dish looking for food. If I am not feeding him or preparing food to feed him, he gets anxious, pacing, growling, barking, snapping etc. etc. Couple of times this week he's need to pee at midnight and wanted to be fed at 1AM.

 

I have a note from the foster telling me to feed him first.. ?????

 

The vet took stool samples on Sunday to see what's wrong. I also had him in for a checkup the week after I got him cause he needed to have an "anal gland adjustment" from little D. At first his tush seemed ok but the feeding issue remained. Max now has BIG D big time and is on metronidazole twice a day until the results come back from the lab.

 

Is it possible to feed a dog too much or too often? Because of the D he is on rice and boiled chicken or rice and boiled hamburger but he will eat 2-3 cups each time after he goes out for a walk -- 4-5 times a day. I am wondering if it is new adjustment issues and if so, should I just keep feeding or overfeeding him.

 

He also can not settle in for the night for 8 hrs - wakes up around 12 -1 AM every night. I have ordered DAP in hopes that will help things. But I hoping for a 8 hr sleep cycle myself soon..

 

Just anxious to do the right thing..

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest trevdog]

That's way too much food...2 to 3 cups of dry food a day should be what he gets, or 4 at the most. We feed 2x a day here and split the servings. How much exercise is he getting during his walks? That much food is bound to give him the big D or at least cause him to need to go more often.

And what did the foster home mean by the note, is it possible to contact them? He needs to get on a schedule of potty breaks as well, how long have you had him?

[ahicks51]

We had the same thing with a foster (which we still have)- he was very eager to get fed, and would wake everyone up to get food. That's why he bounced from his first home, in fact.

 

How long has he been off the track? I suspect he's still on Track Time, although the midnight "I want fed" thing is a bit odd.

 

I would suggest reading more about "NILIF," or "nothing in life is free" training. He sounds like he's on his way to training you to respond to his desires, if he hasn't already. Gregarious males at that age can be very demanding animals, and it is important not to cater to their whims. When they get fed, they get fed- that's it. No amount of begging or cajoling you should be able to change this. It may even be important to get to the point where you mix up the feeding times- no fixed time for dinner, for example, and if you have any rituals before you feed them, then repeat the ritual WITHOUT feeding them.

 

For example, around here we evict all the dogs to the back yard, then fill the food bowls. After this, all four dogs come charging in and go immediately to their respective bowls (and don't think that's a task that doesn't require some sorting out!). In our case, we'd evict the dogs and go through the motions of feeding- including filling the bowls, as they can hear that- and then put the bowls somewhere else. Let the dogs in, and there's no food. Wait 15 minutes, evict them again, and either "false feed" them or, heck- actually feed them.

 

Routine is good- don't get me wrong- but with a demanding animal, a routine can lead to increased demands upon you to cater to them. Don't let it get out of hand.

 

I suspect the foster home gave you that note in the event you had other hounds. "Feed [Max] first" implies he will get aggressive about eating the food of other dogs unless he is being fed, or has already been fed. Presumably they may have had fights in the house over this issue. He sounds very food-intensive, and you can use that to your advantage in terms of training. Specifically, small treats may be much more valuable when it comes to getting him to respond to commands.

[Guest longdogs]

My guess is it's nothing. He probably is conditioned to eat after a walk so more walks, more dinners. Unfortunately your chicken dinners are especially interesting, also the chicken and rice may not satisfy him. I'd be looking to move him on to a decent kibble ASAP, it may be no worse for his tummy problems anyway. If he really wants to eat, it may be the habit rather than a real need. Either feed him a token amount outside mealtimes, preferably plain kibble, or bulk it out with something high in fibre and low in calories. Grated carrot is good, but I'd just feed less. All our greys ate like crazy when they first arrived but they soon adapted.

[RobinM]

You don't say how big he is.

 

My 85 pound biy gets 4cups. 2 in the morning, 2 in the evening.

 

My 60-70 pound hounds get 3 cups. 1.5 and 1.5

 

You also don't say how long each walk is. Is it 5 minutes each walk or is it 40 minutes each walk because that is a big difference.

 

to keep him busy while giving him something to eat, stuff a KONG with low fat treats for him.

[Guest ladyann]

You don't say how big he is.

 

My 85 pound biy gets 4cups. 2 in the morning, 2 in the evening.

 

My 60-70 pound hounds get 3 cups. 1.5 and 1.5

 

You also don't say how long each walk is. Is it 5 minutes each walk or is it 40 minutes each walk because that is a big difference.

 

to keep him busy while giving him something to eat, stuff a KONG with low fat treats for him.

 

He is 67 lbs and the walks are 30-45 minutes each. No 5 minute walks. He doesn't seem to like Kongs - just gives it a few licks and leaves it alone. I have had him for 3 weeks..

 

I had him on Nutro lamb and rice prior to Little D/Big D episodes and now I am starting to mix it back into rice/chicken mix.

 

Thanks to all for your suggestions.

[RobinM]

67 pounds I would feed 3 cups unless he is underweight and then I would do 3.5 until he's at a good weight then cut back to 3 cups.

 

As far as the kong, you have to stuff it with something that will keep his attention, that's the trick. It does take a while for them to figure out how to get the goodies out, but they do figure it out. Keep giving him a kong with his favorite things, one day he will surprise you.

 

Your walks sound greyt.

 

hang in there, don't give up. We are all here. I do understand how frustrating it can be, but you already know what a greyt payoff it is in return.

 

hugs.

[ahicks51]

Plus- I should emphasize this- he's young. With a few months comes maturity, and with a fixed schedule and knowing what comes next, day after day, may come stability.

 

It took about two months for Jake to stop waking us up to get fed. Six months into it (yeah, we've been fostering him for a while!), he's vastly improved. Still very young and eager, but he has some manners. Just don't get between him and his food bowl come feeding time!

[Guest GreysAndMoreGreys]

Sounds like somewhere along the line he's been conditioned to after walk I get fed and if he's getting several walks he's thinking he needs to get fed every time.

Time for a bit of tough love.

 

Pick your feeding times. I believe for most it's 2 times a day. Mornings and evenings.

Basically he's running the show at this point and that's not good.

 

Set up yourself a schedule that works well for you and let him adjust to that. These dogs are all about a schedule, it's what they have known most of their life. While adjustment to it may take some time it really is best for all.

 

Hang in there

[Chicocat]

and runs to his dish looking for food

 

Why don't you also pick up his dish when he is finished eating. He will learn to recognize that feeding time is when you give him his food.

 

As far as the note from the foster nom, I'm guessing that was for a home with multiple pets and it sounds like your boy really wants his food so it's better to give to him first.

 

I also agree with everyone who said it sounds like you are feeding him too much. Three cups should be about right for a male that size, depending on the brand of food. Some dogs tend to have diarreah on Nutro.

[Guest trevdog]

Yes, perhaps a food change is in order, my guys didn't do well on Nutro either. And 3 weeks isn't too long for him to be there, you need to get him adjusted to your schedule. 2x a day for meals should be enough. And that does sound like plenty of exercise but for a 2 year old he might need more.

[Guest oldNELLIE]

We had a similar problem with Nellie for the first 6 months that we had her. She was hungry all the time and would cry for hours until she was fed. Then she started with the night crying. She was on "track time" and would wake us up for her breakfast at 5:00am every day. Then she started waking up in the middle of the night and crying for her "breakfast" at 1-2am. She would cry until 5am until we would feed her. People told us "you can't feed her when she is crying, or she learn to cry for food", but it was awful. When it really got better was when we boarded her for the first time. She stayed at the vet for a long weekend, and there was no one there at night to wake up with her crying (or she didn't think she had them "trained" the way she did us). She got fed in the morning when they came in (I feel like they did the hard work for us ) But either way, she slept through the night for the first time when she came home.

 

What I really think it boild down to was that she just had to learn to trust that she would be fed again. And that took time. Our vet suggested we feed her 3x a day 1 cup at a time, 5:30am, 5:30pm and 8:00pm, and we mix in high fiber / low cal additions to help her feel full (raw veggies mostly). She is still very food minded, but we are now comfortable ignoring her, too. We aren't so worried that she is not okay. It get easier! I can say that from experience!

 

PS. Nellie was always starving on any rice/meat diet. It just didn't fill her up the same way kibble does.

Edited September 23, 2008 by oldNELLIE

[Guest ladyann]

Thank you all for your suggestions - Greytalk community. It is unfortunate that I lived in a small condo in the city so letting Max cry, go out on midnight pee walks , and whine and beg for food is not something I can do at 1-3 AM on an ongoing basis. He turns into a different dog late at night - maybe he misses the company of other dogs or kennel life or having more than one person in a household. He is very young and needy and his GI system is not settling down at all after 3 weeks which makes me think it is stress on top of a food issue.

 

 

I am sure it is only a question of maturity, time, training, and patience and in the right combination that will help him settle into home life. But I am thinking that we are just not a good match. I can not give him what he needs to the extent he needs it and still work full time, and he is unable to give me what I need (6-7 hours uninterrupted sleep.)

 

Edited September 24, 2008 by ladyann

[Guest Harry702]

I'm sorry you're having trouble with Max, but 3 weeks seems to be a little early to be giving up on him. Are there other reasons why you think he's not a good match? If you don't mind my asking, how did he end up with you (ie, did you pick him yourself, or was he recommended/selected for you)? I just think you might have a few more options to exhaust before sending him back.

 

Last week, we fostered a young, needy, LOUD foster girl and believe me, I sympathize about the sleep issue. It can and will get better if you take some of the suggestions here and give him a second chance.

 

Just my

[Guest md7nd]

I understand, I'd suggest talking to your adoption group for a better match/suggestions. We lived in a small condo when we adopted Nina, tho she's 4, she really didnt have any problems except for the few times I had to carry her up/down stairs. Our adoption group was/is wonderful and we, or I cant wait to adopt another soon!

 

Good luck and hope in either case you'll try!

[Batmom]

I would talk to your adoption group ... but ... if he's getting 2-3 cups of food 4-5 times a day, then I'm not surprised he's restless. That's way too much food, and the excess would be inclined to make a dog fuss, want to go out in the middle of the night, continue to have the runs, etc.

 

For a 67-lb. dog, short-term bland diet would be something on the order of 1.5 cups of rice and 1/2-3/4 cup of chicken/beef twice a day.

 

Ditto the remarks about Nutro (caused digestive problems here) and about tough love.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[SAVED2]

Sounds like somewhere along the line he's been conditioned to after walk I get fed and if he's getting several walks he's thinking he needs to get fed every time.

Time for a bit of tough love.

 

Pick your feeding times. I believe for most it's 2 times a day. Mornings and evenings.

Basically he's running the show at this point and that's not good.

 

Set up yourself a schedule that works well for you and let him adjust to that. These dogs are all about a schedule, it's what they have known most of their life. While adjustment to it may take some time it really is best for all.

 

Hang in there

 

Agree

 

[Guest ladyann]

Just want to update this topic:

 

THANKS to everyone for your suggestions.. Fecal exam result came back positive for hookworms which the vet believes would account for his anxiety about eating and eating like he was starving all the time. Nasty things. Once he was dosed by the vet with Drontal Plus and put on some w/d to settle his stomach, he became a different dog. He is eating normally now and has calmed down. I also put DAP in the room where he sleeps.

 

 

Changed his food from Nutro to Canidae which seems to be working out fine also.

 

Just needed some more time as you all said.

[Guest KRKWMU]

So glad he's settling down and feeling better! Good work!