BauersMom
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Yep, we already talked about Babesia, it's on the list to test. Thanks!
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We have a happy, bouncy foster dog (newly up from Florida) who went in for his pre-neuter surgery and his platelets were at 52,000. Obviously, they didn't do the neuter.
We're already doing the full tick panel and a coagulation test and we're starting him on doxy.
Any other thoughts? He is currently showing no signs of illness, no lethargy, no limping, good appetite, etc. but 50K is pretty low.
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For what's it's worth, I think you did the right thing.
Kevin would not see it as you getting "the last word" if you did anything else, he would see it as you did not listen to him when he was uncomfortable. Knowing his history, his next option would be to escalate and potentially bite.
There are different reasons for growling. Guarding a resource that is not his to guard warrants a reprimand or punishment or whatever along those lines (he growls on the couch, he gets booted from the couch). Growling because the situation is upsetting/uncomfortable for them (as in the case of personal space issues many times) is a form of communication - and listen to it. If you don't, you will quickly learn that the next thing after growling is snapping and biting as communication.
Just my two cents.
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I appreciate the opinions on whether or not to do the surgery, but both my vet and the neurologist at Angell Memorial both are in agreement that she'd not make it through surgery. While I obviously don't want her to suffocate to death, I also don't want to take a happy, otherwise healthy dog and risk her life against the recommendation of two vets. There is risk in everything we do as pet owners.
So long as her schedule and routine stays the same, she's easy to keep cool and calm. I'll look into getting some valium to have on hand, too.
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Princess is not a good candidate for the tie-back surgery, so for now we're managing it by keeping her life pretty low-key and low-stress and the AC is on whenever it gets warm out. She still romps and plays in the yard (well, romping for an almost 13 year old
), but I limit that to the cooler evenings.What did you do if you didn't opt for surgery? One thing I haven't changed is her food - don't know if looking at a softer/wetter food option is better? Did you have meds on hand in case of a crisis?
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The symptoms of LS and DM are similar - hind end weakness, knuckling. But as I understand it LS is an impingement of the nerve via a shrinking of the spinal canal, and DM is degeneration of the nerve endings.
I have a DM dog and with her the Dr Stack test is normal (www.greyhound-data.com/dir/397/Lumbosacral_Stenosis.pdf) - meaning, pressing on her spine does not cause her any discomfort. However, she has lost a good deal of sensation in her back toes - so if you pinch her toe webbing, she does not react. DM dogs also can have other nerve-related issues - such as laryngeal paralysis.
In the end though, a visit to a specialist is probably your best bet. Good luck, it's certainly tough to see them having difficulty.
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I'm not surprised. They get asked to do a lot of free consulting, which has to put a burden on their resources. I wish the individual subscription were lower, but I can understand why they priced it as they did.
If that was the problem, then the simple solution is to charge for consults. The "membership" to lock down all information seems really silly.
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I "captured" the behavior too - for us it was ta da! (like the fanfare!).
We also got roach this way too - except that was bang! (like play dead!)
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I'll let you figure out which one knows sit and sit only.
I like the dog to the far left that has his jammies on and just stands there and looks cute to get a treat. That's Princess, and she's 12. So she gets whatever she wants for lookin' cute!
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I'll let you figure out which one knows sit and sit only.
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We went through something similar. In our case, we had noticed that the episodes would start on days when there was thunder and storms. But then the stress and panic would last for days afterwards. He would hide in our closet, wouldn't want to go outside, wouldn't eat etc. Then it started happening without any storms, seemingly randomly... he was not a happy dog, at all.
We ended up putting him on xanax. His thyroid T4 was also low and so we added thyroid supplement a few months in (I forget the exact turn of events)... the combination of both had him almost close to as normal as he'd been in a while.
With us, he ended up having hemangiosarcoma a few months later - I don't think that was related to his anxiety, but I do believe it was why his thyroid was low.
I would do a full medical work up, just in case. If it all comes back clear, there are a lot of good anti-anxiety meds available.
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This thread has me laughing out loud.
I have two who are in the "don't care" category. Somehow I've gotten sit with one of them. A small miracle.
But now if I try to teach her something else, she sits. I guess she's realized that if she gets a treat with a sit, why bother?My third is super food motivated and learns really quickly. He got "speak" in about 20 minutes. The problem I have now is that when I try to teach another dog anything, he wants in on the action. "I'm sitting too! Look paw! Paw, I got that one too!" Not really helpful.
I stuck him in the crate during one training session, and there he was sitting, giving paw, etc in his crate. Oy. -
I'm going to step out on a limb, and disagree with you all on this one. Alpha, or pack leader,is not a debunked theory. It is also not about turning your dog into a submissive robot.
I see it in action everyday with Ted. It is all about respect for the pack in general. It does not matter if your pack is all canine, or a mix of animals and humans.
Just as we humans have rules for everyday life, pack rules ensure that the pack goes on in an orderly fashion.
I'm not trying to start a debate here, but let's see where this thread goes.
Did you read Patricia McConnell's blog?
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Actually... I've seen several recs to not use something like that for DM because it lessens their "feeling" even more. DM causes the nerves to degenerate and they lose the sensation of where their feet are, and I guess the thought is that adding something like a therapaw causes them to lose more of that needed sensation.
Here's one of the links: http://www.mzjf.com/hints.htm . I have no direct experience on using a therapaw for anything outside of corns.... good luck
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How is this diagnosis of degenerative myopathy made?
We (and two vets) believe Spencer has LS, and treatment with acupuncture/chiropractic seems to work. Didn't seem to need an MRI to prove it. He does also make hacking noises with his throat from time to time, though, which has me wondering.
Thanks so much for the info in this thread!
The definitive way of diagnosis DM is an EMG under anesthesia to test the nerve function, but he said that it's too risky for a diagnosis.... anesthesia risks are increased in dogs that have DM (especially with LP), apparently.
So as far as what he did... he did a series of neurological function tests, tested her reflexes, and we had X-rays from our regular vet. He also looked at blood work and her urinalysis and did a full body exam.
If I remember right there were a few things that he saw that point to DM - muscle loss at a particular muscle in the leg (can't remember why), poor neurological reflexes, low pain response, slow reflexes (all in her back legs). When he did the LS test on her spine, she did not react poorly.
Then while we were there, she hacked for him a few times so he said right away that wasn't a cough from her lungs but her trying to clear her throat. So I guess that helped.
Dr. Sisson is a very good neurologist. He's has helped so many sight hounds here in the New England area. I took my boy to him for a second opinion after the initial neurologist wanted to do an expensive MRI to diagnose a back issue. Dr. Sisson spent 2 hours with my guy (on a one hour appointment). I think he gave up his lunch hour. Turns out he didn't have a back issue at all and required no further testing. Your pup is in good hands. Keep us updated on any other information you may learn.
This is the second time we've seen Dr. Sisson - and I agree, he's very thorough... we were also there for 2 hours! By the end, Princess got tired out and fall asleep on the bed we brought with us to the appt. I kinda wished I had one too. Between the drive up and the long appt, I was exhausted.
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Best wishes to your girl. Did the vet have any different suggestions for management?
Is this the vagus nerve (cranial nerve X)?He explained that the larynx is controlled by the longest axon/nerve fiber in the body,
I hope this doesn't sound smart-aleck, but how is this logical?So when nerve degeneration hits, it logically hits the longest nerve fibers first...The way he explained it is that the longer the signal has to travel, the more detrimental the degeneration is to it. It made sense when he explained it, so it may be lost in my translation.
No different suggestions for management - the good thing is we're in the early stages. She first started showing signs of LP about 8 months ago now and it hasn't progressed much in that time. The progression of the legs is new, but she's still running in the yard, so we're just to keep a close eye on her and make sure she doesn't get stressed/overheated, etc.
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Apologies if this is well-known, but I learned something today that I hadn't heard before so wanted to share.
I bought in my senior to Dr. Sisson at Angell Memorial in Boston and he diagnosed her with degenerative myelopathy (nerve degeneration).
She has two main symptoms - signs of LP and an increasingly weak back end. He explained that the larynx is controlled by the longest axon/nerve fiber in the body, oddly enough! Not what I expected for the larynx, but it takes a long route from the brain to the neck... And then the sciatica is the second longest. So when nerve degeneration hits, it logically hits the longest nerve fibers first...
I've heard of dogs commonly having both LP and problems with their hind end, but this was the first explanation I had seen for why we may see both larynx and leg problems in some older dogs.
I might have gotten some of the details wrong since it's always so hard to get everything in a vet appt, but thought I'd pass on if anyone else hadn't known this!
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Spot-On? Is Frontline an example of a spot-on flea/tick product?
Yes.
The review is here:
http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/health/pet-spoton-review.pdf
Nothing really major? Did anyone see something of concern? Looks like they're going to work on better packaging, instructions, etc. which is great.
Ticks are such a problem in this area that it's not a "nuisance", it's a serious problem. I'll continue to use Frontline.
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We've always had good luck w/the liver flavored formula from Thomas Vet. Drug. http://thomasvetdrug.com/product_info.php/pName/healthy-joints-k9-64-fl-oz They also have an "apple" version for horses, which we've given to the dogs just in a lot less quantity. I think they prefer the liver so that's what we use.
Oooh, this looks promising too!
I know I'll be paying more for the flavored versions...but I can't tell you how much food I've wasted trying to get the other supplements into her. She's gotten really picky in her old age, that's for sure.
Thanks for all the suggestions!
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go to www.greyhoundgang.com
Claudia sells pure glucosomine so your dog is getting the real deal, all proceeds go to the hounds and you can't taste it. Elsie would know if there is a grain of salt on her food and I am able to get the glucosomine, MSM and CMO in her food, no problem.
I have the GG stuff - she won't eat if it's mixed in.
I googled Synovi and then also found these soft chews:
http://nutramaxlabs.com/vet/Products/Dasuquin-for-dogs.aspx
Might have to see if my vet carries the Dasuquin and will let me try some.
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Cosequin DS comes in flavor tabs.
Thanks - I've looked at these, and do you know if they are hard tablets? Or more like the soft heartguardy-like ones? I've tried hard tablets with her before and she won't eat them - she also doesn't have teeth, so that may be part of it.
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Of course, "good" is all relative when it comes to dogs, I know.
I can't sneak the powder into her food any longer, and can't hide the caps either. I have some "joint" treats but they're more expensive.
So I need something that's either a flavored liquid to mix in or something that tastes like heartguard/deramaxx - you know, that stinky beefy crap.
Thanks for any suggestions!!
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Sure, age will play a factor.
If you can, I would keep him from putting too much stress on it for as long as you and he can tolerate it. My experience with soft tissue stuff (but with myself and the dogs!) is that it always takes longer than you "think" it will!
Feel better Shadow!
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X-rays on the kidneys showed nothing of note, so we're trying her on a kidney diet to see if that helps there.
I also caught her having an "episode" with her back legs with my video camera. She's back to normal now (well... her "normal") and if you watch, it seems like it's her left leg that causes her the problems - like she can't bend it. It gets caught on the crate, which obviously doesn't help either
but I think that was because she's unable to fully control that leg. And then later in the video, you can see her left toes curl under as she tries to stabilize herself.
Any ideas? Will be sending this to the vet also, because I was unable to really explain what it looked like when she had this problem.
), but I limit that to the cooler evenings.
Platelets At 50K, No Outward Signs Of Problems
in Health and Medical discussion
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I don't have the other numbers, but the vet said they were within range. This vet sees a very large greyhound practice, so I am ok with him reading the numbers and making the call on grey 'normal' so I just didn't ask.
Full tick panel came back negative. Coag was normal to low.
We're going to run with the doxy and retest. The platelet count was repeated by the outside lab and confirmed via manual count.