Ibd In Greyhounds

[tbhounds]

Did your vet also mention that the panting and muscle loss (decreased weight) is also a side effect of the pred?

[Guest greytsmom]

Now that you remind me, yes she did for the panting, but NOT the weight loss. He actually gained weight the last time, but wasn't on the large dose that he was this time. She said, he should have gained weight (water retention) and not lost. Thank you for your response.

[JJNg]

Yup, ditto tbhounds comment about pred causing muscle loss. I don't see it much in other breeds of dogs, but it can be especially dramatic in greyhounds on the higher doses of pred.

[Guest greytsmom]

8# weight loss and past 2 days has barely eaten, maybe 1 and 1/4 cups of food in bits and pieces. No longer panting and water drinking/peeing seem to be returning to his pre-prednisone "normals". He has been sleeping much more then usual and hasn't wanted to go for walks in several days. Something he has always been eager to do. He almost seems a bit depressed. Are these symptoms of prednisone withdrawal?

[JJNg]

You shouldn't see prednisone withdrawal if he was weaned of slowly enough. If prednisone is stopped too quickly, it can lead to signs similar to Addison's disease which can be life-threatening. The signs are usually non-specific, including vomiting, diarrhea, decreased appetite, and lethargy, all of which can also be caused by IBD or other illness. If your boy doesn't show any improvement in his signs, I'd suggest discussing this with your vet asap.

[Guest Mom2Shiloh]

I'm not going to recommend a specific diet -- some of the Honest Kitchen ones are very good, but I can't afford them full times (well not for all 4 dogs anyway). But I am always eager for people to find alternatives to anything Hills makes and my holistic vet has a great regimen for dogs with IBD and Colitis issues that I've found works extremely well so I'll just toss that into the mix.

 

Notes: With all the antibiotics, do make sure that he's getting a good pro-biotic capsule with every antibiotic he has to take. Yogurt simply isn't enough and it makes all the difference. Next, no matter what else you do, do start adding a tsp-tbs of Slippery Elm Bark Powder to all his meals. This can be gotten from a health food store or natural food co-op, but these days you can also order it on Amazon -- it's amazing what you can get on Amazon. Slippery Elm Bark Powder is a specific for healing and soothing stomach, intestines....It has made a huge difference for human sufferers from Crones disease, colitis and IBD... for people you usually want to pop some in capsules. It is absolutely not contraindicated with any diet or medication-- it will not mess anything up at all. It has a mild, nutty flavor and is very nutritious.. in the old days they made it up into an alternate formula for babies who were allergic even to goats' milk.

 

I agree with the stomach protectant suggestion-- and that is true if they are on pred, an antibiotic, or meds like Rimadyl... the stomach is the first thing to start hurting. Of course, regular use of Slippery Elm will also take care of that but in the meantime Pepcid (famatodine is Pepcid isn't it? pardon the spellings) .

 

For a short term break and healing respit for the stomach and gut, you can put any dog on a potato diet ... for a couple of days to a week. Potatoes are MUCH easier on the stomach than rice. My vet used to always have us fast a day and then do the potato diet for 5 and then start mixing the regular food back in. To my surprise, I've never met a dog who didn't like the potato diet or who objected to the slight, mild flavor of the slippery elm. Potato diet is just this.. Cook up (probably steam if you can but boil will do) in these proportions 2 large potatoes, 2 sweet potatoes of equal size, 2 small turnips and 1 small leek chopped up fine for flavor. The Leek can be omitted if you prefer. Mush this up a bit and serve warm but not hot. Obviously cook up a few meals worth at a time and store in the fridge.

 

I was amazed the first time I did this... really thought my dog would turn their noses up but they didn't -- ended up with nice firm normal stool again and a decent appetite once we transitioned back onto the regular food.

 

Good luck .. but at least do give the Slippery Elm Bark Powder a try and save the potatoe diet for another time if you aren't going to use it now

[Guest greytsmom]

I'm not going to recommend a specific diet -- some of the Honest Kitchen ones are very good, but I can't afford them full times (well not for all 4 dogs anyway). But I am always eager for people to find alternatives to anything Hills makes and my holistic vet has a great regimen for dogs with IBD and Colitis issues that I've found works extremely well so I'll just toss that into the mix.

 

Notes: With all the antibiotics, do make sure that he's getting a good pro-biotic capsule with every antibiotic he has to take. Yogurt simply isn't enough and it makes all the difference. Next, no matter what else you do, do start adding a tsp-tbs of Slippery Elm Bark Powder to all his meals. This can be gotten from a health food store or natural food co-op, but these days you can also order it on Amazon -- it's amazing what you can get on Amazon. Slippery Elm Bark Powder is a specific for healing and soothing stomach, intestines....It has made a huge difference for human sufferers from Crones disease, colitis and IBD... for people you usually want to pop some in capsules. It is absolutely not contraindicated with any diet or medication-- it will not mess anything up at all. It has a mild, nutty flavor and is very nutritious.. in the old days they made it up into an alternate formula for babies who were allergic even to goats' milk.

 

I agree with the stomach protectant suggestion-- and that is true if they are on pred, an antibiotic, or meds like Rimadyl... the stomach is the first thing to start hurting. Of course, regular use of Slippery Elm will also take care of that but in the meantime Pepcid (famatodine is Pepcid isn't it? pardon the spellings) .

 

For a short term break and healing respit for the stomach and gut, you can put any dog on a potato diet ... for a couple of days to a week. Potatoes are MUCH easier on the stomach than rice. My vet used to always have us fast a day and then do the potato diet for 5 and then start mixing the regular food back in. To my surprise, I've never met a dog who didn't like the potato diet or who objected to the slight, mild flavor of the slippery elm. Potato diet is just this.. Cook up (probably steam if you can but boil will do) in these proportions 2 large potatoes, 2 sweet potatoes of equal size, 2 small turnips and 1 small leek chopped up fine for flavor. The Leek can be omitted if you prefer. Mush this up a bit and serve warm but not hot. Obviously cook up a few meals worth at a time and store in the fridge.

 

I was amazed the first time I did this... really thought my dog would turn their noses up but they didn't -- ended up with nice firm normal stool again and a decent appetite once we transitioned back onto the regular food.

 

Good luck .. but at least do give the Slippery Elm Bark Powder a try and save the potatoe diet for another time if you aren't going to use it now

 

This sounds just like something I could use. I am inclined to think our vet is not altogether open to other options. Since Pjay still wasn't eating this morning (he did finally eat some this evening), she said if I wanted to I could feed him the rice beef, cottage cheese concoction. I never liked that combination.. Depending on whether he continues to eat and what he stools look like, I may wait till Monday when we hear what the ulresound says to try the potato diet. I do plan to go get some Slipperry Elm Bark tomorrow. Is there a more precise dosing then tsp-tbsp you listed?

 

Thank you so much for sharing this. There have been other very good suggestions here, some I can try and some because of circumstances I cannot.

[Guest greytsmom]

You shouldn't see prednisone withdrawal if he was weaned of slowly enough. If prednisone is stopped too quickly, it can lead to signs similar to Addison's disease which can be life-threatening. The signs are usually non-specific, including vomiting, diarrhea, decreased appetite, and lethargy, all of which can also be caused by IBD or other illness. If your boy doesn't show any improvement in his signs, I'd suggest discussing this with your vet asap.

Pjay saw his vet on Monday and she ruled out Cushing's. I just don't recall such dramatic symptoms during the weaning process before. I apologize for an error in my terminology. He is being weaned/withdrawn from Prednisone slowly. After 2 weeks, he takes his last dose Friday. He does seem overall some better this afternoon. I wouldn't haven given you a plum nickle for him this morning, however. He gets an abdominal ultrasound Friday. Thank you for your advice

[JJNg]

Pjay saw his vet on Monday and she ruled out Cushing's. I just don't recall such dramatic symptoms during the weaning process before. I apologize for an error in my terminology. He is being weaned/withdrawn from Prednisone slowly. After 2 weeks, he takes his last dose Friday. He does seem overall some better this afternoon.

 

Glad he seems better, and I hope that continues. If he hasn't completely stopped getting prednisone, then his lethargy and decreased appetite aren't due to the weaning process. Dogs don't go into "withdrawal" from prednisone. The reason it needs to be tapered slowly is because it suppresses the adrenal glands' own production of cortisol, so weaning down gives the adrenal glands a chance to recover and start producing cortisol again. If prednisone is stopped too quickly, it results in a situation where the adrenal glands are not able to produce cortisol, which is required for an individual to respond to stress, leading to a condition similar to Addison's disease. I'm not sure where ruling out Cushing's fits into this?

[Guest greytsmom]

Pjay saw his vet on Monday and she ruled out Cushing's. I just don't recall such dramatic symptoms during the weaning process before. I apologize for an error in my terminology. He is being weaned/withdrawn from Prednisone slowly. After 2 weeks, he takes his last dose Friday. He does seem overall some better this afternoon.

 

Glad he seems better, and I hope that continues. If he hasn't completely stopped getting prednisone, then his lethargy and decreased appetite aren't due to the weaning process. Dogs don't go into "withdrawal" from prednisone. The reason it needs to be tapered slowly is because it suppresses the adrenal glands' own production of cortisol, so weaning down gives the adrenal glands a chance to recover and start producing cortisol again. If prednisone is stopped too quickly, it results in a situation where the adrenal glands are not able to produce cortisol, which is required for an individual to respond to stress, leading to a condition similar to Addison's disease. I'm not sure where ruling out Cushing's fits into this?

 

Yes, thank you for your very informative post. There can be prednisone induced Cushings syndrome. No you're correct, there is not the withdrawl symptoms as one would see with schedule 2 and 3 drugs.

[Guest greytsmom]

Update: Pjay had his ultrasound yesterday and we will not know the results till Monday. From Monday to Friday, he lost another 6 pounds. I have taken him off Z-D ultra and put him on the potato diet and slippery elm bark. Just started him on a tsp mixed in his food. Although he had started to eat some last week, it wasn't anywhere in the amounts he normally eats. He wasn't fasting because he did seem to be hungry at times and i didin't want him to lose anymore weight as a result of fasting. He gobbled up the potato mixture and today, asked for more! Going to keep him strictly on this till Monday morning then start adding his kibble. It is a bit strange to me, he hasn't had a BM for a good 24 hours.

Vet is thinking he might have a malignnacy. I am not convinced. I am thinking he has developed a sensitivity from his kibble

 

I have not beeen convinced this is a tumor. I am leaning more towards his IBD and his non allergic food. He does not seem to be in any pain.

[Guest greytsmom]

I'm not going to recommend a specific diet -- some of the Honest Kitchen ones are very good, but I can't afford them full times (well not for all 4 dogs anyway). But I am always eager for people to find alternatives to anything Hills makes and my holistic vet has a great regimen for dogs with IBD and Colitis issues that I've found works extremely well so I'll just toss that into the mix.

 

Notes: With all the antibiotics, do make sure that he's getting a good pro-biotic capsule with every antibiotic he has to take. Yogurt simply isn't enough and it makes all the difference. Next, no matter what else you do, do start adding a tsp-tbs of Slippery Elm Bark Powder to all his meals. This can be gotten from a health food store or natural food co-op, but these days you can also order it on Amazon -- it's amazing what you can get on Amazon. Slippery Elm Bark Powder is a specific for healing and soothing stomach, intestines....It has made a huge difference for human sufferers from Crones disease, colitis and IBD... for people you usually want to pop some in capsules. It is absolutely not contraindicated with any diet or medication-- it will not mess anything up at all. It has a mild, nutty flavor and is very nutritious.. in the old days they made it up into an alternate formula for babies who were allergic even to goats' milk.

 

I agree with the stomach protectant suggestion-- and that is true if they are on pred, an antibiotic, or meds like Rimadyl... the stomach is the first thing to start hurting. Of course, regular use of Slippery Elm will also take care of that but in the meantime Pepcid (famatodine is Pepcid isn't it? pardon the spellings) .

 

For a short term break and healing respit for the stomach and gut, you can put any dog on a potato diet ... for a couple of days to a week. Potatoes are MUCH easier on the stomach than rice. My vet used to always have us fast a day and then do the potato diet for 5 and then start mixing the regular food back in. To my surprise, I've never met a dog who didn't like the potato diet or who objected to the slight, mild flavor of the slippery elm. Potato diet is just this.. Cook up (probably steam if you can but boil will do) in these proportions 2 large potatoes, 2 sweet potatoes of equal size, 2 small turnips and 1 small leek chopped up fine for flavor. The Leek can be omitted if you prefer. Mush this up a bit and serve warm but not hot. Obviously cook up a few meals worth at a time and store in the fridge.

 

I was amazed the first time I did this... really thought my dog would turn their noses up but they didn't -- ended up with nice firm normal stool again and a decent appetite once we transitioned back onto the regular food.

 

Good luck .. but at least do give the Slippery Elm Bark Powder a try and save the potatoe diet for another time if you aren't going to use it now

I'm not going to recommend a specific diet -- some of the Honest Kitchen ones are very good, but I can't afford them full times (well not for all 4 dogs anyway). But I am always eager for people to find alternatives to anything Hills makes and my holistic vet has a great regimen for dogs with IBD and Colitis issues that I've found works extremely well so I'll just toss that into the mix.

 

Notes: With all the antibiotics, do make sure that he's getting a good pro-biotic capsule with every antibiotic he has to take. Yogurt simply isn't enough and it makes all the difference. Next, no matter what else you do, do start adding a tsp-tbs of Slippery Elm Bark Powder to all his meals. This can be gotten from a health food store or natural food co-op, but these days you can also order it on Amazon -- it's amazing what you can get on Amazon. Slippery Elm Bark Powder is a specific for healing and soothing stomach, intestines....It has made a huge difference for human sufferers from Crones disease, colitis and IBD... for people you usually want to pop some in capsules. It is absolutely not contraindicated with any diet or medication-- it will not mess anything up at all. It has a mild, nutty flavor and is very nutritious.. in the old days they made it up into an alternate formula for babies who were allergic even to goats' milk.

 

I agree with the stomach protectant suggestion-- and that is true if they are on pred, an antibiotic, or meds like Rimadyl... the stomach is the first thing to start hurting. Of course, regular use of Slippery Elm will also take care of that but in the meantime Pepcid (famatodine is Pepcid isn't it? pardon the spellings) .

 

For a short term break and healing respit for the stomach and gut, you can put any dog on a potato diet ... for a couple of days to a week. Potatoes are MUCH easier on the stomach than rice. My vet used to always have us fast a day and then do the potato diet for 5 and then start mixing the regular food back in. To my surprise, I've never met a dog who didn't like the potato diet or who objected to the slight, mild flavor of the slippery elm. Potato diet is just this.. Cook up (probably steam if you can but boil will do) in these proportions 2 large potatoes, 2 sweet potatoes of equal size, 2 small turnips and 1 small leek chopped up fine for flavor. The Leek can be omitted if you prefer. Mush this up a bit and serve warm but not hot. Obviously cook up a few meals worth at a time and store in the fridge.

 

I was amazed the first time I did this... really thought my dog would turn their noses up but they didn't -- ended up with nice firm normal stool again and a decent appetite once we transitioned back onto the regular food.

 

Good luck .. but at least do give the Slippery Elm Bark Powder a try and save the potatoe diet for another time if you aren't going to use it now

 

I have started PJay on the 5 day potato diet and also the slippery elm bark. He eats it with gusto, but I am not sure how much to feed him. "Normally", he would eat till he made himself sick, meaning he eats with abandonment. I want to make sure he is getting enough. I really feel this is all diet relateded. He has not responded to treatment as he did with 2 previous flare-up. Could he have developed an allergy to some other component in this food (Z?D)? The vet insists it is not the chicken. This is all he gets in meals and treats.

[Guest LindsaySF]

Has your vet considered an ulcer vs IBD? The vomiting and lack of appetite make me think of that.

[Guest greytsmom]

Has your vet considered an ulcer vs IBD? The vomiting and lack of appetite make me think of that.

 

Not that she has mentioned to me... He was diagnosed approximately 4 years ago and doesn't particularly have an issue with vomiting, but loose stools and weight loss.

[Urismom]

Not sure if anyone is still following the thread! My Doris has been regurgitating and after xrays, ultrasound, and yesterday and endoscopy, they found a tumor/growth in the wall of her stomach and also indications of Inflammatory Bowel Disease (waiting on biopsy results for the stomach). And basically now, she just hates eating and a lot comes back up... I'd like to switch to a hypoallergenic diet, or a home cooked diet, and a lot of people in the threat reference home-cooked....where could I find recipes/proportions for that? Thank you!

[tbhounds]

You could consult with a veterinary nutritionist.

I would reach out to Dr Remillard

www.petdiets.com

[Guest OPointyDog]

Just noticed that the first part of this thread is from 2012! I wondered why I hadn't seen it in August.

 

My IBD/PLE dog is on Royal Canin Hypoallergenic food, and doing pretty well on it. I give her a mix of the dry and wet food. This is good food for dogs with food allergies because all the protein has been hydrolized (broken down into the amino acids) so there's nothing for them to react to.

 

When I cooked for her, I mixed boiled hamburger and rice, but that wasn't for long-term maintenance. Cornell maintains a short list of recommended sites for pet nutrition: http://www.vet.cornell.edu/library/publicsvcs/freeresources.cfm#nutrition

[RedHead]

 

 

where could I find recipes/proportions for that?

 

If you want to go the easy/no worry route, there are a few companies who offer vitamin powders + simple recipes to make homemade food. I know BalanceIt works with a lot of veterinarians to make homemade diets. A friend uses it and she just has to cook some meat, quinoa and veggies to mix with the powder. Pretty easy but not sure how expensive it is.

 

https://secure.balanceit.com/tools/ez2/#

 

Dogaware has a lot of good info too

http://dogaware.com/articles/wdjhomemade3.html