greyhead

When we saw Dr. Couto in October he reported that OSU saw 1,400 greyhounds in 2008 and 2,200 in 2009. I gather that Dr. Couto sees most of these dogs in regard to diagnosis and treatment of cancer.

I'm glad you saved the one dog. But I cannot help but feel very badly for what is likely a much larger number of hypothyroid dogs who don't even get tested for it, much less treated, and who suffer with all those symptoms and more, because their people have been told that it's so rare. Also I don't think it would necessarily be a terrible idea to rectify thyroid hormone levels and keep looking for whatever else may be going on. I'm assuming here that seeming "brighter" does not mean seeming perfect. But if there is inadequate thyroid hormone, for whatever reason, the body is not going to function normally. So how about normalizing at least that much and seeing what's still not right?

Glucosamine is going to be a very slow fix, even if it works. A couple months is a long time to be hiding in corners of the yard. And that just sounds like more than arthritis to me.

We had similar lameness (and some insecurity but not hiding) for a few years, told it was probably arthritis, though there was disagreement about that. Recently his hips got skewed, one side higher than the other, which led to x-rays and an MRI. Seems he probably had an old injury, like a hairline fracture of the pelvis. While it is healed, the "wear and tear" of continued racing and life led to other problems. Now he's starting rehab -- today, in fact. Without going into more detail than you need, I would suspect that your dog has some hidden pain that's making him feel really vulnerable, and it sounds like more than arthritis. So I'd start with x-rays and an ortho, rehab, or neuro vet who isn't going to just say it's "probably arthritis" and not look further.

This is quite enlightening!!!

I'd get the greyhound special on TBD testing from Protatek. We had a panter too until he was diagnosed and treated. But then I've come to believe every greyhound should be tested for TBD's.

I'm very sorry for the loss of your beautiful girl.

Woo-hoo! So glad you got some vet support for this approach! How soon can she get started? (I can well imagine that Dr. Beau would open his doors just for you and Goldie, holiday or no!) I'm sure all us GTer's will be hoping and praying that this does the trick. I'd settle for "better", don't need "perfect." You tell Goldie to take those hormones and put them to good use riteawayquik!

I'm so sorry about Money. He was so young.

Not good. You're right, Dee, it's not extraneous. But I still hate to be having this discussion right in this thread when you, your family, and Goldie are having such a time of it and at the holidays to boot. And in all that snow! And feeling flu-y! Please take good care of yourself. I don't have to tell you to take good care of Goldie cuz I already know you will. Best wishes to all for a safe and happy New Year.

T3 is even more sensitive than T4 to nonthyroidal illness. If you've got a decent T4 and T3AA is OK, the low T3 is generally meaningless. What do you mean when you say "sensitive", please? Do you mean nonthyroid illness causes reduction in actual T3 and/or fT3, or do you mean that nonthyroid illness makes the measurement of those things unreliable? ETA: I have to go out to run errands before the stores close, so please don't think I'm ignoring you if I'm absent for a bit.

Our Shane, also 7 then, got a lump like that in what sounds like exactly the same spot. He was also breathing really fast (180), panting, and tending to stand in one spot and not move around. We iced the bump, per the ER instructions, and got his breathing rate down to 80-something, sleeping next to him overnight. Next morning the same thing recurred, so we took him in to the ER. They couldn't find a specific problem, but they thought it was an acute pain event of some kind. They prescribed methocarbamol and rest for five days, and it all cleared up. The bump went away. Later (recently) it became obvious that his hips are askew. An MRI later we know that he has an old injury that has healed, but the subsequent "wear and tear" of racing and life has caused a chain reaction of things: dropped gracilis muscle, sprain on the other side, and now the skewing, which is giving him trouble walking. So he'll go to rehab. That's probably more than you needed to know, but I wanted to give the whole story. I hope the bump is just a passing thing in Jax's case as it was for Shane.

Dan and Sharon, I'm so very sorry it was Maggie's time. I hope you and Andy will take comfort in each other now.

Don't see how you can say that. Greyhounds can be perfectly normal and have an fT4 of zero. This dog actually has a measurable fT4, which is in a very common range for healthy greyhounds, and a midrange TSH, which again is what we expect in a healthy dog. There is no indication of thyroid autoantibodies. Basically, there is no indication at all that the dog has any type of thyroid pathology. I don't know why anyone would think that she does. Note that it is nearly impossible to judge thyroid function if the dog is taking phenobarbitol. It is also very difficult to judge thyroid function when the dog is already ill with something else. With the number of medications this dog is taking, adding another with no good evidence that it is needed -- and significant evidence that it is not -- would be extremely poor practice. The only way low fT4 can be a healthy state, if we want to call it that, is when there is enough fT3 to get the job done. Which in this case there is not. I thought Goldie was taken off pheno before this test. I understand about the being ill (though I don't recall what else Goldie is sick with) and taking lots of meds, which is why I said I wasn't offering advice. But I'm beyond unhappy about the way greyhound thyroid is handled. And I'm still waiting for somebody to produce an actual study that I can read that provides more than the conclusions, something that shows the number of subjects, their demographic status, and what criteria were used to determine that they were "healthy." For example, Burpdog recently posted that she doesn't trust the pool of supposedly healthy dogs that was used for norming TBD's, I think it was, and she suspects some unhealthy dogs were unwittingly included. Because dogs can't talk, we can ask them all the questions we could ask humans to determine if they really are healthy or if they have non-visible symptoms of illness. That's my problem with this stuff, but I am emphatically not giving advice about Goldie for the reasons I already mentioned. I trust Dee will do what she thinks best, and that's fine with me. ETA: I now remember that Burpdog was discussing platelet levels when discussing greyhound norms.

As you may know, Dee, I hate the whole greyhounds-don't-need-thyroid-hormones approach to test interpretation that rules thanks to MSU. I just have to ask how a dog is supposed to function without enough T4, fT4, T3 and fT3. Just saying. By any definition that makes any sense at all, Goldie is hypothyroid. Her thyroid gland isn't producing enough hormones even for a greyhound! As to relying on TSH, here's the thread I started a few weeks ago. There are reasons why TSH alone is not a reliable indicator of thyroid status. If you wade into the article I cited there, you'll see why: http://forum.greytalk.com/index.php/topic/265751-hypothyroidism/ And MSU is relying for its interpretation on only two things that I can see, TSH and antibodies. As to antibodies, one can have hypothyroidism without have autoimmune hypothyroidism (Hashimoto's in humans). So I wouldn't rely on the antibody finding either. Sweetie, given Goldie's age and the state she's in, I'm not giving advice here. I'm just so sorry that things have come to this. Much love to you and Goldie, Mary

That's amazingly sweet of you, Dee. I surely didn't want to put you to any trouble. Now I'll refill my coffee and read your handiwork.

Those thyroid results are just about unreadable. Can you copy and translate them, Batmom, if you know where the spaces are supposed to be? I can't tell where a value ends and a range starts! But I know you swear by MSU, so maybe you understand this. And in the antibody section, the important words seem to have been replaced by the kind of gobbledy-gook that happens when one computer's email program isn't compatible with the other's. But I wouldn't expect you to sort that out! I'm sorry, Dee. Take it easy.

I sometimes jump start Spencer's eating in the morning by giving him some Ensure (1/3 bottle) or else his thyroid pill in a meatball. Usually he'll then go ahead and eat his kibble and gravy. Like Meena, he really takes his time finishing that morning meal, though he's faster with the others. But he's an IBD dog and may not be typical. On the other hand, maybe age comes into play, since he's 10 and I gather Meena's not a pup.

Okay, sweetie, you're right. You use WAAAY too many capital letters to be called "restrained"! And just so ya know, I'm right there with ya, hoping for good ol' treatable thyroid! As I wait. Patiently. NOT! (I hope I'm making you laugh and not just making it all worse!)

Thanks for the update! Glad about the Cushings, sad about the wait. Hang in there and remember to breath slowly and deeply.

You're more restrained than I am! I'd have been asking "what, what, what something"?!

Fingers cross here too!

It's easy to see how you could love the adorable Mittens! Lots of prayers and good thoughts coming your way, that everything goes as well as it possibly can.

I'm so sorry, hon. You did what was best.

Maybe you could call them and see what the status is? Just to make sure it hasn't fallen through the cracks. Hugs and scritches to all.