greyhead

Greygeek speaks the truth. We consider our Spencer to have a permanent case of hooks because two vets missed it before a third caught it, by which time he was overloaded with them. We give a monthly dose of Interceptor, which is necessary but not sufficient, so we also give Drontal two or three times a year. Hooks don't just stay in the gut. They can migrate to any tissue in the body, and they are especially likely to move to the lungs, where they're coughed up and swallowed back to the gut. (Easy to mistake for a backward sneeze.) And there is that cyst business that keeps them protected. I'm afraid I have to say that it's likely Doolin will be more susceptible to intestinal infection because of the hookworm damage. They dig channels. And he's probably more likely to develop IBD, as well. Both Stripeyfan and I have been through this exact trajectory of developments, and I'm sure there are others too. So not to discourage you, but you should change to a vet that is more competent than your current one, and you should always keep an eye out for any kind of GI distress. That said, I'm very happy for you and Doolin that you've found out about this and can treat it! Hope he feels better super fast!

Love and hugs to you and Gracie Run fast and free, Howard.

Oh yes, peeing is not an issue with budesonide like it is with pred. Spencer was only on the pred for about five days, so while he peed a lot more than usual, it didn't have time to develop into a peeing problem for us or him. It was the weight loss that was the big deal for Spencer, like 10 lbs in five days! That's what I mean when I say hair loss is the ONLY side effect with budesonide! (Well, the literature says something about potential "goofy behavior", according to our vet, but we never saw it.)

We've had excellent results with budesonide. The only down side is hair loss (chest and legs), but the hair is coming back as the dosage is getting reduced. (Spencer started at 3 mg, then 2, then 1.5, and now 1 mg/day). I will just note that many vets go to prednisone, IMHO, just because that is what is usually done. They are nervous about doing things at all differently. Because vets are people and people generally don't like things that are different. Spencer lost a lot of weight quickly on pred, so his vet was motivated to research budesonide. (It didn't hurt that she had an IBD dog of her own.) Her conclusion: "Budesonide seems to be where everybody ends up, so I thought we'd just start there." I had done some research of my own, and tbhounds had mentioned the virtues of budesonide, so I was entirely pleased when the vet announced her own conclusion about it. He gained weight quickly as soon as the pred was stopped, for which we were most grateful! The technical aspect of the thing is that budesonide targets the gut rather than having such broad systemic effects as pred does. ETA: He was on pred briefly before his IBD diagnosis. Once we had the dx, he was "started" on budesonide instead.

No no no NO! Donna, I'm beyond sorry. You must be just stunned. Wish there was more I could do. Please accept my heartfelt wishes that you and Spencer enjoy the time remaining as much as you can. Spencer, honey, tell your mom to spoil you rotten and then some.

http://aevh.surtos.com/ Their web site shows them to be impressive! They have a cast of thousands, so the key is probably figuring out which vet would be best on a regular basis, and I'd be asking which are most comfortable that they know something about greyhounds. We used a VCA when we first moved to our area and didn't like it. We had a cat in renal failures, and the vet was newly graduated, having mostly ER experience at that point and that limited ER perspective. By which I mean she was tactless and unaware that CRF could be treated successfully for the long term. (After vet shopping I found a guy who believed he could actually help the cat, which then lived another four years.) So there, stupid newby vet!!! I do think the quality of a VCA will vary by location, as others have already said. Personally, I'd dislike dealing with the corporate aspects of that kind of "umbrella." But I might make an exception for Alameda East.

Well, whatever it is or isn't, I'm glad to hear Beau is happy!

RobinM has used imuran for her Beau, and hopefully you'll hear from her and others. (I suspect you mean Inflammatory Bowel Disease, which is more likely to get her attention, if you can edit your original post heading.) Also using imuran as a search term in this H&M forum will yield 88 threads where it's mentioned; see white box, upper right? We feed only venison to our Spencer: canned (Wellness), kibble (Natural Balance), and raw (Primal Pets). Experience showed that exactly one-third raw gave a good result. Some of our vets were skeptical about giving raw food to an IBD dog but said to stay with it since it apparently works for him. Tylan (tylosin) was the final piece of the complicated medicinal puzzle for us in terms of getting the poop to come out right, so to speak. It's a "mild" antibiotic that hadn't done anything for him early in the game, so I wasn't expecting much. But after we'd cleared up his SIBO infection and gotten started with budesonide and metronidazol for his IBD, it did the trick. Btw, L-glutamine is a wonderful trick for restoring the GI tract's walls to health. Welcome to GT, btw! You've come to a great place for information and shared experience. Best of luck to you and Batou on this. Love that name! Edited to add: We feed venison because we exposed him to most of the other proteins before we knew he had IBD, so he developed an inflammatory response to them. It's especially sad because venison is especially expensive. But we have some hopes that some types of fish will still be all right. (We never did try a prescription diet, and some on this forum who did try them found that their dogs didn't do well. Some also, like Stripeyfan, do home cooking and get a good result.)

Buzzy, we're wondering where you get your supply!

Where are you getting your supply? Google offers a dizzying array of possibilities!

Hey, y'all, going to the vet is hard on a sick greyhound! You don't just throw them in the car in the middle of the night and haul them around for nothing. I've called the e-vet for advice about whether or not it's necessary to come in. They've been courteous enough to hand me off to a tech, who told me what to try and what to look for. Wound up taking him in in the morning anyway since the condition resumed when he awoke. But I don't think it's unreasonable to call for that kind of conversation. What I do think is unreasonable is receptionists who automatically tell people to come in, without themselves asking a tech or vet to make that determination. ("Policy" is my least favorite word, even though I realize the necessity for it.) Glad it turned out well, Lauren. Sorry about the stitches. And I certainly feel ya about the money thing.

Yeah, when it gets to seizures, I wouldn't hold back on the checking! We've had a lot of thyroid arguments here since late November. Some people don't believe that thyroid is a problem for greys. But it definitely is for some. If it is for yours, she'll appreciate it if you have it tested and fixed.

Glad to hear you and Doolin are managing!

Well, x-rays won't show hookworms, but you did get useful information, so I'm glad you didn't read my post ahead of time! Hope the Panacur does a lot for him and that any possible disk problem gets dealt with early. Will be watching for updates.

Hope this resolves soon for poor Kool Aid and poor you!

I wrote you a nice answer and then lost it! So here's it in a nutshell: this sounds like hookworm, and the worms are biting him. Each has six teeth, and this adds up to pain and damage. Went through all this with our Spencer. He started biting at the place where the back legs meet the body, he would whip his head around as though something had bitten him, and sometimes he'd jump up a foot and spin around like he was trying to get away. Get a fecal done with a centrifuge process. Keep doing it until the eggs turn up. X-rays and bloodwork won't help you with this, unless he has had a bad enough case to develop anemia from it, and that usually only happens to puppies. Also watch for coughing up and immediately swallowing. This looks a lot like the "backward sneeze" but is in fact worms being coughed up from the lungs and swallowed back to the stomach. Lots of vets aren't familiar with hookworm. Here in WA State they didn't think we had them, which is one thing that slowed down Spencer's diagnosis. I got so depressed after getting no help or diagnosis from two vets, except possible "emotional problems," that I sat down and did nothing for two more months. I finally found a third vet with a good reputation, he did a fecal as a matter of SOP, and Spencer was so "loaded with hookworm" by then that he probably didn't even need his centrifuge equipment. But he did have it and did find them. Still not soon enough to prevent what turned out to be a permanent case of hookworm. So keep coming back here if you need energy transfusions to keep after this, but do try to keep after it. Edited to add: Since fecals can miss things and be expensive, you could just ask for a prescription (Panacur or Drontal) and see if it helps. Worming doesn't hurt the dog if done with proper medicine. Oh, and Heartguard Plus every month won't cure a case of worms, though it theoretically prevents reinfestation. Even then, you'd need something like Interceptor instead, and none of them are foolproof.

When this was first happening to Spencer, also then 5, it turned out to be hookworm. It took three fecals before that was diagnosed. Meanwhile, they tried metronidazole on the theory that it might be giardia. Apparently that med can actually knock hookworm down ever so slightly, as it did then, but it wasn't a lasting effect. It would be good if you could get him a fecal test done by a method that spins the sample before floatation. It's expensive equipment that most vets don't have, so it may have to be sent to your vet's lab. You should also know that a negative fecal doesn't mean there are no worms! It just means that if there are worms, they aren't shedding eggs right then. So never trust a negative fecal. If you get one, under your circumstances, repeat it weekly for 3 or 4 weeks to be sure. It can get pricey, but the cost of untreated hookworm can get very high indeed, as they have teeth and dig chanels into the walls of the intestines. They also migrate to the lungs and anywhere else in the body they choose, they cover themselves in cysts and go dormant, only to hatch when they get darned good and ready, and they can live in the soil of your yard. (Spencer's went undetected and untreated for at least 9 months. He later developed a severe intestinal infection and then IBD.) Best of luck to you and your big boy!

:grouphug

IBD dogs have that reaction when having an inflammatory response to their food. I don't know if Benedryl will help, but it might not hurt. If it is an inflammatory response, as opposed to a true "allergy," he may well continue having it to the next protein you try. Therefore, I'd go to something more unusual, like venison, that you're willing to sacrifice -- venison because it's too expensive to feed long term (unless you have no other choice, like us). Then you can switch later to another novel protein that you might want to continue feeding, like any of them that aren't super expensive or hard to find -- beef, duck, bison, etc.

Fabulous! (I'm guessing that training DD will also be key to success?) As others have said, continued good wishes!

Half the world gets up before I do, so I'm late with my good wishes! Glad he checked out okay at the vet, but you're wise to keep an eye on things just the same. (Spencer gets jumpy, etc. when his IBD is acting up, but nothing too radical.) Kelly boy, I'm so sorry somethin' bothered you! But if at all possible, quit scarin' your lovely mum!

Our sincere sympathy to Betty Ann and to you!

You can get the 500 mg pills and split them into two doses per day. If your vet thinks it doesn't matter, then s/he should be okay either way, right? Our vets were hesitant about raw, but we tried it because of advice from other IBD greyhound owners. What we found through experimentation was that he does well on one-third raw and two-thirds kibble/canned. Messing with that proportion never ends well, so we've stuck to it. In the end the vets said to keep doing what we were doing because it was working! I know in theory it seems risky to give raw to an IBD dog, but it seems to provide enzymes or something that their guts really appreciate!