AEB

Thank you. Personal references really matter to me. Thank you for the suggestion. Are they something carried by vets? I am learning a lot here- never dealt with a broken anything before. Anyhow, I really hope that they will be able to make him more comfortabe. That and the prognosis is what we're after. We really don't want to put him through surgery. We haven't heard much good about toes and surgical mending.

I do not know how to modify my post title to show there is an update. So here is a new thread. Thanks to everyone that replied! This morning we were told it is a pretty big fracture but fairly well aligned with lots of fragments. The fracture is of p1 on 5th digit of rt front leg. Our vet wants him splinted. Said we might as well not bandage at all if we want to use a soft bandage. That it won't help much to just bandage. The splint, he says, is going to protect the foot. I told him we wanted a referral to an ortho. So he called Ocean State and we have an appointment next Tuesday. I don't think surgery would turn out well. But we are told they might be able to do a custom splint that would be more comfortable. I am hoping we can get a better idea of prognosis from the specialist. And, if we can get him into a more comfy splint and do frequent bandage changes it will be a much better chance for him to heal. I told the vet that if we are using a splint we are doing frequent bandage changes. Kevin is back home now. He is in more pain, I think. Probably from having the toe played with earlier and the cement floors of the vet's office. (We brought a crate bed and a blanket for him. He peed on them!) He was given Rimdayl and Tramadol. We'll give him a light dinner and the lower dose of each tonight and see what happens. I wrote our adoption group and was told that Dr. Cardosa has a lot of experience with greys. Unfortunately he is out tomorrow and so we have an appointment Monday evening.

We had the same issues with Kevin at first and now he is fine. i NEVER thought he would be. First, get the booklet "I'll be home soon" and do away training as others have suggested. Have the talk with the neighbor. Determine if it is SA. It could be frustration intolerance or he could just be settling-in. Is he destroying anything when left alone? Is he soiling the house? If he's just whining it's probably not SA and there's a good chance you can improve it more easily. I found Kevin was ok in his crate but would mess the crate sometimes. Once he got more settled and we had no accidents or destruction with us in the house (just a few of these in the beginning) for a while we did short trips out and left him free. He was perfect. Now he sometimes doesn't care if we leave. But if we are outside on the property he wants to be with us and will howl occasionally. You hear it echo over the fields. It is LOUD! Make the crate (if he needs to stay in it) the place he gets all his high value treats and maybe his meals too. Give him a stuffed kong when you leave so he knows the routine (kong=you leaving) and looks forward to the kong. Also, do training with him to build his confidence. You have only had him a very short time. He will likely settle-in. Edited to add that the DAP diffuser seemed to help a little. And exercise. And, that Kevin does not like closed doors so we use gates. Good luck!

Thanks everyone. We have been told it is a pretty big fracture but fairly well aligned with lots of fragments. The fracture is of p1 on 5th digit of rt front leg. Our vet wants him splinted. Said we might as well not bandage at all if we want to use a soft bandage. That it won't help much to just bandage. The splint, he says, is going to protect the foot. I told him we wanted a referral to an ortho. So he called Ocean State and we have an appointment with Dr. Sweet next Tuesday. Wish it was earlier. I don't think surgery would turn out well. But we are told they might be able to do a custom splint that would be more comfortable. I am hoping we can get a better idea of prognosis from the specialist. And, if we can get him into a more comfy splint and do frequent bandage changes it will be a much better chance for him to heal. I told the vet that if we are using a splint we are doing frequent bandage changes. Any other advice from you guys is appreciated (as are all good thoughts). GT is such a great support!

I think it's a proximal phalange. I know 0 about people or dog anatomy. In any event it broke at the end of the proximal phalange (up by the foot bone) (sorry, no name for that that I found yet). It might well be shattered. It is interesting to hear that the shattered toe was not a good candidate for amputation. I am hoping we don't need to go that route. Thanks for your response. Thank you all for thinking of Kevin this morning. I am nervously waiting for the call and will update when i get it.

Thank you. I am expecting that our vet will refer to someone at Ocean State. Those are the specialists with whom he works most often. I think Northborough is about 90 minutes from us. But we will certainly keep the name. I really appreciate the reply. I don't know of any orthopedists around here but am sure they exist in our area.

Thank you. We will. I'm sure he's getting a ton of them from his girls (the vet techs). He is worshipped there and was smothered with kisses and hugs from about 6-8 techs this morning. He actually loves to go the vet. They really are good to us there. I think the vet will have a better idea in just a short time and we can decide where to go from here. I know it's a toe and we're very lucky if this is the worst thing we face with him. Doesn't make it any easier. I just want it to heal itself without making him uncomfortable. I really hope we can bandage and have it magically heal well. And, we certainly will see about an orthopedist if it seems we have to take off the toe. Steve Sarras told me of a procedure they can do and leave the pad intact but it only works for a certain type of break and I don't think this is the type. I will ask if there is something an orthopedist could do for us at this point if we're trying to just bandage and heal. Thanks everyone.

We'll talk to the vet after he gets a better look at it about a referral.

I think if we are considering amputating we might seek a referral. He wants to be active so in many ways his future activity and how it will be hampered by each option is a primary consideration. Our vet wants to be conservative and so Kevin is going under at 10 to get a better view of the damage and try to get it into a better position. We explained no more splint. Bandage well and if it doesn't seem to heal we'll have to consider amputating. I think he should be able to be comfortable with a bandage. He'll be much less likely to fuss and move around constantly that way. One of the techs said her dog broke a weight-bearing toe last week. He is just getting Rimadyl and rest. Perhaps a bandage- it was busy and I missed that part. Anyway, no splint for him and no amputation. Just hoping it heals. And it was a bad break. He seems to be recovering. I hope we can achieve the same with Kevin. Edited to add I would not feel comfortable unless he was re-bandaged every 2 days or so. A week is too long for me, as has been mentioned, a lot can happen. I should be able to handle bandage changes. I have for leg wounds, foot wounds, and unhappy tails. Granted none have involved support as an integral issue in the injury. But the vet has said I do a really nice job in the past. I hope I can rise to the occasion.

Well, I told him last night I wish he could tell me what he wanted to do. He has made it clear the splint is not something he wants. He is not the same dog with it. Miserable. And he was happy going into the vet last night with his broken toe. He greeted everyone and was a total peach. None of that now. I hope we can bandage this adequately. Less than an hour until we take him in. He's crying. Can't get comfortable with his peg leg sticking out.

We're willing to try bandages. We'd obviously like to save the toe. But the splint is making him very uncomfortable. Last night he was crashing into stuff with it. He barely slept all night. Just laid there with his eyes open and moved to different locations all night long. He hasn't even asked for breakfast this morning. That has not happened in the 10 months we've had him. He's really having trouble with the full leg splint. I'm ok with a wrap, just not a full-leg splint. I suspect the vet will say that the site of the fracture requires this type of immobilization. We'll see how it goes. Anyone with experience with a fracture location such as this (where the toe bone goes into the foot)? It's a bad fracture, not at all clean. I do worry how it will heal. He is 3, almost 4.

I think we'll skip any food tonight then. Poor thing. We mentioned his nightly dentastick and they said not tonight. And usually it's 8 or 9 (I remember from Sadie). Kevin gets up at 615 every morning. He'll be up and howling re: breakfast. We'll take him out and he'll pester us and be miserable until 9 when we take him. I am thinking that if we opt to amputate then I will see if we can do a quick dental while he's under. It's been a year since he had it done when being neutered and his teeth are pretty good, but if he's under . . . And see about clipping his nails while he's out on that foot. They'll grow long in a month. We talked and if the vet thinks we can just bandage we may try it. I think the splint is worse than the break. ANd if he says splint is the only hope for healing we'll amputate. I hope if we opt to amputate they can do it while he's out so he doesn't have to go under again. I don't think they wanted us giving him anything after 8 or 9. Do you think a little PB with an antacid would be ok? This is crazy. Poor dog's leg is sticking out smacking into everything. He's having a lot of trouble because the leg is dragging on the ground. He's going to get hurt worse. Can't stand on his own yet. Almost broke his neck tonight because of it. How big is the splint again? It sounds like one of those that goes up to the knee? I've only seen those used with broken hocks, not toes. If it is one of those larger ones, they are the worst. Kevin will be much better off with a smaller splint - all splints are problematic, but the big ones are really tough. I don't know why they would have him in something that cumbersome for a toe, but I'm not a vet. Yup it goes up to just below his elbow. It's terrible. I'm done with it. Steve Sarras says they race with 3 toes. This makes me feel better.

I don't think they wanted us giving him anything after 8 or 9. Do you think a little PB with an antacid would be ok? This is crazy. Poor dog's leg is sticking out smacking into everything. He's having a lot of trouble because the leg is dragging on the ground. He's going to get hurt worse. Can't stand on his own yet. Almost broke his neck tonight because of it.

Is that Miss Ivy from "Ask Miss Ivy?" I'm sure she would know what to do . . . He's just staring at me with pleading eyes.

Thank you. And thanks to everyone for their responses. I saw the sores on Jen's site on her pup. I am really afraid of that. I can bandage pretty well (horse person). I think if the vet says nope he needs this splint for 4 weeks and it's a bad break not likely to heal then I will lean towards amputating. But I am not sure what I'll do if the vet says "we can bandage it without the splint and it's a bad break but I don't know how it will heal. It might be ok." The whole thing is making me sick to my stomach. Has Princess had any long term effects due to the amputation?

Does anyone think it's possible to bandage this without the huge splint? Also what kind of recovery is involved in an amputation? How will he likely be bandaged? Advice if he has to go under and have it amputated? IV drip? Any particular anesthesia? I ask because it seems we might have to make this decision tomorrow morning if the vet says, "yes it's bad and he needs to wear that splint." Poor baby. Wait til he finds out he can't eat in the morning. He's going to go wild! I am so upset. He insisted on coming up onto our bed and has now finally settled-down. He climbed on the couch and was having trouble climbing off. Seems he really doesn't want his routine interrupted. He was so pleasant at the vet. He even sang for them. Such a good boy. It makes it so much harder to decide how to proceed.

Thank you everyone. It's not what I wanted to hear but I already asked the vet that question point blank. He said let's give it a chance to heal and if it doesn't then we'll look at that. (His dog has broken the outside toes on both front legs and he splinted both. One healed well and one is wanky). It is an outside toe. He's already miserable about the splint. It's a long metal splint and his whole leg is immobilized. It is not a clean break it's sort of splintered. It's broken up were it goes into his foot. I will talk to the vet about whether he needs to be in this type of splint the whole 4 weeks. And the severity of the break. If this is how he's to spend the next 4 weeks I can't imagine him making it. He's going to go stir crazy and be really upset by his limited mobility. He likes a long walk every day and he barks his fool head off and paces if he has to wait for one. Never mind what he does when we can't take him. It's just that amputation is permanent. I worry about making the right decision. He does not operate well on 3 legs and I worry about him missing a digit. Poor thing is still panting and not happy. I feel so guilty. Edited to add that I don't know how helpful a surgery will be. It seems it's either "let's see how it heals" or "chop it off". I hate to get to the end of 4 weeks and he needs it cut off anyway. Going through it all over again when it could have been nearly healed. The decision is weighing very heavily on me though. I don't know what's right for him.

Poor Kevin was running this evening and broke his toe. He was screaming and it was sticking out to the side. Off the vet's for an emergency visit and they managed an xray (he had dinner already so they opted not to do a lateral view which would require a sedative). It's split into multiple pieces. It's now much shorter than the same bone on the opposite foot. He was splinted and given pain medicine. He goes in tomorrow for more x-rays and to try to manipulate the bones into a better position. He's going under with a short acting sedative. I am very worried. Poor thing is AWFUL on three legs and the splint makes his leg stick out straight like a peg leg and he has to hold it to the side to keep it from touching the ground. Vet says 25% chance of sores developing to the point where we need to amputate the toe. Anyone with experience with this? Advice?

This one is my favorite from the FAQ from deerantlersfor pups.com: "When you ship the antler, please make sure not to put “deer antler” on the box. I want it to be a surprise for my dog.Not a problem. Just an FYI, though—most dogs smell better than they read."

OMG! has anyone read the questions/answer section of their site! I laughed so hard I almost peed myself! It was part of the reason i ordered from them! BTW- got an email today from Best Bully Sticks. They are having a 12% off sale.

So happy to hear it. It is such a relief when you find something that works! I see you're pretty new (I guess I am too), but welcome to greytalk.

I second what many posters have said re: exercise. A tired dog is a good dog. Make it part of your daily routine- a really long walk and opportunities to run. But I found what Swifthounds suggested to be most helpful. I would keep a close eye on Kevin and if he started chewing something off-limits I would tell him "no, leave it!" and present him with an antler or chew. We immediately worked on "leave it". And we found chews that could withstand him and always gave him access to something (like the antlers). Then we ordered a ton of bully sticks at a decent price. We gave him one probably every other day. It seemed to satisfy the urge to chew. Some raw feeders find that chewing involved helps. Vigilance is key at first. It just seemed that before Kevin fully settled-in he had to put everything in his mouth. And yes, he'd be just laying next to a bureau and start on the leg. But it has improved to not be a problem 99+% of the time. We've had him 9 months and the first 3-4 were rough. He needed a lot of monitoring. But constantly replacing the not ok with the ok, providing lots of appropriate chews, and finally being able to exercise after 3" of snow melted the problem really was fixed. He almost never touches something he shouldn't now. Maybe a couple times in 6 months and he's much less destructive if he does put something in his mouth that shouldn't be there.

I have no idea what it could be aside from a hernia. But I sure hope the little guy feels better soon. I also can't help but add that I'd love to see more pictures of this adorable boy in another thread sometime! Get well soon Harkan!

Kevin resource guarded when we first got him (toys). Thankfully the folks on GT really helped. You need to actively work on trading-up with him. Do a couple of short sessions at least twice a day (it didn't take Kevin long to catch-on). Past threads have specific instructions. It's good that he growled (warned) and did not snap. He needs to learn that it's good for you to take things from him because he gets even better things. Also, do you do training with him? What commands does he know? Practice NILIF (nothing in life is free- threads out there for that too). If he knows sit or down, have him sit/down for the bully, for his dinner, for walks, for toys, etc. Making him earn things can really help. If he eats kibble, use his food for training and that way he will be earning it and be hand-fed by you (and your wife). Both of you need to work with him on trading-up and NILF and he will likely become more settled, confident, and stop any snarly behavior. Good luck!

Below is where I got mine. But first we bought a chunk from the pet store. It was more expensive than these, not big enough so I worried Kev might try to swallow (but it was the biggest that company made) and it stunk. So we ordered these and they've worked out really well. I asked for large ones with minimal branching (small side branches). I emailed with questions and they had recommendations based on the way Kev chewed and his size and breed. And no stink! I hate stink and am pretty darn sensitive when it comes to smells. http://www.deerantlersforpups.com/