Kevin Soiled His Crate

[Guest PhillyPups]

My big boys (90 lber.) eats 4 cups of food a day. 9 cups of food is a lot. No wonder he is a poop machine, what goes in must come out. 9 cups would feed 2 and 1/4 of mine a day, none of mine are underweight, none are fat. I am in shock at 9 cups of food a day.

 

 

I think he lost 3 pounds with his foster family because they told me he was 73lbs but he was only 70.

 

And he lost a pound in just a week when I cut back to 7 cups!

 

 

What work-ups have been done on him? How long has he been out of the racing kennel? My DonnieDude runs on the "thin" side, always has, according to the trainer and owner (he came right from the racing kennel). What do you consider thin? Has anyone been in touch with his former trainer about his weight? All the trainers that I have contacted about my hounds have been more than willing to help me.

[AEB]

Actually TOTW is rather low in k/cals. It only has 370 per cup. Thrive has 510 plus your add-ins. Evo and other grain free foods are in the 500 k/cal bracket. Earthborn Holistic has 710 k/cals and an ingredient list similar to Evo. But whether Kevin can tolerate it remains to be seen. You could get a small bag and put it in his Kong at lunch time and see how that goes.

 

My opinion is still to go to twice a day feedings. Back off the amount and compensate for that by adding calorie dense add-ins.

 

You should post a picture of Kevin. If he looks too bony you know we'll tell you

 

When I put some Innova or Orijen in his Kong he gasses up the joint in the evening!

 

I tried to start a photobucket account and they told me I was ineligible???? So i have no pictures on the internet to post. Otherwise I would have already posted a picture (or a zillion!).

[Guest mcsheltie]

Actually TOTW is rather low in k/cals. It only has 370 per cup. Thrive has 510 plus your add-ins. Evo and other grain free foods are in the 500 k/cal bracket. Earthborn Holistic has 710 k/cals and an ingredient list similar to Evo. But whether Kevin can tolerate it remains to be seen. You could get a small bag and put it in his Kong at lunch time and see how that goes.

 

My opinion is still to go to twice a day feedings. Back off the amount and compensate for that by adding calorie dense add-ins.

 

You should post a picture of Kevin. If he looks too bony you know we'll tell you

 

When I put some Innova or Orijen in his Kong he gasses up the joint in the evening!

 

I tried to start a photobucket account and they told me I was ineligible???? So i have no pictures on the internet to post. Otherwise I would have already posted a picture (or a zillion!).

Didn't know you could be ineligible for PhotoBucket! Email me the picture and I'll post it.

[AEB]

My big boys (90 lber.) eats 4 cups of food a day. 9 cups of food is a lot. No wonder he is a poop machine, what goes in must come out. 9 cups would feed 2 and 1/4 of mine a day, none of mine are underweight, none are fat. I am in shock at 9 cups of food a day.

 

 

I think he lost 3 pounds with his foster family because they told me he was 73lbs but he was only 70.

 

And he lost a pound in just a week when I cut back to 7 cups!

 

 

What work-ups have been done on him? How long has he been out of the racing kennel? My DonnieDude runs on the "thin" side, always has, according to the trainer and owner (he came right from the racing kennel). What do you consider thin? Has anyone been in touch with his former trainer about his weight? All the trainers that I have contacted about my hounds have been more than willing to help me.

 

No work-ups since he came -off the track and into the group and he had that vet work done. Meaning my vet didn't do anything at our new pet appt. I had Kevin about a week at that appt.

 

He was on a haul that came-up around Nov. 10th. I think he came off the track in November too. I am not sure how to contact the trainer- greyhound-data lists the owner and he raced almost exclusively in Pensacola. The dogs on his haul were in very bad shape. I believe two either did not survive for when the haul came or did not survive the trip.

 

I believe he might be a bit leaner than many, certainly a different body type than Sadie. But, I consider thin hip and shoulder bones protruding more than nubs, seeing all the vertebrae, seeing all the ribs. You can also see a narrower chest and muscles in the hind end, no fat pads on the chest, no fat only skin over the ribs, and seeing the muscle fibers through the skin.

 

I didn't know you could be ineligible either!! I must have done something bad and not know it! Will email you. I don't think I can attach until we email back and forth but I'm not sure how this works.

[Guest mcsheltie]

A good worming may be in order if that hasn't been done. Even if they did it when he first came off the track, a worm's life cycle is approx 21 days. Often you need to worm a couple times.

[AEB]

I know he finished his worming in his foster home. I can talk to my vet. I plan to get a weight again Thursday. They already know I'm obsessive (based on Sadie's care). So I can mention a stool test.

[Guest mcsheltie]

I know he finished his worming in his foster home. I can talk to my vet. I plan to get a weight again Thursday. They already know I'm obsessive (based on Sadie's care). So I can mention a stool test.

Often worms will not show up in a stool sample. As they are not wall to wall in the poop. I would ask for a dose of wormer and save the money on the stool sample. Drontal-Plus is good one time all wormer.

[AEB]

I know he finished his worming in his foster home. I can talk to my vet. I plan to get a weight again Thursday. They already know I'm obsessive (based on Sadie's care). So I can mention a stool test.

Often worms will not show up in a stool sample. As they are not wall to wall in the poop. I would ask for a dose of wormer and save the money on the stool sample. Drontal-Plus is good one time all wormer.

 

Any downside to worming if he doesn't have worms?

[Guest mcsheltie]

I know he finished his worming in his foster home. I can talk to my vet. I plan to get a weight again Thursday. They already know I'm obsessive (based on Sadie's care). So I can mention a stool test.

Often worms will not show up in a stool sample. As they are not wall to wall in the poop. I would ask for a dose of wormer and save the money on the stool sample. Drontal-Plus is good one time all wormer.

 

Any downside to worming if he doesn't have worms?

Nope

[Guest mcsheltie]

Here is the most current picture of Kevin, taken 1/2/11

 

 

I think he could stand another pound or two. But I have fosters just off the track that are the same weight. He doesn't look that skinny to me.

[AEB]

Here is the most current picture of Kevin, taken 1/2/11

 

 

I think he could stand another pound or two. But I have fosters just off the track that are the same weight. He doesn't look that skinny to me.

 

Thanks for posting for me! I tried to get some of him in the mega snow we got today but he is wearing his coats. Plus he is so fast!

[Guest PhillyPups]

If he was longer in the body he would look a lot like my DonnieDude. I think he looks good.

[robinw]

I think he looks perfect in that picture.

[Guest racergirl435]

I'm only on my 2nd hound, so take this with a grain of salt. When we got our first, Seymour, he was about as perfect as they come. He had one major accident about a week after we got him and after that he was pretty much golden with the house rules. Our new boy, Ike, has had multiple accidents and is having a harder time adjusting to his new schedule. We keep him crated during the day when we're not home so he can't cause too much damage. He definitely knows he's not allowed to go in the house anymore but his crate is another story. We also realize that his routine now is a lot different than it was even in his foster home so we expect this to take a little time. When Ike came to us, his foster mom was feeding him 4 cups of dry kibble, once a day. With us, he's getting 2 cups, 2 times a day. He weighs 69 pounds, maybe, and is thin but he's more of a delicate build, not necessarily skinny. He too pooped A LOT when he first came to us. Just about every time we'd let him out and it wasn't as firm a poop as we would have liked. Now that he's gotten used to his new food, he poops less frequently, with less volume and better quality poop. That sounds funny. lol With him having a hard time getting used to his new schedule, I'm considering changing him back to one 4 cup feeing in the evening just because we can then monitor anything he does. At least until he is accident free. He also gets 1/2 large Milk Bone in the morning before I leave for work, a dentastix for treat time between dinner and bed time and then another 1/2 large Milk Bone before bed time. I can tell he's gained a little weight since we've gotten him and his fur is thicker and softer. He shares the same food our senior Lab girl gets, Science Diet Active Longevity, and he seems to be doing just fine on it. He's not gassy, his breath doesn't stink and he seems happy with it.

 

All this to say that it seems like a lot to me to feed a hound 3 times a day and as much as Kevin is getting. He looks good in the above picture. I would do what the experts here have already said and work him down to 2 meals a day with snacks in between. If you take him out more frequently than 2 or 3 times between meal times, you could just adjust his treats and snacks to smaller portions. I think, over time and with regular meals, most hounds will gain weight. Some just gain weight faster than others. Seymour used to put on extra weight in the winter because the dogs didn't get as much exercise. If I were you, I wouldn't be too worried about Kevin's weight.

 

Just another suggestion as far as Kevin's "voraciousness". You might try putting a tennis ball in his food bowl. It will slow down his intake because he has to push the ball around to get to the food.

 

I know what you mean about comparing the dogs though. I'm actually glad Ike is so much different than Seymour (not that you're not re Sadie and Kevin). Seymour was very laid back and nothing bothered him except obnoxious children or yappy dogs. lol But...he didn't play with toys or play in general. He did follow us everywhere and loved to snuggle with the humans though so that made up for that. Ike LOVES to play with toys, though he doesn't seem to need to follow us everywhere. He likes snuggling with Bailey but seems pretty independent. He's actually kind of sassy. But he's a lot younger (2.5) than Seymour was (5) when he came to us. I just can't wait to see his real personality come out.

 

Jess

[fourofem]

I am by no means an expert but here's my advice for what it's worth. He doesn't look bad. I think switching him to raw so quickly might be part of the problem. I did some research into Honest Kitchen recently and actually talked to them about it. They suggested a weaning period before a total transition. I also think three meals a day is way TOO much. Sounds like you've tried some different dry food...I didn't have any luck with Evo with House when he arrived. All of the others were doing fine but it was just too much for him. I transitioned all of them over to California Natural (chicken and rice) with my home cooked chicken and vegetables and everybody is doing great. Maybe cutting him back a bit and moving him off of the raw for a while might help.

[Guest Gemma]

I know you are inundated with food options, right now, but my suggestion would be to go out and buy/borrow the book "Raw dog food: make it easy for you and your dog". It is a great straight forward guide to raw food; not dehydrated or pre made, just slabs of meat you pick up at the store and offer up to your pooch. You could keep him on the honest kitchen in the morning to make things easy for you and your husband (we feed kibble in the AM due to time constraints), and raw in the PM. I have found it very easy to manage my dog's weight with a raw diet; a little tweak here or there has him gaining or losing, as needed. If you have the space for all the meat, I would highly recommend it!

[AEB]

I appreciate everyone's suggestion very much. Here's what I'm going to do for now. I'm going to cut out his lunch, except for a kong stuff with his food/PB. And he'll get some snacks- he already gets very small snacks sometimes during the day and a coupe of liver ships at bedtime. I am already working to cut out lunch.

 

I'm going to keep him on the Honest kitchen because he's doing well on it in terms of stool consistency and gas. But, I am going to mix the food so it's a tighter oatmeal consistency and I'm going to start mixing in more Thrive with the Embark. Thrive has Quinoa and is higher calorie and lower fiber and no flaxseed. I may eventually just transition to it. I will also add more meat to his diet (reducing the HK- it is actually designed for add-ins, particularly raw).

 

Hopefully all of this will result in less poop less often. And hopefully we will still have a happy digestive system as well. I think he will because he came off the track in Nov. (where he presumably had the raw meat based diet) and he did not do well on the kibble. But then he went to a hamburger potato diet and did fine. Then onto the dehydrated raw and did well, except for volume and frequency (which may be a result of volume and frequency on feeding). So, hopefully all will go well. If not, I will consider a food change.

[Guest Gemma]

Sounds like a plan! I hope it goes well, and please keep us updated if you can.

[AEB]

Sounds like a plan! I hope it goes well, and please keep us updated if you can.

 

will do!

[AEB]

Ok, here is an update. Kevin has been switched in the manner I described above and he is eating 6 cups per day essentially since I last posted. He gets 3 for breakfast and 3 for dinner. His weight is stable at 80lbs (racing weight 77lbs). Vet says he looks good and keep him where he is. He still poops fairly often (3-4 times/day), especially if he gets walked. But, his poops are a bit smaller and I'd say the frequency of pottying overall is reduced.

 

Kevin was left on Thursday for 3 hours in his crate and did fine. On Friday he was left for 4.5 hours and he peed in his crate. He was walked before I left and he emptied-out.

 

We are not sure why he had the accident. We have several theories. One, that he does have some SA. Two, that the kong I gave him was stuffed with dry treats and they gave him gas (dry stuff gives him gas) and he was less able to hold his pee. Three, he is just feeling more anxious without proper exercise (the snow is so deep here, the yard is a block of ice, and the road is just wide enough for a car and the cars race twice the speed limit, and the ice has cut his feet up. There's nowhere to exercise and when we try he gets hurt or I fall. It's been a miserable winter).

 

I am hoping Spring will fix some of this. I will update again.

[JJNg]

To help determine whether SA is contributing to the problem, is there any way you can set up a video camera during those longer periods you are gone? If you don't have one, maybe you can borrow one from someone? I would be surprised if it was SA if he's fine for 3 hours but not for 4.5. But a video would also give you an idea of what he's doing, and when the accident actually happens.

[AEB]

I do not have a video camera, I will have to borrow one (not sure who from ...) but have thought of this! It certainly would shed a lot of light on the situation. I will make more of a concerted effort to lay hands upon one.

[Guest sheila]

I think he looks perfect in that picture.

 

I agree with this. However if it is taking 6-7 cups a day of kibble to maintain it there is something wrong. I feed my 70ish lb dogs about 4 cups a day and if I fed them any more they would bulk up in a hurry.

[Guest AngelaJ]

My big boys (90 lber.) eats 4 cups of food a day. 9 cups of food is a lot. No wonder he is a poop machine, what goes in must come out. 9 cups would feed 2 and 1/4 of mine a day, none of mine are underweight, none are fat. I am in shock at 9 cups of food a day.

 

I agree, my three greys (55 lbs, 67 lbs and 78 lbs) all eat 4 cups a day, divided in two meals...and all poop twice a day too. I guess rehydrated food wouldn't swell up like kibble does but 9 cups sounds like a heavy amount. And yes, if it goes in, it's going to come out. Poop happens!

[Guest mcsheltie]

I think he looks perfect in that picture.

 

I agree with this. However if it is taking 6-7 cups a day of kibble to maintain it there is something wrong. I feed my 70ish lb dogs about 4 cups a day and if I fed them any more they would bulk up in a hurry.

If I fed kibble all seven of ours need six cups a day. I was always very jealous of everyone who could feed 4 cups or less.

 

I find the metabolism of dogs off the track is quite a bit higher than dogs who have been in a pet home for a year.