krissy
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Posts posted by krissy
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I may be misunderstanding but I fail to see the aggressive component. Sounds like he just has a bad habit of jumping up when greeting people?
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I didn't read your whole post... but here is my general thought on spooks.
All dogs have quirks or things they are afraid of.
Summit is uncomfortable on certain floors, though I haven't found one yet that he absolutely refuses to walk on. You can just tell he thinks he might slip. He backs up quickly from things falling or moving above head level (paper from the counter, the freezer door swinging open, etc.). He has bad noise phobias to fireworks and gunshots. However, he is not a spook. He loves people, approaches people and dogs with confidence and enthusiasm, he enjoys the outdoors, he enjoys trips to indoor locations like pet stores, he is not afraid of crowds.
A true spook is basically TERRIFIED of everything and everyone. Te really bad spooks are often even quite scared of their owners for a long time. These are the dogs that when they are walked outside wear extra harnesses or collars because they are likely to bolt and try to slip their lead at the smallest things... a person in the distance, a leaf blowing in the wind, a loud truck.
I think your dog just has some quirks and some things he doesn't like or is afraid of. And that's normal. Some are more fearful than others... but being a spook is the pretty extreme end of the spectrum.
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My problem with thawed is lack of chewing. The first turkey neck I ever gave Summit was thawed. He choked it down without chewing. It was awful. First I thought he might choke to death. Then once he finally managed to get it down I worried for the next day that the unchewed bones would cause an obstruction. Now I only feed them frozen. I hadn't heard anything about the bones splintering when frozen, so I can't comment on that.
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Meh, just stick something behind it. Water bottle, treat bag, toy, whatever. Or get a classmate or instructor to film every once in awhile. I started it and now all 3 of us in the class constantly ask one another to film a couple runs.
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It's hard to get video of myself!
Tripod, stool, chair, floor.
How do you think I get videos? It is not because DBF is so wonderful that he will be my video man! Besides, it is SO incredibly useful to watch videos of yourself training or handling. You notice things you had no idea you were doing/not doing! -
Love it! Love the greyhound happy prance. Summit does it too and it's pretty ridiculous.
ETA: pardon my weird boxer shorts, did NOT even think about what I was wearing before I put something on the internet. LOL
You are not really training dogs until you have posted videos of yourself on the internet training your dogs in some form of pyjamas.
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Yay for Dudley!
We need Bu agility videos!
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Ooooo, Kili's weaves are really coming along since the last clip I watched. :)We're training, just not videoing. Maybe next session.
Thanks. She was pretty exhausted by the time I got the camera out so her weaves are pretty slow in the clips from today (blue shirt, white leg warmers), also I added that third set of poles which definitely makes a difference!
I'm going to get Brandi back to obedience this weekend, as long as I've shaken this damn virus I've had for a week. I'm also thinking about trying some tracking with Paige. We'll see.
Tracking! Fun! Dooooo it!
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Pudge
in Remembrance
So sorry for your loss. I had no idea Pudge was unwell. I'm sure she's already found her friends at the bridge.
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No one is working on anything? Sad.
We need some training videos people! Don't let me completely take over this thread! Even if you're just training basic obedience... get those cameras rolling and lets see it! Here's a compilation of Kili at the new indoor centre we've been going to. I had a tonne of footage so I decided to get a little creative with it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHN56f8twlI&feature=youtu.be
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Vet visit for antibiotics might be in order since this was cat inflicted.
Also, I always recommend to clients not to use hydrogen peroxide to clean wounds. It's painful and it also damages healthy tissue and cells, which is the last thing you want for a wound. Rinse with warm water and depending on severity or cause (all cat/dog inflicted wounds typically benefit from antibiotics) visit your vet for antibiotics/wound cleaning.
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12 hours is a long time. I've left Summit for up to 14 hours once or twice (situation beyond my control, got held up, etc.) but I don't routinely leave the dogs for longer than 8-10. I think 12 is starting to push it. It depends on the individual dog of course and how much time you spend with them when you ARE home, but in terms of potty breaks 12 hours is more than I like unless it's an extenuating circumstance. You may want to have someone come in to let him out at lunch or at the 7-8 hour mark. Or hire a dog walker. Or if possible pop home for lunch.
ETA: On re-reading your post I notice you say "we". Will someone else be getting home prior to 12 hours?
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I absolutely think that some dogs NEED to run. It is not that they need it or they will die. But there are different levels of "need". Kili "needs" to run pretty much every day. Does she die if she doesn't? Well, not exactly, but she can't settle, can't relax, and gets into everything and anything all. day. long. Even with training and mental stimulation.
A border collie doesn't need to herd sheep but they DO need a JOB. We don't have as many sheep anymore, but what has saved border collies is that we have found new jobs for them to focus on like agility, flyball, disc, and obedience. You can't take a working line border collie and say "they don't need sheep" so they can just hang out and be a house pet. You have to replace working sheep with something else or everyone will be miserable, including the dog.
Anyone who thinks this is not an actual need is arguably not a runner or an athlete. For those of us that are... we NEED to be active. I NEED to play hockey and Frisbee and go for jogs and hikes. I will not die physically without it, but it is not good for my mental health to be confined all the time. Some of our dogs are more athletes than others, and some really do need it in my opinion. I think most people can find a safe, fenced location to let them run anyway. You don't need to off leash them to let them run.
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Lots of good thoughts for two of my favourite old lady canines.
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I just make sure that I'm prepared and have thought of everything the dogs might need. I leave detailed instructions. Then I drop them off and just leave. Sucks but it's a lot more painless that way. It's like taking off a bandaid... rip it off quick!
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It is vet exclusive but it is non-prescription. So you should be able to walk into pretty much any clinic that carries it and buy it. Or ask your own clinic to order it in for you. It seems pricy per bottle but it does go a long way. It is also cheaper if you buy the larger sizes. I buy it in the 1 L format which lasts about 4 months.
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Healthy Mouth - www.healthymouth.com
As far as I know it is the only water additive with clinically proven results. And as a bonus, it was clinically proven using a test group of greyhound blood donors.
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Just in those few moments, my heart dropped to my stomach. I have lost enough this year that I just can't take any more so I am even more protective than ever I guess.
3 minutes of recall training a day would eliminate that heart in stomach feeling.
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Precisely. Those of us who regularly understand the risk and accept the risk for the benefit. I couldn't do agility if I didn't off leash my dogs ever. People on here lure course... can't lure course in a fully enclosed area in most cases.Sigh ... forgive my shorthand. A loose dog, any dog, often does not come home, that is the reality. When a caregiver intentionally lets their dog loose/off-leash, even with proper training, all the powers that be can align and it will be the one time that the dog does not respond to what it has learned. *For me* it is not worth the risk. My dogs go to classes, I am fortunate to have a fenced yard for their turn-out, we have a "relationship." But I would never let them off-leash. There is a pinned topic here about Trust. It's a good reminder. People simply have to decide for themselves what risks they are comfortable taking.
It is not that I trust my dogs implicitly. I trust their training to the degree in which that is reasonable and understand that it could fail.
We all take risks every day in order to benefit our lives. I watched a woman roll her SUV last Christmas. We stopped and rushed to help her, her daughter, and their dog to get out of the vehicle and called an ambulance. Fortunately they were unhurt. But if they had been, I wouldn't say "if you saw a car roll and everyone was dead in it, you wouldn't drive again". What you WOULD do is drive more carefully, but the risk would still exist.
My point is, this epidemic in the greyhound world is completely wrong. We flame people for putting in the training to safely off leash their dogs. But we don't flame people who didn't provide their dog any training and had a "close call" with an open door or dropped leash. Backwards. You can train your dog to be off leashable and CHOOSE NOT TO. As you said, we all have a comfort level. But in my opinion, it is not stupid and irresponsible to train your dog to be off leash and accept those risks. It IS irresponsible to not train your dog because you will never off leash it, and accept THOSE RISKS... the risk of a slipped collar, open door, open gate, broken leash. (And for those who choose not to off leash but have a dog trained enough to do it safely, kudos on providing your dog with safety and not a false sense of security.)
ETA: I am not trying to be overly argumentative. But it does baffle me how the retired racing community thinks this is the solution. People had dog training all wrong 20 years ago and now we know that positive reinforcement is the way to do it. One day I hope the greyhound community will start to get it right too. It doesn't happen without talking about it though so I hope everyone will keep this lively but cordial.
ETA: also, to clarify, it is not my opinion that all greyhounds or most greyhound ad should be off leashed. Completely the opposite. Most dog owners of any breed will not put in the effort required to off leash and should keep their pets safely contained. My problem is with this blanket statement that makes greyhounds sound like they are special or different or untrainable and therefore we shouldn't bother to train and just keep them on a leash. I'm simply here to suggest that IF someone were inclined to put in the effort as some of us here have... it may be achievable. And to suggest that maybe we should put in at least SOME effort even if we do not put in as much as is necessary to off leash.
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If you have ever helped search for a missing greyhound or three and were unsuccessful in that search, I don't believe you would let your greyhound off-leash in an unsecured area. Heartbreaking.
This argument is like the argument people give me when I say I don't want kids "you'll like your own kids". Why is it the same? Because it is incomplete and makes no sense.
This would be a great argument if the only way people lost their greyhounds was by intentionally off leashing them. But I would argue from reading the Amber Alert page that that is not how the majority of dogs go missing. They slip collars, gates get left open, they dart out open front doors.
The argument that makes perfect sense and that SHOULD be quipped over and over is:
If you have ever helped search for a lost greyhound and not found it you would recall train your dog.
And yet... oddly this is not the case. The majority of dog owners (breed aside) do not sufficiently work on recall. Unintentionally off leashing your dog has absolutely nothing to do with a dog that darts out an open door, spooks and backs out of a collar, or leaves out an open gate. Training your dog absolutely corrects the door dash, can help with a scared dog (if you sufficiently proof and drill the recall), will help if you actually see your dog headed out the gate, and may help you recover a lost hound who actually will recall to it's name. It is also less likely that a dog who gets regular freedom and regular recall practice is going to just say "see ya later!" without a reason (squirrels are good reasons). Whether you choose to intentionally off leash at that point is completely up to the individual owners and their comfort levels, but is nearly irrelevant to the lost dog argument.
THIS is the logical argument
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I off leash both of my dogs on a regular basis. I do so in places where there is no traffic, generally conservation areas or other secluded hiking trails, though I do also off leash them in parks in town. Both dogs have reliable recalls. I also regularly put down Summit's leash on walks in order to correct Kili's leash manners or to pick up after them. I open my front door without fear. I open car doors without fear. I train in unsecure rings all the time for agility. I really don't worry about it because I stay on top of their training at all times. I accept the small risk that remains owing to ignored recall.
My big issue that I take with the whole "oh my goodness, greyhounds can't be let off leash" is that a greyhound is a dog. They are dogs first and greyhounds second. You treat each DOG as an individual and you treat each DOG-owner relationship as unique. Some dogs are not appropriate for off leashing. They are too high prey and can't be recalled off prey, can't be called off a scent, etc. Some dog-owner relationships are not conducive to off leashing. Owners don't spend enough time training and proofing a recall. There is no such thing as no greyhound can ever be off leashed. There IS such a thing as "some greyhounds with some owners can be off leashed" and "some DOGS with some owners can never be off leashed". Kili has a better recall than basically all of her non-greyhound friends.
Look at your dog's characteristics. Then look at your own. The majority of dogs shouldn't be off leashed in unfenced areas, regardless of breed, because their owners do not put the proper emphasis on training and proofing their recalls. If your dog can learn a good recall and you can train and proof it regularly then maybe your dog is a candidate for off leashing. And at all times you assume some small risk because no dog is 100% and no owner is 100%. You as the owner determine if the risk benefit ratio is worth it. To me, with my dogs, it is.
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My dogs are generally friendly and are low (Summit) and low-moderate (Kili) prey drive. Other dogs are never seen as prey. Even outdoor cats are generally seen as friends. Summit does not like Huskies though and if another dog were to act aggressively he would most likely respond in kind. But even if I'm out with just Kili, I do not like being approached by an off leash dog. If there is no owner with it I generally catch them and take them home with me. But first I stop any dog approaching mine so that I can get a read on its intentions, its personality, and the reaction of my own dogs... and also to see if there is an owner with the dog.
I have found that we haven't met with such an aggressive dog yet that couldn't be stopped with just yelling. If a dog comes running at us I stand up tall, put my dogs behind me (as much as Kili will allow since she's generally like "WHOOOO! FRIENDS!" at this point) and bellow (bellow is the best... no high pitched screaming... you want a deep voice, from the belly or chest) at it "GET! Get out of here! Go away! SCRAM!" and I generally actually walk TOWARDS the dog since that is somewhat threatening. This may not be the best idea if the dog is really outright aggressive. It works well on friendly, curious, or scared dogs. I wouldn't recommend challenging a truly aggressive dog, especially if it is a larger breed. I've found that the dogs stop where they are and sort of try to figure out what they are going to do. During that time I look around for an owner to come get their dog.
Also, if the problem is more that you are worried YOUR dog might attack (prey drive etc.) and the approaching dog is just friendly or curious... throw a handful of treats away from you and retreat as the dog eats the treats. This obviously doesn't work in the scenario I worry about, which is an aggressive dog that wants to attack me and mine. But for your hallway Pom... might be just the thing.
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Run free sweet girl.
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I don't believe much in "greyhound savvy" trainers. I mean, if they are that's great. But I don't think it is the be-all and the end-all. All of the trainers I have worked with had relatively limited experience with sighthounds and I have loved them all. I don't care if they don't know much about greyhounds, just so long as they are positive reinforcement based trainers with no heavy handed techniques, no dominance theory and are flexible enough to work with me when I might have a concern. But I basically expect exactly the same from my dogs as any other dog in the classes. We do all the exercises the other dogs do. My dogs like to work and they like repetition though, which is a little different from some. But that's not entirely a greyhound thing, lots of other dogs are like that too. So long as the trainer has patience in working with sensitive, lower drive (work drive) dogs that should be fine.
I would recommend sitting in on a class without your dog so you can see how the trainer interacts with clients and other dogs.
How do you think I get videos? It is not because DBF is so wonderful that he will be my video man! Besides, it is SO incredibly useful to watch videos of yourself training or handling. You notice things you had no idea you were doing/not doing!
We need some training videos people! Don't let me completely take over this thread! Even if you're just training basic obedience... get those cameras rolling and lets see it!
Help With Grey Who Is Overly Friendly With Strangers
in Training and Behavior discussion
Posted
He absolutely could hurt someone which is why I only allow Kili to jump up on me. However, "aggression" denotes an intention to do harm (whether true aggression or fear aggression). An over exuberant dog jumping up has no intention of hurting anyone. It is simply an over excited, under trained dog. Impulse control and obedience training will easily fix the situation. Maybe not easily if he's been doing it for 7 years, but still very possible!