Osteo any new treatment? Amputation is not an option.

[NeylasMom]

Glad you were able to get in! Please keep us posted. I chose the same route as you for Zuri though his radiation treatments were 2 total on consecutive days. Unfortunately we were one of the about 20% that don't see a benefit from the radiation, but the Zoledronate did help. Hoping you have fantastic results!

[EllenEveBaz]

Adding our good wishes.  How's your Brin doing?  

[shannone]

Hi, I'd love to be in on this discussion. I am also in southern Arizona, and we just got our diagnosis of an osteosarcoma last night with our 9-year-old gal, Phoebe. She actually also has a CCL tear in the same knee (rear right), which is how we found the sarcoma. We're just starting to look into what we want to do. Amputating that leg might make her a little more comfortable because honestly, she's already only using 3 of them because of the CCL injury. 

The doc we saw put her on Carprofen and Gabapentin for pain and inflammation, and she seems pretty comfortable, but she definitely doesn't go up the step to the bedroom anymore, or get on the couch or anything. She mostly switches between her two living room beds. We haven't gotten our chest xrays yet, though that's what the doc recommends, as well as an oncology consult. I didn't even think about the possibility that the availability would be limited, but that's just another in a long list of Things I Wish I Didn't Know about this.

I guess I'm here both to offer support and be lifted by it. I'm so overwhelmed, and feel like I'll never stop crying. This is the worst.

[GreytMom]

Hi all - Brin seems to be doing well so far. Second radiation treatment coming up tomorrow. I took her off Tramadol as it absolutely wipes her out. She has a bit of pep in her step so I’m remaining hopeful. Thanks for your interest and support! I’ll keep ya posted. 😊
 

Shannone - I’m so very sorry to welcome you to the osteo club. 💔 I’m not sure how much research you’ve had the opportunity to do yet, but the treatment of choice is amp followed by chemo. That’s what I did with my last guy, but he was younger. As I’m sure you’ve read, this beautiful girl of mine is older, has back problems, and her other rear leg is weak so she isn’t a candidate for amputation. If your girl is a candidate and you decide to go that route, the sooner the better before it metastasizes (more than it may have already). The good news is that amputation removes the pain. (And gets some weight off so the remaining leg doesn’t have to work quite as hard. My boy lost 10 lbs with the removal of his leg.) Yes, chest X-rays are good as the cancer frequently shows up in the lungs so that gives you a hint as to whether it has metastasized already/how far the disease has progressed. I’m not sure where you are but Dr Mary Klein is the oncologist in Tucson at Southern Arizona Vet Specialty (and she is fabulous), and other than that it’s up to Phoenix. At least to the best of my knowledge those are the options. I’d call and get on her schedule if you think you may want to see her as it may be a couple month wait. (And get on the waiting list. I got in over a month sooner off the waiting list.) I called Phoenix also and it was nearly as long a wait there. If I can help, let me know. I am by no means an expert, but sadly I have been down this path before. Wishing the best for you and Phoebe. 

[racindog]

[shannone]

Phoebe update: We did a lot of thinking and researching and talking to her doctor as well as the rescue we adopted her through and decided we are not going to pursue chemo/radiation. We can't really afford to wipe out all of our savings, especially if it may not cure her. We decided we would do the amputation, however, since she had the cancer plus the CCL injury, her doctor thought she would be much more comfortable if we took it off. We did chest x-rays at the same time, and the doc said they looked clear (for now). She also said the bone was paper thin by the time it was removed, and it crumbled in her hand when she examined it, so I feel good about our decision. We are currently 3 days post amputation, and she is doing okay. She has a LOT of swelling and bruising, and she hates wearing the cone, of course. She has already managed to chew the tip of the drain tube off despite it (greyhound faces are just too long for cones!) The doctor recommended getting chest x-rays every couple of months to track the disease progression, and then just keeping an eye on her behavior at home and as long as she's happy, we'll cherish all of the time we have left with her. From what I've read from others who have been through the rear leg amputation, we may have another 6 months, 8 months, a year or maybe more.

 

Glad to hear you've started on your treatment path as well! It's so sucky when we can tell our dogs aren't themselves, so Brin feeling better is such good news. 

[MaryJane]

10 minutes ago, shannone said:

Phoebe update: We did a lot of thinking and researching and talking to her doctor as well as the rescue we adopted her through and decided we are not going to pursue chemo/radiation. We can't really afford to wipe out all of our savings, especially if it may not cure her. We decided we would do the amputation, however, since she had the cancer plus the CCL injury, her doctor thought she would be much more comfortable if we took it off. We did chest x-rays at the same time, and the doc said they looked clear (for now). She also said the bone was paper thin by the time it was removed, and it crumbled in her hand when she examined it, so I feel good about our decision. We are currently 3 days post amputation, and she is doing okay. She has a LOT of swelling and bruising, and she hates wearing the cone, of course. She has already managed to chew the tip of the drain tube off despite it (greyhound faces are just too long for cones!) The doctor recommended getting chest x-rays every couple of months to track the disease progression, and then just keeping an eye on her behavior at home and as long as she's happy, we'll cherish all of the time we have left with her. From what I've read from others who have been through the rear leg amputation, we may have another 6 months, 8 months, a year or maybe more.

 

Have you checked on the trials they have available - there may be some that offer chemo/vaccine.

[NeylasMom]

Glad she's recovering well overall.

Did OSU stop their free chemo? 

I'm also curious, did the vet tell you those are the survival numbers without chemo? Those seem more like what I would expect with chemo, but I'm admittedly a bit out of the loop as it's been a few years since I've dealt with an osteo dx. Of course I hope you have multiple happy years together. 

[shannone]

the numbers I'm getting have been from reading the experiences of others going through the same thing. It seems that some people get months with both amputation and chemo/radiation, and some get longer with just amputation and everything in between. the biopsy came back on her bone, and confirmed the cancer, but also the doc said it hadn't progressed to her lymph nodes, or her chest, so we may have some more time. 

We have had some pretty serious post op complications from her surgery, so I've been spending all of my time, energy (and sanity frankly), worrying about that. she developed an infection about a week post op, and they wanted to do another surgery to clear that out, and then today her 2nd incision opened up AGAIN, so we're taking her back into the clinic tomorrow morning so the doc can look at it. I'm just sick about this whole thing, and am questioning and second guessing every decision we've made about this. I know greyhound skin can be tricky to close, but this will be the second repair surgery now (i'm guessing, she hasn't seen the doc yet). Maybe we should insist on them hospitalizing her for a bit so we can really make sure the incision stays closed, and maybe keep her on antibiotics and fluids and there can be more qualified eyes on her at all times? I just feel so ill-equipped to deal with this. this has been really rough.

I hope Brin is doing well!

[GreytMom]

Brin update - she is doing so well! Hates anesthesia but that’s behind us now. Now we just do the zoledronate monthly and hope for the best. Honestly she is doing much better. Her leg is stronger and she’s running a bit, roaching again, and wagging her tail. I think radiation has been super helpful for her. So, we can only hope this lasts many more months. Thanks for the good thoughts her way. 
 

Sorry about Phoebe. My other grey (Duke) I amputated but recovery was smooth. (Until chemotherapy extravasation - but that’s another story.) Sorry you are facing so many challenges. One thought - I couldn’t bear to have Duke in a cone, and like you say they  need a super long one, and then it’s heavy, and they are trying to navigate on 3 legs, and... ugh. If you sew what I did was make a neck pillow - wide but not that thick - lightly stuffed with poly batting and he didn’t mind that as much. He could see where he was going, it wasn’t as heavy, but it fell in the water bowl for sure. 😂 It did keep him away from his incision though. I tied it to his collar so it didn’t slip off as easily. Someone here used an inflatable one as I recall. I think it worked also. Hang in there. Hopefully that wound will heal soon and you can enjoy whatever time you have left with your girl. 

[shannone]

We're hangin in there over here. We took her in Monday, and then asked them to keep her until we could be sure the incision was going to stay closed. Well. The doc tried a different style of suture that was supposed to spread the tension out a little better, she found a few more blood vessels that were actively bleeding that she was able to tie off, and also she got a little blood transfusion to help combat the amount of blood that had been leaking from her incision. Honestly it seemed to me that her bleeding was never really under control from the get go. The clinic said she perked up SO MUCH after the transfusion, and when I visited her on Tuesday she was just walking around her little kennel like it was nothing. For the entire previous 2 weeks we had had her home after her first and second surgery, she was pretty lethargic, and was only interested in eating on and off and only if we hand fed it to her in her bed.

WELL, along with her feeling better came her being MUCH MORE naughty about getting to her incision, so even with a no-bite tube she was able to pull a drain tube out on Thursday (the day we were planning on bringing her home), so we had to leave her again, and they put the larger E-collar back on her, but overnight she was STILL able to lick her incision and opened it up AGAIN in two places, so they put MORE sutures in, and we had to bring her home yesterday (Friday) because our clinic is closed on the weekends. She's always been fine about leaving her incision alone when we're home with her, so she must have just been bored and annoyed at the clinic by herself.

She's been a different dog than she was when we brought her in. She can get up on her own, we've gone outside and gone potty a bunch (we had relied on pee pads for basically the entire previous week), she is back to eating both meals and standing up at her food stand, and she can lay down by herself. Her incision is lightly bandaged for the weekend, and we bring her in on monday to have the doc look at how it's done after her 12000 resuture surgeries. She also put some "relief cuts" in her skin above the incision to help again relieve the tension and promote healing in the area. It seems the amount of drainage we're seeing now is more typical of what we should expect, so I'm cautiously optimistic, but I haven't seen what the incision looks like now, so we'll see how it goes on Monday. However, I am very encouraged that her demeanor and appetite seem much more normal. 

So happy to hear about Brin's successes!! Roaching is my metric for how happy Phoebe is too! She also has recently been able to get a few good full body shakes in without losing her balance, so I think that's boosting her confidence too!

[GreytMom]

Just checking in for an update on phoebe? So glad things were looking up re her healing. She does sound a wee bit persistent about getting to her incision. Silly girl. 

[shannone]

Hi! Phoebe is FINALLY doing well. Her incision is closed completely now, and we even got the sutures out after a little over a month. The licking solution we finally landed on was kid boxer shorts, with a suitical recovery suit over that pinned closed on her surgical side AND we got her a muzzle (which worked MUCH better than the huge cone, she was much more comfortable in it) XD

She has a bit of a bed sore that we're treating with some antimicrobial scrub pads, but other than that, she's been great. It's as though she's always been on 3 legs, she doesn't really need help with anything except going up the one tile stair that leads to the bedroom at night. She can do it. She just gets nervous and slippy.

It's a little strange to remember that although we just went through this whole ordeal, she isn't "cured". We're just going to enjoy the time we have left with her, however long it is. We'll plan on getting another set of radiographs next month to keep a check on if any lesions have formed in her lungs.

But generally she just acts like her normal self! 

How's Brin?

[apbagwell]

On 7/20/2020 at 8:28 PM, GreytMom said:

Brin update - she is doing so well! Hates anesthesia but that’s behind us now. Now we just do the zoledronate monthly and hope for the best. Honestly she is doing much better. Her leg is stronger and she’s running a bit, roaching again, and wagging her tail. I think radiation has been super helpful for her. So, we can only hope this lasts many more months. Thanks for the good thoughts her way. 
 

Sorry about Phoebe. My other grey (Duke) I amputated but recovery was smooth. (Until chemotherapy extravasation - but that’s another story.) Sorry you are facing so many challenges. One thought - I couldn’t bear to have Duke in a cone, and like you say they  need a super long one, and then it’s heavy, and they are trying to navigate on 3 legs, and... ugh. If you sew what I did was make a neck pillow - wide but not that thick - lightly stuffed with poly batting and he didn’t mind that as much. He could see where he was going, it wasn’t as heavy, but it fell in the water bowl for sure. 😂 It did keep him away from his incision though. I tied it to his collar so it didn’t slip off as easily. Someone here used an inflatable one as I recall. I think it worked also. Hang in there. Hopefully that wound will heal soon and you can enjoy whatever time you have left with your girl. 

A lurker who stumbled upon this thread, how is Brin doing? Our 10.5 year old grey was diagnosed with Osteo in his right ulma 3 weeks ago. Undergoing a CT scan as I type so we can get started on radiation next week. Looking at zoledronate in conjunction with the radiation and the radiologist just talked to us about chemo given that we could be looking at an 9 good months after this. We were kind of shocked by the 9 month estimate as its been hard to watch him hop around on 3 legs and yelp in pain during the night. Curious to hear what another oncologist might have suggested on timelines etc.  

[GreytMom]

Hi apbagwell - sorry to hear about your diagnosis. Darn osteo. 😡 My oncologist, who is fabulous and worked with my last hound where I did amputate and do chemo, suggested we might have another good 6-8 months if we were lucky. The radiation really seemed to help manage the pain. She got her 4th zoledronate infusion a week ago and looks great so far. (Getting those once a month.) Playing with my other dogs, running a little bit, and not seeming to be in pain. No limping. (But she is on carprofen and gabapentin.) In fact, she has some bounce back in her step. We are just over 4 months post diagnosis and I’ll be thrilled if we get 4 more months. I will admit some days she seems kind of tired and I don’t know if that is disease progression or old age. But she has far more peppy days than tired days.

I wondered about a low dose chemo like I did with my other hound after the regular chemo, but we never discussed it with re to Brin and I never have remembered to ask. I assume if my oncologist wanted to add that she would have mentioned it. My regular vet, who worked with my oncologist for a while, said he too thinks palliative radiation is the way to go when other options aren’t really options. One of his pt’s was a 180 lb Newfoundland and he said that dog was running up and down the beach “being a dog again” after palliative radiation. My vet did say not all dogs do well with this protocol, but many, like Brin, do very well. So, I hope your boy benefits and you get many more months to love him!